James Was Not Talking about Faith in Jesus Christ for Salvation

[Ernest T. Bass]

Notable Additional Verses that Deal with Repentance
(But They Do Not Use The Word "Repent" or "Repentance"):

"For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." (Romans 10:13).

13 "And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted. (Luke 18:13-14).

Proverbs 28:13 says whosoever confesses and forsakes sin shall have mercy.

--The publican lived under the OT law therefore is not an example of NT gospel salvation.

--the phrase 'calling upon the name of the Lord' means DOING what the Lord says to do (Luke 6:46). In Acts 2:21, Peter in his sermon quoted Joel "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved". This prophecy of Joel was fulfilled in verse 38:

call upon the name of the Lord>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>saved
repent and be baptized >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>saved/sins remitted

Therefore one who has not repented has not called upon the name of the Lord, has not done what the Lord said in repenting (Luke 13:3). The publican lived under the OT BEFORE Acts 2:38 therefore he was not amenable to the command of God to repent and be baptized that did not exist yet. Therefore 'calling on the name of the Lord" is not done by belief only, not done by saying a sinner's prayer but by obedience to the Lord's words (Luke 6:46) in believing, repenting, confessing and being baptized (Jn 3:16; Lk 13:3; Matthew 10:32-33; Mark 16:16). It's those who DO the will of the Father that enter the kingdom, (Matthew 7:21).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yet you yourself have acknowledge a process of growth in the Christian, not that they cease from all works of the flesh - sin - when they are born again, but that they decrease in their sin, is that not so?

And if that is so, how does that reflect on how you present yourself here? I don't see consistency.

Much love!

I believe some believers can mature quicker than others. But the Bible believing mindset is different than the OSAS mindset because we don’t believe we can abide in sin at any point and remain saved while we sin. The difference between us is that we don’t intend to set out that we are fallen and we cannot help but to sin thereby turning God’s grace into a license for immorality. There is no godly sorrow with the OSAS kind of mindset. In the candy fantasy land of OSAS: One is not really sorry over their sin if they believe they are already forgiven and saved. True godly sorrow is expressed when your life is on the line or when you have something to lose. For example: It’s like a man who cheats on his wife. He takes the risk on losing her by being unfaithful. If she catches him being unfaithful, and he does not seek forgiveness with her over such a sin of unfaithfulness, then he most likely could potentially lose her. Normally if the man truly loved his wife and realized he made a mistake, he would seek forgiveness to restore the relationship. But if this man had an OSAS attitude… she would simply leave the guy if she had any moral backbone because he may say he is sorry but he really has the wrong attitude in that she will never leave him no matter what he does (Thereby showing that he is not really sorry by his heart and actions). To treat God in this way just makes it worse.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

--The publican lived under the OT law therefore is not an example of NT gospel salvation.

Grace, and Sanctification are taught from Genesis to Revelation. So I disagree. It makes no sense for Jesus to teach this parable just so that it would quickly be undone later on when He died upon the cross. There is nothing in the New Covenant (after the cross) that says that the Parable of the Tax Collector no longer applies any more. You need to have a specific example after the cross that teaches that this is so,…but we know you are totally bankrupt on being able to do that.

--the phrase 'calling upon the name of the Lord' means DOING what the Lord says to do (Luke 6:46). In Acts 2:21, Peter in his sermon quoted Joel "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved". This prophecy of Joel was fulfilled in verse 38:

This is yet again a distortion of the meaning of words. Calling upon the name of the Lord means calling upon the name of Lord. No need to continue this conversation if this is how you interpret the Bible, friend. Words mean what they say and they cannot be changed to our own liking because we don’t like what they say.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

1 Corinthians 1:12-13 is a part of John’s water baptism in identifying with Christ. This was only imposed on believers until the time of reformation (The same Greek word “baptismos” is used for the English word “washings” in Hebrews 9:10 as it is used for the English word “baptisms.” In other words, baptism was only imposed upon believers until the time of reformation; Meaning, it was temporary).

With your belief on water baptism for salvation: 1 Corinthians 1:17 still does not make any sense with a normal reading unless you twist it somehow. As I stated before, exchanging out the word “baptize” with “save” or to “preach the gospel” renders the verse as absolute nonsense. For you equate water baptism with salvation and or the gospel.

Christ's baptism replaced John baptism in Acts 2:38. Christ's baptism is the one baptism of the great commission that disciples have been sent forth to baptize with, NOT John's baptism. In Acts 19 there were those in Ephesus who had been baptized with John's baptism which had already expired. So they had to be baptized "in the name of the Lord Jesus" v5. John's baptism was not in the name of the Lord. But the one baptism of Eph 4:5 which is in Christ's name is the baptism of Acts 2:38; Acts 10:47-48 and 1 Cor 1:14-17.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Christ's baptism replaced John baptism in Acts 2:38. Christ's baptism is the one baptism of the great commission that disciples have been sent forth to baptize with, NOT John's baptism. In Acts 19 there were those in Ephesus who had been baptized with John's baptism which had already expired. So they had to be baptized "in the name of the Lord Jesus" v5. John's baptism was not in the name of the Lord. But the one baptism of Eph 4:5 which is in Christ's name is the baptism of Acts 2:38; Acts 10:47-48 and 1 Cor 1:14-17.

Water baptism in the name of Christ after the cross was simply done as a part of the misunderstanding by the apostles in the beginning. God later made it clear to Paul that Christ sent him not to baptize but to preach the gospel. This is why Paul basically said he was glad he did not baptize many. Again, baptism was imposed upon believers until the time of reformation (See: the word washings in Hebrews 9:10 in the Greek at BlueLetterBible; This same Greek word baptismos is translated also as baptisms).

 

[marks]

But the Bible believing mindset is different than the OSAS mindset because we don’t believe we can abide in sin at any point and remain saved while we sin.

Once again, you move the goal post. Abide in sin? Your argument changes when it starts hitting close to home.

Either sin separates a child of God from his Creator, or it doesn't.

You go on and on about "justifying sin", yet you do the same for yourself, only saying that somehow in yourself its not "abiding" in sin, whatever that may mean, thus giving yourself a pass.

And for all the things you say about this, this fact keeps popping up.

Without acknowledging this inconsistency, how can there be true discussion?

Much love!

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Here is my biblical case that...

Spirit Baptism is the one and only baptism in effect today.

Scriptural Support:

#1. Ephesians 4:5 says that there is “one baptism.”​

The one baptism is Christ's baptism of the great commission which was commanded, to be taught, that saves, that was administered by humans (disciples), it was how disciples were made and lasts till the end of time. None of these things are ever said about any kind of "spirit" baptism. Note Acts 8, the Spirit sent Phillip to WATER baptize the eunuch for that is how one is saved not by some spirit baptism. If 'spirit' baptism is what saved why the need for Phillip to water baptize? The Spirit could have done that apart from Phillip.

#2. 1 Corinthians 12:13 says, “For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”

John 3:5-------Spirit ++++++++++ water >>>>>>>>>> in the kingdom
1 Cor 12;13---Spirit ++++++++++baptized >>>>>>>> in one body
Tts 3:5-------Holy Spirit +++++++washing >>>>>>>>> saved

Clearly the Bible shows this is WATER baptism. We already saw that Paul water baptized some of the Corinthians himself 1 Cor 1:14,17.
Paul said "we all" showing the universalism of this baptism among ALL Christians. One cannot be a Christian yet unbaptized..no such thing as an unbaptized Christian. All men have been commanded to be water baptized, the baptism of Christ's great commission that makes one a disciple, that saves that is administered by humans. No human can administer 'spirit' baptism only the Lord administed baptism with the Holy Spirit (Matthew 3:11).

This baptism of 1 Cor 12:13 is NECESSARY in order to be saved/be in the body for there is no salvation outside the body of Christ. Since water baptism has been commanded to all men and men can obey that command then if I have not been water baptized therefore not saved that is MY fault, MY culpability. Being baptized with the Holy Spirit is out of my control. Baptism with the HS has NEVER been commanded to anyone therefore cannot be obeyed. So those who are lost (outside the body) are lost due to God's fault and culpability in not having baptized them with the Holy Spirit. Baptism with the HS was never promised to anyone today, it was never commanded to anyone, it does not save, it is not how disciples are made, it does not last till the end of time and not administered by men. All of these things are only true of the water baptism of the great commission.

#3. The prophecy and fulfilment of the new baptism:

Jesus stated:
“For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.” (Acts of the Apostles 1:5). ......... .

Note: This baptism of the Holy Ghost took place at Pentecost for the Jewish believers (See: Acts of the Apostles 2), and it happened for the Gentiles with Cornelius and his family in Acts 10 (Also see: Acts 11 about Peter’s recollection of this event; For Peter recalls the words of Jesus in Acts of the Apostles 1:5 when Cornelius and his family experienced the baptism of the Spirit after the gospel was preached to them) (Note: In Acts 10-11: Peter was just first learning of the baptism of the Spirit and he did not know yet that water baptism had ended at this point in his life).

CONTEXT!!!! In Acts 1:1-5 Jesus was speaking to His Apostles promising only then baptism with the HS, not speaking to anyone today. And it was just the Apostles in Acts 2 that the HS fell upon on.

#4. 1 Corinthians 1:17 says, “For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.” If water baptism is what places us into Christ, then why is Paul teaching against it here? This must mean that the true baptism is Spirit baptism and that the baptism that Paul was not sent by Christ to put forth was water baptism. For the apostles were commissioned to baptize in Matthew 28:19, and yet, Paul was an apostle.

--Already showed from 1 Cor 1:12-13 one MUST be baptized to be "of" Christ,
--Paul DID water baptize and did not sin.
--1 Cor 1:17 is a not-but ellipsis where emphasis was put on preaching over baptizing but not to the total exclusion of baptizing.

Peter, in speaking about wives, used a not-but ellipsis: "Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel; But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price." Peter is saying wives should put more emphasis on the inward adorning over the outward adorning. Peter is NOT literally telling wives to not put on apparel no more than Paul was to not literally baptize (for he DID) but a placement of emphasis on one thing over another but NOT to the exclusion of either.

John 6:27 another not-but ellipsis:​

"Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life" Jesus is telling them to put more emphasis on the spiritual food over the physical food. Jesus is NOT literally telling them to not work for the physical food they eat for that violates 2 Thessalonians 3:10.

#5. Acts of the Apostles 18:24-26 says, And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus. This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John. And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.” In short, Aquila and Priscilla (who were taught by Paul) expounded the Word of God more perfectly unto Apollos because he only knew of John’s baptism of water. Apollos needed to learn of Spirit baptism (Which is the true New Covenant way of being baptized).

Nothing in the text says Apollos needed to lean about some 'spirit' baptism.

[Bible Highlighter]
#6. Acts of the Apostles 19:1-7 says, “And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied. And all the men were about twelve.”
In other words, the believers at Ephesus only knew of John’s baptism of water, and they were not aware of the Holy Ghost. So Paul baptized them into the Holy Ghost by laying his hands on them. So they received the baptism of the Spirit.[/quote]

It's water baptism that is the 'name of the Lord' Acts 2:38; Acts 10:47-48. Only God can baptize with the HS (Matt 3:11) no man can baptize with the HS.

#7. Mark 16:16 says: “He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
If one believes Ephesians 2:8-9, and they also believe that water baptism is for salvation: .

(Continued in my next post):

Not of works of Eph 2:9 refers to works of merit. Water baptism, obedience to God, is never called a work of merit. If one could work to keep God's law perfectly sinless then that woild be something to boast about. But man's obedience will not be perfect so it is nothing to boast about.​

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Galatians 3:22
“But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.”

It does not say all are born sinners. Paul spends Romans chapters 1 and 2 proving all, both Gentile and Jew, are sinners and not the first time does he even remotely suggest they are sinners by birth. But instead shows various transgressions both Gentile and Jews committed that made them sinners. No one is UNconditionally made a sinner apart from sinning as no one is UNconditionally made righteous apart from doing righteousness.

 

[marks]

There is no godly sorrow with the OSAS kind of mindset.

I think this is your error in presuming this of others.

Much love!

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

This sounds like you are just hitting the disagree button without carefully looking at the points I made with Scripture.

The word “repent” can have a wide variety of meanings based on the context even. Here is an illustrative example:

In other words, the context determines the meaning of what that word means.

I was making the point repentance is not asking God for forgiveness but repentance is not just a change in mind, but requires a obedient turning THEN God forgives.

 

[Daniel L.]

Not of works of Eph 2:9 refers to works of merit.

Not a work of Merit. Which one was Paul refering to: condign merit or congruous merit?

Also, when the wicked sins, is not the death of the wicked merited unto him? Has he not earned his wages?

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Grace, and Sanctification are taught from Genesis to Revelation. So I disagree. It makes no sense for Jesus to teach this parable just so that it would quickly be undone later on when He died upon the cross. There is nothing in the New Covenant (after the cross) that says that the Parable of the Tax Collector no longer applies any more. You need to have a specific example after the cross that teaches that this is so,…but we know you are totally bankrupt on being able to do that.



This is yet again a distortion of the meaning of words. Calling upon the name of the Lord means calling upon the name of Lord. No need to continue this conversation if this is how you interpret the Bible, friend. Words mean what they say and they cannot be changed to our own liking because we don’t like what they say.

Hebrews 9:16-17
"For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth."

The simple fact of these verses is as long as Christ was alive, His NT was not in effect. It would only come into effect some point AFTER He died. Under the OT law as that Pharisee and publican lived under, all that was required to be in saved, in a covenant relationship to God was a physical birth to a Jewish family with ties back to Abraham. The NT gospel requires a spiritual rebirth to be in a NT covenant relationship with God. So those men are not even examples of how one today gets into a NT covenant relationship with God.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Not a work of Merit. Which one was Paul refering to: condign merit or congruous merit?

Also, when the wicked sins, is not the death of the wicked merited unto him? Has he not earned his wages?

Eph 2:9, the OT law required on to keep all of it perfectly, flawlessly to be justified and if one could do that then he could glory in his own effort in keeping the law sinlessly. Yet the Jew could not keep it perfectly, therefore the law could not justify men in the sight of God (Galatians 3:11). But obedience can justify, even though one's obedience will not be perfect. Bit God made obedience a necessary condition to receive His free gift. Since obedience is not perfect it cannot be said to be a work of merit. Hence obedience and works of merit are not the same thing.


Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, condemnation is earned.

But salvation is a free gift so it cannot be earned. Yet God made salvation a conditional gift with the condition being obedience. Therefore obedience cannot earn salvation but is simply meeting a condition placed upon the free gift. No different than Noah meeting God's condition in building the ak to receive the free gift of salvation from the flood. Naaman meeting God's condition to dip 7 times to receive the free gift of healing.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It does not say all are born sinners. Paul spends Romans chapters 1 and 2 proving all, both Gentile and Jew, are sinners and not the first time does he even remotely suggest they are sinners by birth. But instead shows various transgressions both Gentile and Jews committed that made them sinners. No one is UNconditionally made a sinner apart from sinning as no one is UNconditionally made righteous apart from doing righteousness.

Babies are unconditionally saved by Christ’s sacrifice.

To understand this topic one needs to understand Federal Headship.

Four reasons why Federal Headship is true.

#1. Well, the best passage that helps us to understand "Federal Headship" is Hebrews 7:8-10. It says,

8 "Here people who die receive tithes, but there one receives tithes of whom it is testified that he lives.
9 We can say that through Abraham even Levi, who receives tithes, has paid tithes,
10 for he was yet in the body of his father when Melchizedek met him." (Hebrews 7:8-10) (New Heart English Bible).​

Levi paid tithes in Abraham even before Levi was born. This is Federal Headship.

#2. The Virgin Birth. When Eve sinned, nothing happened. It was only when Adam sinned when both of their eyes were opened to the after effects of sin. So sin is passed down by the male seed. This is one of the reasons why Jesus was born of a virgin. Hebrews 7:26 says, "For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;"

#3. The moment we accept Christ as our Savior (for real) we are forgiven of our past sins and we are associating with the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Jesus took on the sins of the entire world in his body in the Garden of Gethsemane from the cup that the Father gave to Him. Jesus was then later wounded for our transgressions and crushed for our iniquities and by his stripes (whip marks) we are healed. Jesus was literally taking our place. Romans 3:25 says "God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past,"; This is the blood or sacrifice of Jesus Christ. His sacrifice is applied to us when we become born again spiritually just as Adam's sin was once applied to us when we were born into this world by the flesh of Adam. 1 John 1:7 talks about our continued salvation in Christ. If we walk in the light [i.e. keep God's commandments abiding in God the Father] as He [Christ] is in the light [God the Father], we have fellowship with one another and the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin (cf. John 14:23). So Christ's sacrifice is applied to our lives when we repent of our sins and we then obey Him.

#4. If we are truly 100% innocent at birth, then there would have been no need for a Savior. God could have just taken our lives before we reached the age of accountability before we could sin in God's eyes.

"For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous." (Romans 5:19).

"Therefore as by the offence of one, judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one, the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life." (Romans 5:18).

"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive." (1 Corinthians 15:22).

When we come to Jesus, we have the promise that we will one day have a new resurrected body that will live forever. The opposite is true when we were born into this world with a body that is condemned by death because of the sin of Adam.

• John 3:6 - “That which is born of the flesh is flesh”
• 1 John 2:16 - "For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world."
• Genesis 8:21 - The Lord said in his heart, “I will never again curse the ground because of man, for the intention of man’s heart is evil from his youth.”
• Psalms 58:3 - The wicked are estranged from the womb; they go astray from birth, speaking lies.
• Job 5:7 - Yet man is born unto trouble, as the sparks fly upward.
• Proverbs 22:15 - "Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child;"
• Job 15:14-16 - "What is man, that he should be clean? and he which is born of a woman, that he should be righteous? Behold, he putteth no trust in his saints; yea, the heavens are not clean in his sight. How much more abominable and filthy is man, which drinketh iniquity like water?"
• Romans 7:24 - "O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?"
• Jeremiah 17:9 - "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?"
• Matthew 26:41 - "...The spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.
  
• Ephesians 2:2-3 - "Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Ephesians 2:3-4 says mankind are sinners by nature because it says by nature men are children of wrath and they are called the "children of disobedience." This means that while it is true that sin is the breaking of the Law (1 Jhn 3:4), sin is not just something we do alone, it is something in who a person is (i.e. a sinner). So while Adam and Eve were originally formed by God to be morally good, they had free will to sin and their failure to obey God had led their descendants to be born with a sinful nature (whereby their hearts would be desperately wicked). This is why all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. Because if we were born 100% innocent, then by sheer mathematical probability, at least one person in the human history would have not sinned (Not counting Jesus Christ of course because He is holy and separate from sinners - See Hebrews 7:26).

We are born in the image of Adam (who is earthy).

1Co 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
1Co 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
1Co 15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
1Co 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

The second man is the Lord from heaven and we (believers) are to bear the image of the heavenly. This means we were not originally born to be spiritual or to be heavenly. It's why we need to be born again spiritually by Jesus Christ (the second man or the last Adam). Granted, this does not mean babies are not saved. Babies are simply unaware of knowing how to sin. Sin is not imputed where there is no Law (Romans 5:13). Babies do not know about any law, so sin cannot be imputed to them. So while babies do carry the sin of Adam (or the sin nature of Adam), they have not put forth any kind of sin or evil works to be judged. But yet, they do carry the sin of Adam within them (Which proves itself true by the fact they will sin later when they grow up). Jesus died for the sins of the entire world. So this very act by Jesus saves babies. If Jesus did not go to the cross, not even babies would have been saved. All of humanity would have been condemned. For Jesus Christ is our Savior; It is not our own own innocence or goodness alone that saves us!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Hebrews 9:16-17
"For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth."

The simple fact of these verses is as long as Christ was alive, His NT was not in effect. It would only come into effect some point AFTER He died. Under the OT law as that Pharisee and publican lived under, all that was required to be in saved, in a covenant relationship to God was a physical birth to a Jewish family with ties back to Abraham. The NT gospel requires a spiritual rebirth to be in a NT covenant relationship with God. So those men are not even examples of how one today gets into a NT covenant relationship with God.

Again, there is no indication that the Parable of the Tax Collector was exclusive to the Old Testament and does not apply to the New Testament. For example: I can demonstrate to you the changes of how the Sabbath is no longer in effect by pointing you to Colossians 2:14-17. This is what you need to do if you are to demonstrate a change. This is why the New Testament after the cross does not indicate that seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus has ended. In fact, on the contrary, we can see seeking forgiveness with the Lord even after the cross (Acts of the Apostles 8:22, Romans 10:14, 1 John 2:1, 1 John 1:9, Hebrews 4:16).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Eph 2:9, the OT law required on to keep all of it perfectly, flawlessly to be justified and if one could do that then he could glory in his own effort in keeping the law sinlessly. Yet the Jew could not keep it perfectly, therefore the law could not justify men in the sight of God (Galatians 3:11). But obedience can justify, even though one's obedience will not be perfect. Bit God made obedience a necessary condition to receive His free gift. Since obedience is not perfect it cannot be said to be a work of merit. Hence obedience and works of merit are not the same thing.


Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, condemnation is earned.

But salvation is a free gift so it cannot be earned. Yet God made salvation a conditional gift with the condition being obedience. Therefore obedience cannot earn salvation but is simply meeting a condition placed upon the free gift. No different than Noah meeting God's condition in building the ak to receive the free gift of salvation from the flood. Naaman meeting God's condition to dip 7 times to receive the free gift of healing.

If a person believes they have to do the work of baptism to be saved, then it is not a free gift. Free gifts by nature are gifts given to a person without them having to do any kind of work to get it. Do parents make their children to work in the morning before they are allowed to have a free gift on Christmas? If so… that does not sound like normal gift giving.

Granted, I don’t celebrate Christmas and don’t encourage anyone to do so. But the point here is that giving gifts does not involve us having to do a work to get it. This is why you don’t understand being saved initially by God’s grace. You are approaching Initial Salvation with a Law based Jewish mindset (See again: Romans 10:1-4 and then compare this with Romans 4:9-12, and Romans 4:3).

 

[Waiting on him]

Paul declares the gospel and defines it for us in this above passage. It is believing that Christ died for our sins, He was buried, and risen the third day according to the Scriptures. If a person believes this gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, they are obeying the gospel message.
There is no mention here of water baptism as a part of the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. This would need to be here if what you say is true, but it simply is not exist in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4

Correct no mention of any works.

 

[Waiting on him]

Water baptism in the name of Christ after the cross was simply done as a part of the misunderstanding by the apostles in the beginning. God later made it clear to Paul that Christ sent him not to baptize but to preach the gospel. This is why Paul basically said he was glad he did not baptize many. Again, baptism was imposed upon believers until the time of reformation (See: the word washings in Hebrews 9:10 in the Greek at BlueLetterBible; This same Greek word baptismos is translated also as baptisms).

baptisms in Hebrews is speaking of washing ones hands. The wash pots at Cana were a good example of the laws they incited in which they’d wash there hands. They were as many here focused on the outside of the cup.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Correct no mention of any works.

Yes, I believe according to the Bible that there is only one gospel and that is described clearly in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 and that it is not of works. Believing the gospel is how we are initially saved (Which is a process of salvation without works). This is not to say there is not another process of salvation that follows later that does include works, though (i.e. the Sanctification of the Spirit of God to live a holy life). 2 Thessalonians 2:13 says that God has chosen us to salvation through Sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth (Which is a call of the gospel - 2 Thessalonians 2:14). 2 Thessalonians 2:13 is not the gospel, but it is merely the call of the gospel. The gospel is 1 Corinthians 15:1-4.

So there is…

#1. The gospel (1 Cor. 15:1-4), and
#2. The call of the gospel (2 Thess. 2:13-14).​

Each of these things are each separated by time.
The gospel comes first in our lives, and then it is followed afterwards by the call of the gospel.

It’s the same with Titus 2:11-12.

There is…

#1. God’s grace (which teaches us)…
#2. To deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world.​

For Christ…

“…gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.” (Titus 2:14).​

Also see Ephesians 5:25-27.

This is extremely vital because we are told to follow after holiness without which no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14). Note: Hebrews 12:14 also includes making peace with all men. So this “holiness” is not a person believing they can sin and still be saved on some level because they believe Jesus paid for their future sins (as many falsely teach nowadays).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

baptisms in Hebrews is speaking of washing ones hands. The wash pots at Cana were a good example of the laws they incited in which they’d wash there hands. They were as many here focused on the outside of the cup.

Yes, it would include this but it would not exclude John the Baptist’s water baptism that was still under the Old Covenant. Remember, John the Baptist was the last OT prophet (Luke 16:16) (Matthew 11:12-13) and he instituted water baptism of repentance (Whereby a person would confess of their sins to the Lord (God) when they were being baptized).

In addition, keep in mind that the New Covenant did not officially begin until Christ’s death (Matthew 26:28) (Hebrews 9:17) (Matthew 27:51). Both Jesus and John the Baptist made a clear distinction between John’s water baptism and the baptism of the Holy Spirit by the testimony of Scripture (Matthew 3:11) (Acts of the Apostles 1:5). Jesus was the one who was going to baptize with the Holy Spirit according to John the Baptist (Matthew 3:11). This would be the new form of baptism in the New Covenant (but some Christians were slow to catch up with the changes that God made) (Please slowly and carefully read Acts of the Apostles 18:24-28, and Acts of the Apostles 19:1-5). Paul says Christ did not send him to baptize but to preach the gospel (1 Corinthians 1:17).

Peter teaches that baptism was never for salvation in the sense of putting away the filth of the flesh (sin), but it was merely an answer of one having a good clean conscience before God (Read: 1 Peter 3:21; Note: Compare the words “filth of the flesh” in 1 Peter 3:21 with the swords “filthiness of the flesh” in 2 Corinthians 7:1). So they would confess of their sins to God and have a clean conscience and then be water baptized as a symbolic picture of their inner spiritual cleansing by what happened when they confessed their sins to God.

Romans 10:8-16 is beautiful. It ties into this. It is talking about calling upon the name of the Lord Jesus for salvation (implying that one is seeking forgiveness of their past life of sins with Jesus) whereby the believe the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. It’s talking about Initial Salvation here. So the real cleansing is the inner cleansing by God when we seek forgiveness with Him. Water baptism back in the day was only temporary and was merely symbolic of this inward cleansing. Water does not do anything but get a person wet.

Statements like Mark 16:16 that says, “He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;” is in reference to Spirit baptism (But the disciples simply did not get what Jesus was talking about - which was not the first time they misunderstood Jesus).

All believers are baptized into one Spirit and thus made to drink of one Spirit automatically when they seek forgiveness of their sins with Jesus Christ believing that He is their Savior.

“For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.” (1 Corinthians 12:13).