Israel? Or the church?

[Truth7t7]

That is mostly speculation, and driving a wedge, since it shows you don't really understand the Biblical revealing of the relationship between God's Israel and Christ's Church.

When some brethren hear the name Israel, they automatically think of the unbelieving Jews in the middle east, and scattered unbelieving Jews in the countries. That's because the preachers those brethren listen to keep their congregations harnessed to a tether on Bible teaching. They simply are not letting out the Real Truth in God's Word about Israel.

The real Biblical Truth about Israel...

1. Israel is the Salvation name which God gave to Jacob to represent Christ's Salvation The Gospel. It involves God's Birthright first given through Abraham, which involved the Promise by Faith.

2. In Galatians 3, Apostle Paul taught that those of Faith are the "children of Abraham", and inherit with faithful Abraham. God gave him the Promises and Abraham believed God, and God counted Abraham's Faith as righteousness.

3. God's Birthright blessings continued from Abraham to his son Isaac, and then to his son Jacob.

4. God gave Jacob the new name Israel, because as a prince Jacob prevailed with the Angel of The Lord.

5. Thus the name Israel is not just about the seed of Jacob; it's about God's Plan of Salvation, The Gospel. That is what Abraham believed was The Gospel, Jesus even saying at the end of John 8 that Abraham saw His day, and rejoiced! Apostle Paul in Galatians 3 even said The Gospel was preached to Abraham, saying that Abraham would become a father of many nations, which involves the Christian nations, since it involves The Gospel of Jesus Christ!

6. Apostle Paul in Ephesians 2, speaking to believing Gentiles, said they had become nigh to God's promises and covenants to Israel, what Paul called the "commonwealth of Israel". Thus Christ's Church is what God's Israel represents per His Word.

7. The Jews Biblically represent only the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi, and some small remnants of the northern ten tribes that refused king Jeroboam's calf idols in the north (2 Chronicles 11).

8. The northern ten tribes under Jeroboam, king of Israel of the tribe of Ephraim, were not known as Jews. The title of 'Jew' originated from the tribe of Judah.

9. The northern ten tribes made up the majority... of the seed of Israel. God scattered the ten tribes out of the holy land first, never to return as a people. The Jewish historian Josephus (100 A.D.) said the ten tribes were still beyond Euphrates in his day, and were a great number of people, too many to be counted.

10. To this day, the northern ten tribes are lost to the world, and to the Jews. Some Jewish scholars think they are lost forever and won't return. Other Jewish scholars see their return because it is Bible prophecy.

11. John N. Darby, one who pushed the false Pre-tribulational Rapture theory in 1830's Great Britain, also created what is called Dispensationalism. In that theory Darby created the idea that the Church is raptured to heaven by Jesus before the "great tribulation", and stays in heaven afterwards while the nation of Israel is restored on earth per OT prophecy. NONE of that idea follows Bible Scripture. Darby's dispensationalist idea is a TOTAL FABRICATION.

12. The foundation of Jews that make up today's nation of Israel in the middle east still represent only the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, Levi, and the small remnants of ten tribes that migrated south to Jerusalem in Jeroboam's day. But even the majority of these, along with strangers, that went captive to Babylon for 70 years, made up only a small remnant of total Jews in Babylon that returned to Jerusalem. The majority of the "house of Judah" (as they were called) chose to stay in Babylon after the 70 years, and they were further scattered through the countries. Only in later centuries would some of them begin to return to the holy land.

13. Christ's Church is... God's Israel, because the name Israel is... the Salvation name involving The Gospel of Jesus Christ. This is why Lord Jesus is to be King of Israel when He returns, and His 12 Apostles each sitting upon a throne judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Ezekiel 47 and 48 shows that eventual layout of the tribes of Israel in Christ's future Kingdom, on earth.

14. Per the Old Testament prophets, the tents of Israel are told to expand to include the believing Gentiles (Isaiah 54). There are several Scriptures in the Old Testament prophets that point to Gentiles saved and gathered 'with' the seed of Israel when God restores Israel back to their original habitations He promised their fathers.

It is Futurism that especially... HIDES... all the above Biblical facts. It reveals that the false Pre-trib Rapture theory of man is a doctrine of devils.

Good post Davy, I Agree with all points except 13 & 14

Yes the name Israel is the salvation of God given to Jacob, yes all promises made to Abraham were fulfilled in Jesus Christ the promised seed of man's salvation Galatians 3:16 with the Church being the Israel of God by faith

There wont be a restoration of Israel in a kingdom upon this earth as you suggest in points 13 & 14, Jesus Christ returns in fire and final judgement, dissolving the heavens and earth by fire (The End)

 

[Truth7t7]

Would you suggest that such pastors as duPlantis, Copeland, Hagan, and Hinn are genuine? Have they not corrupted God's church?

The figures mentioned above nor the (T)rinity (B)roadcasting (N)etwork, represents the protestant church on this earth

Those mentioned above are apostates, that extend from the Los Angeles Azusa street revival in 1906 known as pentecostalism

 

[Truth7t7]

@Enoch111 @Davy @teamventure
And you fellas are examples of whom I speak. Looking in the wrong direction for the danger. Israel you say. So long as the Antichrist focuses on Israel and the city of Jerusalem and it's temple,, the church is free. Prophecy isn't about the church, it's all about Israel. And Enoch can say he won't even be here to worry about it. The mark, the final tribulation and plagues, that's someone else's problem. You guys are already deceived and you perceive no danger to yourselves or your church, because Satan isn't bothered about you, he only has hatred for Israel. I could share how the Papacy fulfills the prophecies, but do you care? Are you interested? Your think the reformers gave their lives for nothing. A mistake. They pointed their collective fingers to the Antichrist, the Antichrist kills them, the Antichrist then invented an alternative hermeneutic, and the reformers' children believe the Antichrist.
Do you cover your eyes and say, nothing to see here? Nothing here worth investigating? No questions to be answered? Enoch says it's one man therefore it cannot be the Papacy. Yet he ignores every other criteria not thinking that the one man had to live for nearly 2000 years. Not thinking that it could be a succession of men ruling over the one institution. Why do you write off other possibilities without due diligence? Your eternal lives are at stake here, and you are willing to pin you entire future on an unproven and unprovable thesis pertaining to events that haven't taken place yet? That's the gamble of the century that is.

The Great Trib Will Be Upon The Antichrist And Wicked, The Church Is Protected, Dont Be Deceived

There's Going To Be An End Times Persecution, The Beast And His Kingdom Are The Target Of God's Empowered (Two Witnesses)

The Great Tribulation Will Come Upon The Wicked World, While The (Sealed Church) Is Protected

The (Sealed Church) will be present on earth and protected, when wicked men are tormented 5 months, desiring to die as death flees

All saved believers are (Sealed) by God, Eph 1:13, 4:30

Ephesians 1:13KJV
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Ephesians 4:30KJV
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

It Was Commanded, Only Those Without God's Seal Will Be Tormented, The Sealed Church Is Protected

Revelation 9:3-6KJV
3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.

Plagues upon The Beast and his Kingdom, a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Revelation 11:3-6
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Revelation 16:1-11KJV
1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.
2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.
8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.
9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.
10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,
11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

 

[Truth7t7]

@Enoch111 @Davy @teamventure
And you fellas are examples of whom I speak. Looking in the wrong direction for the danger. Israel you say. So long as the Antichrist focuses on Israel and the city of Jerusalem and it's temple,, the church is free. Prophecy isn't about the church, it's all about Israel. And Enoch can say he won't even be here to worry about it. The mark, the final tribulation and plagues, that's someone else's problem. You guys are already deceived and you perceive no danger to yourselves or your church, because Satan isn't bothered about you, he only has hatred for Israel. I could share how the Papacy fulfills the prophecies, but do you care? Are you interested? Your think the reformers gave their lives for nothing. A mistake. They pointed their collective fingers to the Antichrist, the Antichrist kills them, the Antichrist then invented an alternative hermeneutic, and the reformers' children believe the Antichrist.
Do you cover your eyes and say, nothing to see here? Nothing here worth investigating? No questions to be answered? Enoch says it's one man therefore it cannot be the Papacy. Yet he ignores every other criteria not thinking that the one man had to live for nearly 2000 years. Not thinking that it could be a succession of men ruling over the one institution. Why do you write off other possibilities without due diligence? Your eternal lives are at stake here, and you are willing to pin you entire future on an unproven and unprovable thesis pertaining to events that haven't taken place yet? That's the gamble of the century that is.

The catholic Church isnt the "Whore" of Revelation 17, nor is the Pope the antichrist as you suggest, Jerusalem is the whore mystery babylon the great, and the future Antichrist will be a Jew/Hebrew in decent

(Jerusalem) Is The Whore, Mystery Babylon The Great Of Revelation Chapter 17

The Levitical High Priest & Dressing represents "The Woman", that is dressed in purple, scarlet, gold, and precious stones as seen below

(Revelation) 17:4KJV
4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:

Yes, The Levitical High Priest, Dressed In Purple, Scarlet, Gold, And Precious Stones

(Exodus) 28:15-20KJV
15 And thou shalt make the breastplate of judgment with cunning work; after the work of the ephod thou shalt make it; of gold, of blue, and of purple, and of scarlet, and of fine twined linen, shalt thou make it.
16 Foursquare it shall be being doubled; a span shall be the length thereof, and a span shall be the breadth thereof.
17 And thou shalt set in it settings of stones, even four rows of stones: the first row shall be a sardius, a topaz, and a carbuncle: this shall be the first row.
18 And the second row shall be an emerald, a sapphire, and a diamond.
19 And the third row a ligure, an agate, and an amethyst.
20 And the fourth row a beryl, and an onyx, and a jasper: they shall be set in gold in their inclosings.

(Jerusalem) is the seven hilled city, where the woman sits, not Rome as many falsely claim.

(Revelation) 17:9KJV
9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.

List of cities claimed to be built on seven hills - Wikipedia
Jerusalem, Israel: Jerusalem's seven hills are Mount Scopus, Mount Olivet and the Mount of Corruption (all three are peaks in a mountain ridge that lies east of the Old City), Mount Ophel, the original Mount Zion, the New Mount Zion and the hill on which the Antonia Fortress was built.

The Roman Empire didnt exist to be guilty of the Prophets blood seen below, Jerusalem did.

(Revelation) 18:24KJV
24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

(Matthew) 23:29-37KJV
29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

 

[amigo de christo]

Israel and the church. Amen.
His plan remains for each.

The church is both believing jews and gentile .
As i bet you would agree . The thing is , paul said , about the UNBELIEVING NON CHURCH JEWS
THEY are not truly OF israel . SO what does that tell us . Exactly .
Was paul part of the church , was james , was peter , was jude , YEAH and they were all JEWS .
YET , paul made it very clear not all of ISRAEL were truly of ISRAEL . PONDER ON THAT FOR A LONG LONG WHILE .

 

[amigo de christo]

The catholic Church isnt the "Whore" of Revelation 17, nor is the Pope the antichrist as you suggest, Jerusalem is the whore mystery babylon the great, and the future Antichrist will be a Jew/Hebrew in decent

(Jerusalem) Is The Whore, Mystery Babylon The Great Of Revelation Chapter 17

The Levitical High Priest & Dressing represents "The Woman", that is dressed in purple, scarlet, gold, and precious stones as seen below

(Revelation) 17:4KJV
4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:

Yes, The Levitical High Priest, Dressed In Purple, Scarlet, Gold, And Precious Stones

(Exodus) 28:15-20KJV
15 And thou shalt make the breastplate of judgment with cunning work; after the work of the ephod thou shalt make it; of gold, of blue, and of purple, and of scarlet, and of fine twined linen, shalt thou make it.
16 Foursquare it shall be being doubled; a span shall be the length thereof, and a span shall be the breadth thereof.
17 And thou shalt set in it settings of stones, even four rows of stones: the first row shall be a sardius, a topaz, and a carbuncle: this shall be the first row.
18 And the second row shall be an emerald, a sapphire, and a diamond.
19 And the third row a ligure, an agate, and an amethyst.
20 And the fourth row a beryl, and an onyx, and a jasper: they shall be set in gold in their inclosings.

(Jerusalem) is the seven hilled city, where the woman sits, not Rome as many falsely claim.

(Revelation) 17:9KJV
9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.

List of cities claimed to be built on seven hills - Wikipedia
Jerusalem, Israel: Jerusalem's seven hills are Mount Scopus, Mount Olivet and the Mount of Corruption (all three are peaks in a mountain ridge that lies east of the Old City), Mount Ophel, the original Mount Zion, the New Mount Zion and the hill on which the Antonia Fortress was built.

The Roman Empire didnt exist to be guilty of the Prophets blood seen below, Jerusalem did.

(Revelation) 18:24KJV
24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

(Matthew) 23:29-37KJV
29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

The whore is jerusalem . No doubt on that . Due to what i read in revelation .
The WHORE WILL SIT OVER That city . ROME will and already does maintain much power and influence over jersusalem of today .
WHO ya think is the one UNITING EVERONE in the all inclusive new world order religion .
The pope is of satan . ON that no man should doubt . BUT all of this will be centered smack in jerusalem , as it already is beginning
big time . My advice , if you or anyone else is sitting in churches and they are huge on unity , relationships , getting along
BUT NOT ON SOUND DOCTRINE and reminders , GET OUT , ITS ALREADY INFECTED .

 

[Truth7t7]

The church is both believing jews and gentile .
As i bet you would agree . The thing is , paul said , about the UNBELIEVING NON CHURCH JEWS
THEY are not truly OF israel . SO what does that tell us . Exactly .
Was paul part of the church , was james , was peter , was jude , YEAH and they were all JEWS .
YET , paul made it very clear not all of ISRAEL were truly of ISRAEL . PONDER ON THAT FOR A LONG LONG WHILE .

Yes the Kingdom was taken from the Jews when they rejected jesus Christ the chief corner stone, the Church has taken this Kingdom, bringing forth its fruit

Matthew 21:42-43KJV
42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

 

[Truth7t7]

The whore is jerusalem . No doubt on that . Due to what i read in revelation .
The WHORE WILL SIT OVER That city . ROME will and already does maintain much power and influence over jersusalem of today .
WHO ya think is the one UNITING EVERONE in the all inclusive new world order religion .
The pope is of satan . ON that no man should doubt . BUT all of this will be centered smack in jerusalem , as it already is beginning
big time . My advice , if you or anyone else is sitting in churches and they are huge on unity , relationships , getting along
BUT NOT ON SOUND DOCTRINE and reminders , GET OUT , ITS ALREADY INFECTED .

Yes Jerusalem is the whore, and I believe the Pope will fulfill the role of the "False Prophet", and the antichrist/ beast will be a Jewish ruler

Yes the ecumenical movement is at the forefront of the future apostate religion, bringing all together as one, that will see the unsaved world receive the mark and worship the image, as the false prophet performs miracles before the beast

 

[amigo de christo]

Yes Jerusalem 8sthe where, and I believe the Popewill fulfill the roleofthe "False Prophet", and the antichrist/ beast will be a Jewish ruler

Yes the ecumenical movement isatthe forefront ofthe future apostate religion, that will see the unsaved receive the mark and worship the image, as the false prophet performs miracles before the beast

That sounds fairly accurate my friend .

 

[Enoch111]

Yet he ignores every other criteria not thinking that the one man had to live for nearly 2000 years.

To stretch 3 1/2 years to 2,000 years would be really S-T-R-E-T-C-H-I-N-G it.
1260 days/30 = 42 months/12 = 3 1/2 years = time, times, and half a time =
7 years/2.

 

[Truth7t7]

To stretch 3 1/2 years to 2,000 years would be really S-T-R-E-T-C-H-I-N-G it.
1260 days/30 = 42 months/12 = 3 1/2 years = time, times, and half a time =
7 years/2.

There is no 7 year tribulation found in scripture

Revelation 11:3 in1260 days, and Revelation 13:5 in 42 months are "Parallel" time frames of the two witnesses and the beast being present on this earth at the same time

As scripture clearly teaches, the two Witnesses are present on this earth to the final hours of earth existence in the 7th trump and final judgement

Verse 7, the two witnesses are killed

Verse 11/12 the two witnesses are raised from the dead, and ascend to heaven

Verse 13 The second woe takes place in the great earthquake the "Same Hour" the witnesses are raised

Verse 14/15 the third woe in the 7th Trump In (The End)

Verse 18 The final judgement Of All

Revelation 11:7-18KJV
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
11 And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

 

[Brakelite]

The figures mentioned above nor the (T)rinity (B)roadcasting (N)etwork, represents the protestant church on this earth

Those mentioned above are apostates, that extend from the Los Angeles Azusa street revival in 1906 known as pentecostalism

And Toronto.

 

[Brakelite]

To stretch 3 1/2 years to 2,000 years would be really S-T-R-E-T-C-H-I-N-G it.
1260 days/30 = 42 months/12 = 3 1/2 years = time, times, and half a time =
7 years/2.

Enoch, I love you brother and agree with much of what you contribute to this forum. But on this matter I think those covid masks are covering your eyes. You cannot validate and prove something that hasn't taken place yet. But the historicist approach had valid irrefutable evidence of the 1260 year initial tenure of the little horn. And it's official reinstatement//resurrection 120 years later. Oh, and it's continuing growth and increasing influence in world politics and religious affairs. And it's determined desire to establish it's mark on society. The current blindness in Christianity to her goals and the threat she is; the current gathering together of every religious persuasion under the sun under her auspices; and the respect shown her by the world politicians including your own who once repudiated any suggestion of a union with her, guarantees her success.

 

[Truth7t7]

And Toronto.

And Brownsville

 

[Davy]

"That is when many Protestants in Europe fled to the Americas."
- Good point.
----
Many of early settlers in North America came..
- From England & Continent..to escape persecution from the 'Church Establishment & State.'

Yeah, and those early settlers did not include Catholics, nor Mormons, nor the Jew's religion, nor eastern religions. The early settlers were Protestant Christians.

 

[Davy]

Good post Davy, I Agree with all points except 13 & 14

Yes the name Israel is the salvation of God given to Jacob, yes all promises made to Abraham were fulfilled in Jesus Christ the promised seed of man's salvation Galatians 3:16 with the Church being the Israel of God by faith

There wont be a restoration of Israel in a kingdom upon this earth as you suggest in points 13 & 14, Jesus Christ returns in fire and final judgement, dissolving the heavens and earth by fire (The End)

No sense in you agreeing with me on that, since you don't really know what I was talking about.

And if you believe all God's promises to Abraham have already been fulfilled, then that further shows you don't really know what all those promises are about. The Christ's 1st coming and the preaching of The Gospel was just one of them.

And there WILL... be a 'literal' restoration of the kingdom of Israel on this earth, as written in God's Word, in both Old and New Testament Books. Ezekiel 47 & 48 is Israel's final layout in the holy lands of promise. So because you go against that which is clearly written in God's Word, that shows you like push the leaven doctrines of man instead of staying in God's Word. That means... YOU ARE NOT TO BE TRUSTED.

 

[Davy]

@Enoch111 @Davy @teamventure
And you fellas are examples of whom I speak. Looking in the wrong direction for the danger. Israel you say. So long as the Antichrist focuses on Israel and the city of Jerusalem and it's temple,, the church is free. Prophecy isn't about the church, it's all about Israel. And Enoch can say he won't even be here to worry about it. The mark, the final tribulation and plagues, that's someone else's problem. You guys are already deceived and you perceive no danger to yourselves or your church, because Satan isn't bothered about you, he only has hatred for Israel. I could share how the Papacy fulfills the prophecies, but do you care? Are you interested? Your think the reformers gave their lives for nothing. A mistake. They pointed their collective fingers to the Antichrist, the Antichrist kills them, the Antichrist then invented an alternative hermeneutic, and the reformers' children believe the Antichrist.
Do you cover your eyes and say, nothing to see here? Nothing here worth investigating? No questions to be answered? Enoch says it's one man therefore it cannot be the Papacy. Yet he ignores every other criteria not thinking that the one man had to live for nearly 2000 years. Not thinking that it could be a succession of men ruling over the one institution. Why do you write off other possibilities without due diligence? Your eternal lives are at stake here, and you are willing to pin you entire future on an unproven and unprovable thesis pertaining to events that haven't taken place yet? That's the gamble of the century that is.

Those men continuing to push reformation philosophy have bewitched you. It is so... easy to study God's Word to know it's impossible for a pope to be the coming pseudo-Christ that is prophesied to come to Jerusalem and be exalted in place of God in a rebuilt temple. Even many of the early Church fathers well understood this, and even held that that false one would be born of Israel! (see Hippolytus)

 

[Davy]

My French Protestant forbears went to Britain.

Nonsense. The Protestant church in America is corrupted to the core. Most mega church televangelists are freemasons. The spiritualism of the occult is rife throughout Protestant America. Just as the OT temple was corrupted with idolatry and paganism, so the NT temple had followed suit. Would you suggest that such pastors as duPlantis, Copeland, Hagan, and Hinn are genuine? Have they not corrupted God's church?

If you believe that the spiritual Temple under Christ can be corrupted, then you are saying JESUS Himself can be corrupted. You need to check your wild speech before you bring evil down upon yourself.

 

[Ruminator]

The Pope is not "the Auntie-Christ." Nor is the end near. The end came c. 70 AD/CE with the return of Christ, the destruction of the Temple, Jerusalem and the Sinai Covenant Temple based theocracy, and the arrival of the New Creation aka the Body of Christ:

[1 John 2:18-19 NASB20] (18) Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour. (19) They went out from us, but they were not [really] of us; for if they had been of us, they would have remained with us; but [they went out,] so that it would be evident that they all are not of us.

If it was the last hour 2000 years ago, c. 68 AD/CE, it is foolish to look for "the Antichrist" now. To understand the various eschatology schools of thought, I recommend this guy's excellent collection of videos:

Peace.

 

[Davy]

The Pope is not "the Auntie-Christ." Nor is the end near. The end came c. 70 AD/CE with the return of Christ, the destruction of the Temple, Jerusalem and the Sinai Covenant Temple based theocracy, and the arrival of the New Creation aka the Body of Christ:

[1 John 2:18-19 NASB20] (18) Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour. (19) They went out from us, but they were not [really] of us; for if they had been of us, they would have remained with us; but [they went out,] so that it would be evident that they all are not of us.

If it was the last hour 2000 years ago, c. 68 AD/CE, it is foolish to look for "the Antichrist" now. To understand the various eschatology schools of thought, I recommend this guy's excellent collection of videos:

Peace.

No pope could ever be the coming Antichrist. He can be one of the "many antichrists", which is about Satan's servants. But the role of 'the Antichrist' is reserved for the devil himself at the end of this world.

And yes we are... very close to the end of this world with Christ's future return. In Revelation 11 there is a hint of how close...

Rev 11:8-9
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
KJV

That event is to occur within the 6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe period. Jesus returns after that on the 7th Trumpet as written there in Rev.11. The time of "great tribulation" is a short period to occur just prior to Lord Jesus' return, so that puts this event of God's two witnesses there in Jerusalem being about the tribulation timing.

When those two witnesses in Jerusalem are killed, and they will be two literal persons, and their dead bodies are left laying the street for the "nations" to "see", then just how... will the nations be able to see... their bodies for three and a half days??

It's called satellite technology, cell phones, TV, etc.

Satellite technology allows a broadcast to be beamed all the way on the other side of the earth, in outerspace to the international space station even!

When... was that kind of tech made possible? Only in the 20th century.

"Well how does that show how close we are to Christ's coming?", some would ask.

That same Revelation 11 chapters involves a standing Jewish temple in Jerusalem along with that time when those two witnesses prophesy for 1260 days there.

So we know the satellite tech. is ready, so now it's simply a matter of the orthodox Jews in Jerusalem building another temple for the end, which is required in order to fulfill Bible prophecy for the end.