new version of OSAS?

[BarneyFife]

Read my lips: "there is no such a thing as "free will." Jesus said: "without me you can't do anything!"

Oh, don't get me wrong. We can choose what time to get up in the morning, what breakfast to eat, what suit and shoes to wear....etc, but "free will" to choose for God? Nope!

To God Be The Glory

So you advocate staunch Calvinism? Is that it?

 

[BarneyFife]

@JunChosen

BTW, the last time someone (George H.W. Bush) famously uttered the words: "Read my lips," the words "No new taxes" followed, which ended up being a lie.

 

[TheslightestID]

What else would a perfect yardstick be? You used the term. What a bore. Pardon me while I slip into a coma.

Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. (Matthew 5:48)
​

Let's just call it a day.

Hope you feel better now. :)

 

[JunChosen]

So you advocate staunch Calvinism? Is that it?

I didn't see Calvin's name written here. Are you saying Jesus lied when He quoted John 15:5?

To God Be The Glory

 

[JunChosen]

@JunChosen

BTW, the last time someone (George H.W. Bush) famously uttered the words: "Read my lips," the words "No new taxes" followed, which ended up being a lie.

So you believe I lie. Hence, prove me wrong and show in Scripture where I can read about "free will" as opposed to John 15:5.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

But not of your own power. But by the power of the transformed life of the believer. He makes you worthy of the kingdom, not you or I - 2 Thessalonians 1:11. The danger of the works gospel in no way shape or form relieves the believer of his responsibility to put the deeds of the flesh to death by the Spirit. To not do that, on purpose, is nothing more than a rejection of the grace by which you were saved. It is a denial of Christ. Keep that up and he will surely deny you. That's the teaching that will build people up into people who will survive the coming judgment of fire. And the person who brings that message will receive his reward.

You and I may be aware of the “ Transformed Life” ....and we know it is not by our own power that anything “ good” ever happens, but my old Church never mentioned it.....it was more like “ whoever has the strongest will-Power gets to go to Heaven for his reward...

It seems like 50 years ago , the Methodist Church that I had to go to had a lot of “ catholicism” in it....I don’t know if it has changed....they got many things right, but I would NEVER send my children there....

I strain to try to put it altogether , but it was like “Jesus died for your PAST sins, but after THAT you had to “make yourself worthy”......I NEVER heard the Truth, which was that if I Believed the Gospel , I was “ MADE WORTHY by the Blood Of The Lamb” ....I never heard that Truth until I was in my mid thirties .....it changed EVERYTHING .

But not of your own power. But by the power of the transformed life of the believer. He makes you worthy of the kingdom, not you or I - 2 Thessalonians 1:11. The danger of the works gospel in no way shape or form relieves the believer of his responsibility to put the deeds of the flesh to death by the Spirit. To not do that, on purpose, is nothing more than a rejection of the grace by which you were saved. It is a denial of Christ. Keep that up and he will surely deny you. That's the teaching that will build people up into people who will survive the coming judgment of fire. And the person who brings that message will receive his reward.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Buddhists do righteous things, Jews do righteous things, Hindus do righteous things, Mormons do righteous things, Jehovah's witnesses do righteous things, are they righteous in God's sight?

Whenever someone levels this argument I don't know if they're praising the righteous things Buddhists and Hindus do, or rationalizing their own unrighteousness, because surely you as a Christian can see the difference between your Christian life and their self righteous life, right?

 

[Ferris Bueller]

You and I may be aware of the “ Transformed Life” ....and we know it is not by our own power that anything “ good” ever happens, but my old Church never mentioned it.....it was more like “ whoever has the strongest will-Power gets to go to Heaven for his reward...

It seems like 50 years ago , the Methodist Church that I had to go to had a lot of “ catholicism” in it....I don’t know if it has changed....they got many things right, but I would NEVER send my children there....

I strain to try to put it altogether , but it was like “Jesus died for your PAST sins, but after THAT you had to “make yourself worthy”......I NEVER heard the Truth, which was that if I Believed the Gospel , I was “ MADE WORTHY by the Blood Of The Lamb” ....I never heard that Truth until I was in my mid thirties .....it changed EVERYTHING .

Lol, I went to the Methodist church, too, as a kid. I don't remember learning anything there. Nothing. But a Methodist pastor I went to lunch with from the last Methodist church I attended with my folks did plant a valuable seed in my spirit that put me on the track to being born again. A couple of years after that I learned about 'relationship' vs. 'religion' and I fell on God's mercy and I was born again. It seems we all automatically default to 'religion' right out of the gate. But we have to be taught about 'relationship' before we can be born again.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Salvation is of God. He can forgive any one whom He wishes to forgive including the sin of "living in adultery/" Consider David who was after God's own heart, Scripture say. He IS in heaven!

Of course he can, and he will/did. Who even indicated he would not be forgiven?

What you are missing is, had David not sought forgiveness, was sorry and repentant, he would not have been forgiven.

In OSAS's book, repentance, being sorry, and asking forgiveness is not necessary.

David is in Heaven today for one reason—-he had Faith.

Perhaps the only man with more despicable deeds than David was Lot ( the guy that had sex with his own daughters) Lot died ....passed out drunk in a cave....and there is no record anywhere that he Repented Of Anything.....I guess it’s hard to say a prayer of repentance when you are passed out drunk.Lot was a wicked man, no record of repentance, yet he is included in the Book Of Hebrews as “ A Hero Of Faith “ His Faith Saved Him also......

The Sinful woman ( probably a prostitute) who wiped her tears from the feet of Jesus was told to go in peace—- “ Your FAITH has SAVED you”—— no Conditions , such as make sure you repent properly , or make sure that from now on you are a “ good girl” , or be sure to be sorry, or you are Saved for now but as the years go by , I’ll have my disciples check up on you to make sure that you are keeping the Commandments and staying “ worthy” of my Forgiveness.....it was Faith Plus Nothing.....the same then as it is now....


The price has been paid for every sin that was ever committed or will ever “ be “ committed.....The only question that remains now is this—— Did you “ Cash-In” to what was already accomplished at the Cross with Faith? Faith gets you the Grace That Saves you.....it does not seem “ fair” a lot of the time—- “ All Those Sinners out there “ getting away with” all those sins they committed!!! This is Outrageous! I’ll not have it!


Relax,Grace deniers and all of you Legalists out there....Nobody “ gets away with” anything in this life ....it might appear that “ the wicked prosper” , but they don’t.....God sees to that.....read the story of David’s life after His sin was revealed—- a total nightmare.....I wonder how much “ joy” Lot had in his life....

This side of the Cross , because of what God did “ FOR” us ......we don’t even have to ask for Forgiveness ...it’s already ours—- if we have Turned to God with Faith in Jesus Christ.....Plus Nothing.

We don’t have to Forgive Others in order to be Saved, now that we are no longer under Law....We look at our own wretchedness and see how God forgave us when He did not have to and how he forgave us when we did not deserve it....and that is the Motive for forgiving others —- if God forgave a wretch like me, why shouldn’t “ I” forgive my fellow man.....You Forgive Others because you WANT to , not because you HAVE to.....it should come Natural to you if you have God's Spirit in you.....if you don’t have “That Spirit ” in you , you are Lost anyway .....Make sure you GET that Spirit......REST in the Good News Of 1cor15:1-4.......

 

[TheslightestID]

David is in Heaven today for one reason—-he had Faith.

Perhaps the only man with more despicable deeds than David was Lot ( the guy that had sex with his own daughters) Lot died ....passed out drunk in a cave....and there is no record anywhere that he Repented Of Anything.....I guess it’s hard to say a prayer of repentance when you are passed out drunk.Lot was a wicked man, no record of repentance, yet he is included in the Book Of Hebrews as “ A Hero Of Faith “ His Faith Saved Him also......

The Sinful woman ( probably a prostitute) who wiped her tears from the feet of Jesus was told to go in peace—- “ Your FAITH has SAVED you”—— no Conditions , such as make sure you repent properly , or make sure that from now on you are a “ good girl” , or be sure to be sorry, or you are Saved for now but as the years go by , I’ll have my disciples check up on you to make sure that you are keeping the Commandments and staying “ worthy” of my Forgiveness.....it was Faith Plus Nothing.....the same then as it is now....


The price has been paid for every sin that was ever committed or will ever “ be “ committed.....The only question that remains now is this—— Did you “ Cash-In” to what was already accomplished at the Cross with Faith? Faith gets you the Grace That Saves you.....it does not seem “ fair” a lot of the time—- “ All Those Sinners out there “ getting away with” all those sins they committed!!! This is Outrageous! I’ll not have it!


Relax,Grace deniers and all of you Legalists out there....Nobody “ gets away with” anything in this life ....it might appear that “ the wicked prosper” , but they don’t.....God sees to that.....read the story of David’s life after His sin was revealed—- a total nightmare.....I wonder how much “ joy” Lot had in his life....

This side of the Cross , because of what God did “ FOR” us ......we don’t even have to ask for Forgiveness ...it’s already ours—- if we have Turned to God with Faith in Jesus Christ.....Plus Nothing.

We don’t have to Forgive Others in order to be Saved, now that we are no longer under Law....We look at our own wretchedness and see how God forgave us when He did not have to and how he forgave us when we did not deserve it....and that is the Motive for forgiving others —- if God forgave a wretch like me, why shouldn’t “ I” forgive my fellow man.....You Firgivecothers because you WANT to , not because you HAVE to.....it should come Natural to you if you have God's Spirit in you.....if you don’t have “That Spirit ” in you , you are Lost anyway .....Make sure you GET that Spirit......REST in the Good News Of 1cor15:1-4.......

David was repentant, look it up and see for yourself. If you want to pretend otherwise, thats up to you.

Have faith, and act like you have faith by being obediant to the lord and go to heaven. Teach a false Gospel where all we need to do is say we care while not acting like it, and end up with a serious pproblem between yourself and God.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

David was repentant, look it up and see for yourself. If you want to pretend otherwise, thats up to you.

Have faith, and act like you have faith by being obediant to the lord and go to heaven. Teach a false Gospel where all we need to do is say we care while not acting like it, and end up with a serious pproblem between yourself and God.

Of course David was repentant , but that was not why he was forgiven.....Judas was the “ king” of repenters —-so sorry for his Sin that he even returned the money back to the Pharisees—- how did that “ repentance” work out for him?

David and Judas both Sinned.....David turned to God with Faith..... Judas turned to a hangman’s noose .....he died in Unbelief—- the same way he lived.....his lack of Faith damned him.....David’s Faith got Him Saved ....just like in the case of Abraham—- He took David’s Faith and counted it as Righteousness....just like he did ours.....

 

[Cooper]

if you stop believing,were you ever really saved?

A person HAS to believe before they can stop believing.
.

 

[ScottA]

Following was my question, either answer it or don't:

What do you mean "we are not the judge of what sin is". I say fornication among other things is sin...why am i not to do that?

Fact is, I judge what sin is every day, it helps me to recognize, and stay away from it, and now you are telling me I am not the judge of what sin is?

Strange conmment.

Okay.

The greater explanation, is that "To everything there is a season, A time for every purpose under heaven", which changes the meaning of much of what would be considered sin. Killing, for instance: "You shall not murder.", but "he who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death" is okay.

There are thousands of other acts that work the same way. Even your example of fornication is subject to interpretation. My point is, just because we consider something to be unacceptable, doesn't make it a sin in every circumstance...even if we judge it to be so from our own perspective. So, regardless of our own thoughts on moral subjects, God's ways are higher, and we don't have the last say. It's not as simple as something always being right or wrong. That is legalism. But God doesn't actually work that way.

 

[Cooper]

Jesus is speaking to His believing followers.
Jesus says=====
John 14:1
“Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.”

John 14:7
.

 

[Cooper]

Okay.

The greater explanation, is that "To everything there is a season, A time for every purpose under heaven", which changes the meaning of much of what would be considered sin. Killing, for instance: "You shall not murder.", but "he who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death" is okay.

There are thousands of other acts that work the same way. Even your example of fornication is subject to interpretation. My point is, just because we consider something to be unacceptable, doesn't make it a sin in every circumstance...even if we judge it to be so from our own perspective. So, regardless of our own thoughts on moral subjects, God's ways are higher, and we don't have the last say. It's not as simple as something always being right or wrong. That is legalism. But God doesn't actually work that way.

God's ways ARE higher, we are not God, there is a time to be born, and a time to die. These are God's times.
.

 

[Cooper]

"Backslider" is a term used for Israel, but never used for a person born again.

Much love!

Depart from the faith, Fallen away...

BIBLE VERSES ABOUT FALLING AWAY
.

 

[ScottA]

.
SCRIPTURALLY Paul is saying, "abortion may be lawful for me," but not all things are beneficial. "All things are lawful for me," but I will not be dominated by anything. (1 Corinthians 6:12)

Should Christian doctors murder unborn babies because it is lawful according to the law of the land, or should they not be dominated by the law of the land and instead walk according to the Spirit for which there is no condemnation?

You tell me. Who do we follow, God or mammon?
.

You know the answer.

Nonetheless, that is all just semantics. The truth of this topic is not defined by any private interpretation, it is defined by Him who has the power to give it. And he has defined it.

 

[Cooper]

You know the answer.

Nonetheless, that is all just semantics. The truth of this topic is not defined by any private interpretation, it is defined by Him who has the power to give it. And he has defined it.

Just as long as you do not attribute to the apostle Paul the sayings popular in Corinth otherwise known as sin city.
.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Of course David was repentant , but that was not why he was forgiven.....Judas was the “ king” of repenters —-so sorry for his Sin that he even returned the money back to the Pharisees—- how did that “ repentance” work out for him?

10 Godly sorrow brings repentance that leads to salvation without regret, but worldly sorrow brings death. 2 Corinthians 7:10​

 

[Corlove13]

Salvation.......

WRONG- If God does NOT intervene in our lives we will still be lost!

Ezekiel 36:23-29

23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I [am] the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes.
24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.
25 ¶ Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them].
28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.
29 I will also save you from all your uncleannesses: and I will call for the corn, and will increase it, and lay no famine upon you.



Unfortunately it is you who do not know! Man is spiritually dead and it is impossible for him to have a free will, let alone about the things that relate to God. Read again Ezekiel 36 above.

To God Be The Glory

It is clear to me when one no longer cares if they sin or not, and if you would like to try to confuse the issue in order to blur the lines in attempt to make sin ok, that is expected of OSAS, but I don't, and never will buy your false doctrin.

If we fall away and begin living in sin, we need to get right with God again, period. And not listen to clowns that do not care about our soul, those who will lead one to an easy, "its ok to sin", path to destruction by teaching, no matter what you do, you cannot lose your salvation.

Don't listen to them, they are liars.

2 chronic 7:14

If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.