Thoughting again!....oh no, is that allowed?

[Ronald David Bruno]

It sounds fairly obvious to me (anyways), that you have not "experienced" such a theophany or christophany, (trying to glean the definitions of these 50 cent words from you're describing 'em), or you wouldn't be talking like you are. You would know the difference/s!
Just as is described by Jesus: "The sheep know MY voice!" There would be no asking! There would be no looking at, or for His face! There would be no confusion!
There would be just you and He! With you being like a dead man such as were the guards at Jesus' tomb when the stone was rolled away. Or, like Daniel was when he was so hard pressed in restraining his bowels, when in the Holy presence of God!
As you view your flesh body melting like so much candle wax spreading across the floor. As your heart and spirit are in His hand. But, there is no fear at this point! None!

The fear comes shortly after the beginning of this "experience", when this "tsunami of love" starts coming unto/into you. And just keeps cutting through you like a hot knife through butter. At first is quite enjoyable! But? when this tsunami keeps growing higher and deeper, (kinda like Jonah before the great fish rescue) and every thought you thought could "keep until the grave" gets blown away? It gets very scary!

As far as Angels are concerned? To me, anyways, they all have the same voice or voices.
Which is why, to "turn a phrase" of the democrats: "vote early....vote often!"
"Test the spirit/s early.....test the spirits often!"

But, we do agree that Angel/s as well as the Gift of the Holy Spirit, will warn you concerning worshiping them!

But as far as God telling one to take off ones' shoes as one is standing on Holy Ground?
No worries! God has that detail covered! :)

And then comes the "educational" parts, and exercises.
After spending $500.00 on a coupla Moody home school courses?
What must have been an Angel sent by God delivers me this message!
"You want them to teach you?
"Or Me?"
Revelation 14:6
And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
1 John 2:27
But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

And yet? After some almost 40 years of this? I'm still a work in progress!
Hebrews 10:3
It is a frightful and reverent thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
IOW? If/when God calls ya? The sooner ya answer Him? The better off we all shall be! :)

That paragraph was just a hypothetical situation btw.
What a strange post. I have not experienced a theophany, only a few have. I was passing on an explanation that I have learn from RC Sproul and others. You can look up the word in the dictionary, you should be able to understand - they are all 50 cent words. God wants to keep it simple, especially for those who have been struggling over certain concepts for 40 years and still don't have it right! ;)

 

[NayborBear]

It is what I am trying to convey.

(I'm not sure I'm buying into the idea that God is manifesting Himself as an angel.)

......And then there's this account of God not being an Angel....But, a man!

Genesis 32:
24 And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day.
25 And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob's thigh was out of joint, as he wrestled with him.
26 And he said, Let me go, for the day breaketh. And he said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me.
27 And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob.
28 And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.
29 And Jacob asked him, and said, Tell me, I pray thee, thy name. And he said, Wherefore is it that thou dost ask after my name? And he blessed him there.
30 And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.

Seems God can do pretty much whatever and whenever to whomever that pleases Him!

Or Israel just had a case of mistaken identity, eh? :)

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

How would a person who doesn't understand you know that he doesn't and therefore should not agree with you? How absurd

Barney, I have told you several times before, ask Sheriff Andy, he'll set you straight. Maybe that is what is missing in your life, a more mature, educated brother to come alongside you and be patient and get yiu on the right path - like Andy has always been.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

......And then there's this account of God not being an Angel....But, a man!

Genesis 32:
24 And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day.
25 And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob's thigh was out of joint, as he wrestled with him.
26 And he said, Let me go, for the day breaketh. And he said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me.
27 And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob.
28 And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.
29 And Jacob asked him, and said, Tell me, I pray thee, thy name. And he said, Wherefore is it that thou dost ask after my name? And he blessed him there.
30 And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.

Seems God can do pretty much whatever and whenever to whomever that pleases Him!

Or Israel just had a case of mistaken identity, eh? :)

That was the Lord, in theological terms, a Christophany. Glad you brought up that scripture.

 

[NayborBear]

What a strange post. I ha e not experienced a theophany, only a few have. I was passing on an explanation that I have learn from RC Sproul and others. You can look up the word in the dictionary, you should be able to understand - they are all 50 cent words. God wants to keep it simple, especially for those who have been struggling over certain concepts for 40 years and still don't have it right! ;)

Yeah? I kinda gathered from reading your reply that you hadn't had such an experience.
Hence my "testimony" to you. Well? to you and anyone else that reads it.
I agree that God rather likes the "K.I.S.S." concept.
As the using of "50 centers" displays to me anyways, a level of vanity contrary to simple.

And as can be seen in your convo with Wrangler? Too much room for misinterpretation.

Simple is better!

But, the good news is? You now have a first hand account to draw from, from one who has had one of them watcha-may-calls-'ems.

Think the Bible refers to it as one who has "been in the Spirit." :)

 

[quietthinker]

It is simply amazing how Satan can fool people even though they have their Bibles right in front of them. Michael would be really upset with these people who try to promote him. He would say "The LORD rebuke thee".

with respect Enoch but I wonder if you would apply your above statement to yourself also?

 

[Brakelite]

Haven't read every post in the thread, but many of them. Several points...
No-one has proved yet that Michael is an angel.
None has proved yet that by calling the pre-incarnate Christ a Messenger... That is, literally, Angel... means He is a created being.
No-one has bothered refuting the several references in the OT that undoubtedly present the Angel present at several events and taking part in several conversations as a Divine being.
And last, no-one has presented a sound reason why archangel (chief of the angels... Equivalent to Lord of hosts)l must be in reference to a created being. Why do you demand that the head over all the created angels must also be an angel?
Oh, and while I'm thinking about this, please prove that there is more than one archangel.

 

[Brakelite]

@Enoch111
Who is the Angel here? Who is the Lord saying, the Lord rebuke thee?

 

[Amazed@grace]

Haven't read every post in the thread, but many of them. Several points...
No-one has proved yet that Michael is an angel.
None has proved yet that by calling the pre-incarnate Christ a Messenger... That is, literally, Angel... means He is a created being.
No-one has bothered refuting the several references in the OT that undoubtedly present the Angel present at several events and taking part in several conversations as a Divine being.
And last, no-one has presented a sound reason why archangel (chief of the angels... Equivalent to Lord of hosts)l must be in reference to a created being. Why do you demand that the head over all the created angels must also be an angel?
Oh, and while I'm thinking about this, please prove that there is more than one archangel.

Jude9 But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not himself dare to condemn him for slander but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”

 

[amigo de christo]

I think I'll stick with the Bible.

Exactly .

 

[Enoch111]

with respect Enoch but I wonder if you would apply your above statement to yourself also?

Why would I, unless you can show me a good reason from Scripture regarding this matter?

 

[quietthinker]

Why would I, unless you can show me a good reason from Scripture regarding this matter?

why would you??..lol, because pride says, it doesn't apply to me ....in particular, this part of your statement, 'It is simply amazing how Satan can fool people even though they have their Bibles right in front of them.'

 

[michaelvpardo]

No. Chapter 1 of the book of Hebrews addressed this Heresy which has been broached by cultists since the 1st century. Jesus isn't Michael as at least one modern cult asserts, Jesus isn't Lucifer as the Luciferians assert, He's the eternal Son of God as the bible asserts.

 

[michaelvpardo]

yet the angel revealing things to Daniel in chapter 12:1 tells us that Michael is the great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people.

It seems to me that the Great Prince who does this is none other than Jesus.

That would be because you misunderstand scripture and are still under the sway of the spirit of error. You must be born again.

 

[michaelvpardo]

You think Michael is Jesus? Have you ever heard of over-thinking?

If you aren't familiar with the cult that calls themselves Jehovahs witnesses, this is their doctrine and they are anathema Maranatha (accursed at the return of the Lord.)

 

[michaelvpardo]

This passage came to mind...

"For He did not subject to angels the world to come, concerning which we are speaking. But one has testified somewhere, saying, “What is man , that You remember him? Or the son of man , that You are concerned about him? You have made him for a little while lower than the angels; You have crowned him with glory and honor , And have appointed him over the works of Your hands; You have put all things in subjection under his feet.” For in subjecting all things to him, He left nothing that is not subject to him. But now we do not yet see all things subjected to him. But we do see Him who was made for a little while lower than the angels, namely, Jesus, because of the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, so that by the grace of God He might taste death for everyone.
Hebrews 2:5‭-‬9 NASB1995

And Jesus is God in flesh.

Colossians 2:9

For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form,

And was God in the very beginning:

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being. In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
John 1:1‭-‬5 NASB1995


So how I see it...is He was higher then the angels beforehand, and gave that up even to come to earth to die for us. Very humbling to think about.

But the cool part, is I believe this means we will one day be higher then the angels as well.

Amen and Anen.

 

[michaelvpardo]

Righty!....I read Hebrews 1 again. How do you see it putting Jesus being Michael to rest?

You must be born again to comprehend spiritual things. Your mind is captured by the spirit of this age.

 

[michaelvpardo]

to get a perspective....in the same vein, if we substituted the word 'angels' for 'men'...would that diminish who Jesus is in himself? I wouldn't have thought so. Wasn't he so much better than men as his name is so much better than theirs?....name meaning, character.

That's one of the errors of the accursed Jehovah's witnesses. Their founders, without any sound knowledge of biblical languages, substituted words in the bible to create their accursed New World Translation, specifically to deny the person of God's son. This is the spirit of antichrist in the world.

 

[michaelvpardo]

Yes, no doubt, He is God incarnate.

However, according to the flesh He is "made of the seed of David" (Romans 1:3 (kjv), Isaiah 45:11).

True enough, but as the scripture says "a tabernacle you have prepared for me" and as He said Himself, "Before Abraham was, I Am.

 

[michaelvpardo]

not saying God is a created being....please read again Renniks.

Yes you are if you're saying that He was an angel, because the Angels, the host of heaven, were created on the 4th day, by the word of God and Jesus is the Word made flesh.