Why does everyone seem to need to come up with their own belief and doctrinal formula?

[Rockerduck]

Well then that leaves a few questions.

Consider the fact that the Bible says the world is a flat disc protected by a dome over it? Not only does the Bible say this, but a bulk of ancient Jewish texts further verify this was their thoughts and so does general Mesopotamian writings. Ancient Jewish men believed that the earth was a disc held up by pillars above water and had a dome over it and that the sun and stars moved around the earth.

Now God would have known, so why would he have chosen to either direct it that way to men or why would those men have felt inspired to write it that way?

They didn't read the Old Testament.

Job 26:7 -He stretches out the north over empty space; He hangs the earth on nothing.

Isaiah 40:22 - It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

 

[St. SteVen]

St. SteVen said:
On the other side we have wackos creating their own cult religions. Thus opening the floodgates to error.

Isn't it great that this forum gives us wackos a platform where we can be heard?

LOL
My point of course, is that there is a middle ground where the believer that is indwelt by the Holy Spirit is fully capable of hearing from God while doing personal Bible study.

As a young man, I decided to give the Bible a hard look and determine whether I would continue with Christianity, or walk away. The Holy Spirit did indeed illuminate my way. Much of it has stuck with me.

[

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I t5hink the answer to the question is almost two easy

we all have individual minds. wants and desires.

Satan is out to destroy us, and keep us from Coming to Gods truth.

Satan makes up these very simple false truths in order to deceive people (play to their emotions or desires)

Satan makes this lie, and these people fall for it. But others do not. so he makes another lie. and other people buy into it, while still others do not. it goes on and on and on

I mean look what he did to the jews. He took a people of God who were given laws by God and had them so confused when Christ came that they did not recognize him.

We see he has done the exact same thing to the church.

 

[Rockerduck]

It is all in understanding the scriptures like the King James translators did. It is not only the Knowledge, but also the Holy Spirit who brings the wisdom and understanding.
Psalms 85:10 -
Mercy and truth are met together;
righteousness and peace have kissed each other.

 

[Lambano]

Interesting to see you write that. I had thrown that out as a possibility. Seems to have resonated on some level.

It did resonate. Our Bible Study group was studying something in the Pauline letters, I can't remember which one, and I was chasing down one of Paul's OT citations. (One of the things I liked about the NIV is they have decent footnotes.) When I saw what the OT actually said and the context in which it was said, I thought, "Whiskey-Tango-Foxtrot? Paul just pulled that interpretation out of his sphincter!"

Fortunately, I had several days to filter my thoughts before our next group meeting.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It is all in understanding the scriptures like the King James translators did. It is not only the Knowledge, but also the Holy Spirit who brings the wisdom and understanding.
Psalms 85:10 -
Mercy and truth are met together;
righteousness and peace have kissed each other.

King James?

Whats he have to do with it?

 

[Rockerduck]

King James?

Whats he have to do with it?

All the King James translators were Holy Spirit filled and had supreme knowledge of the scriptures.

 

[St. SteVen]

It did resonate. Our Bible Study group was studying something in the Pauline letters, I can't remember which one, and I was chasing down one of Paul's OT citations. (One of the things I liked about the NIV is they have decent footnotes.) When I saw what the OT actually said and the context in which it was said, I thought, "Whiskey-Tango-Foxtrot? Paul just pulled that interpretation out of his sphincter!"

Yes.
It's really a thing. And I've never heard anyone address it before.
And I don't have a HUGE problem with it if we at least acknowledge it.

One of my last thoughts on the subject was from a practical view.
Imagine how difficult it would be to check your quotes if you were writing on a scroll with a dip pen/quill and ink.
The quotes were probably from memory. No way they could measure up to our standard for quote integrity.
And it seems that it was standard practice to quote whatever came to mind and attribute it to inspiration.
Thus making the quote prophetic, even if it was not the intention of the quoted writer.

I was astounded when Jewish non-Christians claimed that what we called Messianic prophecies were no such thing.
And when I read them in context I could see their point. With the exception of Isaiah 53. (and a few others)

[

 

[St. SteVen]

Fortunately, I had several days to filter my thoughts before our next group meeting.

Did you inform the group of your findings? (brave soul)
If so, what was the reaction?
If not, what is wrong with small groups? Just a lot of glad-handing. (sigh)

I'm careful not to share everything I am thinking in a small group.
But I do present some thought-provoking questions, which leave them stunned at times. - LOL

[

 

[Skovand]

They didn't read the Old Testament.

Job 26:7 -He stretches out the north over empty space; He hangs the earth on nothing.

Isaiah 40:22 - It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

Again. I would recommend doing what I suggested. For a fact, one of the verses you quoted supports their position. Again. If you want to understand something it’s best to do the work yourself.

For example. What’s the ancient Jewish word for sphere versus what’s the ancient Jewish word for a circle, which is a circular flat disc?

 

[David in NJ]

As wheat among tares, I suppose we are both part of the problem and the solution. Thank God that He is working all things together for good for those who love Him according to His purpose.

BINGO and Good Morning

 

[Eternally Grateful]

All the King James translators were Holy Spirit filled and had supreme knowledge of the scriptures.

That is great for back when they interpreted the word (Although I am not sure they all were)

But how does this help today?

 

[Rockerduck]

Again. I would recommend doing what I suggested. For a fact, one of the verses you quoted supports their position. Again. If you want to understand something it’s best to do the work yourself.

For example. What’s the ancient Jewish word for sphere versus what’s the ancient Jewish word for a circle, which is a circular flat disc?

God promised to preserve His words forever, I believe the KJV is that preservation. Therefore, it doesn't matter what someone a thousand years ago said, it is the Holy Spirit in the KJV translators who brought God's Word to the world and stood the test of time.

Psalms 12:6-7 -
The words of the Lord are pure words:
as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
7 Thou shalt keep them, O Lord,
thou shalt preserve them from this generation forever.

 

[Rockerduck]

That is great for back when they interpreted the word (Although I am not sure they all were)

But how does this help today?

See post 73. The KJV has stood the test of time.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

See post 73. The KJV has stood the test of time.

Post 73 is flawed. and does not answer the question.

The language of the KJV is not even used today. Many of the words have totally different meanings, and some are not even used.

So on the one hand, a young person may read it and not even know what the word means.

or another person may read it. look it up in a dictionary, and be given a modern defenition. which is nothing like the defenition used in the 1600's

Not to mention the fact. The english language itself is flawed. and this causes contextual errors. or a flawed book.

 

[marks]

We see he has done the exact same thing to the church.

Yes, there are many here in our midst, wolves, though they may not audibly growl, but they devour just the same.

Much love!

 

[Rockerduck]

Post 73 is flawed. and does not answer the question.

The language of the KJV is not even used today. Many of the words have totally different meanings, and some are not even used.

So on the one hand, a young person may read it and not even know what the word means.

or another person may read it. look it up in a dictionary, and be given a modern defenition. which is nothing like the defenition used in the 1600's

Not to mention the fact. The english language itself is flawed. and this causes contextual errors. or a flawed book.

Ok. The KJV is not a book you pick up and read. It's more like a carpenter book, or a mechanic book. You have to learn the technical names and definitions, and most go to school to learn, but you can learn on your own. You can study the KJV with a dictionary and commentary until you are learned.

 

[rockytopva]

Dr Satish Kumar... Whose church in India went from 25 to almost 400,000... Claiming that in order to journey to a more promised place we must escape the clutches of Shittim. It nice when any doctrinal formula brings us to a place of actual deliverance!

And Israel abode in Shittim, and the people began to commit whoredom with the daughters of Moab. And they called the people unto the sacrifices of their gods: and the people did eat, and bowed down to their gods. And Israel joined himself unto Baalpeor: and the anger of the Lord was kindled against Israel. - Numbers 25:1-3

 

[rockytopva]

Shittim... Or a bad place... Is what motivates people to generate doctrinal formulas.

 

[amadeus]

““You can enter God’s Kingdom only through the narrow gate. The highway to hell is broad, and its gate is wide for the many who choose that way. But the gateway to life is very narrow and the road is difficult, and only a few ever find it.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭7‬:‭13‬-‭14‬ ‭NLT‬‬

Upon reading last night this popped out at me again. This verse could be taken many different ways. A very narrow and difficult road is typically one less traveled. Anyway; people must ultimately decide for themselves however they will decide to travel.

@ScottA

Indeed, people must decide but if they do not allow themselves to be led by the Spirit, how can they decide rightly?

"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jeremiah 10:23

Why was it that Jesus came?

"The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly." John 10:10

And how is it that a person is to obtain that for which Jesus came?

"For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God." Romans 8:13-14 KJV