What is "Parousia"?

[David in NJ]

I could not agree more, but identifying that foundation in a world ruled by the devil may not be as apparent as you seem to imagine.....

The Jews thought that they were God’s nation and that their relationship to Abraham guaranteed that God would always be with them.....but John the Baptist set them straight...

Matt 3: 7-10....
“When he caught sight of many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to the baptism, he said to them: “You offspring of vipers, who has warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Therefore, produce fruit that befits repentance. 9 Do not presume to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ For I say to you that God is able to raise up children for Abraham from these stones. 10 The ax is already lying at the root of the trees. Every tree, then, that does not produce fine fruit is to be cut down and thrown into the fire.”

Thinking that the religious system that you are a part of is truly “Christian” and therefore its fundamental beliefs cannot be wrong, is falling into the same trap as the first century Jews did.

If “the whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one”, (1 John 5:19) then we would expect deception to be around every corner.....and it is.

Because God’s spirit creates unity and cohesion within the body, it becomes obvious that those claiming to be part of that body, when they are not in agreement with others making the same claim, shows that they are fooling themselves.

There is one group of Christians in this world who teach the truth......and are fulfilling their obligation to be preachers and teachers as Jesus instructed. (Matt 28:19-20)...so there cannot be many who are in disagreement with one another who can claim to do that. All must be in agreement. (1 Cor 1:10) Christendom just continues to be more fragmented. Their fragmentation is proof that God is not among them. God’s spirit unites...it does not divide his worshippers.

As part of his prophesy on the end times, Jesus said that he would appoint “a faithful and wise servant” who would be charged with “feeding” Christ’s entire household of fellow slaves, their “food at the proper time”. (Matt 24:45) Only those feeding at his table would be well nourished spiritually, and understand the need for peaceful unity within that body.....all would be believing the same things and teaching one message about the kingdom of God “in all the inhabited earth” (Matt 24:14)
This is not a buffet where we just help ourselves to what is palatable to us individually.....it is served as complete meals, at the appropriate times, and we all must eat the same “food”.

When I was part of Christendom’s church system, I realised that I had no idea what God’s Kingdom was...or how it “comes” or what it’s purpose was...how God’s will was to “be done on earth as it is in heaven”....that was never explained to me. All emphasis was on going to heaven, not living on earth. (Isa 45:18)

I also came to see that the Lord’s Prayer, which we recited every week, was full of information that was lost in the parroting......they were just words, and as I said them, they meant very little apart from the fact that Jesus taught us to say them......they are not meaningless anymore because I came to see that this Prayer was not to be endlessly recited for every occasion.....it was to be a model for our own prayers. Jesus never said “pray this prayer”...he said “pray this way”....

Just understanding what I was praying for, and what those words meant, opened up a whole new world of discovery for me. I became an avid Bible student after that. I have never stopped studying and gleaning gems from that treasure chest....and still they come.

Now start obeying the Teaching that comes from the Word of God.

Arguing against "It is written" will only prevent you from SEEING the Whole Counsel of God.

This Whole Counsel of God begins with: "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God."

The Whole Counsel of Elohim(God) is in Yeshua HaMoshiach/Jesus the Christ - Isaiah 9:6

For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

 

[David in NJ]

I could not agree more, but identifying that foundation in a world ruled by the devil may not be as apparent as you seem to imagine.....

The Jews thought that they were God’s nation and that their relationship to Abraham guaranteed that God would always be with them.....but John the Baptist set them straight...

Matt 3: 7-10....
“When he caught sight of many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to the baptism, he said to them: “You offspring of vipers, who has warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Therefore, produce fruit that befits repentance. 9 Do not presume to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ For I say to you that God is able to raise up children for Abraham from these stones. 10 The ax is already lying at the root of the trees. Every tree, then, that does not produce fine fruit is to be cut down and thrown into the fire.”

Thinking that the religious system that you are a part of is truly “Christian” and therefore its fundamental beliefs cannot be wrong, is falling into the same trap as the first century Jews did.

If “the whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one”, (1 John 5:19) then we would expect deception to be around every corner.....and it is.

Because God’s spirit creates unity and cohesion within the body, it becomes obvious that those claiming to be part of that body, when they are not in agreement with others making the same claim, shows that they are fooling themselves.

There is one group of Christians in this world who teach the truth......and are fulfilling their obligation to be preachers and teachers as Jesus instructed. (Matt 28:19-20)...so there cannot be many who are in disagreement with one another who can claim to do that. All must be in agreement. (1 Cor 1:10) Christendom just continues to be more fragmented. Their fragmentation is proof that God is not among them. God’s spirit unites...it does not divide his worshippers.

As part of his prophesy on the end times, Jesus said that he would appoint “a faithful and wise servant” who would be charged with “feeding” Christ’s entire household of fellow slaves, their “food at the proper time”. (Matt 24:45) Only those feeding at his table would be well nourished spiritually, and understand the need for peaceful unity within that body.....all would be believing the same things and teaching one message about the kingdom of God “in all the inhabited earth” (Matt 24:14)
This is not a buffet where we just help ourselves to what is palatable to us individually.....it is served as complete meals, at the appropriate times, and we all must eat the same “food”.

When I was part of Christendom’s church system, I realised that I had no idea what God’s Kingdom was...or how it “comes” or what it’s purpose was...how God’s will was to “be done on earth as it is in heaven”....that was never explained to me. All emphasis was on going to heaven, not living on earth. (Isa 45:18)

I also came to see that the Lord’s Prayer, which we recited every week, was full of information that was lost in the parroting......they were just words, and as I said them, they meant very little apart from the fact that Jesus taught us to say them......they are not meaningless anymore because I came to see that this Prayer was not to be endlessly recited for every occasion.....it was to be a model for our own prayers. Jesus never said “pray this prayer”...he said “pray this way”....

Just understanding what I was praying for, and what those words meant, opened up a whole new world of discovery for me. I became an avid Bible student after that. I have never stopped studying and gleaning gems from that treasure chest....and still they come.

Well, i am not part of any "religious system" and neither do i follow the teachings that come from men.
What i am part of is the Body of Christ.
JESUS is the Head of the Body = that means we are under HIM.
If you are not under the LORD Jesus Christ, bowing your knee and heart unto Him, then you are not yet a part of His Body.

LORD Jesus said "no one comes to the Father but through ME, and no one comes to ME unless the Father draws them."

What do we SEE here?
a.) no one has access to the Father apart from the LORD Jesus Christ
b.) our Heavenly Father commands that you come and worship His Son = the LORD Jesus Christ

Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. Even so, Amen.
“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”
Revelation 1:7-8

You will find no greater Love then at the Feet of the LORD Jesus Christ for there HE will meet you and bestow His Great Love upon you and in you.
Amen

 

[Aunty Jane]

Well, i am not part of any "religious system" and neither do i follow the teachings that come from men.

If you hold beliefs that originated in Christendom's version of the Bible's narrative, and you hold the same core of the beliefs that she has spread throughout the world, masquerading as biblical "Christianity", then you are part of that religious system....denomination or not, your beliefs place you in their company.

What i am part of is the Body of Christ.

What then do you believe that the "body of Christ" is?

JESUS is the Head of the Body = that means we are under HIM.

Who is "we"?

If you are not under the LORD Jesus Christ, bowing your knee and heart unto Him, then you are not yet a part of His Body.

LORD Jesus said "no one comes to the Father but through ME, and no one comes to ME unless the Father draws them."

What do we SEE here?
a.) no one has access to the Father apart from the LORD Jesus Christ
b.) our Heavenly Father commands that you come and worship His Son = the LORD Jesus Christ

Yes, no one comes to the son without an invitation from his Father....and no one comes to the Father unless it is through the son.....how can they possibly be one entity? You have two doors to get through, with a hefty bouncer at each one.

What are we to believe when the son identifies his Father as "the only true God" without including himself. (John 17:3) He is said to be "God's holy servant" (Acts 4:27) So I have difficulty seeing the son as anything but what he called himself....and the fact that he identifies his Father as "my God" even in heaven. (Rev 3:12) How can God have a God?

Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. Even so, Amen.

How can those who pierced Jesus see him coming on the clouds of heaven? They are long dead.
And how can these clouds be literal when the earth is round and clouds are not visible to "every eye"? Only clouds directly above us are visible to us.
So, what do you envision when you read a verse like that? Why are the people on earth mourning?

“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”
Revelation 1:7-8

Going back a little....Rev 1:4-5...says
"John to the seven congregations that are in the province of Asia:

May you have undeserved kindness and peace from “the One who is and who was and who is coming,” and from the seven spirits that are before his throne, 5 and from Jesus Christ, “the Faithful Witness,” “the firstborn from the dead,” and “the Ruler of the kings of the earth.”

How many entities can you see mentioned there...?
"The one who is and who was and is coming"....."the seven spirits that are before God's throne"....."AND from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness"....
The "alpha and the omega" is the "Almighty" but you know, I cannot find a single direct mention of Jesus ever being addressed as the Almighty. He was called "theos" (god) which can mean he is 'divine or divinely authorized', but nowhere is Jesus called a deity. He would have to be called "ho theos" for that......but he never was.

Even in the prophesy in Isaiah 9:6,7, the "Prince of Peace" is called "Mighty God" which in the original language did not identify this Prince as the Almighty. ....a Prince is the son of a King.
So it is my belief that the scriptures do not say what most people have been led to imagine that they do....and when you go back centuries to the time when the scriptures began to be twisted, with the birth of Christendom, and look at the conduct of the ones who were claiming to represent Christ on earth at that time.....most people have grown up believing lies that were taught centuries before they were even born, by people who grossly misrepresented the one they claimed was their "Lord".

 

[CadyandZoe]

You have made an obvious error in both of your paragraphs.

1st statement - You started out on the Right Path but came to a wrong conclusion.

2nd statement - It was the Lord who spoke to Israel in the OT = IAM = the WORD became flesh.

Maybe you have never read this:
All this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying:

“Tell the daughter of Zion,
‘Behold, your King is coming to you,
Lowly, and sitting on a donkey,
A colt, the foal of a donkey.’ ”

i'm just scratching the surface here of Scripture

David,
When Jesus came the first time, he existed as Messiah the prince. Acts 3:15. Acts 5:31, Isaiah 9:6,7, exalted to the right hand of God as a Prince and a Savior,

As you may already know, a prince is the son of a king, in line to be king someday. Jesus is the son of God, will be granted dominion over all the kingdoms of the earth at some later -- a time we know as the Second Advent. During his first Advent, Jesus served as the prince of peace, the prince of life,

At that time, as Jesus points out, he will come with the clouds of heaven as the son of man when God almighty will grant him an eternal kingdom. That is when prince Jesus will become king Jesus in actuality. One like a son of man will be granted an eternal kingdom and dominion over all the kingdoms of the earth.

The concept "son of man" comes from two places: 2Samuel 7, and Psalm 8, where David marvels that God would give man dominion over all the kingdoms of the earth. This concept, then, forms the basis of Daniel 7 which says,

“I kept looking in the night visions,
And behold, with the clouds of heaven
One like a Son of Man was coming,
And He came up to the Ancient of Days
And was presented before Him.
14 “And to Him was given dominion,
Glory and a kingdom,
That all the peoples, nations and men of every language
Might serve Him.
His dominion is an everlasting dominion
Which will not pass away;
And His kingdom is one
Which will not be destroyed.

Jesus often referred to himself as "the son of man" and he meant it the way his ancestor David meant it. He (David) anticipated that one of his own sons would sit on his throne and rule over all creation. (Psalms 8) Jesus is that son of David, which is also that "son of man" of whom David spoke.

cc:
@Aunty Jane

 

[David in NJ]

David,
When Jesus came the first time, he existed as Messiah the prince. Acts 3:15. Acts 5:31, Isaiah 9:6,7, exalted to the right hand of God as a Prince and a Savior,

As you may already know, a prince is the son of a king, in line to be king someday. Jesus is the son of God, will be granted dominion over all the kingdoms of the earth at some later -- a time we know as the Second Advent. During his first Advent, Jesus served as the prince of peace, the prince of life,

At that time, as Jesus points out, he will come with the clouds of heaven as the son of man when God almighty will grant him an eternal kingdom. That is when prince Jesus will become king Jesus in actuality. One like a son of man will be granted an eternal kingdom and dominion over all the kingdoms of the earth.

The concept "son of man" comes from two places: 2Samuel 7, and Psalm 8, where David marvels that God would give man dominion over all the kingdoms of the earth. This concept, then, forms the basis of Daniel 7 which says,

“I kept looking in the night visions,
And behold, with the clouds of heaven
One like a Son of Man was coming,
And He came up to the Ancient of Days
And was presented before Him.
14 “And to Him was given dominion,
Glory and a kingdom,
That all the peoples, nations and men of every language
Might serve Him.
His dominion is an everlasting dominion
Which will not pass away;
And His kingdom is one
Which will not be destroyed.

Jesus often referred to himself as "the son of man" and he meant it the way his ancestor David meant it. He (David) anticipated that one of his own sons would sit on his throne and rule over all creation. (Psalms 8) Jesus is that son of David, which is also that "son of man" of whom David spoke.

cc:
@Aunty Jane

Yes, i fully understand the LORD coming into the world as a man to fulfill prophecy beginning in Genesis = which is the Gospel.

In the Plan of Salvation only the Blood of a Sinless Man can pay for the sins of all of mankind = the Gospel.

Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men.
And being found in appearance as a man,
He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross.
Philipians 2:5-8

Let us begin where we first learn Truth = Before Elohim WORD became a man = Genesis 1:1 = John 1:3

What some here fail to realize is that Before HE came into the world HE is Eternal God from the beginning in Genesis.
In the beginning was the Word, the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God.
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

******* Elohim WORD was always KING ******* === Isaiah chapter 43

Before Me there was no God formed,
Nor shall there be after Me.
I, even I, am the Lord,
And besides Me there is no savior.

I am the Lord, your Holy One,
The Creator of Israel, your King.”

FASTFORWARD to Matthew 21:1-5
Now when they drew near Jerusalem, and came to Bethphage, at the Mount of Olives, then Jesus sent two disciples, saying to them, “Go into the village opposite you, and immediately you will find a donkey tied, and a colt with her. Loose them and bring them to Me. And if anyone says anything to you, you shall say, ‘The Lord has need of them,’ and immediately he will send them.”

All this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying:

“Tell the daughter of Zion,
‘Behold, your King is coming to you,
Lowly, and sitting on a donkey,
A colt, the foal of a donkey.’ ”

Much more i can say on this but for now you need to feed on this Eternal Bread of Life.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Yes, i fully understand the LORD coming into the world as a man to fulfill prophecy beginning in Genesis = which is the Gospel.

Where does it say that “the LORD” came into the world as a man. The LORD (capital letters) in the OT is Yahweh. In no passage of the Bible is Jesus ever called “Yahweh”. The title "Lord" was an address to someone who is superior to you. A slave would address his master as "Lord".....titles are not names.
The British have a "House of Lords", but it isn't a "House of Gods".

In the Plan of Salvation only the Blood of a Sinless Man can pay for the sins of all of mankind = the Gospel.

The blood of a sinless mortal man is what paid for the sins of all sinful mankind. He had to be mortal or else he could not die. Since Yahweh is an immortal there is no way for him to die......and mere mortals cannot kill God.
The son of God came to do what his Father could not....he willingly volunteered to complete the mission for which his Father, whom he described as “the only true God” (John 17:3) had “sent” him.
The ‘first Adam’ lost everything for his children, but “the last Adam” gave his human life to buy it all back.
That is what redemption is....like for like. The ransom was an exact payment....no more, no less. One sinless human life for another.

Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men.
And being found in appearance as a man,
He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross.
Philipians 2:5-8

That is a very poor translation of that passage .....
In the original Greek, it does not say what is implied in this mistranslation....

The ESV gives a more accurate translation...
“Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.”

Being “in the form of God”, means what? What “form” does God have? According to John “God is a spirit” which means that God’s son was also a spirit, as are all who inhabit the heavenly realm.
He “DID NOT count equality with God a thing to be grasped” so it says the opposite of what your chosen translation implies. He was not trying to be equal to his Father, who is also his God. (John 20:17)

Jesus was “obedient to the point of death”.....to whom was he obedient? Himself?

It was his God who “highly exalted” him after his death and resurrection, and gave him a new name that was above every name....except of course the name of his Father Yahweh, who is called “the Most High over all the earth”. (Psalm 83:18) Can anyone be higher than the “Most High”?
So every knee bending and confessing that Jesus is Lord (not LORD) is to the glory of the Father, not the son.
Perhaps you need a better translation....?

What some here fail to realize is that Before HE came into the world HE is Eternal God from the beginning in Genesis.
In the beginning was the Word, the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God.
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

Colossians 1:15-17 clears that up I believe....
“He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together.” (ESV)

Being the “firstborn of ALL creation” makes him part of that creation. (Rev 3:14) He was used by his Father in the creation of ALL things. This is called agency as you can see there that Paul says “all things were created through him and for him.”
Agency is so common in the world and yet when God speaks about using his son as his agent, it is completely ignored. If creation is not only “through” him but also “FOR” him, how does that make sense unless Jesus is a completely separate entity, THROUGH who God created ALL things? God gave him the pleasure of assisting him in the creation of what he was going to give to him....(Proverbs 8:30-31)
Genesis 1:26 is God speaking to his "master workman". The son is the "us" and "our", using the power of God's spirit.

How do you read passages like that and not see what is plainly stated?

@CadyandZoe ....

 

[David in NJ]

Where does it say that “the LORD” came into the world as a man. The LORD ((capital letters) in the OT is Yahweh. In no passage of the Bible is Jesus ever called “Yahweh”. The title "Lord" was an address to someone who is superior to you. A slave would address his master as "Lord".....titles are not names.
The British have a "House of Lords", but it isn't a "House of Gods".


The blood of a sinless mortal man is what paid for the sins of all sinful mankind. He had to be mortal or else he could not die. Since Yahweh is an immortal there is no way for him to die......and mere mortals cannot kill God.
The son of God came to do what his Father could not....he willingly volunteered to complete the mission for which his Father, whom he described as “the only true God” (John 17:3) had “sent” him.
The ‘first Adam’ lost everything for his children, but “the last Adam” gave his human life to buy it all back.
That is what redemption is....like for like. The ransom was an exact payment....no more, no less. One sinless human life for another.

That is a very poor translation of that passage .....
In the original Greek, it does not say what is implied in this mistranslation....

The ESV gives a more accurate translation...
“Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.”

Being “in the form of God”, means what? What “form” does God have? According to John “God is a spirit” which means that God’s son was also a spirit, as are all who inhabit the heavenly realm.
He “DID NOT count equality with God a thing to be grasped” so it says the opposite of what your chosen translation implies. He was not trying to be equal to his Father, who is also his God. (John 20:17)

Jesus was “obedient to the point of death”.....to whom was he obedient? Himself?

It was his God who “highly exalted” him after his death and resurrection, and gave him a new name that was above every name....except of course the name of his Father Yahweh, who is called “the Most High over all the earth”. (Psalm 83:18) Can anyone be higher than the “Most High”?
So every knee bending and confessing that Jesus is Lord (not LORD) is to the glory of the Father, not the son.
Perhaps you need a better translation....?


Colossians 1:15-17 clears that up I believe....
“He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together.” (ESV)

Being the “firstborn of ALL creation” makes him part of that creation. (Rev 3:14) He was used by his Father in the creation of ALL things. This is called agency as you can see there that Paul says “all things were created through him and for him.”
Agency is so common in the world and yet when God speaks about using his son as his agent, it is completely ignored. If creation is not only “through” him but also “FOR” him, how does that make sense unless Jesus is a completely separate entity, THROUGH who God created ALL things? God gave him the pleasure of assisting him in what he was going to give to him....(Proverbs 8:30-31)
Genesis 1:26 is God speaking to his "master workman". The son is the "us" and "our", using the power of God's spirit.

How do you read passages like that and not see what is plainly stated?

@CadyandZoe ....

Aunty Jane

FYI - the more scriptures you post does not equate to = 'see, I told you so'

EXAMPLE - You said "The blood of a sinless mortal man is what paid for the sins of all sinful mankind. He had to be mortal or else he could not die."

the Lord Jesus said:

"Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again.
No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself.

I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from My Father.”

No one killed Jesus, not the whippings and viscious beatings, not the nails in His hands and feet, not the crown of thorns

 

[Aunty Jane]

Let us begin where we first learn Truth = Before Elohim WORD became a man = Genesis 1:1 = John 1:3

What some here fail to realize is that Before HE came into the world HE is Eternal God from the beginning in Genesis.
In the beginning was the Word, the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God.
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

******* Elohim WORD was always KING ******* === Isaiah chapter 43

Before Me there was no God formed,
Nor shall there be after Me.
I, even I, am the Lord,
And besides Me there is no savior.

I am the Lord, your Holy One,
The Creator of Israel, your King.”

This is Yahweh speaking.....not Jesus.

Isaiah 43:10-11..... (Tanakh)

"You are My witnesses," says the Lord, "and My servant whom I chose," in order that you know and believe Me, and understand that I am He; before Me no god was formed and after Me none shall be.		יאַתֶּ֚ם עֵדַי֙ נְאֻם־יְהֹוָ֔ה וְעַבְדִּ֖י אֲשֶׁ֣ר בָּחָ֑רְתִּי לְמַ֣עַן תֵּ֠דְעוּ וְתַֽאֲמִ֨ינוּ לִ֚י וְתָבִ֙ינוּ֙ כִּֽי־אֲנִ֣י ה֔וּא לְפָנַי֙ לֹֽא־נ֣וֹצַר אֵ֔ל וְאַֽחֲרַ֖י לֹ֥א יִֽהְיֶֽה:
11 I, I am the Lord, and besides Me there is no Savior.		יאאָֽנֹכִ֥י אָֽנֹכִ֖י יְהֹוָ֑ה וְאֵ֥ין מִבַּלְעָדַ֖י מוֹשִֽׁיעַ:

Psalm 83:18 says

Let them know that You-Your name alone is the Lord, Most High over all the earth.

יטוְיֵֽדְע֗וּ כִּי־אַתָּ֬ה שִׁמְךָ֣ יְהֹוָ֣ה לְבַדֶּ֑ךָ עֶ֜לְי֗וֹן עַל־כָּל־הָאָֽרֶץ:

Psalm 86:11.....from the Jewish Tanakh...

Teach me Your way, O Lord; I shall walk in Your truth. Unify my heart to fear Your name.

יאהוֹרֵ֚נִי יְהֹוָ֗ה דַּ֫רְכֶּ֥ךָ אֲהַלֵּ֥ךְ בַּֽאֲמִתֶּ֑ךָ יַחֵ֥ד לְ֜בָבִ֗י לְיִרְאָ֥ה שְׁמֶֽךָ:

The LORD is Yahweh יְהֹוָ֗ה

FASTFORWARD to Matthew 21:1-5
Now when they drew near Jerusalem, and came to Bethphage, at the Mount of Olives, then Jesus sent two disciples, saying to them, “Go into the village opposite you, and immediately you will find a donkey tied, and a colt with her. Loose them and bring them to Me. And if anyone says anything to you, you shall say, ‘The Lord has need of them,’ and immediately he will send them.”

All this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying:

“Tell the daughter of Zion,
‘Behold, your King is coming to you,
Lowly, and sitting on a donkey,
A colt, the foal of a donkey.’ ”

The man was told...."And if anyone says anything to you, you shall say, ‘The Lord has need of them,’ and immediately he will send them".
Who is "the Lord" here? It is Jesus, not God. Because the Jews stopped using God's name, the title "Lord" came to be viewed as a name, when it never was. It is a title widely used in Bible times as a respectful address.

It is Yahweh who appointed his son as King...and @CadyandZoe and myself have shown you, Jesus became King when God installed him as such at his appointed time. (Daniel 7:13-14)

According to Moses Yahweh will rule as King for all eternity....but for the thousand years allotted to Christ and his elect, kingship is theirs until they complete their mission to bring redeemed humankind back into reconciliation with their Creator....our bond with him was broken when Adam sinned.....so Jesus, acting in his Father's behalf was the agency through which that reconciliation takes place. This is what a mediator is for.....to bring two estranged parties back together......the mediator cannot be one of the parties he is trying to reconcile.

Only after one final test at the end of the thousand years will Jesus hand the reins back to the rightful Sovereign King of the Universe.

1 Cor 15:2--25...
"But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For as by a man came death, by a man has come also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ. 24 Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet."

Christ's rulership is for a specified time.....he has to put all his enemies under his feet as it was prophesied in Psalm 110:1-2.

The rulership of the Father will then last for all eterenity.

Much more i can say on this but for now you need to feed on this Eternal Bread of Life.

I am questioning what sort of stale bread you have been fed TBH...

 

[Aunty Jane]

EXAMPLE - You said "The blood of a sinless mortal man is what paid for the sins of all sinful mankind. He had to be mortal or else he could not die."

the Lord Jesus said:

"Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again.
No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself.

I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from My Father.”

No one killed Jesus, not the whippings and viscious beatings, not the nails in His hands and feet, not the crown of thorns

Again, you read right over what you do not wish to see....let's try that again....

"Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again.
No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself."

What is Jesus saying here....? As a free willed being, he had the say as to whether he would willingly lay down his life for mankind...or not. No one could force him to do that, but since he was the only "son of God" who could be "sent" to this earth as a human, that Yahweh could rely on to complete his mission successfully, Jesus' love for mankind created no hesitation in him....he would lay down his life willingly, confident in the knowledge that his Father's promise of a resurrection was a sure thing.
He would give up his life confident that he would take it up again.

"I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from My Father.”
That command came from his Father.....God's holy spirit was with Jesus throughout his ministry as it had been throughout his earthly life. Despite an attempt by the devil to have him put to death as an infant, Jesus presented himself for baptism to begin his earthly mission.
After three and a half years, his teachings having been dispensed to the "lost sheep of the house of Israel" he surrendered to the Jews and was executed as an innocent man....fulfilling prophesy.

The scriptures plainly state that God raised Jesus from the dead......he did not raise himself.

Acts 2:29-36...
“Brothers, I may say to you with confidence about the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. 30 Being therefore a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would set one of his descendants on his throne, 31 he foresaw and spoke about the resurrection of the Christ, that he was not abandoned to Hades, nor did his flesh see corruption. 32 This Jesus God raised up, and of that we all are witnesses. 33 Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this that you yourselves are seeing and hearing. 34 For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says,

“‘The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at my right hand, 35 until I make your enemies your footstool.”’

36 Let all the house of Israel therefore know for certain that God has made him both Lord and Christ, this Jesus whom you crucified.” (ESV)

 

[David in NJ]

This is Yahweh speaking.....not Jesus.

Isaiah 43:10-11..... (Tanakh)

"You are My witnesses," says the Lord, "and My servant whom I chose," in order that you know and believe Me, and understand that I am He; before Me no god was formed and after Me none shall be.		יאַתֶּ֚ם עֵדַי֙ נְאֻם־יְהֹוָ֔ה וְעַבְדִּ֖י אֲשֶׁ֣ר בָּחָ֑רְתִּי לְמַ֣עַן תֵּ֠דְעוּ וְתַֽאֲמִ֨ינוּ לִ֚י וְתָבִ֙ינוּ֙ כִּֽי־אֲנִ֣י ה֔וּא לְפָנַי֙ לֹֽא־נ֣וֹצַר אֵ֔ל וְאַֽחֲרַ֖י לֹ֥א יִֽהְיֶֽה:
11 I, I am the Lord, and besides Me there is no Savior.		יאאָֽנֹכִ֥י אָֽנֹכִ֖י יְהֹוָ֑ה וְאֵ֥ין מִבַּלְעָדַ֖י מוֹשִֽׁיעַ:

Psalm 83:18 says

Let them know that You-Your name alone is the Lord, Most High over all the earth.

יטוְיֵֽדְע֗וּ כִּי־אַתָּ֬ה שִׁמְךָ֣ יְהֹוָ֣ה לְבַדֶּ֑ךָ עֶ֜לְי֗וֹן עַל־כָּל־הָאָֽרֶץ:

Psalm 86:11.....from the Jewish Tanakh...

Teach me Your way, O Lord; I shall walk in Your truth. Unify my heart to fear Your name.

יאהוֹרֵ֚נִי יְהֹוָ֗ה דַּ֫רְכֶּ֥ךָ אֲהַלֵּ֥ךְ בַּֽאֲמִתֶּ֑ךָ יַחֵ֥ד לְ֜בָבִ֗י לְיִרְאָ֥ה שְׁמֶֽךָ:

The LORD is Yahweh יְהֹוָ֗ה

The man was told...."And if anyone says anything to you, you shall say, ‘The Lord has need of them,’ and immediately he will send them".
Who is "the Lord" here? It is Jesus, not God. Because the Jews stopped using God's name, the title "Lord" came to be viewed as a name, when it never was. It is a title widely used in Bible times as a respectful address.

It is Yahweh who appointed his son as King...and @CadyandZoe and myself have shown you, Jesus became King when God installed him as such at his appointed time. (Daniel 7:13-14)

According to Moses Yahweh will rule as King for all eternity....but for the thousand years allotted to Christ and his elect, kingship is theirs until they complete their mission to bring redeemed humankind back into reconciliation with their Creator....our bond with him was broken when Adam sinned.....so Jesus, acting in his Father's behalf was the agency through which that reconciliation takes place. This is what a mediator is for.....to bring two estranged parties back together......the mediator cannot be one of the parties he is trying to reconcile.

Only after one final test at the end of the thousand years will Jesus hand the reins back to the rightful Sovereign King of the Universe.

1 Cor 15:2--25...
"But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For as by a man came death, by a man has come also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ. 24 Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet."

Christ's rulership is for a specified time.....he has to put all his enemies under his feet as it was prophesied in Psalm 110:1-2.

The rulership of the Father will then last for all eterenity.

I am questioning what sort of stale bread you have been fed TBH...

a.) You are My witnesses,” says the Lord,
b.) “And My servant whom I have chosen,
c.) That you may know and believe Me,
d.) And understand that I am He.
e.) Before Me there was no God formed,
f.) Nor shall there be after Me.
g.) I, even I, am the Lord,
h.) And besides Me there is no savior.

a.) Jesus replied, when the Holy Spirit comes upon you, and you will be My witnesses.....Acts 1:8

b.) Jesus says: "you have not chosen me but I have chosen you" - John 15:16

c.) Jesus says: "Verily, verily, I say to you, He that believes on me has life eternal. - John 6:47

d.) Jesus says: "if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins."

e.) "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God...the Word became flesh = God with us

f.) Jesus says: "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

g.) Jesus says: "Before Abraham I AM" and "Moses wrote about Me" and
h.) but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

Thus says the LORD, the King and Redeemer of Israel, the LORD of Hosts: “I am the first and I am the last, and there is no God but Me."
knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, like silver or gold, from your aimless conduct received by tradition from your fathers, but with the precious blood of Christ,

But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

 

[Aunty Jane]

a.) You are My witnesses,” says the Lord,
b.) “And My servant whom I have chosen,
c.) That you may know and believe Me,
d.) And understand that I am He.
e.) Before Me there was no God formed,
f.) Nor shall there be after Me.
g.) I, even I, am the Lord,
h.) And besides Me there is no savior.

a.) Jesus replied, when the Holy Spirit comes upon you, and you will be My witnesses.....Acts 1:8

b.) Jesus says: "you have not chosen me but I have chosen you" - John 15:16

c.) Jesus says: "Verily, verily, I say to you, He that believes on me has life eternal. - John 6:47

d.) Jesus says: "if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins."

e.) "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God...the Word became flesh = God with us

f.) Jesus says: "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

g.) Jesus says: "Before Abraham I AM" and "Moses wrote about Me" and
h.) Thus says the LORD, the King and Redeemer of Israel, the LORD of Hosts: “I am the first and I am the last, and there is no God but Me."
knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, like silver or gold, from your aimless conduct received by tradition from your fathers, but with the precious blood of Christ,

And you do understand that there is not one clear and unambiguous statement in any of your cross references there......they are all based on pre-conceived assumptions that are grafted over those scriptures. None of them say what you think they do.

If you read Exodus 3:14,15 in the Jewish Tanakh, you will see that God's name does not mean "I AM".
Yahweh was not making a statement about his existence but about what he would "BE" or "BECOME" to his chosen nation.

"God said to Moses, "Ehyeh asher ehyeh (I will be what I will be)," and He said, "So shall you say to the children of Israel, 'Ehyeh (I will be) has sent me to you.'"		ידוַיֹּ֤אמֶר אֱלֹהִים֙ אֶל־משֶׁ֔ה אֶֽהְיֶ֖ה אֲשֶׁ֣ר אֶֽהְיֶ֑ה וַיֹּ֗אמֶר כֹּ֤ה תֹאמַר֙ לִבְנֵ֣י יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל אֶֽהְיֶ֖ה שְׁלָחַ֥נִי אֲלֵיכֶֽם:
15 And God said further to Moses, "So shall you say to the children of Israel, 'The Lord God of your forefathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.' This is My name forever, and this is how I should be mentioned in every generation."		טווַיֹּ֩אמֶר֩ ע֨וֹד אֱלֹהִ֜ים אֶל־משֶׁ֗ה כֹּ֣ה תֹאמַר֘ אֶל־בְּנֵ֣י יִשְׂרָאֵל֒ יְהֹוָ֞ה אֱלֹהֵ֣י אֲבֹֽתֵיכֶ֗ם אֱלֹהֵ֨י אַבְרָהָ֜ם אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִצְחָ֛ק וֵֽאלֹהֵ֥י יַֽעֲקֹ֖ב שְׁלָחַ֣נִי אֲלֵיכֶ֑ם זֶה־שְּׁמִ֣י לְעֹלָ֔ם וְזֶ֥ה זִכְרִ֖י לְדֹ֥ר דֹּֽר:

Chabad.ORG

If "I AM" is not the actual name of God, then Christendom is calling on the name of the wrong deity.

 

[David in NJ]

And you do understand that there is not one clear and unambiguous statement in any of your cross references there......they are all based on pre-conceived assumptions that are grafted over those scriptures. None of them say what you think they do.

If you read Exodus 3:14,15 in the Jewish Tanakh, you will see that God's name does not mean "I AM".
Yahweh was not making a statement about his existence but about what he would "BE" or "BECOME" to his chosen nation.

"God said to Moses, "Ehyeh asher ehyeh (I will be what I will be)," and He said, "So shall you say to the children of Israel, 'Ehyeh (I will be) has sent me to you.'"		ידוַיֹּ֤אמֶר אֱלֹהִים֙ אֶל־משֶׁ֔ה אֶֽהְיֶ֖ה אֲשֶׁ֣ר אֶֽהְיֶ֑ה וַיֹּ֗אמֶר כֹּ֤ה תֹאמַר֙ לִבְנֵ֣י יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל אֶֽהְיֶ֖ה שְׁלָחַ֥נִי אֲלֵיכֶֽם:
15 And God said further to Moses, "So shall you say to the children of Israel, 'The Lord God of your forefathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.' This is My name forever, and this is how I should be mentioned in every generation."		טווַיֹּ֩אמֶר֩ ע֨וֹד אֱלֹהִ֜ים אֶל־משֶׁ֗ה כֹּ֣ה תֹאמַר֘ אֶל־בְּנֵ֣י יִשְׂרָאֵל֒ יְהֹוָ֞ה אֱלֹהֵ֣י אֲבֹֽתֵיכֶ֗ם אֱלֹהֵ֨י אַבְרָהָ֜ם אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִצְחָ֛ק וֵֽאלֹהֵ֥י יַֽעֲקֹ֖ב שְׁלָחַ֣נִי אֲלֵיכֶ֑ם זֶה־שְּׁמִ֣י לְעֹלָ֔ם וְזֶ֥ה זִכְרִ֖י לְדֹ֥ר דֹּֽר:

Chabad.ORG

If "I AM" is not the actual name of God, then Christendom is calling on the name of the wrong deity.

Jesus says to us the same He said to the Jews when He walked this earth:
Moses wrote about Me = I AM

As far as the Name of God and who God is for you to know Aunty Jane (as well as for everyone).
This is what Yahweh says to you - so pay attention!

Look to Me, and be saved,
All you ends of the earth!
For I am God, and there is no other.
I have sworn by Myself;
The word has gone out of My mouth in righteousness,
And shall not return,
That to Me every knee shall bow,
Every tongue shall take an oath.
Isaiah 45:22-23

Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name,
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Jesus says to us the same He said to the Jews when He walked this earth:
Moses wrote about Me = I AM

As far as the Name of God and who God is for you to know Aunty Jane (as well as for everyone).
This is what Yahweh says to you - so pay attention!

Look to Me, and be saved,
All you ends of the earth!
For I am God, and there is no other.
I have sworn by Myself;
The word has gone out of My mouth in righteousness,
And shall not return,
That to Me every knee shall bow,
Every tongue shall take an oath.
Isaiah 45:22-23

Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name,
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

None so blind.....you have not addressed the simple fact that God never said "I AM"...therefore Jesus never said it either.....

 

[keithr]

Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name,
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

It is apparent that Jesus is not God from 1 Corinthians 15:24-28 (WEB):

(24) Then the end comes, when he will deliver up the Kingdom to God, even the Father; when he will have abolished all rule and all authority and power.​

(25) For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet.​

(26) The last enemy that will be abolished is death.​

(27) For, “He put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when he says, “All things are put in subjection”, it is evident that he is excepted who subjected all things to him.​

(28) When all things have been subjected to him, then the Son will also himself be subjected to him who subjected all things to him, that God may be all in all.​

 

[David in NJ]

None so blind.....you have not addressed the simple fact that God never said "I AM"...therefore Jesus never said it either.....

Aunty Jane,

If you are not looking to Adonai Yeshua HaMoshiach for Salvation = then you are not saved.

Look to Me, and be saved,
All you ends of the earth!
For I am God, and there is no other.
I have sworn by Myself;
The word has gone out of My mouth in righteousness,
And shall not return,
That to Me every knee shall bow,
Every tongue shall take an oath.
Isaiah 45:22-23

Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name,
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth,
and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

 

[David in NJ]

It is apparent that Jesus is not God from 1 Corinthians 15:24-28 (WEB):

(24) Then the end comes, when he will deliver up the Kingdom to God, even the Father; when he will have abolished all rule and all authority and power.​

(25) For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet.​

(26) The last enemy that will be abolished is death.​

(27) For, “He put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when he says, “All things are put in subjection”, it is evident that he is excepted who subjected all things to him.​

(28) When all things have been subjected to him, then the Son will also himself be subjected to him who subjected all things to him, that God may be all in all.​

Good Morning Keithr, and thank you for the excellent scripture - amen

Did you ever notice that Yeshua only calls God His FATHER ???

Yeshua NEVER called His FATHER = the LORD

Yeshua NEVER said "my LORD and your LORD"

the LORD is Yeshua whereas God is His FATHER

ALSO - Please keep in mind that the "WORD was GOD" and the "WORD became flesh" therefore a new Dynamic established

Peace

 

[Aunty Jane]

Aunty Jane,

If you are not looking to Adonai Yeshua HaMoshiach for Salvation = then you are not saved.

Who said that I am not looking to Jesus for my salvation? You did.....I didn’t.
Jesus’ sacrifice paid the ransom demanded by God’s perfect law....a sinless life for e a sinless life.
He could not have been an immortal because Adam wasn’t, and the equivalency would therefore not have fulfilled the criteria. Christ died as Adam died and as he inflicted a dreadful inheritance on all his children......he had to be a 100% mortal human being.

Look to Me, and be saved,
All you ends of the earth!
For I am God, and there is no other.
I have sworn by Myself;
The word has gone out of My mouth in righteousness,
And shall not return,
That to Me every knee shall bow,
Every tongue shall take an oath.
Isaiah 45:22-23

Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name,
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

I gave you a clear explanation of Philippians 2:5-11 but apparently you read right over the obvious statements because they did not match how you want to interpret that scripture. The translation you used was also misleading in its rendering. Read as it was intended, it says the opposite of the way the KJV interpreted it.

Isaiah 45:22-23 is Yahweh speaking.....there is no other God but Yahweh....who is “the Most High over all the earth” (Psalm 83:18) No name could be higher than his. So please tell me how Jesus is given “a name which is above every name”? How does God exalt himself?
Yahweh has only one name in scripture, but many titles....Jesus OTOH has many names depending on the role that he is fulfilling.
In Rev 3:12 he says....
“The one who conquers—I will make him a pillar in the temple of my God, and he will by no means go out from it anymore, and I will write upon him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the New Jerusalem that descends out of heaven from my God, and my own new name.”

Jesus is addressing his God in these statements and this is after his return to heaven.
He also speaks about his “new name”.

And tell me how ‘bending a knee’ has to be worship. Bending a knee before someone in Bible times was a mark of humble respect. It still is in some countries today who retain a monarchy. Jesus is a King appointed by his Father to rule in a kingdom of his making.....this kingdom is the means by which Yahweh re-establishes his first purpose for mankind on this earth. It will last a thousand years in which time the human race will be returned to the previously sinless condition with which they were created. This is not a training ground for heaven....it never was.

And if we “confess that Jesus is Lord”....does that identify him as God, when that form of address was also common in Bible times....everyone addressed as “Lord” back then was not God. (1 Peter 3:6)

Now we also see there that making such a confession was to whose glory? To the Father’s glory, not the son’s.

It’s all there in plain sight if you actually read the words without the lens provided by Christendom’s teachings. Let the Bible speak in the plain terms that it uses without forcing scripture to say what it never did.

 

[keithr]

Did you ever notice that Yeshua only calls God His FATHER ???

Yeshua NEVER called His FATHER = the LORD

Yeshua NEVER said "my LORD and your LORD"

Jesus did, however, say:

John 20:17 (WEB):

(17) Jesus said to her, “Don’t hold me, for I haven’t yet ascended to my Father; but go to my brothers, and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”​

the LORD is Yeshua whereas God is His FATHER

God (YHVH) is Yeshua's Father, but YHVH is not Yeshua! Yeshua is not his own father, and God is not His own son!

ALSO - Please keep in mind that the "WORD was GOD" and the "WORD became flesh" therefore a new Dynamic established

See this post for an explanation of what "the word was God" could mean. However, we need to be careful not to turn this thread into another Trinity discussion, as the managers of the forum don't seem to like freedom of speech and discussing certain fundamental Christian beliefs. I don't understand why not!

 

[David in NJ]

Jesus did, however, say:

John 20:17 (WEB):

(17) Jesus said to her, “Don’t hold me, for I haven’t yet ascended to my Father; but go to my brothers, and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”​

God (YHVH) is Yeshua's Father, but YHVH is not Yeshua! Yeshua is not his own father, and God is not His own son!


See this post for an explanation of what "the word was God" could mean. However, we need to be careful not to turn this thread into another Trinity discussion, as the managers of the forum don't seem to like freedom of speech and discussing certain fundamental Christian beliefs. I don't understand why not!

EXACTLY - John 20:17 ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

but NOT = 'my LORD and your LORD'

Keep this in your mind & heart = the Word was God and the Word became flesh

BECAUSE - Yeshua fulfills these words

Truly You are God, who hide Yourself,
O God of Israel, the Savior!
But Israel shall be saved by the Lord
With an everlasting salvation;

For thus says the Lord(Word) = "Through Him(Word) all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made."
Who created the heavens,
Who is God,
Who formed the earth and made it,
Who has established it,

“I am the Lord, and there is no other.
I, the Lord, speak righteousness,
I declare things that are right. = JESUS fulfills this = "I AM the Way the Truth and the LIFE" = "my words are Spirit and LIFE"

And there is no other God besides Me,
A just God and a Savior; = Isaiah 9:6-7 , Luke 2:11 , Acts 5:29-32 , 1 John 4:14
There is none besides Me. = John 8:24

“Look to Me, and be saved,
All you ends of the earth!
For I am God, and there is no other. = "Looking to Jesus the Author and Finisher of our faith"

Isaiah 45:22-23 = ONLY fulfilled in JESUS
I have sworn by Myself;
The word has gone out of My mouth in righteousness,
And shall not return,
That to Me every knee shall bow,
Every tongue shall take an oath.

ONLY Fulfilled in JESUS = Philippians 2:9-11
Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

If you believe you are following YHWH but not the LORD Jesus = then you are not following YHWH but a false god.

If you believe that you can go directly to YHWH without coming to LORD Jesus = then you are deceived and following a false god.

If you believe now that Jesus died for your sins and all you need is YHWH = then you are deceived and following teachings of men.

Nobody comes to the Father but thru JESUS.

the FATHER says you are to worship His SON = John 5:18-23

Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God. Then Jesus answered and said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, but what He sees the Father do; for whatever He does, the Son also does in like manner. For the Father loves the Son, and shows Him all things that He Himself does; and He will show Him greater works than these, that you may marvel. For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will.
For the Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son,
that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father.
He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.

TODAY, if you hear His Voice, you can bow your knee and confess Jesus Christ as LORD.

 

[amigo de christo]

Yes, i fully understand the LORD coming into the world as a man to fulfill prophecy beginning in Genesis = which is the Gospel.

In the Plan of Salvation only the Blood of a Sinless Man can pay for the sins of all of mankind = the Gospel.

Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men.
And being found in appearance as a man,
He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross.
Philipians 2:5-8

Let us begin where we first learn Truth = Before Elohim WORD became a man = Genesis 1:1 = John 1:3

What some here fail to realize is that Before HE came into the world HE is Eternal God from the beginning in Genesis.
In the beginning was the Word, the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God.
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

******* Elohim WORD was always KING ******* === Isaiah chapter 43

Before Me there was no God formed,
Nor shall there be after Me.
I, even I, am the Lord,
And besides Me there is no savior.

I am the Lord, your Holy One,
The Creator of Israel, your King.”

FASTFORWARD to Matthew 21:1-5
Now when they drew near Jerusalem, and came to Bethphage, at the Mount of Olives, then Jesus sent two disciples, saying to them, “Go into the village opposite you, and immediately you will find a donkey tied, and a colt with her. Loose them and bring them to Me. And if anyone says anything to you, you shall say, ‘The Lord has need of them,’ and immediately he will send them.”

All this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying:

“Tell the daughter of Zion,
‘Behold, your King is coming to you,
Lowly, and sitting on a donkey,
A colt, the foal of a donkey.’ ”

Much more i can say on this but for now you need to feed on this Eternal Bread of Life.

This too is why we drink not of the blood . For the blood is the life .
Even the law POINTS TO JESUS .
The very sacrfice of animals , the BLOOD was what purified them . an aminal had to lose its life
in order for the cleansing of the flesh .
And yet a far greater sacrifice has been made which can cleanse even the very conscious of a man .
The life is in the blood and there is no blood that even could compare to that of one who was and is SINLESS
and unlike even the animals who did not VOLUNTEER to give up their lives , JESUS DID HIS OWN for the sake of the world that
all who would believe would have eternal life .
Another thing i have read on and seen a nugget of truth is this .
What was the very commandment given about the PRIESTS who were to enter into and offer the bread
and offerings . What could not been seen on him . NO BLEMISH on the outside . no mole , no dwarf
no etc . BUT THEN read the message that GOD giveth unto samuel and YE shall see WHO ALONE
was to be and only COULD BE THE ONE TRUE GREAT HIGH PRIEST .
For GOD told samuel something . HE said LOOK not on his outward appearance
FOR GOD LOOKS UPON THE HEART , what is on the inside .
A GREATER AND TRUE HIGH PRIEST was coming which could make the atonement for sins .
BUT that HIGH PREIST would have to be without BLEMISH ON THE INSIDE . THERE IS NO MAN that has not sinned .
SO ONLY ONE COULD BE THAT HIGH PRIEST . HE WHO NEVER SINNED .
HE alone who was worthy , righteous and without spot or blemish on the inside would be the very one
who alone could save mankind . ONLY GOD IS WITHOUT SIN . THUS THE WORD DID BECOME FLESH
the perfect holy righteous one took on the form of man , made in the likness of that same sinful flesh
so that HE alone would overcome and fullfill the law of righteous that all who do believe
would be made the RIGHTEOUSNESS OF GOD IN HIM . JESUS CHRIST THE KING .
Now let all that has breath and loves the LORD in SPIRIT and IN TRUTH
dance a jig of great praise and thanksgiving unto the MIGHTY GOD who sent the SON to be the savoir of the world
that all who do BELIEVE would be saved . JESUS IS who HE said HE IS
and as such LET US BELIEVE HIS EVERY WORD , FOR EVERY WORD HE EVER SPOKE CAME FROM GOD .
But the question now is , AND I KNOW YOU KNOW THE ANSWER , are we gonna follow
men and what they say GOD IS AND CHRIST IS , or are we gonna FOLLOW GOD AND CHRIST and simply LOVE and
embrace HIS TEACHINGS . The world and her religious do as they do
But lambs , WELL THEY DO AS GOD SAID , AS JESUS SAID to do . ANd they will not
heed a twister of the word , a strangers voice . FOR THE LORD goeth before them and is their rear gaurd .
THEY feast UPON the green pastures of HIS teachings and HE KEEPETH THEM SAFE .