Unitarianism vs Trinitarianism

[RLT63]

The $64,000 question: Is believing (or not believing) in the Trinity a salvation issue?

In other words, does it matter?

Act 16:30

and after he brought them out, he said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?”

Act 16:31

They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”
Act 16:32

And they spoke the word of Act 16:33

And he took them that very hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized, he and all his household.

 

[Matthias]

Act 16:30

and after he brought them out, he said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?”

Act 16:31

They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”
Act 16:32

And they spoke the word of Act 16:33

And he took them that very hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized, he and all his household.

What conclusion(s) do you draw from that in regard to my question about the Trinity?

 

[MatthewG]

The trinity is a huge subject, @Matthias, confusing and convoluted.

Salvation?

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.

 

[MatthewG]

I believe that by and through the Gospel of Christ, by the Spirit and praying a person can really understand and get to know all of those things Jesus stated and what he means if they just sit and take time to read and study their bible.

Thank you.

 

[RLT63]

What conclusion(s) do you draw from that in regard to my question about the Trinity?

I don't think anyone who got saved in the book of Acts understood the Godhead.

 

[Wrangler]

The average trinitarian isn’t aware of the history and doesn’t care anything about it.

… Why does the trinitarian pastor not teach the history of the doctrine of the Trinity?

Most people hate history in general. Oswald Spengler said that nothing is more quintessentially philosophy than history.

To have a fully developed word view that integrates all known facts takes a lot of work. For most people, ‘in the beginning’ starts in their lifetime. Anything earlier than that and their eyes glaze over. They could NOT care less.

 

[Matthias]

The trinity is a huge subject, @Matthias, confusing and convoluted.

That begins to get at the reason - which you indicated that you didn’t want to discuss - why you aren’t a trinitarian.

Salvation?

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.

When I was a trinitarian, I saw the Trinity in this passage.

I wonder if a trinitarian would tell you that he or she doesn’t.

 

[MatthewG]

Most people hate history in general. Oswald Spengler said that nothing is more quintessentially philosophy than history.

To have a fully developed word view that integrates all known facts takes a lot of work. For most people, ‘in the beginning’ starts in their lifetime. Anything earlier than that and their eyes glaze over. They could NOT care less.

That is true, most people do not want to take time to do the research and find out facts, and some people couldn't care anymore about that than being able to watch a YouTube video, or go do other things than read in general.

I would like to get better at reading old history, I have a Josephus, and Cassio Dio book which is interesting just never went through to read about the whole thing as my eye did generally glaze over and decide to find other things that excites them.

Tough stuff, kinda.

 

[Matthias]

I don't think anyone who got saved in the book of Acts understood the Godhead.

I think every single one of them understood exactly who God is.

 

[MatthewG]

That begins to get at the reason - which you indicated that you didn’t want to discuss - why you aren’t a trinitarian.

The reason mainly is that is simply a man-made tradition. Another reason is I am afraid that you could go on and on with me by continuously asking question which can be overbearing and annoying.

When I was a trinitarian, I saw the Trinity in this passage.

I wonder if a trinitarian would tell you that he or she doesn’t.

That is why I stated that I do not care. Salvation is founded in the Gospel of Christ which is the power of God unto Salvation.

 

[MatthewG]

Either you love the Calvinist or you hate them, there is no in-between unless you are trying to get some money off of them, and act like your their friend and then when your done with them you throw them away.

Either you love the unitarian, the muslim, the hindu, or you hate them. There is no in-between really, unless you have evil doings to do such manipulate them and use them for your own purposes.

That is the way I look even this titled thread Something Vs Something - when it should be love... in the sense of 1 Corinthians 13 for all people, even praying for the President of the United States.

You know people hated trump but Paul tells Timothy to pray for those in authority.

So Christianity itself is convoluted and confusing - unless you abide in Christ by and through the Spirit, @Matthias.

 

[Matthias]

The reason mainly is that is simply a man-made tradition.

I asked you how you came to that conclusion. I didn’t think it was necessary to add that trinitarians don’t.

Another reason is I am afraid that you could go on and on with me by continuously asking question which can be overbearing and annoying.

I’m biting my tongue here. I’ll give it a few minutes before deciding whether to leave it at that or not.

In the meantime, you have several good options. I recommend that you weigh them carefully.

That is why I stated that I do not care.

That’s not the reason you gave when you said that you don’t care about the things you specified that you don’t care about.

Salvation is founded in the Gospel of Christ which is the power of God unto Salvation.

See above.

 

[MatthewG]

I asked you how you came to that conclusion. I didn’t think it was necessary to add that trinitarians don’t.

You said you were once a trinitarian. What changed? Please share with me in a short paragraph or so.

I’m biting my tongue here. I’ll give it a few minutes before deciding whether to leave it at that or not

Don't make it bleed.

That’s not the reason you gave when you said that you don’t care about the things you specified that you don’t care about.

When it comes to individual subjectivism its not up to me to dictate what a person NEEDS to believe. All I can do is share what I have learned from the Bible.

Up to them to decide for themselves in their own soul. Some seek for truth and seek out the Bible and read some don't... it's not much a big deal because it is their own choice.

 

[RLT63]

I think every single one of them understood exactly who God is.

Luk 23:39

¶
And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.
Luk 23:40

¶
But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
Luk 23:41

And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.
Luk 23:42

And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
Luk 23:43

¶
And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

 

[Matthias]

Most people hate history in general. Oswald Spengler said that nothing is more quintessentially philosophy than history.

To have a fully developed word view that integrates all known facts takes a lot of work. For most people, ‘in the beginning’ starts in their lifetime. Anything earlier than that and their eyes glaze over. They could NOT care less.

My favorite subject in school was history. Not the names, places and dates, those those are indispensable elements. Things happen for a reason. All kinds of reasons. I was never content with just knowing that something happened. I always wanted to understand why something happened.

 

[Matthias]

Luk 23:39

¶
And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.
Luk 23:40

¶
But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
Luk 23:41

And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.
Luk 23:42

And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
Luk 23:43

¶
And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

I believe Jesus and the malefactor knew exactly who God is.

 

[Matthias]

You said you were once a trinitarian. What changed? Please share with me in a short paragraph or so.

My mind.

You have a lot of nerve asking me a question.

Don't make it bleed.

When it comes to individual subjectivism its not up to me to dictate what a person NEEDS to believe. All I can do is share what I have learned from the Bible.

Up to them to decide for themselves in their own soul. Some seek for truth and seek out the Bible and read some don't... it's not much a big deal because it is their own choice.

 

[MatthewG]

Thank you for answering.

Like I stated before,

When it comes to individual subjectivism its not up to me to dictate what a person NEEDS to believe. All I can do is share what I have learned from the Bible, or history, or news, or experience.

Up to them to decide for themselves in their own soul. Some seek for truth and seek out the Bible and read some don't... it's not much a big deal because it is their own choice.


Take care.

 

[Matthias]

Thank you for answering.

Like I stated before,

When it comes to individual subjectivism its not up to me to dictate what a person NEEDS to believe. All I can do is share what I have learned from the Bible.

Up to them to decide for themselves in their own soul. Some seek for truth and seek out the Bible and read some don't... it's not much a big deal because it is their own choice.


Take care.

I heard you.

 

[Wrangler]

My favorite subject in school was history. Not the names, places and dates, those those are indispensable elements. Things happen for a reason. All kinds of reasons. I was never content with just knowing that something happened. I always wanted to understand why something happened.

BINGO!

Me too.

The highest question is WHY. Without it, history is mindless.