There is no spiritual gift called "the gift of tongues".

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St. SteVen

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There are no miracle workers through which God channels his power. The gifts in NT biblical times were passed on and made manifest by the laying on of the apostle's hands, and they are all dead.
Are there still elders in the church?

James 5:14-15 NIV
Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the elders of the church
to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord.
15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well;
the Lord will raise them up. If they have sinned, they will be forgiven.

/ cc: @rebuilder 454
 
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DJT_47

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Are there still elders in the church?

James 5:14-15 NIV
Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the elders of the church
to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord.
15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well;
the Lord will raise them up. If they have sinned, they will be forgiven.

/ cc: @rebuilder 454
As I just said to someone else, prayer is NOT one of the miraculous manifestations of the Spirit listed in 1 Cor 12:8-10
 
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J

Johann

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As I just said to someone else, prayer is NOT one of the miraculous manifestations of the Spirit listed in 1 Cor 12:8-10
Is any sick among you -- In the early church, when miraculous gifts were imparted by the laying on of apostolic hands "as a sign to unbelievers," one of these was the gift of healing. In most early churches founded by the apostles some one of the elders would have this gift.
There is no more reason for the descent of this gift to our times than of any other miraculous power. This passage, then, describes what was peculiar to the early church. The sick were anointed by the elders with oil, a symbol of the Spirit, which effected the healing, hands were laid, and prayer offered. See Mar_6:13; also Isa_1:6, and Luk_10:34. - PNT

of the church -- This is the Greek term ekklesia, which literally meant "called out ones." It was used in the Septuagint to translate the Hebrew term qahal or "assembly" of Israel. In secular Greek it originally meant a local town assembly (cf. Act_19:32; Act_19:39; Act_19:41).
It is interesting theologically that the emphasis here is on local leaders, not itinerant faith healers. Healing is a spiritual gift which is mentioned in 1Co_12:9; 1Co_12:28 and was widely practiced in the NT and the early church.
Notice that the elders were to go to the sick when requested, not the sick to the gathered church meeting. This was to be a private spiritual procedure. - Utley

anointing -- This is an aorist active participle. The word aleiphô is not the common word for ceremonial, religious anointing (chriô or chrisma), but it is the common term for rubbing on medicine. Physical touching is always emotionally significant to the sick. This may have been a culturally expected act like Mar_6:13; Mar_7:33; Mar_8:23; Joh_9:6; Joh_9:11. - Utley
[See Utley at Jas 5.14 for a study of the Greek terms used of anointing.]
 
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St. SteVen

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As I just said to someone else, prayer is NOT one of the miraculous manifestations of the Spirit listed in 1 Cor 12:8-10
Seriously?
If healing results, it is an operation of the gifts of healing.
Gifts plural. What do you suppose that means?

1 Cor 12:8-10 NIV
To one there is given through the Spirit a message of wisdom,
to another a message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit,
9 to another faith by the same Spirit,
to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit,
10 to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy,
to another distinguishing between spirits,
to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,[a]
and to still another the interpretation of tongues.[b]

/
 
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St. SteVen

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New discovery indicates that
supposed "gibberish" tongues
are actually the French language.

Go to next post.

/
 
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Truthnightmare

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Is there anyone on this forum that claims to speak in tongues?

Is there anyone that can speak to all languages at once?

I would be more than happy to gather a few people of different languages that believe in Christ, and see if the words spoken by the tongue speaker can be understood by the people.
 
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rockytopva

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I was brought up GARBC Baptist and firmly believed all that Pentecostal stuff was of the devil. Until I came down to Virginia and stayed the summer with my grandmother. Pictured below is farmer I would work for in the hay field that year... Dallas would shout at work, shout in the hay field, and shout in church. He would also speak in tongues and run the aisles. He and his wife would operate a dairy farm and he would also work at the local ammunition plant. A very large soul his shouting would ring through the building. In the altar services he would kneel behind me in prayer and tears would roll off his cheek and onto my shoulders. A wonderfully large soul. Along with Dallas there were many others like him who would let the praises roll during church service along with speaking in tongues. During the altar service old Evans Linkous used to weep like a baby. And if he were to look back to catch the amazed look in my eye he would weep, "The Holy Ghost! The Holy Ghost!" And point to all the souls being blessed around the altar. After I experienced these things for myself the people would make a fuss, or in the words of the Apostle Paul, glorify God in me.

One day, after a beautiful autumnal week of beautiful Virginia fall and revival I lay on my bed with open door, listening to the Katydids sing their praises to God, reading Run Baby Run, with fireflies lighting up the mountain as they would fly, and heard the Spirit ask... "Put the book down" and then continue, "Where is all that hatred, strife, and bad feeling?" In which examining my eternal man there was nothing there but sheer beauty. I thought to myself... Oh my! I got exactly what those folks got!
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And in the words of George Clark Rankin, "It was the third Sunday in September, 1866 (in my case much later), and those Church vows became a living principle in my heart and life. During these forty-five long years, with their alternations of sunshine and shadow, daylight and darkness, success and failure, rejoicing and weeping, fears within and fightings without, I have never ceased to thank God for that autumnal day in the long ago when my name was registered in the Lamb's Book of Life." - The Life of George Clark Rankin

After church one day at the end of the month Robert Sheffey could not wait to trudge his way to the mountain peak, for his soul felt full and the morning sermon had opened his eyes to something. The minister had preached long and eloquently. His theme was that most of mankind did not respond to the call of God because they did not feel His lovingkindness." - Jess Carr's Saint of the Wilderness (the calling of RS Sheffey)

With the proper lovingkindness exemplified, I came to faith via Pentecostal Holiness. We do not have the lovingkindness of ways like the generations before and I worry we are going the way of the Methodist church. But... I am glad I picked it up when I did!
 
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rockytopva

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Is there anyone on this forum that claims to speak in tongues?

Is there anyone that can speak to all languages at once?

I would be more than happy to gather a few people of different languages that believe in Christ, and see if the words spoken by the tongue speaker can be understood by the people.
Here is a lady speaking in tongues at the Merrimac Pentecostal Holiness church...

 
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rockytopva

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The Merrimac Pentecostal Holiness church… If any were to say my church was far inferior to yours, and all that speaking in tongues is of the flesh… I would have to hang my head in great sorrow and agree! But in our time we would have given you the run for the money!
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David in NJ

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Yes--sect of the Nazarene= the new religion of the Nazarene( Jesus)--And fact-In Revelation Jesus speaks to 7 churches not to synagogues.
That is the claim of the Jews who did not BELIEVE the WORD that became flesh.

Acts ch24
5For we have found this man(JESUS) a plague, a creator of dissension among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes.

The only religion here in Acts 24:5 is that of Unbelieving Jews who are contrary to the WORD.
 

David in NJ

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Are there still elders in the church?

James 5:14-15 NIV
Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the elders of the church
to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord.
15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well;
the Lord will raise them up. If they have sinned, they will be forgiven.

/ cc: @rebuilder 454

Yes, there are still elders in the church.

You will find them in the back room - please dust off the cob webs - thank you
 

Truthnightmare

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Here is a lady speaking in tongues at the Merrimac Pentecostal Holiness church...

That’s not the tongues of Acts, because I didn’t understand a word of what she said… I went to a Pentecostal church, for a while… and I spoke in tongues, only thing is, all I did was mimic what the other people were doing… badashadade olamakhade la shamalaladada.

That’s not speaking in tongues… But I also have much documentation from former believers on the subject..

I LEFT THE TONGUES MOVEMENT BECAUSE OF:

1. Sincere convictions regarding their doctrines, emphases, and practices.
2. An unsound biblical basis for their doctrine of the Holy Spirit.
3. An over-emphasis of one gift of the Holy Spirit.
4. An under-emphasis of other doctrines.
5. Their "experience" orientation.
6. The undermining of the personality of the Holy Spirit.
7. Spiritual pride and disunity produced by their doctrine.
8. The teaching that tongues-speaking is a sign of spirituality and even of salvation.
9. Sign-seeking instead of faith.
10. Questionable activities practised and condoned.
11. The fear of questioning the so-called activities of the Holy Spirit.
12. The view that the Corinthian church was a model church.
13. The danger of claiming extra-biblical revelation.
14. The excesses and deceptive practices condoned in divine healing campaigns.
15. The tendency to blind, unquestioning devotion to popular leaders.
16. The possibility that the Charismatic Movement will be instrumental in producing the prophesied world ecumenical church of the last days.
17. Their distortion of the true Spirit-filled life."
 

rockytopva

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As far as the belief in tongues I did not come to faith Pentecostal Holiness because of the tongues. But because of the wonderful lives they lived. Especially as the married couples had happy homes.

"No such thing as a divorce was known among them" -George Clark Rankin... The Story of My Life Or More Than a Half Century As I Have Lived It and Seen It Lived Written by Myself at My Own Suggestion and That of Many Others Who Have Known and Loved Me

CHAPTER III An Old-Time Election in East Tennessee, and Else

In the earlier days, long before the railroads ran through that section, East Tennessee was a country to itself. Its topography made it such. Its people were a peculiar people - rugged, honest and unique. I doubt if their kind was ever known under other circumstances. Hundreds of them were well-to-do, and now and then, in the more fertile communities, there was actual wealth. Especially was this true along the beautiful water-courses where the farm lands are unequaled, even to this good day.

Among them were people of intelligence and high ideals. No country could boast of a finer grade of men and women than lived and flourished in portions of that "Switzerland of America." Their ministers and lawyers and politicians were men of unusual talent. Some of the most eloquent men produced in the United States were born and flourished in East Tennessee.

Those evergreen hills and sun-tipped mountains, covered with a verdant forest in summer and gorgeously decorated with every variety of autumnal hue in the fall and winter; those foaming rivers and leaping cascades; the scream of the eagle by day and the weird hoot of the owl by night - all these natural environments conspired to make men hardy and their speech pictorial and romantic. As a result, there were among them men of native eloquence, veritable sons of thunder in the pulpit, before the bar, and on the hustings.

But far back from these better advantages of soil and institutions of learning, in the gorges, on the hills, along the ravines and amid the mountains, the great throbbing masses of the people were of a different type and belonged almost to another civilization. They were rugged, natural and picturesque. With exceptions, they were not people of books; they did not know the art of letters; they were simple, crude, sincere and physically brave. They enjoyed the freedom of the hills, the shadows of the rocks and the grandeur of the mountains. They were a robust set of men and women, whose dress was mostly homespun, whose muscles were tough, whose countenances were swarthy, and whose rifles were their defense. They took an interest in whatever transpired in their own localities and in the more favored sections of their more fortunate neighbors. They were social, and practiced the law of reciprocity long before Uncle Sam tried to establish it between this country and Canada.

Who among us, having lived in that garden spot of the world, can ever forget the old-fashioned house-raisings, the rough and tumble log-rollings, the frosty corn-shuckings, the road-workings and the quilting-bees?

And when the day's work was over - then the supper - after that the fiddle and the bow, and the old Virginia reel. None but a registered East Tennessean, in his memory, can do justice to experiences like those. No such things ever happened in just that way anywhere on the face of the earth except in that land of the skies.

Therefore, the man who even thinks of those East Tennesseans as sluggards and ignoramuses who got nothing out of life is wide of the mark. They had sense of the horse kind; and they were people of good though crude morals. No such thing as a divorce was known among them. It was rare that one of them ever went to jail in our section; and, if he did, he was disgraced for life. I never knew, in my boyhood, of but one man going to the penitentiary and it was a shock to the whole country.
 

Keiw

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It is just that we're quick to jump into conclusion, when scripture must be witnessed based on context perspective.

For it is written; "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, 'Death is swallowed by victory.' "

Why not to you, the immortal saints shall probably inherit the earth forever?
The little flock will be changed into immortal spirit beings and go to heaven. The great crowd and resurrected ones who are not anointed will be mortal on earth.
 
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Keiw

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That's an even more... ludicrous statement. Those in Christ today know very well what Jesus Christ taught in His Word, because those 'in Christ' actually READ what He says in His Word. People like you do not, otherwise you wouldn't have made such an idiotic statement like the above.

What you say is not to be trusted.
Lets see--Matt 6:33-Keep on seeking-FIRST-the kingdom and his( YHVH(Jehovah)righteousness and all these things will be added( sustenance, covering, spirituality) --Are you taught to do this? Every true follower knows it by heart already.
 
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