The "We" in Ephesians

[MatthewG]

How could we be the we in the day in age?

That doesn’t make any sense at all. But if you think of the Apostles themselves and their history of being part of the nations of Israel, it starts to make a little more sense.

Paul is writing to the people in Ephesus, now if that is not important, then, I don’t know what to tell you… however he is stating of them “the Apostles” as “we” and that Paul is coming to write to the Gentiles concerning their invitation to salvation.

 

[Lambano]

In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,”. <- towards the gentiles.

He's talking to the Ephesians there. Says so in verse 1. And they are already "in Him". He's not writing a general-purpose theology paper, though the principles are applicable to all Gentiles.

 

[MatthewG]

He's talking to the Ephesians there. Says so in verse 1. He's not writing a general-purpose theology paper, though the principles are applicable to all Gentiles.

Not when he is stating we, but when you starts up, he is acknowledging what is being brought forth to the people at Ephesus.

You can disagree, in the end I find what I’m saying to remain true and I don’t have to move on the stance I’ve made.

He makes a distinction though between the apostles themselves and what’s being brought forth having come from the predestined nation of Israel whom brings forth Jesus and thus salvation to all through them.

 

[Lambano]

People typically forget the original audience and make themselves the original audience, I don’t think that is a good way to really deduct scripture.

Yes, I've noticed that.

 

[MatthewG]

I think I broke predestination doctrine.

 

[MatthewG]

It’s not something that is new though none of the things I’m saying is new.

 

[Lambano]

Cool. Well I hope you got your question answered, when it comes down to the “we” here in Ephesians. May Yahavah guide.

But I asked you. When Paul talks about those "in Him", what does he mean?

 

[MatthewG]

But I asked you. When Paul talks about those "in Him", what does he mean?

He talking about the apostles whom are in him, whom are going around continuing to spread the gospel. That is the only thing that makes logical sense. Concerning this introduction, at least to me.

 

[Lambano]

I think I broke predestination doctrine.

It was already broken because the Calvinists misappropriated verse 4 as a prooftext for their own theological system.

 

[MatthewG]

It was already broken because the Calvinists misappropriated verse 4 as a prooftext for their own theological system.

What’s good lambano. I’m still sick. Hope you and your family doing okay. My mom is also sick, but she going to work today.

 

[Lambano]

He talking about the apostles whom are in him, whom are going around continuing to spread the gospel.

So only the Apostles are "in Christ", and the "saints at Ephesus" are not "in Christ"?

 

[Lambano]

What’s good lambano. I’m still sick. Hope you and your family doing okay. My mom is also sick, but she going to work today.

Oh dear. I hope you and your mom get better soon.

 

[MatthewG]

So only the Apostles are "in Christ", and the "saints at Ephesus" are not "in Christ"?

Are you the predestined in Christ? Why you so hung up on this for?

 

[MatthewG]

If we in Christ don’t we love, God and love our neighbor and bring forth spiritual fruit brought by Yahavah? @Lambano?

But in this context it seems to me Paul is speaking of the apostles “we” I ain’t never seen Jesus rise again personally, but they witnessed it.

 

[Lambano]

He talking about the apostles whom are in him, whom are going around continuing to spread the gospel. That is the only thing that makes logical sense. Concerning this introduction, at least to me.

Try reading it with the view that "we" and "us" includes Paul, his companions, and the Ephesians themselves, and see what conclusions you arrive at.

 

[MatthewG]

Try reading it with the view that "we" and "us" includes Paul, his companions, and the Ephesians themselves, and see what conclusions you arrive at.

I’ve already stated what I’ve arrived at man. Don’t do that to me.


Paul is stating “we” concerning him and the apostles, or the nation of Israel to bring forth Jesus to them, and the. You get to “you.” You “in Ephesus.”

 

[Lambano]

Are you the predestined in Christ? Why you so hung up on this for?

Christ is predestined. We who are His Body tag along for the ride.

 

[MatthewG]

People can like it, not like, apply scriptures to themselves and make it for themselves.

I really don’t care in the end, but this is an interesting topic in itself…

 

[MatthewG]

Paul is stating “we” as either the apostles or the nation of Israel, bringing forth Yeshua. Paul also makes a predestined call back in Romans 9-11, which he also shows the saints in Rome about the historical significance concerning Yeshua and his coming through the Old Testament scriptures so the gentiles would know what was up.

Paul was a cool guy. His stuff is hard to understand for some and some even hate the guy, just like James.

 

[MA2444]

It’s Paul writing to a certain group. It couldn’t be us.

Commonly people assume its us.

Paul is speaking of his people, though the Jews right?

You've probably read this before but the answer to your question is in

Romans 11:17-24
17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.

20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:

21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.

24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?.../KJV

So even though Paul may speak to certain groups of people in other writings, none of it negates Romans 11 and if we are in Him and born again then we are grafted into the olive tree, so He is speaking to us also.