The six things of Daniel 9:24

[CTK]

As we do live in the world, what other way do you think we should interpret Daniel 9:24?
People with your views are divorced from reality and they go right off the rails of scriptural truths.

Correct and there is no way the events Prophesied for that period were fulfilled in the first Century.

Very nice response. Rather than make inappropriate comments against the person, why don’t you try and explain your position or offer to state why you disagree.
I have noticed this is a familiar and unattractive manner you use when someone does not agree with your interpretations.

But, you’re entitled to your views and how you react to others.

 

[Douggg]

And it is NOT the holy place that was anointed. It was the Messiah who was anointed at the time He was baptized in the Jordan on the first day of His ministry - the first day of the 70th week of the prophecy.

To anoint the most Holy....

In Psalms2, is the gathering of the kings of the earth's armies to make war on Jesus. In verses 6-7, God sets Jesus as king over the earth, when Jesus returns to Jerusalem, at His Second Coming.

Psalms 2.

1 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing?

2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying,

3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.

4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision.

5 Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure.

6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.

7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It will fulfill Ezekiel 37, in the days Israel is reunited as one nation again, verse 19-22, 1948. David my servant is a referral to the messiah - Jesus. Verse 26 is the bringing in of everlasting righteousness.

Ezekiel 37:25 And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever.

26 Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.

In Isaiah 9...

6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this. (read again Psalms 2:6-7)

 

[covenantee]

But those six tenets of Daniel 9:24 are not yet fulfilled.

Did Jesus fulfill "reconciliation for iniquity" for the 3,000 of Daniel's people in Jerusalem who received Him on the Day of Pentecost? Acts 2:41

No one yet has answered this question.

Give it your try.

 

[Douggg]

Did Jesus fulfill "reconciliation for iniquity" for the 3,000 of Daniel's people in Jerusalem who received Him on the Day of Pentecost? Acts 2:41

No one yet has answered this question.

Give it your try.

Jesus provided the means for reconciliation for iniquity - which the 3000 received on that day. However, the 3000 were a small portion of Daniel's people. The majority of Daniel's people have not.

The 70 weeks are not over because the vision regarding the little horn person is still not yet fulfilled.

 

[covenantee]

Jesus provided the means for reconciliation for iniquity - which the 3000 received on that day. However, the 3000 were a small portion of Daniel's people. The majority of Daniel's people have not.

The 70 weeks are not over because the vision regarding the little horn person is still not yet fulfilled.

"Majority" is a myth.

Isaiah recognized it.
Isaiah 10
22 For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness.

Paul confirmed it.
Romans 9
27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

3,000 of Daniel's people received reconciliation for iniquity on the Day of Pentecost.

As has every one of Daniel's people who has received Christ since that time.

The saved remnant.

Testifying to the 70th week fulfilled in Christ and Calvary.

2,000 years ago.

 

[jeffweeder]

Jesus provided the means for reconciliation for iniquity - which the 3000 received on that day.

Amen, yes, he did, in the allotted 70 weeks after his revealing as Messiah after 7 and 62 weeks.

If one has come to fulfillment then they all have in the 70 weeks.

However, the 3000 were a small portion of Daniel's people. The majority of Daniel's people have not.

They were all called, but only a few responded.
The result of those who didn't respond was desolation and exile right.
Thankfully the door is still open for Daniels people to be part of the Holy Nation found only in Jesus.

The 70 weeks are not over because the vision regarding the little horn person is still not yet fulfilled.

The 70 weeks have nothing to do with some little horn character being fulfilled in the 70 weeks.
Just this Person called Messiah.


24 “Seventy weeks [of years, or 490 years] have been decreed for your people and for your holy city (Jerusalem),
to finish the transgression,
to make an end of sins,
to make atonement (reconciliation) for wickedness,
to bring in everlasting righteousness (right-standing with God),
to seal up vision and prophecy and prophet,
and to anoint the Most Holy Place.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Jesus provided the means for reconciliation for iniquity - which the 3000 received on that day. However, the 3000 were a small portion of Daniel's people. The majority of Daniel's people have not.

The 70 weeks are not over because the vision regarding the little horn person is still not yet fulfilled.

1. to finish the transgression - Fulfilled at the Cross

2. to make an end of sins - Fulfilled at the Cross

3. to make reconciliation for iniquity - Fulfilled at the Cross

4. to bring in everlasting righteousness - Fulfilled at the Cross

5. to seal up the vision and prophecy - Fulfilled at the Cross

6. to anoint the most Holy. - Fulfilled at the Cross


The Hebrew word translated "make a end" is [chatham], which means to 'close up' something so that it is inaccessible. It's the exact same word used at the end of that verse saying, "to seal up the vision." It illustrates that something is no longer an option, it is secured or locked that it cannot be used, read, practiced, experienced, or whatever is in view. Just as a seal that is set on a book is there so that it cannot be opened. Likewise, sin being closed up or sealed up is illustrating that sinning will no longer be an option. In these 70 weeks it is determined that sins will be closed or sealed off, because reconciliation is made for those sins so that access has been sealed shut. In Christ they are as far as east is to west (psalms 103:12). That's how far sins have been removed from us by the work of Christ. Israel will has no sin because they are put away by the reconciliation that Christ has made at the cross. So that is the prophecy that in these 70 weeks of daniel 9, sin would be brought to an end. Not at the end of 70 weeks, but when Christ went to the Cross! Read carefully:

Hebrews 9:26

• "...but now once in the end of the world hath He appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.

2nd Corinthians 5:18

• "And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to Himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation.
• To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto Himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation."

This is what Daniel means by making an end of sins and that reconciliation is made for iniquity. This verse 24 of Daniel chapter 9 is clearly speaking of the Messiah's atonement for the sins of Israel, by the work of the cross.

Luke 1:68-70

• "Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,
• And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;
• As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:"

Here the prophecy is fulfillled as Daniel's people Israel has their Messiah come, that their sins would be closed up (or come to an end), and that reconciliation would be made. And that is exactly what Christ, who was Israel's Messiah, did.

Hebrews 2:17

• "Wherefore in all things it behooved Him to be made like unto His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of The People."

The same as the Prophesy we read in Daniel, that Messiah would come for the reconciliation of the sins of His people. And this was fulfilled in Christ's atonement. At the CROSS where the blood of the Lamb has brought Salvation to men and the dragon was cast out of the kingdom of heaven (old testmanet congregation that was fallen) into the bottomless pit. Right there at the Cross:

Rev 12:9-11

• And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
• And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
• And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

Salvation did not come "after the little horn person". You made it up to fit your false doctrine. You were trying to make the "people of the Prince" or the "he" in verse 27 to be some evil person as "little horn person" instead of Christ, so you say that the six things have not fulfilled yet. Private interpretations and speculations. Your doctrine denies the kingdom of God that Christ established at the Cross.

 

[Douggg]

The 70 weeks have nothing to do with some little horn character being fulfilled in the 70 weeks.
Just this Person called Messiah.


24 “Seventy weeks [of years, or 490 years] have been decreed for your people and for your holy city (Jerusalem),
to finish the transgression,
to make an end of sins,
to make atonement (reconciliation) for wickedness,
to bring in everlasting righteousness (right-standing with God),
to seal up vision and prophecy and prophet,
and to anoint the Most Holy Place.

You misquoted what the verse says.

to seal up the vision and prophecy.
to anoint the most Holy.

The vision is that of the time of the little horn's activities which Daniel first encountered Gabriel in Daniel 8.

 

[jeffweeder]

You misquoted what the verse says.

to seal up the vision and prophecy.
to anoint the most Holy.

The vision is that of the time of the little horn's activities which Daniel first encountered Gabriel in Daniel 8.

Did that happen at the time Jesus provided reconciliation for iniquity in the 70 weeks- that you agree Jesus achieved?
He anointed the most Holy place through the shedding of his blood as well as reconciliation for sins.

Heb 9
11 But when Christ appeared as a High Priest of the good things to come [that is, true spiritual worship], He entered through the greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not a part of this [material] creation. 12 He went once for all into the Holy Place [the Holy of Holies of heaven, into the presence of God], and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, having obtained and secured eternal redemption [that is, the salvation of all who personally believe in Him as Savior].

 

[Keraz]

explain your position or offer to state why you disagree.

I did post in #100, why the 6 tenets of Daniel 9:24 remain unfulfilled.
Of course if what I say does not suit your beliefs, then ignore it as usual.

A point of difference is that my RE Bible and the CJB, NIV and NLT versions all say: ..... and to the anoint the Most Holy Place.
The KJV omits the word 'Place'. Why?

This omission furthers the errors and confusion of KJV onlyists.

 

[CTK]

I did post in #100, why the 6 tenets of Daniel 9:24 remain unfulfilled.
Of course if what I say does not suit your beliefs, then ignore it as usual.

A point of difference is that my RE Bible and the CJB, NIV and NLT versions all say: ..... and to the anoint the Most Holy Place.
The KJV omits the word 'Place'. Why?

This omission furthers the errors and confusion of KJV onlyists.

I believe this is a good time to suspend any further discussion or responses between us. Best wishes.

 

[Douggg]

Did that happen at the time Jesus provided reconciliation for iniquity in the 70 weeks- that you agree Jesus achieved?

To seal up the vision and prophecy is referring to the vision when Daniel first encountered Gabriel. That was back in Daniel 8 regarding the time of the end vision about the little horn stopping the daily sacrifice and committing the transgression of desolation. It has not been fulfilled yet.

Daniel 8:13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

 

[rwb]

as a "whole" as being the majority.

Neither whole, nor partial, appears in Daniel 9. What it say is...

Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

Does Daniel use the term "thy people" to define an ethnic (Jews) people, or ethnic (Jews) of faith in the promises?

 

[Douggg]

Does Daniel use the term "thy people" to define an ethnic (Jews) people, or ethnic (Jews) of faith in the promises?

Ethnic Jews people. In his prayer, in the first parts of Daniel 9, Daniel confessed (verse 4) that his people as a group had sinned against God (verse 5) and all Israel had transgressed God's laws of the Mt Sinai covenant (verse 11).

The covenant to be confirmed in Daniel 9:27 is the Mt. Sinai covenant, by the prince that shall come, in the role of the Antichrist, King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah by the ethnic Jews in the last days - for a while. Then, after that erroneous experience, the ethnic Jews will turn to Jesus and the gospel of salvation in the middle part of 7 years, Revelation 12:10.

 

[covenantee]

Amen, yes, he did, in the allotted 70 weeks after his revealing as Messiah after 7 and 62 weeks.

If one has come to fulfillment then they all have in the 70 weeks.


They were all called, but only a few responded.
The result of those who didn't respond was desolation and exile right.
Thankfully the door is still open for Daniels people to be part of the Holy Nation found only in Jesus.


The 70 weeks have nothing to do with some little horn character being fulfilled in the 70 weeks.
Just this Person called Messiah.


24 “Seventy weeks [of years, or 490 years] have been decreed for your people and for your holy city (Jerusalem),
to finish the transgression,
to make an end of sins,
to make atonement (reconciliation) for wickedness,
to bring in everlasting righteousness (right-standing with God),
to seal up vision and prophecy and prophet,
and to anoint the Most Holy Place.

Bro, I believe that the anointing was of Messiah, who is immeasurably Holier than any place. The interlinear OT text translation does not include "Place".

 

[covenantee]

Ethnic Jews people. In his prayer, in the first parts of Daniel 9, Daniel confessed (verse 4) that his people as a group had sinned against God (verse 5) and all Israel had transgressed God's laws of the Mt Sinai covenant (verse 11).

The covenant to be confirmed in Daniel 9:27 is the Mt. Sinai covenant, by the prince that shall come, in the role of the Antichrist, King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah by the ethnic Jews in the last days - for a while. Then, after that erroneous experience, the ethnic Jews will turn to Jesus and the gospel of salvation in the middle part of 7 years, Revelation 12:10.

The 3,000 included ethnic Jews. Acts 2:5

 

[rwb]

Ethnic Jews people. In his prayer, in the first parts of Daniel 9, Daniel confessed (verse 4) that his people as a group had sinned against God (verse 5) and all Israel had transgressed God's laws of the Mt Sinai covenant (verse 11).

The covenant to be confirmed in Daniel 9:27 is the Mt. Sinai covenant, by the prince that shall come, in the role of the Antichrist, King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah by the ethnic Jews in the last days - for a while. Then, after that erroneous experience, the ethnic Jews will turn to Jesus and the gospel of salvation in the middle part of 7 years, Revelation 12:10.

While Daniel prayed, no doubt his mind and prayers were for those ethnic Jews who were in captivity through disobedience toward God in transgressing against the Law. Daniel desired to know what would physically become of them since Daniel "understood by books the number of the years, whereof the word of the LORD came to Jeremiah the prophet, that he would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem." Daniel knew the seventy literal years of captivity was ending and he desired to know what would come of them.

From verses 22-27 the words are not part of Daniel's prayer, they are the words spoken by Gabriel, sent by God to give Daniel understanding of prophecy of what would come to pass far beyond the time of Daniel. God didn't send Gabriel to Daniel specifically to tell him about what would physically become of them. God has a far greater purpose and promise for sending Gabriel to show him what was to come to pass through the promised Messiah/Savior (Messiah the Prince) the prophets foretell would come.

Unlike Daniel, Gabriel speaks of "thy people" for whom the prophecy is to be fulfilled, not as a physical ethnic Israel, but as of a spiritual people of Daniel called "Israel of God." The prophecy foretold according to the Covenant promise of God to Abraham, as well as from the days of Noah was never for ethnic Israel alone, it has always been to people from all the nations of the world.

So, whether or not Daniel understood "thy people" as being Jew & Gentiles of faith together, called "Israel of God" really doesn't matter. Because the everlasting Covenant of redemption through the Messiah Savior or Messiah the Prince who was to come has never been only for the Jews, but from the beginning has been unto all who believe in Him upon the whole earth.

Genesis 9:16 (KJV) And the bow shall be in the cloud; and I will look upon it, that I may remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is upon the earth.

Genesis 12:3 (KJV) And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Daniel 9:20-21 (KJV) And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God; Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.

Daniel 9:22-27 (KJV) And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding. At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision. Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

When we read the prophecy, remembering the everlasting Covenant promise of God to mankind, it's clear "thy people" are all people of faith, like that of Noah, Abraham, and Daniel.

 

[covenantee]

Ethnic Jews people. In his prayer, in the first parts of Daniel 9, Daniel confessed (verse 4) that his people as a group had sinned against God (verse 5) and all Israel had transgressed God's laws of the Mt Sinai covenant (verse 11).

The covenant to be confirmed in Daniel 9:27 is the Mt. Sinai covenant, by the prince that shall come, in the role of the Antichrist, King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah by the ethnic Jews in the last days - for a while. Then, after that erroneous experience, the ethnic Jews will turn to Jesus and the gospel of salvation in the middle part of 7 years, Revelation 12:10.

Daniel's people were the children of Israel.

Israel included both Jews and Gentiles from its inception and throughout its history. Genesis 17:12; Exodus 12:48-49; Leviticus 19:34; Leviticus 24:22

 

[covenantee]

I did post in #100, why the 6 tenets of Daniel 9:24 remain unfulfilled.
Of course if what I say does not suit your beliefs, then ignore it as usual.

A point of difference is that my RE Bible and the CJB, NIV and NLT versions all say: ..... and to the anoint the Most Holy Place.
The KJV omits the word 'Place'. Why?

This omission furthers the errors and confusion of KJV onlyists.

The interlinear OT text translation does not include "Place".

 

[Douggg]

From verses 22-27 the words are not part of Daniel's prayer, they are the words spoken by Gabriel, sent by God to give Daniel understanding of prophecy of what would come to pass far beyond the time of Daniel.

I agree that verses 22-27 are words spoken by Gabriel.

23 At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision.

understand the matter - is that of the 70 years of serving the King of Babylon being about over.

consider the vision - is to consider the vision which Daniel first encountered Gabriel. Which was of the time of the end vision about the little horn person to stop the daily sacrifice and commit the transgression of desolation .

Unlike Daniel, Gabriel speaks of "thy people" for whom the prophecy is to be fulfilled, not as a physical ethnic Israel, but as of a spiritual people of Daniel called "Israel of God."

No, Daniel did not call his people the "Israel of God"

That phase is found in one place in the bible - Galatians 6:16.

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/search.php?q=Israel+of+God&bsec=&order=0&s=1

When we read the prophecy, remembering the everlasting Covenant promise of God to mankind, it's clear "thy people" are all people of faith, like that of Noah, Abraham, and Daniel.

No, "thy people" i.e. Daniel people, are the ethnic Jews.

In Daniel 10, Daniel received another visit from an angel who told him everything that was going to happen to his people in Daniel 11-12. With Daniel 11:36-12:13 being of things in the latter days, end times.

Daniel 10:14 Now I am come to make thee understand what shall befall thy people in the latter days: for yet the vision is for many days.

Daniel 8 > Daniel 9 > Daniel 10 (introducing Daniel 11 > Daniel 12)

That's the whole big picture of what is going to happen to Daniel's people, the ethnic Jews.