The Righteous

[VictoryinJesus]

@Episkopos what is the difference in “righteousness” and “holiness”?

Exodus 28:36
[36] And thou shalt make a plate of pure gold, and grave upon it, like the engravings of a signet, HOLINESS TO THE Lord .

Ephesians 4:24
[24] And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Titus 2:3
[3] The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things;

Hebrews 12:10
[10] For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.

 

[Episkopos]

@Episkopos what is the difference in “righteousness” and “holiness”?

Exodus 28:36
[36] And thou shalt make a plate of pure gold, and grave upon it, like the engravings of a signet, HOLINESS TO THE Lord .

Ephesians 4:24
[24] And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Titus 2:3
[3] The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things;

Hebrews 12:10
[10] For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.

The difference between these two things is truly the distance between us and God....in today's world ....IN the church.

Righteousness is to DO the right thing. It doesn't mean to be sinless...but rather to act with love and good intent. It is honest and innocent of evil intent. Sometimes it means to believe something...from good faith...but mainly to do something. The second main commandment...to love others...is about righteousness.

Holiness is the beauty of God. Only HE has what we would term holiness. He is unique....with a unique presence and glory. So then holiness for us is to walk with or IN God...in His presence. His proximity changes things around Him the way a fire melts or consumes things. Nothing is His proximity is anything but holy. And there is nothing holy away from His presence. The first main commandment is to love God the way He is...in holiness.

The righteousness of God is the acting out of God's will and judgments. It means God getting involved.

 

[07-07-07]

Faith = belief

I think your point is that we are saved by our works and not by faith only. IMO that is salvation by the works of man and not by what Jesus did on the cross. But the religious want credit for what they do to be saved just as Cain did.

Walking in God's holiness and righteousness is a necessity to remain saved. God will either purge the tree or He will remove it.
John 15
[1] I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
[2] Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
[3] Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
[4] Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[5] I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
[6] If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

 

[Episkopos]

Walking in God's holiness and righteousness is a necessity to remain saved. God will either purge the tree or He will remove it.
John 15
[1] I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
[2] Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
[3] Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
[4] Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[5] I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
[6] If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Welcome here! :)

 

[justbyfaith]

Walking in God's holiness and righteousness is a necessity to remain saved. God will either purge the tree or He will remove it.
John 15
[1] I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
[2] Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
[3] Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
[4] Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[5] I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
[6] If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Welcome here! :)

Ditto.

 

[icxn]

I once heard a certain wise man give the following definition (or rather illustration) of righteousness and holiness:

Imagine a basket having two apples, one good and one rotten and two people sharing a table. The righteous person throws away the rotten and divides the good apple in two, one half for himself and the other for his brother. The holy person on the other hand, takes the rotten apple for himself and leaves the good one for his brother.

 

[CoreIssue]

Walking in God's holiness and righteousness is a necessity to remain saved. God will either purge the tree or He will remove it.
John 15
[1] I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
[2] Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
[3] Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
[4] Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[5] I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
[6] If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Romans 8 osas

Just because someone says there saved or thinks are saved is not mean they were ever saved.

 

[justbyfaith]

I once heard a certain wise man give the following definition (or rather illustration) of righteousness and holiness:

Imagine a basket having two apples, one good and one rotten and two people sharing a table. The righteous person throws away the rotten and divides the good apple in two, one half for himself and the other for his brother. The holy person on the other hand, takes the rotten apple for himself and leaves the good one for his brother.

If those are the definitions, then it doesn't make much sense to be holy, impaho.

 

[Nancy]

I once heard a certain wise man give the following definition (or rather illustration) of righteousness and holiness:

Imagine a basket having two apples, one good and one rotten and two people sharing a table. The righteous person throws away the rotten and divides the good apple in two, one half for himself and the other for his brother. The holy person on the other hand, takes the rotten apple for himself and leaves the good one for his brother.

AGAPE! :) Welcome. Although, I think splitting it would be just fine. Now, if one took the good apple for himself and left the rotten one for the other ... there would be no righteous or holy person at the table.

 

[icxn]

If those are the definitions, then it doesn't make much sense to be holy, impaho.

I agree with you. It is contrary to common sense, but so is turning the other cheek, giving your cloak also and loving your enemy... not to mention the foolishness of the Cross. (1 Corinthians 1:21-23)

 

[icxn]

AGAPE! :) Welcome. Although, I think splitting it would be just fine. Now, if one took the good apple for himself and left the rotten one for the other ... there would be no righteous or holy person at the table.

Thank you for the welcome. :-)

Your exclamation is spot on. Agape and holiness go hand in hand.

 

[justbyfaith]

I agree with you. It is contrary to common sense, but so is turning the other cheek, giving your cloak also and loving your enemy... not to mention the foolishness of the Cross. (1 Corinthians 1:21-23)

I think that if I took the rotten apple for myself it would be foolish at the very least for me to eat it: how holy am I going to be if I end up getting sick all over the table? :

 

[justbyfaith]

One thing that has been getting me is that when people do us wrong, we are to bless and not curse...to me this amounts to rewarding them for doing me wrong! But nevertheless, the Lord wants me to do it.

I still pray every one of the Psalms about twice a month concerning whatever may apply...

 

[Nancy]

I think that if I took the rotten apple for myself it would be foolish at the very least for me to eat it: how holy am I going to be if I end up getting sick all over the table? :

Good point!

 

[07-07-07]

Romans 8 osas

Just because someone says there saved or thinks are saved is not mean they were ever saved.

Romans 8 confirms that OSAS is not true. More specifically, it is written.
Romans 8
[12] Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
[13] For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
[14] For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

 

[justbyfaith]

Romans 8 confirms that OSAS is not true. More specifically, it is written.
Romans 8
[12] Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
[13] For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
[14] For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

If you compare Romans 8:12-14 to John 11:25-27, you should be able to see that if anyone truly believes in Him, (with a genuine, bona fide, living and saving faith that will endure unto the end,) they will not live after the flesh.

Therefore OSAS is not ruled out of the equation by Romans 8:12-14 (really POTS is the more accurate truth).

 

[07-07-07]

If you compare Romans 8:12-14 to John 11:25-27, you should be able to see that if anyone truly believes in Him, (with a genuine, bona fide, living and saving faith that will endure unto the end,) they will not live after the flesh.

Therefore OSAS is not ruled out of the equation by Romans 8:12-14 (really POTS is the more accurate truth).

The Scriptures teach that one can depart from the faith; that nullifies the teaching of OSAS. What's more, OSAS is a destructive teaching to carnal minded believers in Yeshua because mere belief won't compel one to push into the Kingdom of God through sanctification of the Spirit. Prayer, fasting and walking in the Scriptures are the disciplines necessary to die to self so that one can be truly sanctified. Fleshly minded Christians will never make it, and the OSAS teaching keeps many stuck in that rut. In the Christian life, you're either moving forward or backward because you can't remain parked. Whoever has an ear, let him hear.

 

[Episkopos]

The Scriptures teach that one can depart from the faith; that nullifies the teaching of OSAS. What's more, OSAS is a destructive teaching to carnal minded believers in Yeshua because mere belief won't compel one to push into the Kingdom of God through sanctification of the Spirit. Prayer, fasting and walking in the Scriptures are the disciplines necessary to die to self so that one can be truly sanctified. Fleshly minded Christians will never make it, and the OSAS teaching keeps many stuck in that rut. In the Christian life, you're either moving forward or backward because you can't remain parked. Whoever has an ear, let him hear.

Word.

 

[justbyfaith]

There are scriptures that do, however, basically teach the doctrine of POTS. And when going into the fray of spiritual battle, it is useful to be wearing a helmet.

 

[CoreIssue]

If you compare Romans 8:12-14 to John 11:25-27, you should be able to see that if anyone truly believes in Him, (with a genuine, bona fide, living and saving faith that will endure unto the end,) they will not live after the flesh.

Therefore OSAS is not ruled out of the equation by Romans 8:12-14 (really POTS is the more accurate truth).

28 And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, whoi]">[i] have been called according to his purpose. 29 For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters. 30 And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified. No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. 38 For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons,k]">[k] neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, 39 neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

The Scriptures teach that one can depart from the faith; that nullifies the teaching of OSAS. What's more, OSAS is a destructive teaching to carnal minded believers in Yeshua because mere belief won't compel one to push into the Kingdom of God through sanctification of the Spirit. Prayer, fasting and walking in the Scriptures are the disciplines necessary to die to self so that one can be truly sanctified. Fleshly minded Christians will never make it, and the OSAS teaching keeps many stuck in that rut. In the Christian life, you're either moving forward or backward because you can't remain parked. Whoever has an ear, let him hear.

That that is false.

One can participate in the faith without being saved. Do not equate church attendance, claims and such as meaning that person was ever saved.

As for nullifying what the bible says, that is nullifying God, which no one can do.

There is no exception clause in romans 8.