The Gospel is actually good news and here is why.

[prism]

They even turned away from the Father.

They never knew the Father if they rejected the Son.

John 8:19 KJV
[19] Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.


1 John 2:23 KJV
[23] Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

 

[Cooper]

What are we to repent of if it is not sin?

Unbelief in Jesus.

Christ died for every sin that has ever been committed and every sin that ever will be committed.....Even Hitler’s and even Blood Bought’s Sins.....I am going to Heaven and Hitler is in Hell.....why ? Hitler did not “ cash in” on what Jesus accomplished at the Cross with Faith, and I did.....

“ Cash In” on what has been completely taken care of—— REST in Paul’s Gospel, given to him by Jesus to give to us....REST in 1 Cor15:1-4......

BB. What is the matter with you? You ask, "What are we to repent of?"

We are to repent of our sins, and sin no more.
.

 

[Cooper]

They never knew the Father if they rejected the Son.

John 8:19 KJV
[19] Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.i


1 John 2:23 KJV
[23] Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

They knew the I AM, but then turned to idol worship. The point being, there are millions who do it, whether it is money, power or whatever it matters not, they are all things of earth. Bur as you said, those who reject Jesus reject the Father. They are Godless.
.

 

[Mungo]

1. That's because Jesus never sinned. He bore our sin that we would not be eternally separated from God.
2. Many legally pay another's fine in today's court system.
3. The stipulation to be declared righteous (justified) is faith in Jesus, the One who bore the penalty for our sin.
4. God's grace and mercy is only possible because the debt has been paid as in "It is Finished".

You never did address my Isaiah quote...

Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. (Isa 53:4-5)

Addressing your numbered points
1. If he legally bore our sin then the punishment then should have taken is eternal separation from God because that is our punishment. If he is not eternally separated from God then he did not take our punishment.
2. We are not talking about fines for parking offences. You don't get fined for murder for example. Don't trivialise what Jesus did for us. And that doesn't answer the point that God would be legally punishing an innocent person for the sins of another.
3. I can't see how that statement addresses any of the points I made
4. There is no occasion for mercy if the debt has been paid.

Jesus taught about debt and forgiveness in Mt 19=8:23-35
The master was merciful because he forgave the debt.
If the servant had paid it (or anyone else did) he would be legally free of the debt.
God is merciful because he forgives debt.

Is 53:4-5
Who wounded him?
Who bruised him?
Who chastised him?
Was it God or men?

Jesus made a voluntary self sacrifice.

What Jesus did for us by his Passion, Death and Resurrection is about making satisfaction by a sacrifice not being punished in our stead.
John 10:17-18
For this reason the Father loves me, because I lay down my life, that I may take it again. No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again

Eph 5:2 states “Christ loved us and gave himself up for us, a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God”. This allows the Father to be merciful; to look mercifully on his children and forgive them their sins. In this scenario God is like a loving Father who accepts his children with their faults when they are disobedient – as long as they repent and want to be reconciled – hence the parable of the Prodigal Son.
By his perfect obedience, his freely offered suffering and death Jesus’ is able to appease the Father’s wrath, and can plead for us continually (Rom 8:34, Heb 7:25, 1Jn 2:1).

Would such intercession be necessary if Jesus had paid the (legal) penalty for our sins?

In the Old Testament animal sacrifices were intended as an offering to atone for sins, not because they paid a penalty for sins but to appease God’s anger.

 

[prism]

They knew the I AM, but then turned to idol worship. The point being, there are millions who do it, whether it is money, power or whatever it matters not, they are all things of earth. Bur as you sad, those who reject Jesus reject the Father. They are Godless.
.

What you seemed to point to was those who had experienced the works of God but never personally knew Him. Like those in Heb. 6.

 

[prism]

Addressing your numbered points
1. If he legally bore our sin then the punishment then should have taken is eternal separation from God because that is our punishment. If he is not eternally separated from God then he did not take our punishment.
2. We are not talking about fines for parking offences. You don't get fined for murder for example. Don't trivialise what Jesus did for us. And that doesn't answer the point that God would be legally punishing an innocent person for the sins of another.
3. I can't see how that statement addresses any of the points I made
4. There is no occasion for mercy if the debt has been paid.

Jesus taught about debt and forgiveness in Mt 19=8:23-35
The master was merciful because he forgave the debt.
If the servant had paid it (or anyone else did) he would be legally free of the debt.
God is merciful because he forgives debt.

Is 53:4-5
Who wounded him?
Who bruised him?
Who chastised him?
Was it God or men?

Jesus made a voluntary self sacrifice.

What Jesus did for us by his Passion, Death and Resurrection is about making satisfaction by a sacrifice not being punished in our stead.
John 10:17-18
For this reason the Father loves me, because I lay down my life, that I may take it again. No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again

Eph 5:2 states “Christ loved us and gave himself up for us, a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God”. This allows the Father to be merciful; to look mercifully on his children and forgive them their sins. In this scenario God is like a loving Father who accepts his children with their faults when they are disobedient – as long as they repent and want to be reconciled – hence the parable of the Prodigal Son.
By his perfect obedience, his freely offered suffering and death Jesus’ is able to appease the Father’s wrath, and can plead for us continually (Rom 8:34, Heb 7:25, 1Jn 2:1).

Would such intercession be necessary if Jesus had paid the (legal) penalty for our sins?

In the Old Testament animal sacrifices were intended as an offering to atone for sins, not because they paid a penalty for sins but to appease God’s anger.

1. God can compact eternity into one second. Your finite logic is inadequate to comprehend God.
2. What do you think the sacrifices of spotless lambs and oxen pointed to?
3. I’ll pray that you see.
4. Mercy is transferred to those who embrace God’s Mercy Seat (propitiation) by faith.

5. Define punishment.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

BB. What is the matter with you? You ask, "What are we to repent of?"

We are to repent of our sins, and sin no more.
.

What is the matter with me? I fell in the shower last week and must have bumped my head...

Btw.....how’s that “ sin no more” thingy working for ya?

Some other things to consider......Nobody in the Bible “ Repented” more than God did....( nine times, give or take)
If “ Repentance Of Sin” is the recipe for Salvation, few in Heaven would be exalted more than Judas....he Repented to the point that he gave the money back to the Pharisees that gave it to him....

“ Repenting Of Sins” is a great thing—— it just does not Save anybody in and of itself......TURNING *TO* GOD ( Repentance) is the Repentance that Saves......NOT Turning * FROM* sins......
Remember the Promise ? “Turn to me and I will Turn to you” ......THAT will get you Saved...

Turning from Sin? That will perhaps make you more Moral , but God ain’t in the business of saving “ moral” people.....Hell will be full of “ moral” people . God is looking for “ Dead” people that KNOW that they are Dead—— “ Dead in Trespasses and Sin” .....That is the condition of every human being before they TURN to God ( the type of repentance that God demands) with Faith in Jesus Christ....

Before I turned to God and got Saved, I never Repented of any sins—— I sinned to my heart’s content and thought nothing of it...on the other side of Salvation, the side I am on now, I find myself repenting more often than I care to admit......I don’t do it to get Saved or stay Saved —- I do it to restore a damaged relationship .....it just comes naturally with the Salvation “ package” .....previously it did not even exist......

Any “ repentance” that doe not involve Turning *TO* God as opposed to Turning *From* Sin is a Fool’s Errand and it will NOT save anybody......Faith in Jesus WILL!

Wanna know what True Repentance looks like? Just check out the tale of the Evil Tax-Collector Who finally saw himself for the Lost Sinner that He was ( just like you and me ) and cried out, “ Lord, have Mercy on me, a Sinner”.... He Turned to God. Jesus said it got him Saved.It worked for him.It worked for me. It will work for anybody . It’s a Promise Of God.

 

[Mungo]

1. God can compact eternity into one second. Your finite logic is inadequate to comprehend God.

That's a cop out

2. What do you think the sacrifices of spotless lambs and oxen pointed to?

They were a sacrificial offering to God pointing to the sacrifice of Jesus
They were not punished.

The sacrifice of Jesus

4. Mercy is transferred to those who embrace God’s Mercy Seat (propitiation) by faith.

Which has nothing to do with punishment.

5. Define punishment.

I think rather you define it. It was your OP that said:
"2. Jesus Christ perfectly fulfilled all the requirements for righteousness AND took all our sins upon Himself and took the punishment that those sins fully deserve. (Rom 5:19)"

 

[prism]

That's a cop out



They were a sacrificial offering to God pointing to the sacrifice of Jesus
They were not punished.

The sacrifice of Jesus


Which has nothing to do with punishment.


I think rather you define it. It was your OP that said:
"2. Jesus Christ perfectly fulfilled all the requirements for righteousness AND took all our sins upon Himself and took the punishment that those sins fully deserve. (Rom 5:19)"

I guess being put to death is not punishment. Obviously, it hasn't happened to you yet, so how would you know?
As far as a 'cop out' goes, I guess I'll follow Scripture ...

Titus 3:10 (KJV) A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;

and 'drop out'.

 

[Mungo]

I guess being put to death is not punishment. Obviously, it hasn't happened to you yet, so how would you know?

No, it's sacrifice -in Jesus' case self sacrifice.

I guess I'll follow Scripture ...

Titus 3:10 (KJV) A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;

and 'drop out'.

You cannot answer my points so you call me a heretic.
Hmmm.

 

[Cooper]

What you seemed to point to was those who had experienced the works of God but never personally knew Him. Like those in Heb. 6.

Yes.
For how can those who abandon their faith be brought back to repent again? They were once in God's light; they tasted heaven's gift and received their share of the Holy Spirit; they knew from experience that God's word is good, and they had felt the powers of the coming age. And then they abandoned their faith! It is impossible to bring them back to repent again, because they are again crucifying the Son of God and exposing him to public shame. (Hebrews 6:4-6)

Rather than deny scripture, it is best we accept it and make sure we are not like them. It is fair warning.
.

 

[Taken]

The Gospel is actually good news and here is why.
OP^

Jesus bore the sins of a mans soul.

* A mans flesh is appointed to die for it's sin.
* A mans soul's sin was a burden Jesus took upon Himself.
* Jesus' spilled blood, was given for a mans Forgiveness, OF his flesh sin, OF his soul's sin.

 

[prism]

You cannot answer my points so you call me a heretic.
Hmmm.

Anyone denying that Christ was punished for our sins is either a heretic or has a different definition for the word 'punished', seeing you decline giving your definition of punished, I'll go with heretic...

But he was pierced for our transgressions;
he was crushed for our iniquities;
upon him was the chastisement that brought us peace,
and with his wounds we are healed. Isaiah 53:5 ESV

But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. Isaiah 53:5 KJV

And he is pierced for our transgressions, Bruised for our iniquities, The chastisement of our peace is on him, And by his bruise there is healing to us. (Isa 53:5) YLT

But He was wounded for our transgressions, He was bruised for our guilt and iniquities; the chastisement [needful to obtain] peace and well-being for us was upon Him, and with the stripes [that wounded] Him we are healed and made whole. Isaiah 53:5 AMP

But he was wounded for ·the wrong we did [Tour transgressions];
he was crushed for ·the evil we did [Tour iniquities].
The punishment, which ·made us well [brought us wholeness/peace], was given to him,
and we are healed because of his ·wounds [lacerations; Tstripes; 1 Pet. 2:24]. Isaiah 53:5 EXB

But continue in your fantasies if you must.
I am done with you.

 

[TheslightestID]

Tired of the Gospel being turned into a system of law that only drags us down, robs us of joy
and stifles our love for the One who died for us?
Tired of being rerouted back to the law in order to be sanctified or to prove that your faith is genuine?

Can you please give us an example of someone who does that?

Or, in reality, is that just you exagerating the truth, and using verbal sleight of hand to make it appear what is biblical, is wrong, and what is not biblical, or your end of this, seem right?

 

[Mantis]

I have noticed whenever someone shares the gospel there will always be someone that comes along tries to disparage it or discredit it (just like Jesus said it would happen). Every time.

 

[prism]

They knew the I AM, but then turned to idol worship. The point being, there are millions who do it, whether it is money, power or whatever it matters not, they are all things of earth. Bur as you sad, those who reject Jesus reject the Father. They are Godless.
.

One of the Greek definitions, for the word 'know' means to have an intimate personal knowing. Another word simply means to 'know about' someone. The Jews who rejected Jesus never knew (intimately) God otherwise they would not have rejected His Son.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

I have noticed whenever someone shares the gospel there will always be someone that comes along tries to disparage it or discredit it (just like Jesus said it would happen). Every time.

“ The Gospel is Foolishness to those that Perish....”

 

[Cooper]

I have noticed whenever someone shares the gospel there will always be someone that comes along tries to disparage it or discredit it (just like Jesus said it would happen). Every time.

It makes me want to weep.
.

 

[prism]

Can you please give us an example of someone who does that?

Or, in reality, is that just you exagerating the truth, and using verbal sleight of hand to make it appear what is biblical, is wrong, and what is not biblical, or your end of this, seem right?

I think I had already mentioned it was a problem Paul addressed in the Letter to the Galatians.

 

[TheslightestID]

I think I had already mentioned it was a problem Paul addressed in the Letter to the Galatians.

Then you cannot point to anyone who says the things you accused of in the OP?