The Galilean wedding is the model for the pre-trib rapture

[The Light]

Scripture?

The Feast of Trumpets is day of blowing trumpets........per the scripture.

Fact is every year they blow 100 trumpet blasts. Thats fact. And every year there is a Last Trump. You can pitty patty around this all you want, but those are the facts. They all know what the last trump is because they have been doing this since God told them to.

The Feast of Trumpets is a fall harvest feast.

 

[WPM]

The Feast of Trumpets is day of blowing trumpets........per the scripture.

Fact is every year they blow 100 trumpet blasts. Thats fact. And every year there is a Last Trump. You can pitty patty around this all you want, but those are the facts. They all know what the last trump is because they have been doing this since God told them to.

The Feast of Trumpets is a fall harvest feast.

You are not answering my queries. Where in Scripture does it say there will be 100 trumpet blasts at the end before and including the last trumpet? And who is making these blasts?

 

[WPM]

1 Thes 4

1 Cor 15

You will find the two raptures referenced by Paul in these chapters.

Where?

 

[Timtofly]

Is that what you think Acts 2:29-32 is referring to?

David's literal physical throne was destroyed thousands of years ago.

So what kind of throne do you think Acts 2:29-32 is referring to?

Jesus was born to sit on David's throne in Jerusalem. Not the one you think was destroyed, nor any throne in heaven, as that is what you think that David's throne is in heaven.

David's throne is in reference to the legal authority passed down from the ancestor of Jesus by human birth to rule over Israel.

David's throne is not a spiritual concept as God ruling from heaven, the spiritual side of the physical throne of David that you claim is in heaven.

The Prince to come part has not been fulfilled. You say that is Jesus, but you deny that Jesus will physically sit on a future throne in Jerusalem. Jesus will be King on David's throne at the Second Coming. At the 7th Trumpet, Jesus will be declared King over the rest of the nations as well.

Certainly you don't think the 7th Trumpet has sounded, do you? Did Peter in Acts 2 declare a 7th Trumpet has sounded?

"Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day. Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne; He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption. This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses. Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear. For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, Until I make thy foes thy footstool. Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ."

Peter points out that Jesus was the seed of David to be the rightful heir to the throne. David also prophecied that Jesus would be the anointed Messiah and have to die as well. But Peter pointed out that Jesus was not dead, but arose and ascended into heaven and was granted all authority, while having to wait until all enemies were subdued. Then when God was ready, Jesus would return to that throne of David.

Being both Lord of Israel on David's throne and the Messiah was the point. But sitting on David's throne is still future, as the Second Coming has yet to happen. That message was reiterated by Gabriel to Daniel, and Daniel was given a time frame for when Jesus would appear. The second appearance would be as King, not the first appearance.

 

[Timtofly]

Revelation 17:10
and they are seven kings: five of whom have fallen, one exists and is reigning; the other [the seventh] has not yet come, and when he does come, he must remain a little while.

At the time of writing who was reigning?

Rome, the 4th kingdom. John was not giving us first century history lessons. John was giving us his first hand account of the Second Coming.

The five fallen were Babylon, Medes and Persians. Greece, Rome, and the ten toes; I would say as the Holy Roman Empire.

We are in the 6th kingdom and will be until the 7th Trumpet sounds.

 

[Timtofly]

Peter said that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. He did not say the Day of the Lord is 1000 years. The day of the Lord is the day of His vengeance and His vengeance is not a 1000 years long.

If you need me to post scriptures that a day can be considered a year in scripture, just ask.


If the following does not convince you that the Day of the Lord is not the millennial kingdom, I can add lots more scriptures. Just let me know.

Isaiah 13
6 Howl ye; for the day of the Lord is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

Isaiah 13
9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

Jeremiah 46
10 For this is the day of the Lord God of hosts, a day of vengeance, that he may avenge him of his adversaries: and the sword shall devour, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood: for the Lord God of hosts hath a sacrifice in the north country by the river Euphrates.

Joel 1
Alas for the day! for the day of the Lord is at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.

Joel 2
11 And the Lord shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the Lord is great and very terrible; and who can abide it?

Amos 5
20 Shall not the day of the Lord be darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?

The Day of the Lord begins when the 7th seal is opened and lasts for one year. The 7th seal is the wrath of God.

Peter explains that the Day of the Lord comes as a thief in the night. But the surprise does not last a thousand years, the Day of the Lord lasts a thousands years. All the prophets told how the Day of the Lord would come as vengeance and judgment, but it would not be a thousand years nor a year of vengeance and judgment.

Some SDA think the thousand years leaves a barren landscape of death and destruction, because they interpret your verses as lasting a thousand years, while you say a year. But you are both wrong. We don't know the length of the final harvest, because that time was shortened from 3.5 years to whatever length God determines.

Jesus and all His angels along with the 144k are on the earth gathering the final harvest during this time, but the Day of the Lord only starts after the harvest is over and the earth is cleaned up and restored.

The Day of the Lord comes at the 6th Seal, but starts when the 7th Trumpet stops sounding.

Jesus does not snap His fingers like in the movies, and every thing instantly changes. That is the Amil position. Nor can we say it is going to take an exact year.

"And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."

God is always looking out for the elect, those named in the Lamb's book of life, even while judgment and vengeance is falling on those who reject God's gift of salvation.

So keep posting those thief in the night moment verses of the coming of the Day of the Lord. The Millennial Kingdom is longer than a year.

 

[jeffweeder]

Rome, the 4th kingdom. John was not giving us first century history lessons. John was giving us his first hand account of the Second Coming.

The five fallen were Babylon, Medes and Persians. Greece, Rome, and the ten toes; I would say as the Holy Roman Empire.

We are in the 6th kingdom and will be until the 7th Trumpet sounds.

The Angel was explaining to John and told him 5 had fallen and one is. In Johns mind that was Rome.

 

[Timtofly]

Jesus remains in the clouds at the sixth seal. It is the second coming when all eyes see the coming of the Lord. All return to heaven which is why you see a great multitude in heaven, some of which came out of Great Tribulation. They go to the marriage supper as seen in Rev 19 and then return to earth with the armies of heaven for Armageddon.

When you start rearranging the book of Revelation to fit your human understanding is where you get into trouble like every other poster, who argues over the sticking points.

There are no parallel views, because that would have to be argued over and taught as to what those parallel views are. John saw events as they happened.

That multitude in Revelation 7 is all the sum total of all redeemed mankind since Abel and Enoch to the church raptured who make up the church in Paradise. Some came out of great tribulation. Some died peacefully in their sleep while others were being killed on the other side of the earth. There was great tribulation at times even in the OT.

John is letting us know at that point, the church was in heaven, the angels were on the earth, and 144k of Israel had been sealed. The final harvest had not started, so those on earth were waiting to stand in Judgment before Jesus sitting on His glorious throne in His Temple in Jerusalem on the earth.

The church does not return at Armageddon. Those on white horses are the 144k and the final harvest gathered in the first 6 Trumpets and the 7 Thunders. Why do people just skip over the Thunders as if they will not happen?

What you call the vengeance and wrath of God during the Trumpets and Thunders, I have no issues with, but the date setting length of time. But it is the final harvest as described in Matthew 25 and Matthew 13.

Jesus is on the earth, because both chapters in Matthew explicitly state Jesus is on the earth, not some symbolism as portrayed by John. John is just pointing out in Revelation 14, the final harvest is over, not the explicit details of the harvest itself.

Just like at the 5th and 6th Seal , John does not explicitly state the rapture and Second Coming to the Mount of Olives, like Paul would by going into detail. We can know it happened, because now the church is complete and in heaven.

It was not just the wrath of God, when all could see the face of God sitting on the GWT at the 6th Seal. They could see the Lamb, Jesus as King on the earth as well.

"And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:"

Who is the He in the next verse, the face of the one on the throne or the Lamb?

"For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"

 

[Timtofly]

None of this is scriptural. If you think it is, please provide scriptural support.

I have used Scripture.

You say parallel views.

I say two different endings depending on the Confirming of the Covenant during the days of the 7th Trumpet. Daniel 9:27 takes place in the days of the 7th Trumpet.

You claim Revelation keeps repeating itself. I say Revelation is a systematic removal of humans from the earth.

The Seals deal only with the church.

The Trumpets deal only with Israel.

The Thunders deal only with the Gentiles.

Each containing their own type of harvest.

The 42 month extension are the gleanings, those beheaded instead of receiving the mark.

By Armageddon, only those with the mark go through the winepress of God's wrath. The winepress in Revelation 14 is before any mark is given, and no one receives a mark, because time is up, and all have been placed in the LOF.

You cannot remove the church, and then have a harvest, and then all of a sudden time travel back to the rapture of the Church. John did not yo yo through time.

Most are looking for some antichrist and a bunch of trouble, but if you are pre-trib, all that AoD, starts in Revelation after the 7th Trumpet already sounds, and there is no time travel back to the first 4 Seals.

The first Trumpet cannot sound until the 7th Seal is opened. The 7th Trumpet cannot sound, until after the 7 Thunders. Revelation 14 cannot happen until after the 7th Trumpet starts to sound. There is no negotiation over this order of events. Daniel 9:27 is the week of the days of the 7th Trumpet, because that is the time up in Revelation 10.

"And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets."

The 7th Trumpet is declaring the end of the 70th week. Now the Millennium can start with those promises made in Daniel 9:24.

The third woe is directly associated with the 7th Trumpet, not any of the Seals, not the first 6 Trumpets and not the 7 Thunders.

The third woe is Satan coming to earth and being given the 42 months in chapter 13. That is not back in the Seals. Revelation 14 is not back in the Seals. Revelation 14 is the end of the week of the 7th Trumpet. That is it, the end. Satan is bound, and the Millennium starts. God does not say there has to be a third woe.

"Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child."

None of the redeemed final harvest are on the earth at the 7th Trumpet. They have been removed to the sea of glass, as protection. But that is only if Satan is given 42 months, because the 7th Trumpet is when Satan is cast out as the third woe. Satan does not time travel at the 7th Trumpet, back to the Seals. There is no time given to Satan prior to the 7th Trumpet. At the 5th Seal, he is able to release his rebel angels from their chains of darkness. They torment humans for 5 months. Then the 6th Trumpet sounds , and the 7 Thunders. By that time they are invading heaven itself and have to be cast out at the 7th Trumpet.

So why do people yo yo through Revelation as if the facts John presents do not even matter?

 

[Timtofly]

You're obviously missing 2 there because John very specifically said that 5 were already fallen. Why not accept that John knew more than you about this whether you understand how 5 kingdoms had already fallen at that point or not?

Your lack of trust that John knew what he was talking about is disturbing. You should be ashamed of yourself for trying to change what he explicitly said. Not only did he explicitly say that five had fallen, but he also said "ONE IS". You change that to "ONE WILL BE IN THE FUTURE". Such nonsense and dishonesty. Have you no shame at all? You blatantly change scripture and have no conscience about doing so. What was said about doing that with the book of Revelation?

Revelation 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

If you are purposely changing the text to fit your doctrine, as it appears you are, then you are playing with fire. I hope it's the case instead that you're not doing it intentionally and you are just being very ignorant.


Your understanding of John saying "5 have fallen" is atrocious. You turn 5 into 3. What a joke. Terrible. And your understanding of the word "is" is atrocious. John said "one IS, not "one WILL BE in the future". You're changing the scripture. Just because you don't know the identification of the other 2 kingdoms that had fallen doesn't mean there can't be two other previously fallen kingdoms.


Why didn't you give me a chance to explain before deciding that I supposedly "have no 4th and 5th fallen kingdom"? Even if I didn't, it wouldn't matter because, unlike you, I would just assume there were two other kingdoms because John said so. I don't need to know what they were in order to know that 5 had already fallen. Because John said so very explicitly. I trust John to have written the truth, unlike you.

But, despite the fact that it doesn't matter if I can identify the other 2 fallen kingdoms or not (since we should just trust that John knew what he was saying since he was inspired by God), I do have an opinion on that. I believe that the other 2 kingdoms are Egypt and Assyria, which preceded the Babylonian empire.

So, the 5 fallen kingdoms were Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Media-Persia, and Greece. The one that existed at the time John wrote the book ("one is") was obviously Rome. I couldn't care less if you agree with me or not, but at least I agree with John that 5 kingdoms had fallen as of the time he wrote the book and one existed at the time ("one is") and the seventh kingdom obviously would come after the one existing at the time (Rome) fell.

I did not change Scripture at all.

I simply pointed out that John was viewing things at the time of the Second Coming.

You view things as if they were happening in the first century like a Preterists does.

Blame your agreement with Jesuit Preterist theology, not me.

Do you not think that 5 have fallen at the Second Coming? Was the Second Coming in the first century during the 4th kingdom, Rome?

If you think they are Egypt and Assyria, then you blatantly contradict both Daniel 2 and that the Second Coming is yet to happen after the whole statue of Daniel has fallen which is 5 kingdoms, not 7 with you adding two kingdoms prior to Babylon into God's Word.

John was viewing the time of the Second Coming, when he stated 5 had fallen, not his first century time frame.

 

[Timtofly]

The Angel was explaining to John and told him 5 had fallen and one is. In Johns mind that was Rome.

John was viewing the Second Coming. The Second Coming was in John's mind, not first century politics.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I did not change Scripture at all.

Yes, you most certainly did. The angel speaking to John from the perspective of the current time (not the future) in Rev 17:10 said 5 of the kingdoms HAD fallen. That was not from a second coming perspective that John had, this was an angel telling John in real time that 5 of the kingdoms had fallen as of that time and "one is" with one yet to come. The angel speaking to John did not say in any way, shape or form that 5 kingdoms WILL HAVE fallen as of the time of the second coming. You are adding that to the text and therefore you are changing the scripture. Everyone here can see that. Do you think you're fooling anyone with this lie?

I simply pointed out that John was viewing things at the time of the Second Coming.

Nowhere does the text indicate such a thing. You are believing what you want to believe and making the text say what you want it to say instead of accepting what it actually says.

You view things as if they were happening in the first century like a Preterists does.

LOL. I view John as having written the book in the first century and that some, but far from all, of the things he wrote about were things happening in his day or were things that were true in his day, such as that five of the kingdoms he referenced in relation to the beast had fallen as of the time he was writing the book while one of them existed at the time he wrote the book.

In the case of Revelation 2 and 3, those are messages to actual first century churches in the Roman province of Asia. So, yes, there were things happening in those first century churches in the first century that Jesus alluded to specifically in His messages to them. Does that mean the whole book is about things that happened in the first century? No, of course not. Only foolish full preterists would claim that.

Blame your agreement with Jesuit Preterist theology, not me.

LOL. Do you think anything in the book of Revelation applies to the first century? I would hope so. Clearly, the book was addressed to seven actual first century churches in the ancient Roman province of Asia. Do you deny this? It doesn't at all mean everything in the book applied to them, but certainly some of it did. Namely, chapters 2 and 3.

Do you not think that 5 have fallen at the Second Coming?

No. Why would I think that when John didn't say that? Speaking in present tense, the angel speaking to John said 5 had fallen and "one is". That means 5 of the kingdoms had fallen before he wrote the book and one was still in power when he wrote the book which was obviously Rome.

Was the Second Coming in the first century during the 4th kingdom, Rome?

No, of course not. I'm not a preterist. Jesus has not yet come again.

If you think they are Egypt and Assyria, then you blatantly contradict both Daniel 2

No, I don't contradict Daniel 2 at all. Where does Daniel 2 say that Egypt and Assyria can not represent the first 2 heads/kingdoms of the beast described in Revelation 17:8-10? It doesn't.

What proof do you have that Daniel 2 has the exact same context as Revelation 17:8-10? None. In Daniel 2, the first kingdom shown in King Nebuchadnezzar's dream was the kingdom he ruled over, which was Babylon. That doesn't mean the first head/kingdom of the beast has to also be Babylon. Nothing says such a thing. You are making that up in your imagination.

It's not as if there weren't any previous kingdoms before Babylon. Egypt and Assyria simply had no relation to the vision the king had. Past kingdoms had no relevance to his dream. That doesn't mean they have no relevance to the beast, so it doesn't mean they can't represent the first 2 heads/kingdoms of the beast.

and that the Second Coming is yet to happen after the whole statue of Daniel has fallen which is 5 kingdoms, not 7 with you adding two kingdoms prior to Babylon into God's Word.

Why are you equating the statue of Daniel with the beast? Show me where scripture makes that connection and then maybe I'll consider what you're saying. Otherwise, I have no reason to do that.

John was viewing the time of the Second Coming, when he stated 5 had fallen, not his first century time frame.

Prove it. Where does it say that?

Are you missing that it's the angel who was speaking to John that is talking in Revelation 17:10 rather than John himself talking while seeing a vision of the future? If John was seeing a vision of the second coming in Rev 17:10 and speaking from the perspective of the time of the second coming, then you would have a point. But, that is not the case. Instead, it's an angel speaking to John and telling him what had happened in the past (5 of the 7 kingdoms represented by the 7 heads had fallen), what was true at that time (one of the kingdoms was still in power) and what would be true in the future (1 of the 7 kingdoms was yet to come).

 

[Truth7t7]

The Angel was explaining to John and told him 5 had fallen and one is. In Johns mind that was Rome.

False, John stated no such thing

 

[Truth7t7]

You are believing what you want to believe and making the text say what you want it to say instead of accepting what it actually says.

Sounds exactly like you, are you looking in the mirror, smiles

From a poster that falsely teaches Matthew 24:21 "The Great Tribulation" is a fulfilled event in 70AD, and scripture teaches Jesus returns (Immediately After This Tribulation) in Matthew 24:29 a "Future" event unfulfilled, where is your 2,000 year gap found between Matthew 24:21 & Matthew 24:29, there isn't one!

From a poster that teaches John's (The Beast) is nothing more than "symbolism", when scripture teaches (The Beast) will be a future literal human man with a body!

From a poster that runs from these direct claims without answer!

 

[jeffweeder]

False, John stated no such thing

I didn't say John stated anything.
The Angel had carried John away in the Spirit to see a woman riding on a beast and he wondered in amazement.
The Angel went on to explain John.

The Angel told John 5 has fallen and the 6th is now reigning. John was living in Roman times.

 

[jeffweeder]

John was viewing the Second Coming. The Second Coming was in John's mind, not first century politics.

See above reply to 7t7

 

[rebuilder 454]

The saints are not, in my opinion, in heaven during the *Reign of Antichrist* (not "the Tribulation"), unless it is the *dead* saints! ;) The "Great Tribulation" is, in my view, the NT era in which the Jewish People are punished in the Diaspora. The dead saints are in heaven with the Lord now!

I memorized Matt 24 back in the early 70s. ;)

Angels do, of course, come from heaven. They travel from one end of heaven to the other searching the earth for those who belong to the Lord. There is no Pretrib Rapture, in my view. And there is no mention of one in the Bible--the texts taken to prove this are not proofs at all, but only eisegesis.

The Flood is not used as a choreography detailing the exact sequence of the 2nd Coming. It is used as an example of God's Wrath without all of the inserted itinerary. This is not an exegesis at all. The assumptions being made are not doctrinally asserted in the Scriptures. There is no inference that the Flood account projects a Pretrib Rapture.

Noah escaped from God's wrath poured out on wicked people en mass. At the 2nd Coming, God's People will escape God's all-encompassing eternal wrath through the resurrection. There is no inference in the Flood account that Noah represents dead or living saints. He escapes an earthly judgment. The saints at Christ's Return escape a heavenly judgment.

Matt 10.28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

Heb 12.22 But you have come to Mount Zion, to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly, 23 to the church of the firstborn, whose names are written in heaven. You have come to God, the Judge of all, to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, 24 to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.
25 See to it that you do not refuse him who speaks. If they did not escape when they refused him who warned them on earth, how much less will we, if we turn away from him who warns us from heaven?


Rev 14.14 I looked, and there before me was a white cloud, and seated on the cloud was one like a son of man[b] with a crown of gold on his head and a sharp sickle in his hand. 15 Then another angel came out of the temple and called in a loud voice to him who was sitting on the cloud, “Take your sickle and reap, because the time to reap has come, for the harvest of the earth is ripe.” 16 So he who was seated on the cloud swung his sickle over the earth, and the earth was harvested.

Matt 13.30 Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”...
37 He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. 38 The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one, 39 and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels.
40 “As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. 41 The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. 42 They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear.

This "Harvest" of the Son of Man is not "during the Trib/Reign of Antichrist." It is the classic 2nd Coming of the Son of Man to judge the wicked, deliver the saints, and establish God's Kingdom at the *end of the age.*

In John 6 we are told that the saints are raised up on the "last day." This is the time of the harvest of the saints, as well as the time when God treads the winepress of His wrath.

Rev 14.19 The angel swung his sickle on the earth, gathered its grapes and threw them into the great winepress of God’s wrath.

Quote:
" the Flood is not used as a choreography detailing the exact sequence of the 2nd Coming. It is used as an example of God's Wrath without all of the inserted itinerary. This is not an exegesis at all. The assumptions being made are not doctrinally asserted in the Scriptures"

Uh, no, it is so hurtful to your doctrine, that there is, in honesty, no way to spin it away from what is ACTUALLY SAYS.
Mat 24
37. But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

Hello?
"In the days BEFORE THE FLOOD, EATING, AND DRINKING..NORMAL LIFE AND PEACETIME "
"Watch as He is coming before the flood"

Before the flood, one taken/ left
Vivid chronology

EXACT CHRONOLOGY.
UNMISTAKABLE, and also dishonest, to try and rewrite God's Holy Book.
Red flags galore.

 

[The Light]

When you start rearranging the book of Revelation to fit your human understanding is where you get into trouble like every other poster, who argues over the sticking points.

I am rearranging nothing. When the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, Christ has set up the millennial kingdom. If you don't understand this, you will not understand Revelation.

Revelation 11
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

There are no parallel views, because that would have to be argued over and taught as to what those parallel views are. John saw events as they happened.

There is one wrath of God. That is the seventh seal. Both the trumpets and vial happen in the 7th seal. At the end of the trumpets, Armageddon is over an Christ sets up His kingdom. Same thing happens at the end of the vials.

That multitude in Revelation 7 is all the sum total of all redeemed mankind since Abel and Enoch to the church raptured who make up the church in Paradise. Some came out of great tribulation. Some died peacefully in their sleep while others were being killed on the other side of the earth. There was great tribulation at times even in the OT.

This can be proven as incorrect. What is the tribulation of those days and when does it begin.

Matthew 24
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:

18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.

19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!

20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

John is letting us know at that point, the church was in heaven, the angels were on the earth, and 144k of Israel had been sealed. The final harvest had not started, so those on earth were waiting to stand in Judgment before Jesus sitting on His glorious throne in His Temple in Jerusalem on the earth.

The great multitude is the Church in heaven. The 144,000 are in heaven and the seed of the woman the 12 tribes across the earth are in heaven.

After the 6th seal, on earth are the unbelievers, the woman, Israel in her place of protection and the 2 witnesses.

The church does not return at Armageddon. Those on white horses are the 144k and the final harvest gathered in the first 6 Trumpets and the 7 Thunders. Why do people just skip over the Thunders as if they will not happen?

Armageddon happens during the 7 trumpets. We know that because the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord at the 7th trumpet.

What you call the vengeance and wrath of God during the Trumpets and Thunders, I have no issues with, but the date setting length of time. But it is the final harvest as described in Matthew 25 and Matthew 13.

Jesus is on the earth, because both chapters in Matthew explicitly state Jesus is on the earth, not some symbolism as portrayed by John. John is just pointing out in Revelation 14, the final harvest is over, not the explicit details of the harvest itself.

Jesus is in the clouds in Rev 14. After the harvest believers are in heaven as the great multitude. Unbelievers remain on earth and are cast into the 1 year wrath of God.

Just like at the 5th and 6th Seal , John does not explicitly state the rapture and Second Coming to the Mount of Olives, like Paul would by going into detail. We can know it happened, because now the church is complete and in heaven.

At the second coming Jesus remains in the clouds and sends His angels to gather the elect from heaven and earth. That occurs at the 6th seal

The mount of Olives occurs at the end of the trumpets. That is the second advent when the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord.

It was not just the wrath of God, when all could see the face of God sitting on the GWT at the 6th Seal. They could see the Lamb, Jesus as King on the earth as well.

"And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:"

Who is the He in the next verse, the face of the one on the throne or the Lamb?

"For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"

Wrath of God, wrath of the Lamb, Day of the Lord. ................ALL THE SAME.

 

[The Light]

I have used Scripture.

You say parallel views.

I say two different endings depending on the Confirming of the Covenant during the days of the 7th Trumpet. Daniel 9:27 takes place in the days of the 7th Trumpet.

Daniel 9:27 begins before the seals are opened. The Church is already in heaven. See Rev 5.

You claim Revelation keeps repeating itself. I say Revelation is a systematic removal of humans from the earth.

The Church is in heaven before the seals are opened. The 144,000 are in heaven as 1st fruits before the 5th seal. The seed of the woman is in heaven at the harvest of the 6th seal.

The Seals deal only with the church.

The Church is in heaven before the seals are open. The seal take place in the 70th week of Daniel and are about the people of Daniel.

Daniel 9
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

The Trumpets deal only with Israel.

The trumpets are the wrath of God. The seed of the woman Israel is in heaven at the 6th seal before the wrath of God. The woman, Israel, those that fled to a place of protection are on earth during the wrath of God. None of Gods people are appointed to wrath.

1 Thes 5
9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

The Thunders deal only with the Gentiles.

The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened. The seals are about the people of Daniel.

Each containing their own type of harvest.

The 42 month extension are the gleanings, those beheaded instead of receiving the mark.

There are no extensions.

You cannot remove the church, and then have a harvest, and then all of a sudden time travel back to the rapture of the Church. John did not yo yo through time.

The Church is in heaven BEFORE the seals are opened.

Most are looking for some antichrist and a bunch of trouble, but if you are pre-trib, all that AoD, starts in Revelation after the 7th Trumpet already sounds, and there is no time travel back to the first 4 Seals.

The AOD has to start before the 5th seal.

The first Trumpet cannot sound until the 7th Seal is opened.

Correct.

The 7th Trumpet cannot sound, until after the 7 Thunders.

Correct.

Revelation 14 cannot happen until after the 7th Trumpet starts to sound.

Totally incorrect.

The 1st 6 seals are what Jesus taught about in Matthew 24. Revelation 14 happens in the seals.

Here is the great tribulation which is the 5th seal
Rev 14
13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.

Here is the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal.
Rev 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

This is the same event in Matthew 24

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

There is no negotiation over this order of events. Daniel 9:27 is the week of the days of the 7th Trumpet, because that is the time up in Revelation 10.

The week begins when there a covenant with many. The seals are opened after the covenant is confirmed. Jesus comes at the 6th seal for the second harvest. Then the 1 year wrath of God begins.

"And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets."

The 7th Trumpet is declaring the end of the 70th week. Now the Millennium can start with those promises made in Daniel 9:24.

Correct.

The third woe is directly associated with the 7th Trumpet, not any of the Seals, not the first 6 Trumpets and not the 7 Thunders.

Correct.

The third woe is Satan coming to earth and being given the 42 months in chapter 13.

No. The 42 months begins when the AOD is set up. That takes place in the seals and has to be before the 5th seal.

That is not back in the Seals. Revelation 14 is not back in the Seals. Revelation 14 is the end of the week of the 7th Trumpet. That is it, the end. Satan is bound, and the Millennium starts. God does not say there has to be a third woe.

Rev 14 takes place in the seals.

The Church is in heaven before the seals are opened. The covenant is made with many likely starting final week. The covenant is confirmed and the seals are opened. The 1st 4 seals are the beginning of sorrows in Matthew 24. The 5th seal is the great tribulation of Matthew 24 also seen in Rev 14

Rev 14
13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.

Then Jesus comes at the 6th seal for the harvest. Seen in Matthew 24 and Rev 14.

The fact that you understand the millennial kingdom starts at the 7th trumpet should tell you that Rev 13 and 14 take place in the seals.

"Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child."

None of the redeemed final harvest are on the earth at the 7th Trumpet. They have been removed to the sea of glass, as protection. But that is only if Satan is given 42 months, because the 7th Trumpet is when Satan is cast out as the third woe.

You are confusing Satan as being one of the beasts. He is not. Satan is not given 42 months.

Satan does not time travel at the 7th Trumpet, back to the Seals. There is no time given to Satan prior to the 7th Trumpet. At the 5th Seal, he is able to release his rebel angels from their chains of darkness. They torment humans for 5 months.

The 5th is the great tribulation. The 5 months is after the 7th seal is opened at the 5th trumpet.

Then the 6th Trumpet sounds , and the 7 Thunders. By that time they are invading heaven itself and have to be cast out at the 7th Trumpet.

So why do people yo yo through Revelation as if the facts John presents do not even matter?

Because the millennial kingdom is set up at the 7th trumpet. It's done. Finished. Wrath is over. When you are reading Rev 13 and 14 you get another view of things that happen in the 1st 6 seals.

 

[The Light]

You are not answering my queries. Where in Scripture does it say there will be 100 trumpet blasts at the end before and including the last trumpet? And who is making these blasts?

Where in scripture does it say that the Feast of Trumpets is a day of blowing trumpets?

What happens on the feast of trumpets? There are 100 trumpet blasts and there is the last trump. If you have an issue with this, take it up with the Jews and tell them they have been doing this wrong for a long time.