"Salvation" is the gift of Eternal Life - it's FOREVER.

[Christ4Me]

@Eternally Grateful @Lifelong_sinner @Cooper @Taken @Renniks @BarnyFife

Discipleship or running that race has nothing to do with salvation, because we are saved for why we are in that race, but this is for the high prize of our calling ( Philippians 3:12-21 ) to be that vessel unto honor in His House by departing from iniquity ( 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) & sins daily as we look to Him to help us lay aside every weight & sin each day ( Hebrews 12:1-2 & 1 John 2:1-2 ) so we can be accepted by Him at the rapture event. (2 Corinthians 5:5-11 & 2 Peter 3:3-18 ) and not become castaways and not just losing the rewards of crowns 1 Corinthians 9:24-27 & Revelation 2:18-25

Salvation cannot be lost but what we build on that foundation will be judged ( 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 ) in that day of the rapture ( 1 Peter 4:17 )

Unfortunately we may still sin daily because putting off a good deed for tomorrow is sin, James 4:13-17 so when we do sin, we have an advocate with the Father; 1 John 2:1-2 to ask Him for the forgiveness of those sins ( 1 John 1:9 ), and to ask Him for His help not to do it again, ( Hebrews 4:12-16 ) in laying aside them daily, along with the weights, provisions for the flesh that causes us or tempts us to sin. That is how we look to Him for help daily ( Hebrews 12:1-2 ) in walking in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son 1 John 1:3-7

 

[Christ4Me]

@Eternally Grateful @Lifelong_sinner @Cooper @Taken @Renniks @BarnyFife

It is habitual sins that we are to encourage believers to look to Him daily to lead them away from temptations and deliver them from the evil one and that sin of bondage that is reaping corruption . 1 John 3:3 1 John 3:8 & more importantly 2 Timothy 4:18 & Jude 1:24-25 & Hebrews 4:12-16

To say a believer can never sin after salvation is to deny the Lord's prayer that He had taught His disciples to pray which came with a warning. Matthew 6:9-15 <--- Reads to me that is an everyday thing for us to do or else the Father will not forgive our sins. We all need His help with that daily as it should be obvious below for why this is written to saved believers.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. 31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: 32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Plus habitual sinners will just give up if you really believe no believer can ever sin again after salvation.

Yet at the same time, we do not want to give an air that it doesn't matter because sowing to the flesh is unrepentance, and it can reap corruption for why those that are spiritual are to help those overtaken by a fault, especially those of the household of the faith. Yep. It is written. Galatians 6:1-10

So when we do sin, ask Jesus for forgiveness and His help not to do it again. That is looking to Him for help in laying aside every weight & sin daily in running that race. Hebrews 12:1-2

 

[Taken]

@Eternally Grateful @Lifelong_sinner @Cooper @Taken

Discipleship or running that race has nothing to do with salvation, because we are saved for why we are in that race, but this is for the high prize of our calling ( Philippians 3:12-21 ) to be that vessel unto honor in His House by departing from iniquity ( 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) & sins daily as we look to Him to help us lay aside every weight & sin each day ( Hebrews 12:1-2 & 1 John 2:1-2 ) so we can be accepted by Him at the rapture event. (2 Corinthians 5:5-11 & 2 Peter 3:3-18 ) and not become castaways and not just losing the rewards of crowns 1 Corinthians 9:24-27 & Revelation 2:18-25

Salvation cannot be lost but what we build on that foundation will be judged ( 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 ) in that day of the rapture ( 1 Peter 4:17 )

Unfortunately we may still sin daily because putting off a good deed for tomorrow is sin, James 4:13-17 so when we do sin, we have an advocate with the Father; 1 John 2:1-2 to ask Him for the forgiveness of those sins ( 1 John 1:9 ), and to ask Him for His help not to do it again, ( Hebrews 4:12-16 ) in laying aside them daily, along with the weights, provisions for the flesh that causes us or tempts us to sin. That is how we look to Him for help daily ( Hebrews 12:1-2 ) in walking in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son 1 John 1:3-7

Agree, men are CALLED.
The major point of Jesus coming to Earth, was to Speak the Word of God.
And Send Teachers out into the World, to Speak the Word of God.
Which is precisely men OF the World, being CALLED to Hear the Word of God.
Some Teachers, Preach the Word of God, according to Gods Word.
Some “Teachers”, Preach the word of man, according to man.

Agree, some men hear and listen.
Some men hear a bit, and reject.

* Some men hear, believe, and CALL ON THE LORD, accepting His gift of salvation RIGHT THEN, and ARE SAVED, right then.

* Some men hear, continuing hearing, believe, but NEVER Call ON the Lord, to become SAVED, while alive in their flesh.
THEY... continue hearing, believe, (endure) to the day of their physical death....and THEN become SAVED.

* Some men hear, believe, continue, then stop believing, and SHALL NOT become Saved at their physical death.

 

[Taken]

@Eternally Grateful @Lifelong_sinner @Cooper @Taken @Renniks @BarnyFife

It is habitual sins that we are to encourage believers to look to Him daily to lead them away from temptations and deliver them from the evil one and that sin of bondage that is reaping corruption . 1 John 3:3 1 John 3:8 & more importantly 2 Timothy 4:18 & Jude 1:24-25 & Hebrews 4:12-16

To say a believer can never sin after salvation is to deny the Lord's prayer that He had taught His disciples to pray which came with a warning. Matthew 6:9-15 <--- Reads to me that is an everyday thing for us to do or else the Father will not forgive our sins. We all need His help with that daily as it should be obvious below for why this is written to saved believers.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. 31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: 32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Plus habitual sinners will just give up if you really believe no believer can ever sin again after salvation.

Yet at the same time, we do not want to give an air that it doesn't matter because sowing to the flesh is unrepentance, and it can reap corruption for why those that are spiritual are to help those overtaken by a fault, especially those of the household of the faith. Yep. It is written. Galatians 6:1-10

So when we do sin, ask Jesus for forgiveness and His help not to do it again. That is looking to Him for help in laying aside every weight & sin daily in running that race. Hebrews 12:1-2

Disagree.
A believing and following man, that IS NOT SAVED, (has not become converted)......Believes and CONTINUES TO SIN....and continually asks for forgiveness.

A SAVED man (WHO HAS BECOME CONVERTED), His SINS are Forgiven......he sins NO MORE.
(And before you wonder if that means...sinless...or without sin...I am saying no such thing......I am expressly saying....HIS SINS ARE FORGIVEN and Covered........and thereafter he can not SIN.......ANY MORE.....).

 

[Eternally Grateful]

My father gave me physical life, I did not earn it, for it was a free gift, and like my spiritual father, we remained close till the end of our days. Unfortunately, just as some families on earth break up, people can break with their heavenly Father also, and they do, but remember this, it is always OUR doing. Our heavenly Father, never leaves us or forsakes us, so we need to examine ourselves, even to the extent of whether we follow the one who gave us new life eternal, or whether we follow an imposter.
.

Here is the difference.

Even those who break up with their family. Still have their fathers blood flowing through them. You may leave your father, but your still your fathers son. You have your fathers blood in you. You can’t break that.

Its no different than Christ and his blood which is in every one of the people who were adopted into his family through his blood

You may walk away, But you are still your fathers son. And remember also. God said he will never leave nor forsake you. Remember in the OT when a prophet wanted to get away. What was Gods answer? Where are you going to go that I am not there. To the highest mountain, the lowest valley, wherever you go. There I am.

You may try to walk away, But God will never walk away, and he has ahold of you. Again, Would you or any loving father allow their child to jump to their death?

You Heavenly Father out of love will nto allow you to do that either

 

[mailmandan]

Jesus taught eternal life not conditional life...

Amen! Salvation is not probation.
Eternal life is not temporary life.
Jesus is the door. He is not a revolving door.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

There's lots of people who have made that transition. It's not easy to understand why, but I'm convinced that the devil has something to do with it. It's probably a series of little unbeliefs that eventually add up to realizing that they have lost faith completely.

Nah,

We lose faith when the person becomes unfaithful, or we never had true faith to begin with.Many jews tried this new christian thing, but their faith was in judaism, not in christianity. So they ended up leaving the church and going back to the law. How often did paul and the book of hebrews warn them of doing this. Hebrews went on to say if they did this, they can not be renewed to repentance because they crucify for themselves the son of God again.

A dog returns to his vomit because he is a dog. He was never made a new creature. If he was. He never would have returned to being a dog.

It is God who makes you new, Vomit (sin) is poison to you now. You can’t continue in it like you did before. Thats why John said whoever sins has never seen God and whoever is born of God can not sin, You can;t undo what God did and all of a sudden vomit taste good again and you start eating it like it is a delicacy. Not to mention you are chastened by God. Which is painful. Believe you me, I know, as a former prodigal son, how painful it can be.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Amen! Salvation is not probation.
Eternal life is not temporary life.
Jesus is the door. He is not a revolving door.

We were not given a spirit of fear. But of sound mind, and we can come to our dad and say Abba Father.

The people for the most part I have seen leave church are those who are told they have to live up to some standard. Or if you are struggling in an area, you must not be saved, And instead of helping them overcome, they judge them.

These people leave and deny the God they came to believe in. Which was not the god of heaven. But the legalistic God taught by the legalistic church.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Yeah, I guess they got the name of the book of Romans wrong. Silly me.

Either way, as the record states, they were only "called."

Paul wrote letters to the church, and it was directed to the church.

But he, like every pastor I know, understood not everyone in that church who would be reading his words was saved, there are some who were there and had not made the final decision yet. Some were exploring and some where there just because of the fellowship. He wrote to them also. That they may make that dicision, and gave them warnings if they did not.

 

[Cooper]

Here is the difference.

Even those who break up with their family. Still have their fathers blood flowing through them. You may leave your father, but your still your fathers son. You have your fathers blood in you. You can’t break that.

Its no different than Christ and his blood which is in every one of the people who were adopted into his family through his blood

You may walk away, But you are still your fathers son. And remember also. God said he will never leave nor forsake you. Remember in the OT when a prophet wanted to get away. What was Gods answer? Where are you going to go that I am not there. To the highest mountain, the lowest valley, wherever you go. There I am.

You may try to walk away, But God will never walk away, and he has ahold of you. Again, Would you or any loving father allow their child to jump to their death?

You Heavenly Father out of love will nto allow you to do that either

I still wouldn't have a home.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

@Lifelong_sinner & @Cooper & @Taken @Renniks @BarnyFife

Apostle John is addressing believers that thinks sins is no longer sin to them for why he reproves them by pointing out how Jesus walked in the light in 1 John 1:3-10

So when the lust of the flesh the lust of the eye, and the pride of life causes some to love the world and not have the love of the Father in them, one can see that as them departing out from us in that way too and not just by false prophets. 1 John 2:14-29

There are two folds of sheep; the ones that follow His voice and those who followed the stranger's voice, those sheep that went astray ( John 10:1-5 ), but the Lord will get those lost sheep even after excommunication by the church ( Matthew 18:10-17 ) and at the rapture event when He denies them at the rapture event because unrepentant carnal believers & even former believers are still His for why He still abides ( 2 Timothy 2:11-13 )

Those sheep He "must" bring that are not of the fold that followed His voice hence the stranger's voice, His sheep that went astray ( John 10:14-16 ) because He will lose none of all the Father has given Him ( John 6:37-40 )

Do note how former believers are still called to depart from iniquity in 2 Timothy 2:18-21 so as to be accepted by Him ( 2 Corinthians 5:7-11 ) as a vessel unto honor in His House rather than disqualified and left behind as denied by the Bridegroom to attend the Marriage Supper in Heaven but as that vessel unto dishonor ( vessels of wood & earth ) but still in His House.

My friend, In the small segment of 1 John I wrote about. John tells us who he is talking about

22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.

These people were

1. They were part of the ministry and had fellowship with the church as in they were with them
2. They left the church
3. In leaving, they now deny Jesus, which by defenition makes them an unbeliever.

It does not matter what group you are in, gnostic, jew, catholic, etc etc.., if this happens, John says you are an antichrist, and you were never a true part of the church, if you were a true part of the church you never would have left denying christ

Many leave the church but do not deny christ, this particular group are those who leave and are not claiming to be a non believer, they have in effect given God the finger and says I deny you..

 

[Cooper]

Agree, men are CALLED.
The major point of Jesus coming to Earth, was to Speak the Word of God.
And Send Teachers out into the World, to Speak the Word of God.
Which is precisely men OF the World, being CALLED to Hear the Word of God.
Some Teachers, Preach the Word of God, according to Gods Word.
Some “Teachers”, Preach the word of man, according to man.

Agree, some men hear and listen.
Some men hear a bit, and reject.

* Some men hear, believe, and CALL ON THE LORD, accepting His gift of salvation RIGHT THEN, and ARE SAVED, right then.

* Some men hear, continuing hearing, believe, but NEVER Call ON the Lord, to become SAVED, while alive in their flesh.
THEY... continue hearing, believe, (endure) to the day of their physical death....and THEN become SAVED.

* Some men hear, believe, continue, then stop believing, and SHALL NOT become Saved at their physical death.

If people are called, what is all this rubbish about election?
.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

@Eternally Grateful @Lifelong_sinner @Cooper @Taken @Renniks @BarnyFife

It is habitual sins that we are to encourage believers to look to Him daily to lead them away from temptations and deliver them from the evil one and that sin of bondage that is reaping corruption . 1 John 3:3 1 John 3:8 & more importantly 2 Timothy 4:18 & Jude 1:24-25 & Hebrews 4:12-16

To say a believer can never sin after salvation is to deny the Lord's prayer that He had taught His disciples to pray which came with a warning. Matthew 6:9-15 <--- Reads to me that is an everyday thing for us to do or else the Father will not forgive our sins. We all need His help with that daily as it should be obvious below for why this is written to saved believers.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. 31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: 32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Plus habitual sinners will just give up if you really believe no believer can ever sin again after salvation.

Yet at the same time, we do not want to give an air that it doesn't matter because sowing to the flesh is unrepentance, and it can reap corruption for why those that are spiritual are to help those overtaken by a fault, especially those of the household of the faith. Yep. It is written. Galatians 6:1-10

So when we do sin, ask Jesus for forgiveness and His help not to do it again. That is looking to Him for help in laying aside every weight & sin daily in running that race. Hebrews 12:1-2

My friend,

Again, the apostle john says the a child of God can not live in sin, and whoever does has never seen or met God

Your right, we can claim a believer will never sin, The same author says if we claim we have no sin we are decieved. And we need to get into a discipleship relationship with someone we trust so we have accountability and can work on those sins, and study and learn and learn what other sins we are doing we do nto even know are sins. Its a lifetime of work to walk towards being like christ.

But a true believer can not go back to living in sin like before salvation. The Bible says that is impossible.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I still wouldn't have a home.

Yep. Not here on earth. But when you died, A loving father would come to get you and bring you home, Just like God will

Now when you get home, and its judgment day, You may see all your rewards burned as wood hay and stubble. But you will still have a home.

God does not go back on his promises. He is a truly loving God. That is why his death made such a pronounced impact on the spirit world. He died for sinners. Even those who do not want him. He died for everyone. And when he adopts people into his family. He does not let them go.

 

[Cooper]

My friend, In the small segment of 1 John I wrote about. John tells us who he is talking about

22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.

These people were

1. They were part of the ministry and had fellowship with the church as in they were with them
2. They left the church
3. In leaving, they now deny Jesus, which by defenition makes them an unbeliever.

It does not matter what group you are in, gnostic, jew, catholic, etc etc.., if this happens, John says you are an antichrist, and you were never a true part of the church, if you were a true part of the church you never would have left denying christ

Many leave the church but do not deny christ, this particular group are those who leave and are not claiming to be a non believer, they have in effect given God the finger and says I deny you..

Are you saying people go cold, but still believe and would never dream of denying him? If so, I agree with you.
.

 

[Cooper]

Yep. Not here on earth. But when you died, A loving father would come to get you and bring you home, Just like God will

Now when you get home, and its judgment day, You may see all your rewards burned as wood hay and stubble. But you will still have a home.

God does not go back on his promises. He is a truly loving God. That is why his death made such a pronounced impact on the spirit world. He died for sinners. Even those who do not want him. He died for everyone. And when he adopts people into his family. He does not let them go.

The Bible differentiates between the flesh and the spirit. So I think you are saying if someone was on drugs let's say, they might be thrown out of house and home, but both father and son still love each other? The point being, is that the Christian is fortunate in having an earthly home and a heavenly home?

Jesus said to build up treasure in heaven.
.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Are you saying people go cold, but still believe and would never dream of denying him? If so, I agree with you.
.

I went cold for 5 years. Because of some crap that happened in my life. I lost faith in the church. But I never lost faith in God. Sadly while away, in seeking to fill the whole that was left. i did some things I am not proud of. But I also suffered through those things, the guilt and the pain was so severe, in the end, I wanted to take my own life. Until God stepped and and a friend I led to the lord as teens, called me, And spared my life and got me back in church.

The lord promises, he leaves the whole flock to find the lost sheep. That sheep hears his voice and follows him. He came and found me through my friend, and I followed him back. But he also waited until I wa broken and ready. Thats what makes him God. He knows when to act.

 

[Taken]

If people are called, what is all this rubbish about election?
.

God does not call you up on the Phone!
Men are CALLED to come HEAR the WORD of GOD!

Never seen a Marquee sitting in front of a Church building?
It’s an INVITATION to COME AND HEAR the WORD of GOD!

Never had a friend INVITE you to Church?
It’s an INVITATION to COME and HEAR the WORD OF GOD!

Why the INVITATIONS?
So a man CAN HEAR GODS WORD, which IS GOD CALLING MEN!

Never Learned, Once a man ANSWERS Gods Calling, the man IS HEARING Gods WORD?

Never Learned, BY HEARING Gods Word, God Word is an OFFERING for men to Become SAVED........WHILE ALIVE IN THEIR FLESH?

Never Learned, men WHO ACCEPT GODS OFFERING.......THEN CALL on the Lord NAME, and CONFESS, TESTIFY, GIVE THEIR CONSENT, BY THEIR OWN WORD, to ACCEPT the Lord Gods OFFERING?

Never Learned, a man WHO IS ACCEPTING Gods OFFERING.....
IS: “choosing, agreeing, selections, submitting”....which ALL MEANS....
ELECTING the Lord God Almighty.....once and forever.....ONLY HE...
TO FOREVER....BE THEIR GOD ?

Rubbish?
Good grief, be still your mouth!

1 Thes 1:
[4] Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.

Never Learned...or Understood the meaning of 1 Thes 1:4 ?

* Precisely......applicable to a man ... WHO CHOSE to answer Gods calling.
* Precisely......applicable to a man ... WHO CALLED ON GOD, in his own testimony and word, that man CHOOSES ONLY the Lord God Almighty to Forever BE THAT MANS God.
* Precisely.....the Apostles teaching ... KNOW THIS: that man IS: NOW...
~ A Brethren of all others whose ONLY God, is the Lord God Almighty.
~ All Brethren are beloved of All who are Brethren, all having ONLY one God.......the Lord God Almighty.

DID you not learn what a commitment is?
A commitment is an AGREEMENT, between TWO.
* God offers grounds, the contract, what can be agreed on.
* God being the author of the contract, already agrees with the contract.
* It is men who have to decided to agree, and accept the contract...or not.
* Once a man agrees...
* the Contract is SEALED in agreement...An Agreement...
BETWEEN......God and one man.
BETWEEN..... One man and God.
And the agreement IS KEPT FOREVER VALID...BY THE POWER OF GOD!

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The Bible differentiates between the flesh and the spirit. So I think you are saying if someone was on drugs let's say, they might be thrown out of house and home, but both father and son still love each other? The point being, is that the Christian is fortunate in having an earthly home and a heavenly home?

Jesus said to build up treasure in heaven.
.

I was given this as an explanation along time ago. And I think it fits, I hope I can remember it all

Its a story about a son, who hated his father, his father wanted his life to mean something, so he kept asking his child to do things, and would punish him when his child sinned against him, so he left. He traveled to the other side of the country, and lived the way he wanted to live, apart from his fathers blessings, he went out on his own.

About 20 years later, a man knocked on his door. It was a lawyer. he was told his father had passed away, but his father left his inheritance to his son. You see, even though the son left, he never stopped being the fathers son, The fathers love could not be broken. He made a promise, and on his character and his love, he kept that promise. No matter what the son did.

The son never doubted his fathers love again.

I believe when we get to heaven we will hear af many stories like this, all these prodigal children who left. And died before they returned (like I did) and yet when it comes to ressurection day. They are told they still have their fathers inheritance, Because it was not based on them that the father gave it to them to begin with, it was based on his love, His blood and his family

A father who is truly loving does not leave his child. he will let him walk away in free will and turn out on his own, and suffer all that he will suffer for doing that (i know of that suffering personally) But he will never go back on his promise.

 

[Cooper]

I went cold for 5 years. Because of some crap that happened in my life. I lost faith in the church. But I never lost faith in God. Sadly while away, in seeking to fill the whole that was left. i did some things I am not proud of. But I also suffered through those things, the guilt and the pain was so severe, in the end, I wanted to take my own life. Until God stepped and and a friend I led to the lord as teens, called me, And spared my life and got me back in church.

The lord promises, he leaves the whole flock to find the lost sheep. That sheep hears his voice and follows him. He came and found me through my friend, and I followed him back. But he also waited until I wa broken and ready. Thats what makes him God. He knows when to act.

God is wonderful, praise his Holy name. He cares for us and brings us back to the fold. I am glad you are back and possibly a stronger and more understanding Christian after those years in the wilderness.

My concern is for those who refuse to return to the fold.