SALVATION: BY GRACE OR BY WORKS? A FALSE DICHOTOMY

[GracePeace]

Dichotomy: a division into two especially mutually exclusive or contradictory groups.

False dichotomy in salvation is the belief that it must be by Grace or it must be by works.
This is a false dichotomy because the two do not contradict!!
They both harmonize perfectly with one another.

The faith only to obtain salvation gospel advocates teach a false gospel of saving faith apart from works.
Likewise faith onlyist teach if works are involved then salvation cannot be by Grace for grace is a free gift.
This is a logical fallacy!

Grace is a free gift but grace is not unconditionally given.
Gods grace is conditional, therefore Gods grace comes with terms.

Must meet Gods terms to receive His gift of unmerited grace,
Titus 2:11-12,
- for the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that denying ungodliness and worldly lusts we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age

Grace teaches us we must do good works. Paul taught Titus that grace and works go together. They harmonize!
You will hear the faith onlyist use Ephesians 2:8-9 as a "proof text" we are saved without any involvement of works.

First, if salvation is apart from ALL works then we are saved without the work Christ did on the cross,
John 17:4,
- I have glorified You on earth I have finished the  work which You have given Me

Second Paul does teach in Ephesians 2:8-9 that we are not saved by works.
But what must be understood is the gospel teaches there are different kinds of works.
To lump ALL works into meritorious works like for instance the commandment to be baptized, turns Jesus' gospel
in Mark 16:15-16 into a gospel that teaches we earn our salvation through a work of baptism.

The kind of works Paul condemns in Ephesians 2:8-9 is works of merit.
Paul also teaches that saving faith is a faith that works,
Galatians 5:6,
- for in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision profits anything but faith  working through love
1Corinthians 7:19,
- circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but keeping the commandments of God is what matters

God requires a faith with action/obedience to His commandments in Jesus' gospel.
Only faith that works to meet Gods conditions can receive His grace!!!

When one believes in His gospel 1Corinthians 15:1-4
And obeys the commandments in His gospel,
Can one qualify to receive His unmerited favor.
Hebrews 5:8-9,
- and having been perfected, Jesus became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him

Jesus' gospel is by grace through faith when faith is rightly defined.
It is a working/obedient faith that justifies the alien sinner,
James 2:24,
- you see then that a man is justified by works and NOT by faith alone

This faith is the only faith that is acceptable unto God,
Acts 10:35,
- but in every nation whoever fears God and works righteousness is accepted by Him

God made it very clear that anyone who teaches no obedience/works to God to be saved is not a servant of of God but of the devil, Gen. 3:3-4.
1John 2:2-5,
- and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins and not ours only but also for the whole world, now by this we know we know Him  if we keep His commandments, he who says I know Him and does not keep His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him

Last we get INTO Christ by baptism,
Galatians 3:26-27,
- for you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, for as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ

No spiritual blessings outside of Christ,
Ephesians 1:3,
- blessed be the God and Father of our Lord and Savior who has blessed us with EVERY spiritual blessing  in the heavenly places IN Christ

If not why not?

The confusion between salvation by faith or salvation by works seems, to me, to be resolved in the statements
1. "God's righteousness is revealed from faith to faith" (Ro 1:17),
2. "let every man be fully convinced in his own mind" (Ro 14:5)
3. "whatever is not of faith is sin" (Ro 14:23)

"Works" we are not saved by are "a righteousness of my own", deeds that proceed from the sinful flesh (Ro 8:3; Gal 3:3), but, under Grace (Ro 6:14), works we do by "faith" are God's own working in us (Php 2:12,13), which is "God's righteousness" (Php 3:9), whereby we are justified (Ro 2:6-16), which is why it says the one who does not walk by faith sins and is "condemned" (Ro 14:23), whereas the one who is "in Christ" has "no condemnation" (Ro 8:1): to "abide in Him" (1 Jn 2:28), where the eternal life is located (1 Jn 5:11), requires walking by faith, or to "love one another" (1 Jn 3:23, 24), and those who are not "found in Him" (Php 3:9), bc of not working works of faith, not loving others, are "condemned" (opposite of "justified"--bc they're not abiding in Christ, "God Is Our Righteousness" (Jer 23:6)) both now and in the future.

This conclusion is in keeping with ancient forms of Christianity, and offends all of the Johnny-Come-Latelies who can't make Scripture say anything coherent.

 

[GracePeace]

Dichotomy: a division into two especially mutually exclusive or contradictory groups.

False dichotomy in salvation is the belief that it must be by Grace or it must be by works.
This is a false dichotomy because the two do not contradict!!
They both harmonize perfectly with one another.

The faith only to obtain salvation gospel advocates teach a false gospel of saving faith apart from works.
Likewise faith onlyist teach if works are involved then salvation cannot be by Grace for grace is a free gift.
This is a logical fallacy!

Grace is a free gift but grace is not unconditionally given.
Gods grace is conditional, therefore Gods grace comes with terms.

Must meet Gods terms to receive His gift of unmerited grace,
Titus 2:11-12,
- for the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that denying ungodliness and worldly lusts we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age

Grace teaches us we must do good works. Paul taught Titus that grace and works go together. They harmonize!
You will hear the faith onlyist use Ephesians 2:8-9 as a "proof text" we are saved without any involvement of works.

First, if salvation is apart from ALL works then we are saved without the work Christ did on the cross,
John 17:4,
- I have glorified You on earth I have finished the  work which You have given Me

Second Paul does teach in Ephesians 2:8-9 that we are not saved by works.
But what must be understood is the gospel teaches there are different kinds of works.
To lump ALL works into meritorious works like for instance the commandment to be baptized, turns Jesus' gospel
in Mark 16:15-16 into a gospel that teaches we earn our salvation through a work of baptism.

The kind of works Paul condemns in Ephesians 2:8-9 is works of merit.
Paul also teaches that saving faith is a faith that works,
Galatians 5:6,
- for in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision profits anything but faith  working through love
1Corinthians 7:19,
- circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but keeping the commandments of God is what matters

God requires a faith with action/obedience to His commandments in Jesus' gospel.
Only faith that works to meet Gods conditions can receive His grace!!!

When one believes in His gospel 1Corinthians 15:1-4
And obeys the commandments in His gospel,
Can one qualify to receive His unmerited favor.
Hebrews 5:8-9,
- and having been perfected, Jesus became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him

Jesus' gospel is by grace through faith when faith is rightly defined.
It is a working/obedient faith that justifies the alien sinner,
James 2:24,
- you see then that a man is justified by works and NOT by faith alone

This faith is the only faith that is acceptable unto God,
Acts 10:35,
- but in every nation whoever fears God and works righteousness is accepted by Him

God made it very clear that anyone who teaches no obedience/works to God to be saved is not a servant of of God but of the devil, Gen. 3:3-4.
1John 2:2-5,
- and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins and not ours only but also for the whole world, now by this we know we know Him  if we keep His commandments, he who says I know Him and does not keep His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him

Last we get INTO Christ by baptism,
Galatians 3:26-27,
- for you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, for as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ

No spiritual blessings outside of Christ,
Ephesians 1:3,
- blessed be the God and Father of our Lord and Savior who has blessed us with EVERY spiritual blessing  in the heavenly places IN Christ

If not why not?

Also, yes, God saves us by grace through faith, but that salvation is comparable to the Jews' from Egypt--after having been saved, they sinned, so they fell under God's wrath and didn't inherit the Promise, and this happened to them to warn us what will happen to us if we also live in sin after having been saved (1 Corinthians 10).

 

[amigo de christo]

Your saved by Grace.. Through faith.. Not works.

You can obey until your blue in the faith. It will not save you

they wont truly obey though . that too is key .
IF one denies JESUS CHRIST , believe me they are not OBEYING . yeah . BUT YE HAVE OBEYED FROM THE HEART
that VERY COMMANDMENT DELIVERED YOU . we cannot seperate faith and love , obediance and etc .
WHO WE OBEY issssssssss whose we are . We are saved SOLEY BY THE GRACE OF GOD .
the problem is many folks , AS YOU WELL KNOW , are following another jesus , another version of what THEY think grace is
another love , thus another god . THE SPIRIT OF GOD IS HOLY . and cannot lie .
But men can ......................
the more we bible up , the better off many folks gonna be for having done so .

 

[amigo de christo]

We hear the gospel of Christ for it is the power of God unto salvation. Romans 1:16
We either believe it to be truth and accept it, or deny it's truth and reject God's amazing love unto mankind. John 3:

As believers of God and his word we all must follow his commandments under the law of liberty; (1 Peter 2:16-17
As free, and not using your liberty for a cloke of maliciousness, but as the servants of God. Honour all men. Love the brotherhood.)
God's grace and our faith in Jesus will cause us to want to please him at the cost of our own lives, our desires, ect and be crucified with him.

I think the works that are in dispute are to do with the traditions and rituals of organized religions and the private interpretations of the doctrines of men; not the commands of our saviour.

Mankind will use liberty as a means to serve the flesh , NOT GOD .
mankind will follow the traditions and rituals of organized religion passing them off as THE PRECEPTS OF GOD .
But
LAMBS DONT AND WONT . nor will they sit under such who do such a thing .
YEP . Thats right sister . Lambs follow THE KING . And the BOOK from which we feast , HIS HOLY BIBLE .
that is what lambs love . but men love as they love and will do as they love to do .
But lambs have the LOVE OF GOD shed upon their hearts , they gonna do AS HE BIDS and LOVE HIS TRUTH .

 

[GracePeace]

Wrong, gentiles and former Jews made up the congregation in Rome.

Paul was teaching the gentile converts to Christ in the book of Romans not to allow the Jewish converts to Christ to bind the old law on them!!!

The Jewish Christians tried to bind the old law on gentile christians.
Paul is teaching about this in the book of Romans and Galatians.
The apostles were dealing with this in the book of Acts also,
Acts 15:24,
- forasmuch as we have heard that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words subverting your souls saying ye must be circumcised and keep the law to whom we gave no such commandment

Acts 2:10 Talks about the Jews who were christians in Rome!! Those Jews were members of the church in Rome,
- Phrygia and Pamphylia in Egypt and in parts of Libya about cyrene and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes

Every scholar knows and understands this self-evident fact, but the people here aren't well read.

Romans 2:17 You call yourself a Jew
Romans 4:1 Abraham our forefather according to the flesh
Romans 7:1 Brothers (for I speak to those who know the Law),

From chapter 2 through chapter 11, Paul is addressing Jewish believers in Rome--Gentiles back then didn't know the Scriptures (Ro 2:14), so they wouldn't have even known where to begin to object to Paul, so all of the Scripture-based objections Paul was raising and answering would've been completely lost on them, so of course those parts were written to Jews. So many mistakes are made by people who just don't even understand the basic written text.

 

[amigo de christo]

We are Born Again, exactly how God speaks it into being.

We are Born Again by his seed, which is the Living word of God, The Holy Spirit....” Spirit gives birth to spirit “
We were born of our human fathers seed.

We are Born Again...by our Fathers seed, who is God...by the power of the Holy Spirit...the seed of God is Living and he is the Holy Spirit...he is not dead......he brings life to those who are Born Again.....his Spirit brings our spirit out of darkness into his light,.....we become Alive in Christ’s Spirit.....as his word says.

1 Peter 1:23​

​

King James Version​

​

​

23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Ephesians 2​

​

New International Version​

​

​

Made Alive in Christ​

2 As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh[a] and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christand seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8 For it is by grace you have been saved,through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

The key to knowing WHOM to GIVE ALL CREDIT , ALL HONOR and ALL GLORY is
in knowing , does a man MAKE HIMSELF BORN AGAIN , or was this the WORK of GOD .
FOR that answer i allow us a reminder .
On may thirtieth of two thousand six i started out as every day i had before . The old man lost in sin and darkness .
BUT THEN GRACE APPEARED and DREW ME TO GOD PUTTING WHOLE NEW DESIRES IN MY HEART , FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST .
THUS , GOTTA SAY ALL THE CREDIT GOES TO GOD . That we indeed are saved SOLEY and i do mean SOLEY BY the GRACE OF GOD .

 

[GracePeace]

Can you not obey the commandment of God in the new testament and be saved?
Doing Gods commandments are works of righteousness., Acts 10:35= Psalm 119:172

1John 3:23-24,
- and this is Gods commandment that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another as He gave us commandment

Fact: God does not do the commandments of God. We must obey His commandments.
We must work the works of God, John 6:28-29, John 14:12,
- most assuredly I say to you he who believes in Me the works that I do he will do also and greater works than these he will do, because I go to My Father

Yup...

"Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure." Php 2:12,13

They say "God does the work"--that's only half right. The whole truth is "God Is working in you, therefore obey."

 

[L.A.M.B.]

The key to knowing WHOM to GIVE ALL CREDIT , ALL HONOR and ALL GLORY is
in knowing , does a man MAKE HIMSELF BORN AGAIN , or was this the WORK of GOD .
FOR that answer i allow us a reminder .
On may thirtieth of two thousand six i started out as every day i had before . The old man lost in sin and darkness .
BUT THEN GRACE APPEARED and DREW ME TO GOD PUTTING WHOLE NEW DESIRES IN MY HEART , FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST .
THUS , GOTTA SAY ALL THE CREDIT GOES TO GOD . That we indeed are saved SOLEY and i do mean SOLEY BY the GRACE OF GOD .

Amen.
You were given a CHOICE when grace was revealed and you were drawn by the conviction of the Holy Spirit !

YOU COULD HAVE REFUSED THE GRACE OF GOD UNTO SALVATION, AS MANY DO !!!

CHOOSE THIS DAY, WHILE IT IS CALLED TODAY, WHOM YOU WILL SERVE.

 

[GracePeace]

Here is a teaching from Jesus in every translation on earth that his real teachers teach the flock=Matt 6:33-Keep on seeking-FIRST- the kingdom and his( YHWH(Jehovah) righteousness and all these things will be added( sustenance, covering, spirituality)--teachers lead by the darkness that do not listen to Jesus teach to seek Jesus' righteousness first. What do your teachers teach?

The topic is not whether Jesus is God. Why don't you start your own thread on that topic? Why do you have to crash someone else's thread and take it off the rails? Why do you have to be disorderly?

 

[Keiw]

The topic is not whether Jesus is God. Why don't you start your own thread on that topic? Why do you have to crash someone else's thread and take it off the rails? Why do you have to be disorderly?

Salvation is only for-Matt 7:21--The ones who live now to do Jesus' Fathers will over self in this satan ruled system. That means those listened to Jesus and obeyed=Man does not live by bread alone but by EVERY utterance from God= OT-NT, over and over it never stops. The ones taking the leadin Jesus' 1 real religion make 100% sure they teach-Every utterance from God to the flock without fail. Thus all can look at who teaches them if they obey Jesus or not. If not--RUN FROM THEM.

 

[GracePeace]

Dichotomy: a division into two especially mutually exclusive or contradictory groups.

False dichotomy in salvation is the belief that it must be by Grace or it must be by works.
This is a false dichotomy because the two do not contradict!!
They both harmonize perfectly with one another.

The faith only to obtain salvation gospel advocates teach a false gospel of saving faith apart from works.
Likewise faith onlyist teach if works are involved then salvation cannot be by Grace for grace is a free gift.
This is a logical fallacy!

Grace is a free gift but grace is not unconditionally given.
Gods grace is conditional, therefore Gods grace comes with terms.

Must meet Gods terms to receive His gift of unmerited grace,
Titus 2:11-12,
- for the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that denying ungodliness and worldly lusts we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age

Grace teaches us we must do good works. Paul taught Titus that grace and works go together. They harmonize!
You will hear the faith onlyist use Ephesians 2:8-9 as a "proof text" we are saved without any involvement of works.

First, if salvation is apart from ALL works then we are saved without the work Christ did on the cross,
John 17:4,
- I have glorified You on earth I have finished the  work which You have given Me

Second Paul does teach in Ephesians 2:8-9 that we are not saved by works.
But what must be understood is the gospel teaches there are different kinds of works.
To lump ALL works into meritorious works like for instance the commandment to be baptized, turns Jesus' gospel
in Mark 16:15-16 into a gospel that teaches we earn our salvation through a work of baptism.

The kind of works Paul condemns in Ephesians 2:8-9 is works of merit.
Paul also teaches that saving faith is a faith that works,
Galatians 5:6,
- for in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision profits anything but faith  working through love
1Corinthians 7:19,
- circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but keeping the commandments of God is what matters

God requires a faith with action/obedience to His commandments in Jesus' gospel.
Only faith that works to meet Gods conditions can receive His grace!!!

When one believes in His gospel 1Corinthians 15:1-4
And obeys the commandments in His gospel,
Can one qualify to receive His unmerited favor.
Hebrews 5:8-9,
- and having been perfected, Jesus became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him

Jesus' gospel is by grace through faith when faith is rightly defined.
It is a working/obedient faith that justifies the alien sinner,
James 2:24,
- you see then that a man is justified by works and NOT by faith alone

This faith is the only faith that is acceptable unto God,
Acts 10:35,
- but in every nation whoever fears God and works righteousness is accepted by Him

God made it very clear that anyone who teaches no obedience/works to God to be saved is not a servant of of God but of the devil, Gen. 3:3-4.
1John 2:2-5,
- and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins and not ours only but also for the whole world, now by this we know we know Him  if we keep His commandments, he who says I know Him and does not keep His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him

Last we get INTO Christ by baptism,
Galatians 3:26-27,
- for you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, for as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ

No spiritual blessings outside of Christ,
Ephesians 1:3,
- blessed be the God and Father of our Lord and Savior who has blessed us with EVERY spiritual blessing  in the heavenly places IN Christ

If not why not?

BTW That avatar is funny lol
I'm pro 2A so I'm not laughing "at" it, it's just funny.

 

[GracePeace]

Salvation is only for-Matt 7:21--The ones who live now to do Jesus' Fathers will over self in this satan ruled system. That means those listened to Jesus and obeyed=Man does not live by bread alone but by EVERY utterance from God= OT-NT, over and over it never stops. The ones taking the leadin Jesus' 1 real religion make 100% sure they teach-Every utterance from God to the flock without fail. Thus all can look at who teaches them if they obey Jesus or not. If not--RUN FROM THEM.

So you're saying you're on topic bc you're agreeing with the OP (we must walk in faith to be saved, ultimately), and you're adding that part of walking in faith is believing that Jesus is not God?

 

[Keiw]

So you're saying you're on topic bc you're agreeing with the OP (we must walk in faith to be saved, ultimately), and you're adding that part of walking in faith is believing that Jesus is not God?

Jesus teaches--John 17:3--This means eternal life(getting salvation) their knowing you(Father) THE ONLY TRUE GOD and the one whom you sent forth Christ Jesus.---See one must know the Father as the only true God and know he did not come down here, he sent another, named Jesus as a mortal. Jesus did not err, trinity bibles are altered and filled with contradictory errors. Gods truth does not contradict itself.
Paul teaches the same as Jesus-1 Cor 8:5-6--There is ONE GOD to all=The FATHER.

 

[GracePeace]

Jesus teaches--John 17:3--This means eternal life(getting salvation) their knowing you(Father) THE ONLY TRUE GOD and the one whom you sent forth Christ Jesus.---See one must know the Father as the only true God and know he did not come down here, he sent another, named Jesus as a mortal. Jesus did not err, trinity bibles are altered and filled with contradictory errors. Gods truth does not contradict itself.
Paul teaches the same as Jesus-1 Cor 8:5-6--There is ONE GOD to all=The FATHER.

In the OT Scriptures, God is "husband" to His people; in the NT Scriptures, Jesus is "husband" to God's people. How can that be unless Jesus is God?

However, you're not to hijack threads. The discussion here is not necessarily the definition of "obey" (eg, whether believing Jesus is God transgresses that), but whether salvation depends on obeying/walking in faith.

 

[GracePeace]

Jesus teaches--John 17:3--This means eternal life(getting salvation) their knowing you(Father) THE ONLY TRUE GOD and the one whom you sent forth Christ Jesus.---See one must know the Father as the only true God and know he did not come down here, he sent another, named Jesus as a mortal. Jesus did not err, trinity bibles are altered and filled with contradictory errors. Gods truth does not contradict itself.
Paul teaches the same as Jesus-1 Cor 8:5-6--There is ONE GOD to all=The FATHER.

I've heard lots of arguments for and against the idea of Jesus's divinity, and I find many of them, on either side, convincing--eg, no man has seen God at any time, yet many have seen Jesus, so how can Jesus be God?

Whether Jesus is divine or not, He will make clear, and I will believe whatever Jesus says He is, and I'm sure He won't hold it against people who can't fully understand or have questions.

Irrespectively, the topic is not Jesus's divinity.

 

[Gottservant]

"No longer will any one say "know the Lord" for they will all know me" Jeremiah 31:34

I've been caught trying to influence the faith, so I know what the OP is getting at. You feel like you have this special 'faith' and you can't understand why all your brothers and sisters don't get excited for what you know that 'faith' implies. But this is the Devil's work. Scripture clearly teaches we will all be taught by God. It is up to us to be ready to receive the message (we can even pray for this). If you still feel a burden for your brothers and sisters, start to give praise to God that He will deliver them!

 

[Ritajanice]

The key to knowing WHOM to GIVE ALL CREDIT , ALL HONOR and ALL GLORY is
in knowing , does a man MAKE HIMSELF BORN AGAIN , or was this the WORK of GOD .
FOR that answer i allow us a reminder .
On may thirtieth of two thousand six i started out as every day i had before . The old man lost in sin and darkness .
BUT THEN GRACE APPEARED and DREW ME TO GOD PUTTING WHOLE NEW DESIRES IN MY HEART , FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST .
THUS , GOTTA SAY ALL THE CREDIT GOES TO GOD . That we indeed are saved SOLEY and i do mean SOLEY BY the GRACE OF GOD .

The key to knowing God as you call it.

Is how his word says.....” Heart Knowledge “ NOT “ Head Knowledge “?.....just as his word says...Born Again of his seed.....that penetrates our heart, as Spirit gives birth to spirit......?.............words above “ yours” are head Knowledge....post some Born Again scripture for a change...instead of ranting..on how everyone should get into their Bible..” Who says we don’t read the seed of Gods word?....plus you condem those who don’t follow your THEOLOGY.....no one is PERFECT in their understanding of God’s Living Word.....we are all learning!.....we learn from our helper the seed of God...The Holy Spirit!...which is HIS Living word.

There is “ NO CHOICE “ in becoming Born Again ...we are Born Again like the wind...Spirit gives birth to spirit!.....I acknowledge Born Again scripture...not what “:you” think Born Again scripture is...nowhere in scripture does it say you “ chose” to be Born of God” Born Again “ Regenerated..Born Again of incorruptible seed...which means what exactly?

We are Born Again and saved...we aren’t saved without the seed of God....the two go together....Born Again and Saved from eternal damnation...it’s Gods seed that saves us...Born Again of incorruptible seed...?

Tell me how or show in scripture where God says you can choose to be Born Again.....he doesn’t.

We are Born Again by his seed...therefore we have the new heart/ Spirit within us...the Living seed of God lives in our hearts...not our heads.?

The key to knowing WHOM to GIVE ALL CREDIT , ALL HONOR and ALL GLORY is
in knowing , does a man MAKE HIMSELF BORN AGAIN , or was this the WORK of GOD .
FOR that answer i allow us a reminder .
On may thirtieth of two thousand six i started out as every day i had before . The old man lost in sin and darkness .

We are Born Again, exactly how God speaks it into being.....By HIS LIVING SEED! The Holy Spirit.

We are Born Again by his seed, which is the Living word of God, The Holy Spirit....” Spirit gives birth to spirit “
We were born of our human fathers seed.

We are Born Again...by our Fathers seed, who is God...by the power of the Holy Spirit...the seed of God is Living and he is the Holy Spirit...he is not dead......he brings life to those who are Born Again.....his Spirit brings our spirit out of darkness into his light,.....we become Alive in Christ’s Spirit.....as his word says.

1 Peter 1:23​

King James Version​

23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Ephesians 2​

New International Version​

Made Alive in Christ​

2 As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh[a] and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christand seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8 For it is by grace you have been saved,through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

 

[Ritajanice]

Those without the Spirit of God are NONE of His.

They chime to the words of their own voice...

◄ 2 Timothy 4:3 ►

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. New Living Translation For a time is coming when people will no longer listen to sound and wholesome teaching. They will follow their own desires and will look for teachers who will tell them whatever their itching ears want to hear. English Standard Version For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, Berean Standard Bible For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires. Berean Literal Bible For there will be a time when they will not endure sound teaching, but according to the own desires, having an itching ear, they will gather around them teachers to suit themselves,

1 Peter 1:23 KJV​

being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

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◄ Romans 8:9 ►

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Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version You, however, are not in the realm of the flesh but are in the realm of the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. New Living Translation But you are not controlled by your sinful nature. You are controlled by the Spirit if you have the Spirit of God living in you. (And remember that those who do not have the Spirit of Christ living in them do not belong to him at all.) English Standard Version You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him. Berean Standard Bible You, however, are controlled not by the flesh, but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.

 

[Keiw]

In the OT Scriptures, God is "husband" to His people; in the NT Scriptures, Jesus is "husband" to God's people. How can that be unless Jesus is God?

However, you're not to hijack threads. The discussion here is not necessarily the definition of "obey" (eg, whether believing Jesus is God transgresses that), but whether salvation depends on obeying/walking in faith.

Hard to obey when one rejects Jesus' truth like i shared in my previous post.

 

[Keiw]

I've heard lots of arguments for and against the idea of Jesus's divinity, and I find many of them, on either side, convincing--eg, no man has seen God at any time, yet many have seen Jesus, so how can Jesus be God?

Whether Jesus is divine or not, He will make clear, and I will believe whatever Jesus says He is, and I'm sure He won't hold it against people who can't fully understand or have questions.

Irrespectively, the topic is not Jesus's divinity.

God only accepts worship in spirit and TRUTH-John 4:22-24-- I shared bible truth on what Jesus says it takes to enter Gods kingdom and get eternal life.