Religious Facade Christianity
- Thread starter Episkopos
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I think it's a definitive statement. Its saying they not only drank literal water from a literal rock but they also drank from Jesus. They had a spiritual life. But they did not remain trusting.
I had asked episkopos a question, to which you jumped in to answer, but you've then ended up dodging giving an actual answer, so I'm wondering why you did that? Was there some other reason? Perhaps? Now you seem to be dodging that this was what you did, and I can't help but wonder, what is all this really about?The reason to post was because you quoted me and asked me a question...?
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I think things are clearly seen, myself. I ask you for your sake.
Much love!
The question, though, is, where the Israelites born again as we are in the New Covenant, when they crossed through the Red Sea?
Simple question.
It's a curious thing when people will go through all this effort first to join the conversation, then to avoid committing themself to such a simple statement of their understanding. It's not hard. I'll go first.
No, they were not born again, rebirth only happens by joining Jesus in His death and resurrection, which had not occurred yet.
?
Much love!
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Read John 8:34-36. It takes more than believing in Jesus, you must also follow Him. You can't do that without the Holy Spirit. The only way to receive the Holy Spirit is to REPENT from sin, then Jesus gives you the ability to stay free from willful sin.
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Correct, you were not asking me about me. You were asking me to say if Israel was born again from above with the Spirit of God. I answered that I didn't really know and had not gone into great research regarding it. I am not sure that I agree that none of them had Gods Spirit, and thus were not born again from above. David said, do not take your Spirit from me. And men walked with God, who is Spirit.
But the me part came into it when I refused to say they weren't born again with Gods Spirit because from what I've read I can't make that determination. What I read is that they drank from a spiritual rock, which was Jesus, which suggests, to me, that they drank from the water of which Jesus said, if anyone is thirsty come and drink freely.
And I DID give simple statements about my understanding. You just didn't like them I guess...
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Hi, sbg
David was anointed to be King. Only kings and prophets had the Holy Spirit either straight from God, or by anointing from a prophet.
The gospel (good news) of the New Covenant is about grace. However, I don't believe you know the correct definition of grace. In the New Covenant grace is the power of God to obey and stay righteous. The key is REPENTANCE. This is why John the Baptist's ministry came first teaching repentance. It paved the way to the Messiah.
Romans 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes.
Acts 2:38
“REPENT, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Helen
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Oh you are also part of the cheerleading group too...I missed that part in my life as a teen when I was a groupie.
Oh you are also part of the cheerleading group too...I missed that part in my life as a teen when I was a groupie.
I was never picked for a cheerleader!
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
E, this is the first Calvinistic thing I've ever seen you write. That sounds like we can accept Jesus as our Savior, follow him, be filled with the Spirit, and if God hasn't chosen you, then you're damned.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
But it doesn't say "unmerited." Our repentance is up to us. God doesn't force us to repent.
Hmm...well, God shows favor to who He wants. And considering how holy He is, it would always be unmerited where humans are concerned.
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CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
God gives grace/power to those who repent. The reason why we repent is because we realize that we have no power in ourselves, even by memorizing all the commandments. It is acknowledging our weakness. That humility causes God to give us weaklings His own power to overcome sin, which we could never do in the flesh. God makes us born again of the Spirit. But the first step is repentance.
I have no problem with that. We were talking about your suspicion that I didn't understand what grace meant. I think grace means kindness and favor. Is part of Gods kindness and favor the giving of the Holy Spirit? So then I think your suspicion was that I didn't know the extent or power of Gods grace...? Or I could be wrong and you think grace does not mean kindness and favor...
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CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
I could have gotten you all wrong. By your "name" I figured you were Calvinist. I was wrong then?
Yes, you were wrong. I did once think I might be until I looked deeper into what Calvinists aver and then I ran screaming from them. But the grace of God toward me stuns me daily.
A good follow up question I think is, what does it mean when we say God shows favor to us?
Grace, the Power of God in Salvation, Sanctification, and Service
Grace, the Power of God in Salvation, Sanctification, and Service
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