Reasons Jews Reject Jesus

[Wrangler]

This topic is in the realm above which man can fully perceive.

Appeal to Ignorance.

 

[Wrangler]

You are my Son,
today I have begotten you”;
Hebrews 5:5
> What day was that? His birth!

No. People are not begotten on the day they are born but the day they are conceived.

 

[Waiting on him]

Yes. What are some other reasons which have not been brought forward yet? Which reasons that have been brought forward would you like to discuss in greater detail?

Deuteronomy 30:19 KJVS
[19] I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:
Another reason they rejected the first to have life in him, was they preferred cursing?

Proverbs 18:21 KJVS
[21] Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

 

[Waiting on him]

No. People are not begotten on the day they are born but the day they are conceived.

My opinion is that day was witnessed by the Baptist in the Jordan.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

No. People are not begotten on the day they are born but the day they are conceived.

Most people think Jesus was begotten at birth. Twchnically, being brought into existence, generated by parents at that moment of conception would be more accurate. But I think we are both wrong.
The resurrection is when he was begotten. The context talks about becoming High Priest and ascending into heaven.
Also,
Acts 13-33 God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee.

 

[Wrangler]

Right, being brought into existence, generated by parents at that moment of conception. Just all the references to people begeting this one and that one refer to people who have been born, been given names at birth, when they are brought into the world , seen by everyone. But of course, with Jesus, his name was given prior to her conception. 1 point for you!

1 point for me?

A couple of weeks ago another poster observed the disturbing pattern of people using God's word as some kind of odd competition or Gotcha type dynamic. This is not a debate forum but an apologetics forum. We love God and his son Jesus and I trust you want to faithfully serve them as much as I do.

In another thread, there is a virulent atheist whose relentless attacks on the faith are very intellectual. We need to sharpen our irons for his kind. Win a point for God with that guy. ;)

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

1 point for me?

A couple of weeks ago another poster observed the disturbing pattern of people using God's word as some kind of odd competition or Gotcha type dynamic. This is not a debate forum but an apologetics forum. We love God and his son Jesus and I trust you want to faithfully serve them as much as I do.

In another thread, there is a virulent atheist whose relentless attacks on the faith are very intellectual. We need to sharpen our irons for his kind. Win a point for God with that guy. ;)

Actually I rewrote my response. Apparently we are both wrong. According to Acts 13:33, Jesus was begotten when He was raised from the dead.
I am witnessing to that atheist, they are all tough nuts to crack. Plant a seed and pray is all we can hope for.

 

[Johann]

Acts 13-33 God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee.

Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee - quoted by Paul (Act_13:30-33) as fulfilled in the resurrection of Christ.

From eternity He was the Only-begotten of the Father (Joh_17:5), 'God OF God, Light OF Light' (Nicene Creed).

At the incarnation the First-begotten was brought into the world (Heb_1:6). But it was only at and by His resurrection that His Divinity, as the Only-begotten of the Father, was manifested and openly attested by God. "Made of the seed of David according to the flesh," He was then "declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the Spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead" (Rom_1:4).

Correct @Ronald David Bruno
Johann.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee - quoted by Paul (Act_13:30-33) as fulfilled in the resurrection of Christ.

From eternity He was the Only-begotten of the Father (Joh_17:5), 'God OF God, Light OF Light' (Nicene Creed).

At the incarnation the First-begotten was brought into the world (Heb_1:6). But it was only at and by His resurrection that His Divinity, as the Only-begotten of the Father, was manifested and openly attested by God. "Made of the seed of David according to the flesh," He was then "declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the Spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead" (Rom_1:4).

Correct @Ronald David Bruno
Johann.

Yes, we'll it is confusing. The Father identified Jesus as His Son at His baptism. Obviously, at conception and His birth and childhood, He was His Son as well. So looking closely at the scripture, "Son of God with power", does not necessarily say He wasn't His son before His resurrection, just His Son without power and glory. Begotten looks like it means resurrected, a newly transformed eternal body and woth that His glory and power returned to Him.
So in the same sense, we are adopted sons of God now, but will be begotten when our spiritual resurrection happens ... I guess?

 

[Johann]

Yes, we'll it is confusing. The Father identified Jesus as His Son at His baptism. Obviously, at conception and His birth and childhood, He was His Son as well. So looking closely at the scripture, "Son of God with power", does not necessarily say He wasn't His son before His resurrection, just His Son without power and glory. Begotten looks like it means resurrected, a newly transformed eternal body and woth that His glory and power returned to Him.
So in the same sense, we are adopted sons of God now, but will be begotten when our spiritual resurrection happens ... I guess?

Could be-could be not-a trip down memory lane-beginning with the Church fathers-the Reformers-then the Armenians-Pelagius-Pentecostals-well--
Shalom
Johann.

 

[Johann]

Could be-could be not-a trip down memory lane-beginning with the Church fathers-the Reformers-then the Armenians-Pelagius-Pentecostals-well--

Thou art my Son. Quoted in Act_13:33. Heb_1:5; Heb_5:5. This is the Divine formula for anointing. Compare Mat_3:17, for Prophet; Mat_17:5, for Priest; and Heb_1:5, Heb_1:6, for King.

begotten Thee. Figure of speech-. It refers to resurrection (Act_13:33. Rom_1:3, Rom_1:4. Col_1:18. Rev_1:5).

Thou: Mat_3:17, Mat_8:29, Mat_16:16, Mat_17:5; Act_8:37, Act_13:33; Rom_1:4; Heb_1:5, Heb_3:6; Heb_5:5, Heb_5:8
this: Psa_89:27; Joh_1:14, Joh_1:18, Joh_3:16; Heb_1:6

All I can say is-keep it simple, believe what stands written brother-not being facetious with you.
Johann.

 

[Waiting on him]

Thou art my Son. Quoted in Act_13:33. Heb_1:5; Heb_5:5. This is the Divine formula for anointing. Compare Mat_3:17, for Prophet; Mat_17:5, for Priest; and Heb_1:5, Heb_1:6, for King.

begotten Thee. Figure of speech-. It refers to resurrection (Act_13:33. Rom_1:3, Rom_1:4. Col_1:18. Rev_1:5).

Thou: Mat_3:17, Mat_8:29, Mat_16:16, Mat_17:5; Act_8:37, Act_13:33; Rom_1:4; Heb_1:5, Heb_3:6; Heb_5:5, Heb_5:8
this: Psa_89:27; Joh_1:14, Joh_1:18, Joh_3:16; Heb_1:6

All I can say is-keep it simple, believe what stands written brother-not being facetious with you.
Johann.

Ok, Jesus was the first man to receive the Holy Spirit.

 

[Johann]

Ok, Jesus was the first man to receive the Holy Spirit.

Are you "fishing?"
J.

 

[Waiting on him]

Are you "fishing?"
J.

No, just stating what is simply written in the scriptures you’re quoting, that Jesus was the first man to have ever received the Spirit of God. Had he not been then someone else would’ve declared Him?

 

[Waiting on him]

Even the Apostle John stated that no man had ever seen God at anytime. Do you believe John?

 

[Waiting on him]

But the son he has declared Him?

 

[Johann]

No, just stating what is simply written in the scriptures you’re quoting, that Jesus was the first man to have ever received the Spirit of God. Had he not been then someone else would’ve declared Him?

Illogical reasoning-not interested in parrying with you-some here are coming dangerously close in blaspheming the Holy Spirit.
J.

 

[Johann]

But the son he has declared Him?

Not interested in your one, maybe two liners.
Keep on "waiting"
J.

 

[Johann]

No, just stating what is simply written in the scriptures you’re quoting, that Jesus was the first man to have ever received the Spirit of God. Had he not been then someone else would’ve declared Him?

Don't put words in my mouth-as if I'm concurring with you-I'm not.
J.

 

[Waiting on him]

Not interested in your one, maybe two liners.
Keep on "waiting"
J.

NP.