Q for JW- KIEW?

[Zao is life]

Upon Jesus completion of the ransom sacrifice he is called savior as well now.

Once again your own words prove that you do not know what you're talking about. You don't even have a clue.

Galatians 5:22-23 Fruit of the Spirit - definition.
John 6:28-29 Work of God. One commandment only.
John 13:34-35 Love one another (fruit of faith).
1 John 3:23-24 Believe on Jesus and love one another (fruit of faith). One commandment only.
1 John 3:16-18 What loving the brethren is (fruit of faith), and what it is not. Same words in James and Matthew as in the verses below:
James 2:14-17 What loving the brethren is (fruit of faith), and what it is not.
Matthew 25:34-36 What loving loving the brethren is (fruit of faith), and what it is not. Same words in John and James as above.
John 15:4-6 Key word: Abide. (How to produce the fruit of the Spirit).
1 John 3:6 Key word: Abide. (How to produce the fruit of the Spirit).

1 John 3:17-18
But whoever has this world's goods and sees his brother having need, and shuts up his bowels from him, how does the love of God dwell in him?
My children, let us not love in word or in tongue, but in deed and in truth.

James 2:15-18
If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, and if one of you says to them, Go in peace, be warmed and filled, but you do not give them those things which are needful to the body, what good is it? Even so, if it does not have works, faith is dead, being by itself. But someone will say, You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.

James 2:1-4: My brothers, do not have the faith of our Lord Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.
For if there comes a gold-fingered man in fancy clothing into your assembly, and if there also comes in a poor man in shabby clothing, and if you have respect to him who has the fancy clothing and say to him, You sit here in a good place, and say to the poor, You stand there, or sit here under my footstool;
Did you not make a difference among yourselves and became judges with evil thoughts?

Matthew 25:37-40
Then the righteous shall answer Him, saying, Lord, when did we see You hungry, and fed You? Or thirsty, and gave You drink? When did we see You a stranger, and took You in? Or naked, and clothed You? Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and came to You?
And the King shall answer and say to them, Truly I say to you, Inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brothers, you have done it to Me.

John 15:4-5
Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it remains in the vine, so neither can you unless you abide in Me.
I am the Vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, the same brings forth much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.

Your works are YOUR fruit. The only way you can abide in the Vine and produce the fruit OF THE SPIRIT is through faith in Christ. You do not come to God through your works. You come to God through faith in Christ and in HIS works and in HIS righteousness. He is THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS, the last Adam and the Son of man. The Man Jesus Christ represents before God those who believe in Him, and because He is God, He represents God to man. Good works are righteous works. Good works that are the fruit of the Spirit are evidence of faith IN Christ. Anything else is the works of the flesh - works produced by your flesh, your own human effort.

Your false theology and belief in your works is keeping you away from God the Father, because you are not coming through Christ alone and because you call him a created being. Created beings are angels. Jesus is not a created angelic being. Created angelic beings were created by the Word of God. The Word of God is God.

 

[PS95]

Yes free gift to those who obey.

For those who obey whom? Jesus or WT Governing body?

 

[PS95]

Say about what? Catholicisms own encyclopedia says--The apostolic Fathers knew nothing of God being a trinity. It wasnt established or assimilated into christian life until near the end of the 4th century)))--381 ce recorded history= the very first time the holy spirit was added to a godhead. None knew God as a trinity prior. In the 2nd century a man named Tertullian was considering that maybe God was a trinity= the true God was still being served= the Abrahamic God= a single being God= YHVH(Jehovah)=Jesus' God and Father.

I'm glad that can see the MANY similarities that JWs teach like earliest Gnosctics that John spoke of. I have more to add there also.
Who said anything about trinity? I didn't. I agree with you about Apostlic Fathers not teaching "trinity". It seem though that you haven't read them very carefully. They did NOT teach what WT does, unless you rip words out CONTEXT just like ROMANS 6!
Remember Keiw, I was raised in Jw teachings. I have had to investigate this thoroughly!!!!!!
You have not carefully read AF's, or you wouldn't be a Jw. It's not possible.

 

[PS95]

@Keiw Stop being fooled. There is only one God, one Savior.

Jws will not clink on links from Christians. They are not allowed. They teach that Christians are antichrists.

 

[PS95]

Good bye to Romans 6. ?
trinity discussions are banned on these forums.

 

[Keiw]

Wasn't me. It was Isaiah., Matthew, and Mark. Did you look up those verses? And I didn't say Jesus is Father Jehovah, I said the Son shares His Father's name, and is therefore God.

KJV Isaiah 40:3
3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Speaking of John the Baptist, Matthew said...
KJV Matthew 3:3
3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

And Mark agreed, in fact, Mark's gospel was written first I believe...
KJV Mark 1:1-3
1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;
2 As it is written in the prophets, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

No-one has ever declared themselves unworthy to tie the shoe laces of an angel. But the Son of God?

KJV Hebrews 1:1-3, 8
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

KJV Hebrews 1:4
4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

Jesus is never called Jehovah by any bible writer.
Heb 1:4 you quoted. Its because he inherited the name Jesus, given to him by Jehovah he is better than the angels.
Psalm 45:7--Jesus has a God---companions=angels. It cannot be speaking of Jehovah( God) he is the one anointing Jesus with the oil of exultation--the holy spirit is singular thus cannot be companions--angels are the only other ones in heaven=Jesus' companions.

 

[Keiw]

Once again your own words prove that you do not know what you're talking about. You don't even have a clue.

Galatians 5:22-23 Fruit of the Spirit - definition.
John 6:28-29 Work of God. One commandment only.
John 13:34-35 Love one another (fruit of faith).
1 John 3:23-24 Believe on Jesus and love one another (fruit of faith). One commandment only.
1 John 3:16-18 What loving the brethren is (fruit of faith), and what it is not. Same words in James and Matthew as in the verses below:
James 2:14-17 What loving the brethren is (fruit of faith), and what it is not.
Matthew 25:34-36 What loving loving the brethren is (fruit of faith), and what it is not. Same words in John and James as above.
John 15:4-6 Key word: Abide. (How to produce the fruit of the Spirit).
1 John 3:6 Key word: Abide. (How to produce the fruit of the Spirit).

1 John 3:17-18
But whoever has this world's goods and sees his brother having need, and shuts up his bowels from him, how does the love of God dwell in him?
My children, let us not love in word or in tongue, but in deed and in truth.

James 2:15-18
If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, and if one of you says to them, Go in peace, be warmed and filled, but you do not give them those things which are needful to the body, what good is it? Even so, if it does not have works, faith is dead, being by itself. But someone will say, You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.

James 2:1-4: My brothers, do not have the faith of our Lord Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.
For if there comes a gold-fingered man in fancy clothing into your assembly, and if there also comes in a poor man in shabby clothing, and if you have respect to him who has the fancy clothing and say to him, You sit here in a good place, and say to the poor, You stand there, or sit here under my footstool;
Did you not make a difference among yourselves and became judges with evil thoughts?

Matthew 25:37-40
Then the righteous shall answer Him, saying, Lord, when did we see You hungry, and fed You? Or thirsty, and gave You drink? When did we see You a stranger, and took You in? Or naked, and clothed You? Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and came to You?
And the King shall answer and say to them, Truly I say to you, Inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brothers, you have done it to Me.

John 15:4-5
Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it remains in the vine, so neither can you unless you abide in Me.
I am the Vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, the same brings forth much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.

Your works are YOUR fruit. The only way you can abide in the Vine and produce the fruit OF THE SPIRIT is through faith in Christ. You do not come to God through your works. You come to God through faith in Christ and in HIS works and in HIS righteousness. He is THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS, the last Adam and the Son of man. The Man Jesus Christ represents before God those who believe in Him, and because He is God, He represents God to man. Good works are righteous works. Good works that are the fruit of the Spirit are evidence of faith IN Christ. Anything else is the works of the flesh - works produced by your flesh, your own human effort.

Your false theology and belief in your works is keeping you away from God the Father, because you are not coming through Christ alone and because you call him a created being. Created beings are angels. Jesus is not a created angelic being. Created angelic beings were created by the Word of God. The Word of God is God.

Jesus was never called savior in the OT, only Jehovah was. If Jesus had failed the ransom sacrifice he wouldn't be savior. He had free will as we all do. He could have chosen to rebel. Its why satan tried to get him to rebel in the wilderness. And satan offered him-every kingdom( govt, armies supporters) on earth for an act of worship( sin)--because satan controls all of them. As the world will find out at Rev 16 when every kingdom on earth gets mislead to stand in opposition to Gods king at Armageddon.

 

[Keiw]

For those who obey whom? Jesus or WT Governing body?

God is the head of Jesus, Jesus is the head of the congregation. But there is 0 doubt that Jesus appoints the ones taking the lead in his one religion, and yes its the governing body.

 

[Keiw]

There is still only one God. Jesus is not an additional God. You've once again implied and shown that in your false theology there is more than one God and more than one Savior. Your theology is idolatrous.

There is only one God=Jehovah the Father. Jesus is Gods son=not God. All sons are created by their Fathers.

 

[Keiw]

I'm glad that can see the MANY similarities that JWs teach like earliest Gnosctics that John spoke of. I have more to add there also.
Who said anything about trinity? I didn't. I agree with you about Apostlic Fathers not teaching "trinity". It seem though that you haven't read them very carefully. They did NOT teach what WT does, unless you rip words out CONTEXT just like ROMANS 6!
Remember Keiw, I was raised in Jw teachings. I have had to investigate this thoroughly!!!!!!
You have not carefully read AF's, or you wouldn't be a Jw. It's not possible.

God will show the world, the JW,s are his sons religion on earth today.

 

[Brakelite]

Jesus is never called Jehovah by any bible writer.
Heb 1:4 you quoted. Its because he inherited the name Jesus, given to him by Jehovah he is better than the angels.
Psalm 45:7--Jesus has a God---companions=angels. It cannot be speaking of Jehovah( God) he is the one anointing Jesus with the oil of exultation--the holy spirit is singular thus cannot be companions--angels are the only other ones in heaven=Jesus' companions.

That conveniently avoids having to deal with what I actually wrote. Matthew and Mark agreed that the prophecy of Isaiah declared that John the Baptist fulfilled the role of the voice crying in the wilderness, preparing the way of the LORD.
KJV Isaiah 40:3
3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

 

[Keiw]

That conveniently avoids having to deal with what I actually wrote. Matthew and Mark agreed that the prophecy of Isaiah declared that John the Baptist fulfilled the role of the voice crying in the wilderness, preparing the way of the LORD.
KJV Isaiah 40:3
3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Yes Jesus is Lord-Not LORD. you are mistaken. And if Isiah has LORD=YHVH(Jehovah) not Jesus. Jesus lives 24/7 to do Jehovahs will, its how they are ONE. Thus all Jesus does is because Jehovah commands it. So all Jesus does is for Jehovah( LORD)--
LORD all capitols does not belong in the OT-YHVH belongs. Jerome removed Gods name by satans will and replaced it with titles in his Latin Vulgate--Its recorded history FACT. And every place GOD is in the OT-YHVH belongs. Jesus is NEVER called LORD, he is called Lord.

 

[Brakelite]

Jesus is never called Jehovah by any bible writer.
Heb 1:4 you quoted. Its because he inherited the name Jesus, given to him by Jehovah he is better than the angels.
Psalm 45:7--Jesus has a God---companions=angels. It cannot be speaking of Jehovah( God) he is the one anointing Jesus with the oil of exultation--the holy spirit is singular thus cannot be companions--angels are the only other ones in heaven=Jesus' companions.

And you would argue with the writer of Hebrews who under the inspiration of the Spirit of God declared unequivocally that God was talking of His Son when He said, "thy throne o God... Etc".

 

[PS95]

God will show the world, the JW,s are his sons religion on earth today.

Keiw, Luke 14, ever read it? You have had invitations to come to Christ. You have rejected Him every time and have chosen man. That's what man does. The road is few.

14:15-23
15 When one of those at the table with him heard this, he said to Jesus, “Blessed is the one who will eat at the feast in the kingdom of God.”

16 Jesus replied: “A certain man was preparing a great banquet and invited many guests. 17 At the time of the banquet he sent his servant to tell those who had been invited, ‘Come, for everything is now ready.’

18 “But they all alike began to make excuses. The first said, ‘I have just bought a field, and I must go and see it. Please excuse me.’

19 “Another said, ‘I have just bought five yoke of oxen, and I’m on my way to try them out. Please excuse me.’

20 “Still another said, ‘I just got married, so I can’t come.’

21 “The servant came back and reported this to his master. Then the owner of the house became angry and ordered his servant, ‘Go out quickly into the streets and alleys of the town and bring in the poor, the crippled, the blind and the lame.’

22 “‘Sir,’ the servant said, ‘what you ordered has been done, but there is still room.’

23 “Then the master told his servant, ‘Go out to the roads and country lanes and compel them to come in, so that my house will be full. 24 I tell you, not one of those who were invited will get a taste of my banquet.’”

​

 

[Brakelite]

Yes Jesus is Lord-Not LORD. you are mistaken. And if Isiah has LORD=YHVH(Jehovah) not Jesus. Jesus lives 24/7 to do Jehovahs will, its how they are ONE. Thus all Jesus does is because Jehovah commands it. So all Jesus does is for Jehovah( LORD)--
LORD all capitols does not belong in the OT-YHVH belongs. Jerome removed Gods name by satans will and replaced it with titles in his Latin Vulgate--Its recorded history FACT. And every place GOD is in the OT-YHVH belongs. Jesus is NEVER called LORD, he is called Lord.

Again, you are arguing with Matthew and Mark, the inspired writers of the gospels under their name. They said that John the Baptist was the one who fulfilled his role as detailed in Isaiah...Preparing the way of הוָֹהיְ Yëhovah.
It doesn't matter if the translators replaced the name centuries later. Matthew and Mark would have been referring back to the original scroll of Isaiah, where it would have been הוָֹהיְ Yëhovah a copy of the same scroll which Jesus Himself opened when He declared Himself as fulfilling another of Isaiah's prophecies in the synagogue of Nazareth.
KJV Luke 4:16-21
16 And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read.
17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,
18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
20 And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him.
21 And he began to say unto them, This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.

 

[PS95]

And you would argue with the writer of Hebrews who under the inspiration of the Spirit of God declared unequivocally that God was talking of His Son when He said, "the throne o God... Etc".

They translate that differently.
I know that your mean well, but for a Jw the trinity is exceptionally evil. It is antichrist to them.
It's not wise to try to convince them of it. All it does is cause them to dig their boots in further.
It goes nowhere. Try showing them all of the other false teachings instead.
The watchtower Gb worship is very serious!!!

Plus the fact that moderators have banned the trinity on these boards.

 

[PS95]

God is the head of Jesus, Jesus is the head of the congregation. But there is 0 doubt that Jesus appoints the ones taking the lead in his one religion, and yes its the governing body.

How can you say that Jesus heads your religion and the GB With all of their lies? really? Do you think that's respectful to the Lord Jesus?
Tell me where the bible says that Michael's impersonal life force was put into the ovum of Mary?

 

[Brakelite]

They translate that differently.
I know that your mean well, but for a Jw the trinity is exceptionally evil. It is antichrist to them.
It's not wise to try to convince them of it. All it does is cause them to dig their boots in further.
It goes nowhere. Try showing them all of the other false teachings instead.
The watchtower Gb worship is very serious!!!

Plus the fact that moderators have banned the trinity on these boards.

That had nothing to do with the trinity. It is all about the identity of Jesus. I will add the following.
The scriptures below, also from Isaiah 40, the same chapter that speaks of preparing the way of the Lord, says...
KJV Isaiah 40:9-11
9 O Zion, that bringest good tidings, get thee up into the high mountain; O Jerusalem, that bringest good tidings, lift up thy voice with strength; lift it up, be not afraid; say unto the cities of Judah, Behold your God!
10 Behold, the Lord GOD will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.
11 He shall feed his flock like a shepherd: he shall gather the lambs with his arm, and carry them in his bosom, and shall gently lead those that are with young.

So? You might ask. Well, Jesus declared Himself the fulfilment of those also. Note either He was a liar, a charlatan, or self deceived... Or He was telling the truth.
“I am the Good Shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.” “I am the Good Shepherd, and know My sheep, and am known of Mine. As the Father knoweth Me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down My life for the sheep.” . . .
Christ applied these prophecies to Himself, and He showed the contrast between His own character and that of the leaders in Israel. The Pharisees had just driven one from the fold, (sound familiar @Keiw ?) because he dared to bear witness to the power of Christ. They had cut off a soul whom the True Shepherd was drawing to Himself. In this they had shown themselves ignorant of the work committed to them, and unworthy of their trust as shepherds of the flock. Jesus now set before them the contrast between them and the Good Shepherd, and He pointed to Himself as the real keeper of the Lord’s flock.

 

[Brakelite]

They translate that differently.
I know that your mean well, but for a Jw the trinity is exceptionally evil. It is antichrist to them.
It's not wise to try to convince them of it. All it does is cause them to dig their boots in further.
It goes nowhere. Try showing them all of the other false teachings instead.
The watchtower Gb worship is very serious!!!

Plus the fact that moderators have banned the trinity on these boards.

That had nothing to do with the trinity. It is all about the identity of Jesus. I will add the following.
The scriptures below, also from Isaiah 40, the same chapter that speaks of preparing the way of the Lord, says...
KJV Isaiah 40:9-11
9 O Zion, that bringest good tidings, get thee up into the high mountain; O Jerusalem, that bringest good tidings, lift up thy voice with strength; lift it up, be not afraid; say unto the cities of Judah, Behold your God!
10 Behold, the Lord GOD will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.
11 He shall feed his flock like a shepherd: he shall gather the lambs with his arm, and carry them in his bosom, and shall gently lead those that are with young.

So? You might ask. Well, Jesus declared Himself the fulfilment of those also. Note either He was a liar, a charlatan, or self deceived... Or He was telling the truth.

Yes Jesus is Lord-Not LORD. you are mistaken. And if Isiah has LORD=YHVH(Jehovah) not Jesus. Jesus lives 24/7 to do Jehovahs will, its how they are ONE. Thus all Jesus does is because Jehovah commands it. So all Jesus does is for Jehovah( LORD)--
LORD all capitols does not belong in the OT-YHVH belongs. Jerome removed Gods name by satans will and replaced it with titles in his Latin Vulgate--Its recorded history FACT. And every place GOD is in the OT-YHVH belongs. Jesus is NEVER called LORD, he is called Lord.

Notice this and compare...
KJV Isaiah 40:10
10 Behold, the Lord GOD will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.

KJV Revelation 22:12
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

KJV Revelation 22:13-17
13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

Note again...
KJV Isaiah 44:6
6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

KJV Revelation 1:8, 11
8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.
Join the dots. And BTW for all those watching and reading. This has nothing to do with any discussion on the trinity. This is solely about the identity of Jesus Christ, the Son of the living God, whose name He has inherited as His Father's Son.

 

[Brakelite]

Heb 1:4 you quoted. Its because he inherited the name Jesus, given to him by Jehovah he is better than the angels.

KJV Philippians 2:9
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

The name of Jesus, Yeshua, Saviour, was a gift. The name spoken of in Hebrews was His by right, by inheritance, due Him by consequence of birthright. The same name as His Father. YHWH.