Premillennialism contradicts the scriptures which teach that Jesus will destroy all unbelievers and burn up the earth when He comes again

[Davy]

(Continued...)

Isa 24:20-23
20 The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again.
21 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones that are on high, and the kings of the earth upon the earth.
22 And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited.
23 Then the moon shall be confounded, and the sun ashamed, when the LORD of hosts shall reign in mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, and before his ancients gloriously.
KJV

On the day of Jesus' future 2nd coming, those kings of the earth will be cast into Satan's pit prison with him, and then after many days (Christ's "thousand years" reign of Rev.20), they will be visited (i.e., judged and sentenced).


Zech 14:16-19
16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.
18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
KJV

Those "left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem" are about the nations gathered around Jerusalem on the last day of this world which Jesus with His army from Heaven comes to defeat. Those left over not destroyed, will be made to come up to Jerusalem and worship Christ The KING. And that is for AFTER Christ's future return, and BEFORE God's new heavens and a new earth.


Ps 149:5-9
5 Let the saints be joyful in glory: let them sing aloud upon their beds.
6 Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a twoedged sword in their hand;
7 To execute vengeance upon the heathen, and punishments upon the people;
8 To bind their kings with chains, and their nobles with fetters of iron;
9 To execute upon them the judgment written: this honour have all his saints. Praise ye the LORD.
KJV

That above is what Christ's elect saints will be doing with the wicked leaders of the earth immediately after Jesus' future return. We will be judging those, and locking them in the pit in chains, executing judgment upon them.


Isa 60:14
14 The sons also of them that afflicted thee shall come bending unto thee; and all they that despised thee shall bow themselves down at the soles of thy feet; and they shall call thee, "The city of the LORD, The Zion of the Holy One of Israel."
KJV

Those wicked will come to Jerusalem after Christ's return, bowing the knee.

Rev 3:8-9
8 I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name.
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
KJV

Jesus said He will make those wicked of the "synagogue of Satan" to come and bow at the feet of His elect in worship to Him.

This reveals that God's future new heavens and a new earth time will NOT have come yet, because the wicked are only subdued and made to 'bow' to Christ at that time of His reign, Christ's enemies being made His footstool like Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15:24-28. That is about Christ's "thousand years" LITERAL reign of Revelation 20 that starts on the day of His future return.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The 2 Peter 3 Scripture about the "day of the Lord" coming "as a thief in the night" is EASY!

Oh, really? That's GREAT, Davy. Will you be the first Premill ever to give an interpretation of the passage that makes any sense? Let's see....

The FIRST thing that MUST be done when READING the 2 Peter 3 Scripture is to RIGHTLY DIVIDE its TIMELINES. Spiritual Israelite obviously DOES NOT DO THIS.

LOL. Let's see if you can prove that...(highly UNLIKELY).

In the below verse subject, Peter is pointing first to "the heavens and the earth, which are now" that is reserved unto fire. He then mentions the "day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men", however, that last phrase does not happen immediately on that same day of Christ's coming, because Peter instead points out how a 'day' to God is LIKE a literal "thousand years".

Oops! Here's your first mistake. You say that the "day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men" does not happen "on that same day of Christ's coming"? Really? Then what do you make of this....

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:....41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Do you not think the goats here represent ungodly men, Davy? I'm sure they do. And Jesus said they will be cast into everlasting fire when He comes with His angels. Not a thousand years later as you believe.

Why would Peter include that "thousand years" idea within that timing? It is because the actual time of God's Great White Throne Judgment of the "dead" only happens AFTER Christ's "thousand years" reign! That is what is WRITTEN in Revelation 20.

This is total nonsense! You are taking 2 Peter 3:8 completely out of context.

2 Peter 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

The context of Peter saying what he did in verse 8 is seen in verse 9 (not in Revelation 20! LOL!). The Lord created time and exists outside of it. So, to Him, He is not being slow to fulfill the promise of His second coming. It's not even possible for Him to be slow in doing that because He exists outside of time and time does not affect Him. People might say He's being slow, but He's not because time doesn't affect Him to the point where one day and a thousand years make no difference to Him. That is the context of 2 Peter 3:8. You are trying to change the context of the verse to fit your doctrine.

Peter obviously knew about that, but it was not actually fully revealed here, but only HINTED at by Peter...

LOL. No.

2 Peter 3:7-12
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

What men's false Amill theories do is to SUBTRACT Peter's "thousand years" idea from this timeline and instead go straight to God's new heavens and a new earth timing to be on the same day which Lord Jesus returns.

LOL! It's quite telling that Premills have to ADD to God's word to make it say what they want it to say. In no way, shape or form was Peter alluding to the duration of the day of the Lord in 2 Peter 3:8.

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Yet Peter was determined that we are not to be "ignorant" of that future "thousand years" period of time that must occur first, prior to the coming of the new heavens and a new earth time.

My goodness, you are taking every word out of context! Terrible! Read verse 9 for the context of verse 8. He was saying not to be ignorant of the fact that time does not affect the Lord, so there is no reason to claim that He is being slow to keep His promise of coming again. In no way, shape or form was he saying to not be ignorant of the supposted future thousand years. You are BUTCHERING the text to try to make it fit your doctrine, which is PATHETIC.

That is why Peter injects that "thousand years" timeline here in connection with God's longsuffering of not willing that any should perish at the future "lake of fire".

I'd almost bet yal didn't know Peter was actually pointing to Christ's future literal "thousand years" reign over the unsaved by that above 2 Peter 3:8-9 Scripture.

No, he was not. Wow. Ridiculous.

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

In Revelation 16:15, Lord Jesus said He comes "as a thief", warning His Church on that 6th Vial timing. On that day of His coming, man's works will be burned off the surface of this earth, and the heavenly dimension will be opened up to everyone, on earth. This present flesh world will be over, but not God's original creation of the earth.

So, now you are acknowledging that 2 Peter 3:10 refers to the day of Jesus's second coming? Where does the supposed future thousand years fit in there then?

How exactly will just man's works be burned off the surface of the earth rather than everything on the surface of the earth being burned up? How about the heavens passing away with a great noise? What is your understanding of that? In verse 12 it says the heavens will be dissolved.

The Greek for that word "elements" above does not mean science's atomic weight chart of earthly material elements. It means an ordinal of world time.

LOL. Another baseless claim to try to make the text fit your doctrine. Your interpretation is WEAK and EMBARRASSING (for you).

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
KJV

The Zechariah 14 Chapter reveals Christ's future return back to this earth where He ascended to Heaven from per Acts 1. So we know Peter does not mean this earth is going to be literally turned into an asteroid belt floating among the stars. The is earth is forever (Psalms 104:5).

So, you decide that 2 Peter 3:10-12 needs to be interpreted in light of Zechariah 14 instead of the other way around. How can you not understand that the NT sheds light on the OT? Peter clearly did not have the same understanding of Zechariah 14 as you do or else he wouldn't have written what he did. Your solution is to try to change what Peter wrote, which is dishonest. You aren't willing to try to reconcile the two passages honestly.

All... of the above 2 Peter 3 Scripture is about the timeline for the end of this PRESENT 2nd world earth age, NOT the future new heavens and a new earth.

2 Peter 3:13
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
KJV

The above verse is about the future "new heavens and a new earth" that God has promised. But Peter does NOT say WHEN that will 3rd world earth age will come. Did he really need to, since there's so much written about it in The Old Testament prophets??

What promise is Peter referring to there? The one he first mentioned in 2 Peter 3:4 which is the promise of Christ's second coming. So, Peter was saying we look for new heavens and a new earth in fulfillment of the promise of His second coming, NOT for an earthly millennial kingdom.

 

[Davy]

Oh, really? That's GREAT, Davy. Will you be the first Premill ever to give an interpretation of the passage that makes any sense? Let's see....

I did... break it down in 2 Peter 3, and yeah, IT WAS EASY!

(Since you don't like my capitals and big letters, I have reduced your responses back to your normal preferred size.)

LOL. Let's see if you can prove that...(highly UNLIKELY).

I already did prove it, BY the WRITTEN BIBLE SCRIPTURE in 2 Peter 3. You should try actually sticking with what the Scripture says as written, then you might... understand it. I'm surprised that folks like you haven't hurt yourself by your faulty reading comprehension, like when doing something technical that you have to follow written instructions with.

Oops! Here's your first mistake. You say that the "day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men" does not happen "on that same day of Christ's coming"? Really? Then what do you make of this....

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:....41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Ah... exactly what I warned others NOT to do; which is forgetting Christ's Book of Revelation He gave His faithful Church with MORE DETAILS about events that happen after His future return. Revelation 20 has details that REQUIRE a literal "thousand years" period to happen PRIOR to the destruction of the wicked in the "lake of fire". That did NOT change the above Matthew 25:41 event of their future destruction. Revelation 20 simply gave MORE DETAIL that He did not give in Matthew 25.

Or what does one think... the word 'revelation' means? If we are NOT to believe what Jesus gave us in His Book of Revelation, but stop at that Matthew 25 Chapter and make ALL... our beliefs and understanding just to that point, then why... did He give us His Book of Revelation?

It is EASY to fathom what those like Spiritual Israelite enjoys doing with Bible Scripture to try and twist it. Only when he likes a certain verse or Scripture, at the expense of other Bible Scripture that relates to it, he would rather just omit those other related Bible Scriptures. How in the world can one ever get Biblical literacy doing that?? It's like they think to re-write God's Word by cherry pickin' a verse here, and a verse there, and making up their own bible.

Do you not think the goats here represent ungodly men, Davy? I'm sure they do. And Jesus said they will be cast into everlasting fire when He comes with His angels. Not a thousand years later as you believe.

I forget what that above ploy is called, but it's similar to the 'association by guilt' ploy which Spiritual Israelite loves to use as a lever. So his comparison in asking me what I think about those goats separated by Jesus to His left hand, is just a vain attempt to try and make one seem stupid for not agreeing with him. The reality is that he simply made a stupid statement that does not work. And here's why...

Just because Jesus said nothing about His future "thousand years" reign over the unsaved in that specific Matthew 25 Chapter does not mean it does not exist. And the reason why that is so is very simple. It's because Jesus DID cover the "thousand years" of His future reign over the unsaved in His Book of Revelation GIVEN TO THE CHURCH LATER than His 1st coming here in Matthew 25.

Why then, would Spiritual Israelite just OMIT that fact? Thinks he's so smart, when he actually reveals how unthinking and Biblically illiterate he is.

This is total nonsense! You are taking 2 Peter 3:8 completely out of context.

2 Peter 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

The context of Peter saying what he did in verse 8 is seen in verse 9 (not in Revelation 20! LOL!). The Lord created time and exists outside of it. So, to Him, He is not being slow to fulfill the promise of His second coming. It's not even possible for Him to be slow in doing that because He exists outside of time and time does not affect Him. People might say He's being slow, but He's not because time doesn't affect Him to the point where one day and a thousand years make no difference to Him. That is the context of 2 Peter 3:8. You are trying to change the context of the verse to fit your doctrine.

Apostle Peter in 2 Peter 3:8-9 WAS... pointing to Christ's future "thousand years" reign over the unsaved of Revelation 20. It should be obvious even in The Gospel Books, like Luke 24:27, that Lord Jesus revealed to them what was written in the Old Testament Books about Him, and there are events in the Old Testament prophets that point to that future reign by Christ over the unsaved that happens AFTER His future return (Zechariah 14:16-19 especially).

Just because Peter declared that a 'day' to God is like a "thousand years", and then said God is not willing that any should perish, we supposed to play stupid and deny that has nothing to do with Christ's future "thousand years" reign over the unsaved that will bow the knee to Jesus after His return, and some of them might be saved??? How is Peter NOT pointing to the subject of Revelation 20 with that; just because those on man's false Amill theory say so??

Once again, it is very EASY... to recognize those who do not stay in God's Word as written and show their Biblical illiteracy. Peter inserted the future event of Christ's "thousand years" reign over the unsaved nations, showing he knew about it, just like Apostle Paul did also when Paul in 1 Cor.5 said to send that member who was having sex with his mother to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his 'spirit' might be saved in the day of Christ (i.e., "day of the Lord" is last day of this present world age, and first day of Christ's future "thousand years" reign). Thus Apostle Paul also knew beforehand about Christ's future "thousand years" reign.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I did... break it down in 2 Peter 3, and yeah, IT WAS EASY!

Yes, it was easy for you to twist the text to fit your doctrine.

I already did prove it, BY the WRITTEN BIBLE SCRIPTURE in 2 Peter 3. You should try actually sticking with what the Scripture says as written, then you might... understand it. I'm surprised that folks like you haven't hurt yourself by your faulty reading comprehension, like when doing something technical that you have to follow written instructions with.

You're so full of hot air. I have proven that you have terrible reading comprehension repeatedly. Such as you thinking I claimed that all Premills are pre-tribbers, which I never did.

Ah... exactly what I warned others NOT to do; which is forgetting Christ's Book of Revelation He gave His faithful Church with MORE DETAILS about events that happen after His future return. Revelation 20 has details that REQUIRE a literal "thousand years" period to happen PRIOR to the destruction of the wicked in the "lake of fire". That did NOT change the above Matthew 25:41 event of their future destruction. Revelation 20 simply gave MORE DETAIL that He did not give in Matthew 25.

Pathetic. This is a baseless claim. As if Jesus Himself didn't know all the details? Give me a break. Are you kidding me? This is the lame excuse you came up with to change His words to mean something different than what He said?

When are both believers and unbelievers gathered before His throne? At His second coming and at the same time. That is undeniable based on what Jesus Himself said in Matthew 25:31-46. So, why in the world would He wait to judge unbelievers for 1,000+ years after believers? He gave no such indication whatsoever. Why would you not interpret Revelation 20 in light of what the Great God, King and Master of the Universe said instead of the other way around?

Or what does one think... the word 'revelation' means? If we are NOT to believe what Jesus gave us in His Book of Revelation, but stop at that Matthew 25 Chapter and make ALL... our beliefs and understanding just to that point, then why... did He give us His Book of Revelation?

It does NOT mean it reveals things that are not referenced elsewhere in scripture. It does NOT indicate that Jesus wasn't aware of everything before the book of Revelation was written.

It is EASY to fathom what those like Spiritual Israelite enjoys doing with Bible Scripture to try and twist it.

You are the one twisting it by taking 2 Peter 3:8 completely out of context.

Only when he likes a certain verse or Scripture, at the expense of other Bible Scripture that relates to it, he would rather just omit those other related Bible Scriptures. How in the world can one ever get Biblical literacy doing that?? It's like they think to re-write God's Word by cherry pickin' a verse here, and a verse there, and making up their own bible.

That's exactly what you are doing. You are such a hypocrite.

I forget what that above ploy is called, but it's similar to the 'association by guilt' ploy which Spiritual Israelite loves to use as a lever. So his comparison in asking me what I think about those goats separated by Jesus to His left hand, is just a vain attempt to try and make one seem stupid for not agreeing with him. The reality is that he simply made a stupid statement that does not work.

It's stupid to try to place their judgment 1,000+ years after Jesus places it.

And here's why...

Just because Jesus said nothing about His future "thousand years" reign over the unsaved in that specific Matthew 25 Chapter does not mean it does not exist. And the reason why that is so is very simple. It's because Jesus DID cover the "thousand years" of His future reign over the unsaved in His Book of Revelation GIVEN TO THE CHURCH LATER than His 1st coming here in Matthew 25.

Why then, would Spiritual Israelite just OMIT that fact? Thinks he's so smart, when he actually reveals how unthinking and Biblically illiterate he is.

He said He was reigning over the earth already after His resurrection. You say He doesn't reign until He returns. Who should I believe? The choice is EASY. I will believe Him over you and your foolishness every time.

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

Is that big enough for you to see, Davy?

Apostle Peter in 2 Peter 3:8-9 WAS... pointing to Christ's future "thousand years" reign over the unsaved of Revelation 20.

No, he absolutely was not. That's why he said in 2 Peter 3:13 that we look for new heavens and a new earth in fulfillment of the promise of Christ's second coming. He clearly did not believe in this supposed future thousand year earthly reign that you believe in or else he would say that we are looking for that in fulfillment of the promise of Christ's second coming instead.

It should be obvious even in The Gospel Books, like Luke 24:27, that Lord Jesus revealed to them what was written in the Old Testament Books about Him, and there are events in the Old Testament prophets that point to that future reign by Christ over the unsaved that happens AFTER His future return (Zechariah 14:16-19 especially).

Just because Peter declared that a 'day' to God is like a "thousand years", and then said God is not willing that any should perish, we supposed to play stupid and deny that has nothing to do with Christ's future "thousand years" reign over the unsaved that will bow the knee to Jesus after His return, and some of them might be saved??? How is Peter NOT pointing to the subject of Revelation 20 with that; just because those on man's false Amill theory say so??

Once again, it is very EASY... to recognize those who do not stay in God's Word as written and show their Biblical illiteracy. Peter inserted the future event of Christ's "thousand years" reign over the unsaved nations, showing he knew about it, just like Apostle Paul did also when Paul in 1 Cor.5 said to send that member who was having sex with his mother to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his 'spirit' might be saved in the day of Christ (i.e., "day of the Lord" is last day of this present world age, and first day of Christ's future "thousand years" reign). Thus Apostle Paul also knew beforehand about Christ's future "thousand years" reign.

Tell me, if 2 Peter 3:10-12 is not talking about literal, physical destruction occurring on the day of the Lord when Jesus comes as a thief in the night, then how do you interpret this passage:

1 Thessalonians 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. 4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

What is your understanding of the "sudden destruction" that Paul says will occur on the day of the Lord from which those in spiritual darkness will not escape? If it's not physical destruction by fire on the earth, per 2 Peter 3:10-12, then why does Paul say that those in spiritual darkness will not escape it? If it's literal fire coming down on the entire earth, then it would make sense that they could not escape that. How else should that text be understood?

 

[Davy]

LOL. No.

Yes, Apostle Peter was... revealing a hint of Christ's future "thousand years" reign over the unsaved nations who then in that future reign will be made to 'bow' the knee to Christ in worship of Him. This is simply shown in the those Zechariah 14:16-19 verses I referenced, and here according to Apostle Paul...

Phil 2:10-11
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
KJV

Therefore, just HOW can that happen... if all the wicked are destroyed on the day of Christ's future coming, like deceived Amill folks claim? If on the day of Christ's future return we go immediately into God's new heavens and a new earth time, that means all the unsaved and wicked are destroyed on that day of Christ's return. HOW then will those bow the knee in worship to Christ if that Amill idea were true? And here's yet another Scripture example of the wicked still existing after Christ's return, and their bowing in that future Millennium...

Rev 3:9
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
KJV

Those of that "synagogue of Satan" represent Christ's greatest enemies on earth. They have never... bowed the knee in worship to Christ to this day. But they will. It will happen AFTER Christ's future return and during that literal "thousand years" period He showed in His Book of Revelation Chapter 20.

LOL! It's quite telling that Premills have to ADD to God's word to make it say what they want it to say. In no way, shape or form was Peter alluding to the duration of the day of the Lord in 2 Peter 3:8.

Nothing was added. Peter went to the subject about how a "thousand years" period relates to GOD's timeline, and how He does not wish for anyone to perish, which ANYONE who has actually read and studied Christ's Book of Revelation would understand, since Jesus well covered His future literal "thousand years" reign over the unsaved after His future return per the Revelation 20 Chapter.

Spiritual Israelite simply chooses to scrap the events of the Revelation 20, and part of God's Plan of Salvation. Wonder what other parts of The Bible he chooses to scrap and throw away.

My goodness, you are taking every word out of context! Terrible! Read verse 9 for the context of verse 8. He was saying not to be ignorant of the fact that time does not affect the Lord, so there is no reason to claim that He is being slow to keep His promise of coming again. In no way, shape or form was he saying to not be ignorant of the supposted future thousand years. You are BUTCHERING the text to try to make it fit your doctrine, which is PATHETIC.

Nope! I am not taking things out of context that Peter said in 2 Peter 3:7-12. Peter was talking about 3 world earth ages in that 2 Peter 3 Chapter. And at verse 7 he starts off talking about how this present 2nd world earth age is reserved unto destruction by fire, and the perdition of ungodly men. That idea of their perdition means their future destruction in the "lake of fire". So Peter is covering a wide... timeline in that 7th verse, from the end of this present world with Christ's future return, and then after His future reign over the wicked, and then the wicked's casting into the future "lake of fire" after that "thousand years" reign, of which Jesus gave great detail about in the Revelation 20 Chapter.

And the fact that Peter says God is not willing that any should PERISH... again... shows Peter was pointing to the "lake of fire" destruction after Christ's future "thousand years" reign! This is actually very EASY... IF... one follows understanding in all The Bible, and not strain as a gnat on a single verse like Spiritual Israelite does here, like Jesus said of the BLIND Pharisee Jews.

So, now you are acknowledging that 2 Peter 3:10 refers to the day of Jesus's second coming? Where does the supposed future thousand years fit in there then?

If you would actually study The Bible 'as written' instead of heeding stupid doctrines from the devil's own, then you might understand how that "day of the Lord" event of God's "consuming fire" will NOT literally destroy this whole earth, nor the souls of the wicked. Just the Zechariah 14:16-19 and Revelation 3:9 Scripture ought to be enough to understand that not all the wicked are destroyed on that day, and that there still will exist the "second death" after Christ's return when those will be cast into the "lake of fire" after Christ's "thousand years" reign!

But no... you'd rather follow men's stupid Amill LIES instead of keeping to God's Word.

How exactly will just man's works be burned off the surface of the earth rather than everything on the surface of the earth being burned up? How about the heavens passing away with a great noise? What is your understanding of that? In verse 12 it says the heavens will be dissolved.

Like I said, IF... you would study your Bible instead of heeding men's false doctrines, you might come to learn what all God's "consuming fire" will and won't do when it happens on the day of Christ's return.

Here I go again... READ the Zechariah 14:16 verse about the leftovers who will have come up against Jerusalem on the last day of this world. They are still there... AFTER Christ's return and that "consuming fire". And the EARTH IS STILL THERE TOO per that Zechariah 14 Chapter after the "day of the Lord" battle.

Like the Psalms says...

Ps 104:5
5 Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.
KJV

The end of Hebrews 12 also reveals God's "consuming fire" is only going to cleanse man's works off the surface of this present earth, so that only the things God created may remain.

 

[Davy]

LOL. Another baseless claim to try to make the text fit your doctrine. Your interpretation is WEAK and EMBARRASSING (for you).

You are only revealing your Biblical illiteracy...

NT:4747
stoicheion (stoy-khi'-on); neuter of a presumed derivative of the base of NT:4748; something orderly in arrangement, i.e. (by implication) a serial (basal, fundamental, initial) constituent (literally), proposition (figuratively):

KJV - element, principle, rudiment.
(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006, 2010 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

Like I said, that KJV word "elements" does NOT mean science's period table of atomic weight elements of matter. Greek stoicheion instead means an 'orderly arrangement' like I said, pointing to a world earth age which Peter was talking about regarding this present one we are still in today that is reserved unto fire.

If that is too difficult for you to read, I can add more commas to make it easier for ya.

So, you decide that 2 Peter 3:10-12 needs to be interpreted in light of Zechariah 14 instead of the other way around. How can you not understand that the NT sheds light on the OT? Peter clearly did not have the same understanding of Zechariah 14 as you do or else he wouldn't have written what he did. Your solution is to try to change what Peter wrote, which is dishonest. You aren't willing to try to reconcile the two passages honestly.

Let's see, Zechariah 14:1 mentions that "day of the Lord". Paul said the "day of the Lord" will come "as a thief in the night"; Peter said that "day of the Lord" will come "as a thief in the night"; Lord Jesus said that He comes "as a thief". So what's NOT to understand about that day of Christ's future return? How could one NOT link all those Scripture events about that "day of the Lord" when Jesus returns?

And now you start claiming what Peter didn't know, when he pointed to that idea of the "thousand years"???

There's just something that ain't right with how your mind works.

What promise is Peter referring to there? The one he first mentioned in 2 Peter 3:4 which is the promise of Christ's second coming. So, Peter was saying we look for new heavens and a new earth in fulfillment of the promise of His second coming, NOT for an earthly millennial kingdom.

At 2 Peter 3:13, Peter is starting a new subject, about the future new heavens and a new earth that ONLY will occur after... Christ's literal "thousand years" reign, as shown in Rev.21 & 22.

And here's something in Revelation 22 that actually occurs during Christ's "thousand years" reign of Revelation 20...

Rev 22:14-15
14 Blessed are they that do His commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
KJV

In verse 15 with "For without...", that phrase MUST tie back to the last subject phrase of verse 14, which is... "the city". And in that 14th verse it is revealed just which "city" that is, the "beloved city" of Rev.20:9, the new Jerusalem, simply because even in that time when the wicked are still existing, INSIDE the gates of that city is that Tree of Life. Christ brings it when He comes, along with the Millennial "sanctuary" of Ezekiel 47 with God's River. Yet that still is NOT the NHNE time, because the wicked are still there per that Rev.22 Scripture.

That reveals the wicked are STILL on earth during that future Millennial time of Christ's future reign over the unsaved nations. That is actually a Revelation 20 "thousand years" time event.

But one might ask, how is it that Tree of Life and beloved new Jerusalem will exist while the wicked are still there outside its gates?

It is because the Revelation 20 Chapter about Christ's future "thousand years" reign will be a LITERAL THOUSAND YEARS REIGN, and not an allegory.

There's other Bible Scriptures related to that future event about the wicked. At the end of Isaiah 24 it mentions how the kings of the earth will be cast into the pit prison and after many days will be visited. That "many days" idea there does not say 1,000 years, but it is a direct refence to Christ's "thousand years" reign He declared in His Revelation Chapter 20.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Yes, Apostle Peter was... revealing a hint of Christ's future "thousand years" reign over the unsaved nations who then in that future reign will be made to 'bow' the knee to Christ in worship of Him. This is simply shown in the those Zechariah 14:16-19 verses I referenced, and here according to Apostle Paul...

Phil 2:10-11
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
KJV

Therefore, just HOW can that happen... if all the wicked are destroyed on the day of Christ's future coming, like deceived Amill folks claim?

Hello? Wake up. You believe that the wicked will all be destroyed at the end of Satan's little season, don't you (Revelation 20:9)? How will they be judged? By being resurrected first. So, that's how that can happen, buddy. Think!

If on the day of Christ's future return we go immediately into God's new heavens and a new earth time, that means all the unsaved and wicked are destroyed on that day of Christ's return. HOW then will those bow the knee in worship to Christ if that Amill idea were true?

LOL. You are so ignorant. No, before we go into the new heavens and new earth, the judgment occurs first, as described in Matthew 25:31-46. At the judgment, all will bow before Him.

And here's yet another Scripture example of the wicked still existing after Christ's return, and their bowing in that future Millennium...

Rev 3:9
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
KJV

Where does this say anything about the millennium? Nowhere! Stop making things up. That will occur at the judgment. Do you equate the judgment with the millennium? No, the judgment occurs after the millennium.

Those of that "synagogue of Satan" represent Christ's greatest enemies on earth. They have never... bowed the knee in worship to Christ to this day. But they will. It will happen AFTER Christ's future return and during that literal "thousand years" period He showed in His Book of Revelation Chapter 20.

No, they will do so at the judgment when all people appear before Christ to give an account of themselves.

Nothing was added. Peter went to the subject about how a "thousand years" period relates to GOD's timeline, and how He does not wish for anyone to perish, which ANYONE who has actually read and studied Christ's Book of Revelation would understand, since Jesus well covered His future literal "thousand years" reign over the unsaved after His future return per the Revelation 20 Chapter.

What did Peter say in relation to the Lord not wishing anyone to perish?

2 Peter 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Peter indicated that the Lord is being longsuffering because of His desire for people to repent and not perish and that explains why He is taking a long time to return, as some see it according to the human perspective, but Peter made it clear that the Lord is not being slow from His perspective because a day and a thousand years are no different to Him from His eternal perspective. There is nothing there in that text in relation to a future thousand year reign whatsoever. You are adding that idea to the text and ignoring the context of it.

Spiritual Israelite simply chooses to scrap the events of the Revelation 20, and part of God's Plan of Salvation. Wonder what other parts of The Bible he chooses to scrap and throw away.

That is a lie. You know who tells lies? Liars.

Nope! I am not taking things out of context that Peter said in 2 Peter 3:7-12.

You absolutely are, as I've shown. And, you noticeably are not even addressing what I've said about the context of 2 Peter 3:8-9.

Peter was talking about 3 world earth ages in that 2 Peter 3 Chapter.

LOL. What a joke. No, he was not.

And at verse 7 he starts off talking about how this present 2nd world earth age is reserved unto destruction by fire, and the perdition of ungodly men. That idea of their perdition means their future destruction in the "lake of fire".

He may have been referring to the lake of fire as well, but he first referred to the destruction of the heavens and the earth by fire. Why did you neglect to mention that?

2 Peter 3:7 6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: 7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

The heavens and the earth aren't ever said to be cast into the lake of fire. Peter was comparing the destruction of the heavens and earth by fire directly to the flood in Noah's day. That was a physical, global event and Peter was comparing a future physical, global event to that one. The earth will be destroyed by fire when Jesus returns similarly to how it was destroyed by water in Noah's day. The fire won't annihilate the earth, but it will affect the entire earth just as the water covered the entire earth in Noah's day.

So Peter is covering a wide... timeline in that 7th verse, from the end of this present world with Christ's future return, and then after His future reign over the wicked, and then the wicked's casting into the future "lake of fire" after that "thousand years" reign, of which Jesus gave great detail about in the Revelation 20 Chapter.

According to Jesus Himself in Matthew 25:31-46 the wicked will be cast into the lake of fire, which He called "everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels" when He comes again with His angels, not a thousand years (plus Satan's little season) later.

If you would actually study The Bible 'as written' instead of heeding stupid doctrines from the devil's own, then you might understand how that "day of the Lord" event of God's "consuming fire" will NOT literally destroy this whole earth, nor the souls of the wicked.

In 2 Peter 3:6-7, Peter said it will destroy the whole earth similarly to how the flood literally destroyed the whole earth. Why do you ignore that?

But no... you'd rather follow men's stupid Amill LIES instead of keeping to God's Word.

You are nothing more than a little child using his parents' computer and going on the Internet and ranting. Pathetic.