PAUL WROTE DO NOT LISTEN TO THE PRETRIB RAPTURE TEACHERS

[No Pre-TB]

The antichrist is an enemy of God and Christ. It doesn't matter what exact things he will say. Denial of the Father and Son is only one small part of the AC puzzle.

Like I said, if you can find it, I will believe it. I have no problems humbling myself and learning something new. But I have never seen it.
John penned 4 verses on antichrists.

1. Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
2. For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
3. And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
4. Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

Christ said in Matthew 24,
For many will come in My name, claiming, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many.

None of these can say without a doubt that the man of sin, denies Christ, that Jesus came in the flesh and that he is not from God.
Now, Jesus also did say in Matthew 24,

For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders that would deceive even the elect, if that were possible.

Obviously, the False Prophet is one of these that works miracles. But I don't see any context that 100% links him to be Antichrist. As I stated a few posts back, maybe he will harbor that spirit. It is very possible. I don't understand why people want him to have that title so badly when we know he is called the man of sin or the man of lawlessness and the horn speaking great things. But he has to have those attributes and I cannot find it in 66 books.

Now, I agree that some historians thought that the man of sin was THE Antichrist. Their writings tell us that. People believe many things, but I prefer to tread safely with the word of God. If it doesn't say it and it's a grey area, don't use it. Otherwise, where do we draw the line on things? Whatever people think goes regardless of if it's found or not. This is the same issue with Pre-TB.

So, I have seen no evidence that the man of sin is an Antichrist and should be called such, but it is possible that he will be an Antichrist. We just don't know.

Edit: Is a Fake Christ or a Fake Prophet the same as an Anti Christ or an Anti Prophet? Or is a Fake Christian the same as Anti Christian?

 

[David in NJ]

The air is actually above the earth! That is where we meet Him. Not on a cruise ship.

The seas/oceans the land/earth and the air are all contained in one environment we call 'earth' = Read Genesis chapter 1

 

[David in NJ]

Yes, we are coming back with Him. Do not pretend that because Satan has wrath in the tribulation, that that trumps the fact it is God's wrath and Satan is only part of that.


The Rapture. Correct. Very comforting to know Jesus is coming to take us out before He takes them out!

You can only come back with Jesus if you DIE and your flesh body is buried/sleep in the dust of the earth.

When a Saint dies his/her spirit goes directly to the LORD Jesus in Heaven Above where the spirits of the Saints (who DIED) currently are as we speak.

It is comforting to know that when a Saint DIES, only his/her flesh body DIES and returns to the ground from which it came.

 

[No Pre-TB]

The word "antichrist" Apostle John used about the one he said the brethren had ALREADY HEARD SHALL COME (1 John 2:18). So that means if THEY already knew and heard "antichrist" shall come, then why don't you?

There were many antichrists already. I have replied to ewq1938 on this. You can read my reply there in post #221.

Thus a NEW TEMPLE IN JERUSALEM is... REQUIRED to fulfill that prophecy! No ifs, no buts, that is the FACT of Bible Scripture, and either one aligns with Scripture as written, or they align with something else other than God's written Word, like you are trying to do.

Sadly, I and others disagree.

Sitteth in the temple of God - That is, in the Christian church. It is by no means necessary to understand this of the temple at Jerusalem, which was standing at the time this Epistle was written, because:

(1) the phrase "the temple of God" is several times used with reference to the Christian church, 1 Corinthians 3:16, 1 Corinthians 3:17; 2 Corinthians 6:16; Ephesians 2:21; Revelation 3:12; and,

(2) the temple was the proper symbol of the church, and an apostle trained amidst the Hebrew institutions would naturally speak of the church as the temple of God.

But it is a spiritual temple, as the church is called, 1 Corinthians 3:16,17. So Augustine, Jerome, Hilary, Chrysostom, understand it.

not in the temple of Jerusalem, which was to be destroyed and never to be rebuilt more, and was destroyed before this man of sin was revealed; but in the church of God, so called, 1 Corinthians 3:16 the Ethiopic version renders it, "in the house of God"

The great Usurper who claims for himself that he “is God,” appropriates consequently the sanctuaries of religion and prostitutes them to his own worship. “Within the temple of God—not in Jerusalem alone,” says Chrysostom, “but in every church.”

Might need to extend your understanding back to Daniel 2, which reveals 5 PIECES of the beast statue, NOT 4.

Your pride is not a desired quality I wish to use. I did not bring up Daniel 2 because we were talking about the False Prophet; How he is not the Beast of the sea but the Beast of the Earth. Please pivot back to Daniel 7.

but Rev.13 does not say anything about a "false prophet"

Are you saying the Beast of the Earth is not a False Prophet? Yes or No.

The word "antichrist" is from 2 Greek words, 'anti' which means 'in place of' or 'instead of', and 'christos' which means Christ. It simply means the 'instead of Christ'.

I already replied back on this and I mentioned on point 1 in this reply. The description of what makes an antichrist and whom it is to be applied to.

 

[dad]

No, it's proof.

The only thing it is proof of is that when God sics Satan on the world the old boy is mad as a wet hornet. All part of the wrath of God. Undeniably.

The GT is satan's wrath, a war against Christians who are the church.

Another wrong claim. The Bride is with Jesus at the time of the wrath on earth.

That's the entire purpose of the GT, for the church to be persecuted. Many will be killed. The only escape is Apostasy and I fear the majority will go that route.

So you totally miss the purpose and nature of end time prophesy. OK. The wrath of God actually is for the world. Judments start to fall and people are forced to decide who they will love and worship. The time of Jacob's trouble is that time when God takes the church away and deals with Israel in large part. Most of them are killed and finally a remnant is saved who are all Israel by the very end period.

 

[dad]

You can only come back with Jesus if you DIE and your flesh body is buried/sleep in the dust of the earth.

When a Saint dies his/her spirit goes directly to the LORD Jesus in Heaven Above where the spirits of the Saints (who DIED) currently are as we speak.

It is comforting to know that when a Saint DIES, only his/her flesh body DIES and returns to the ground from which it came.

No. Those folks go up in the air to be with Him. When we die our spirit goes to be with God. Our dead bodies don't. The time when the dead bodies rise up in the air is the same time our live bodies rise up and we all go to be with Jesus. Later, we return to earth with Him from heaven in our new immortal bodies to rule here with Him for 1000 years.

 

[David in NJ]

No. Those folks go up in the air to be with Him. When we die our spirit goes to be with God. Our dead bodies don't. The time when the dead bodies rise up in the air is the same time our live bodies rise up and we all go to be with Jesus. Later, we return to earth with Him from heaven in our new immortal bodies to rule here with Him for 1000 years.

CORRECT - our physical bodies die and are buried in the earth = "sleep in the earth"

No physical bodies descend to earth with the Lord Jesus Christ at His Coming.

BECAUSE it is IMPOSSIBLE just as God has said:
1 Thessalonians , 2 Thessalonians , 1 Cor ch15, Matthew ch24 , Hebrews 9:28 , 1 John ch2 & ch3 , Daniel ch12 , Revelation

ONLY the spirits of the Saints who died are coming back with the LORD Jesus Christ for the RESURRECTION

No one goes back to heaven and then returns for a 3rd Time - No one!

We remain with the LORD and enter with Him into the 1,000 Year Reign in Glorified Resurrected/raptured Bodies

 

[No Pre-TB]

The Bride is with Jesus at the time of the wrath on earth.

True statement. But where you apply that wrath and where others do is the issue.

The time of Jacob's trouble is that time when God takes the church away and deals with Israel in large part.

Jacob's trouble has to do with the Israel of God. Not physical Israel which was delt with in 70 AD.

That day" points to the future, and thus, even apart from other reasons, excludes the supposition that it is the day of the destruction of Jerusalem that is meant. The words "that day is great" refer to Joel 2:11, and "there is none like it" is an imitation of Joel 2:2; in the latter passage the prophet makes use of a judgment which he had seen passed on Judah - its devastation by locusts - and for the first time presents, as the main element in his prophecy, the idea of the great day of judgment to come on all nations, and by which the Lord will perfect His kingdom on this earth. This day is for Jacob also, i.e., for all Israel, a time of distress; for the judgment falls not merely on the heathen nations, but also on the godless members of the covenant people, that they may be destroyed from among the congregation of the Lord. The judgment is therefore for Israel as well as for other nations a critical juncture, from which the Israel of God, the community of the faithful, will be delivered

And who is the Israel of God? Paul tell's the Galatians in Ch. 6 it is them, the Church.

The time when the dead bodies rise up in the air is the same time our live bodies rise up

That is not 100% accurate. Unless I am understanding you wrongly. The dead rise FIRST, THEN the living. They do not rise together. There is a space between both groups and how big a space we do not know. One rises first and the others...however long it is will rise and then meet them (the dead that were waiting there for us) in the air.

we return to earth with Him from heaven

We don't go to heaven with Christ. That is found nowhere in scripture that I'm aware of though it sounds nice. Unless you have a verse I can look at.

 

[No Pre-TB]

When it comes to eschatology, the Church in general (today) really stinks at it. And I worry how all that will affect believers when things do happen and they do see them.
Just because someone's eschatology is off doesn't mean the rest of their beliefs are off too. But I wonder if others will see it that way or perhaps forsake the church because, "if they can't be right on these things, maybe they are wrong on others". That feeling of having been lied to or betrayed.

And where are people's hearts really today? As many of my coworkers that say they believe in God, their actions and their words say otherwise. Though Church doesn't save, don't you want to be around like-minded people? Why do you enjoy doing the things of the world and not the things of God? Why do we talk about the latest R rated movie as the next best thing on Netflix and forget what Christ said about the eye...letting evil inside and it darkens the whole body where you cannot tell right from wrong. Do we glory in death on TV? Nudity? Bad language? Do you not find it repulsive? You should. Or what James said about bridling your tongue: You can't bless God and with the same tongue curse men.

We have people that identify as Christian and yet they protest others with signs saying "Youre going to Hell", God hates gays" and all kinds of bigotry that is repulsive. God does hate sin, but are we to throw it in people's faces and cast stones? Are we not sinners too? Hate the sin, but show love. Pray for them and let your works be seen in them that God can work in the sinner and them just as he works in us.

Just be careful and love one another. It's ok to be passionate in your belief's, but do so in love. 7 Church's and only 1 gets it fully right. Guess what? The odd's are against all of us.

 

[Davy]

Like I said, if you can find it, I will believe it. I have no problems humbling myself and learning something new. But I have never seen it.
John penned 4 verses on antichrists.

1. Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
2. For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
3. And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
4. Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

Christ said in Matthew 24,
For many will come in My name, claiming, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many.

None of these can say without a doubt that the man of sin, denies Christ, that Jesus came in the flesh and that he is not from God.
Now, Jesus also did say in Matthew 24,

For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders that would deceive even the elect, if that were possible.

Obviously, the False Prophet is one of these that works miracles. But I don't see any context that 100% links him to be Antichrist. As I stated a few posts back, maybe he will harbor that spirit. It is very possible. I don't understand why people want him to have that title so badly when we know he is called the man of sin or the man of lawlessness and the horn speaking great things. But he has to have those attributes and I cannot find it in 66 books.

Now, I agree that some historians thought that the man of sin was THE Antichrist. Their writings tell us that. People believe many things, but I prefer to tread safely with the word of God. If it doesn't say it and it's a grey area, don't use it. Otherwise, where do we draw the line on things? Whatever people think goes regardless of if it's found or not. This is the same issue with Pre-TB.

So, I have seen no evidence that the man of sin is an Antichrist and should be called such, but it is possible that he will be an Antichrist. We just don't know.

Edit: Is a Fake Christ or a Fake Prophet the same as an Anti Christ or an Anti Prophet? Or is a Fake Christian the same as Anti Christian?

Well, you've been shown about that Antichrist; maybe you ought to re-read the 1 John 2:18 verse... since that's where you apparently are trying to base your ideas on.

1 John 2:18
18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
KJV

The phrase is red is about a singular Antichrist John said the brethren had already heard shall come. When and where did they first hear that Antichrist shall come?

The phrase in green is about the "many antichrists", the followers of 'the Antichrist'. These are about the "mystery of iniquity", the "tares", the "crept in unawares" of Jude, the "workers of iniquity" back in the Old Testament.

In Christ's Olivet discourse He pointed to BOTH, the SINGULAR Antichrist the brethren already heard shall come, AND the "many antichrists" workers. Apostle Paul pointed to BOTH also in 2 Thessalonians 2.

"many antichrists":
Matt 24:4-5
4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
KJV

"antichrist", which the below is actually about a singular false Christ:
Matt 24:23-26
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, "Lo, here is Christ, or there"; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, "Behold, He is in the desert"; go not forth: "behold, He is in the secret chambers"; believe it not.
KJV

Do you not 'see' the difference above between the "antichrist", and the "many antichrists"? The "many antichrists" are those who only CLAIM to be Christ, but have NO SHOW of miracles. They're like Moon, Jim Jones, etc., many have claimed to be Christ throughout history.

But that one Jesus warns about in the 23-26 verses, that is different, because that singular "antichrist" is to come working those "great signs and wonders" that will be so powerful in deception, that it would almost deceive even Christ's very elect.

And if you can receive it, the devil himself is going to be that coming pseudo-Christ working those great signs and wonders to deceive the whole world with. Once he is booted out of the Heavenly dimension, he has no choice but to come into our 'earthly' dimension and appear to us in plain sight. So yeah, there is an Antichrist coming, definitely, and Jesus warned us about it, as did Apostle Paul and Apostle John.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Paul addressed the Pretribulation Rapture teachers in 2Th 2:1-5. When someone told the Thessalonians the rapture was at hand or could happen at any moment, the Thessalonians became confused about what Paul taught them. The fellow who said this was a Pretribulation Rapture teacher because when he said the rapture could happen at any moment the Antichrist had not yet emerged on the scene. In other words, he was teaching the rapture occurs before the Antichrist rises to power. In order for the Thessalonians to become confused about what Paul taught them they must have esteemed the Pretribulation Rapture teacher as Pastors are esteemed by believers today; otherwise the believers would not have taken him seriously. When Paul heard about this he wrote the letter recorded in 2Th. 2:1-5 and told the Thessalonians not to listen to the Pretribulation Rapture teacher because the rapture or our gathering to the Lord does not occur until after the the falling away and after the Antichrist seats himself in Jerusalem displaying himself as God. The scriptures tell us the Antichrist doesn’t seat himself in Jerusalem until 3 1/2 years after he emerges on the scene.

2Th. 2:1 Now we request you, brethren, with regard to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and our gathering together to Him, 2 that you may not be quickly shaken from your composure or be disturbed either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come. 3 Let no one in any way deceive you, for it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God. 5 Do you not remember that while I was still with you, I was telling you these things?

YOu are confusing the Day of the Lord with the descent of the Lord into the Atmosphere to gather the church! Almost without fail, in both the OT and NT the Day of the Lord refers to the 70thweek of Daniel or what we call the tribulation.

The tribulation or Day of the Wrath of God and of the Lamb will begin when the Antichrist signs a 7 year covenant with Israel.

And Paul in thess. declared emphatically we will be delivered from that wrath.

1 Thessalonians 1:10
And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

The only other thing called wrath in Scripture is Gods anger against sin and unbelievers.

 

[Davy]

Sadly, I and others disagree.

It's OK to disagree with me, but it's more important that you determine whether it's really me you're disagreeing with, or disagreeing with God's written Word. I say the latter.

Sitteth in the temple of God - That is, in the Christian church. It is by no means necessary to understand this of the temple at Jerusalem, which was standing at the time this Epistle was written, because:

There's that old trick from the false Jew's doctrines crept into 'some' Churches.

Apostle Paul in 2 Thess.2:4 was talking about the TRADITIONAL JEWISH TEMPLE in Jerusalem, not the Christian Church.

Here's why...

Eph 2:19-22
19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief corner stone;
21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
KJV

You gonna' try and tell me that SPIRITUAL TEMPLE that is built upon the "foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief corner stone" CAN BE CORRUPTED??? Absolutely NOT!!!

The fake preacher you've been listening to has bewitched you away from God's written Word on that matter. I suggest you leave that 'beth-aven' (house of vanity) immediately, and find one that teaches The Bible instead of their own word.

 

[Truth7t7]

Jesus is coming back and will be here in the flesh to rule the whole world.

Many claim Jesus will literally return and rule "On This Earth" In A Millennium, this being false in deception

Jesus warned his followers against this teaching, Jesus wont be found anywhere upon this earth as many claim

The Antichrist will be in Jerusalem, claiming to be God-Messiah Returned, "Beware"!

"Believe It Not" "Go Not Forth"

Matthew 24:23-27KJV
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Revelation 13:13-14KJV
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

Revelation 19:20KJV
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

 

[No Pre-TB]

1 John 2:18
18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
KJV

Nothing there says the man of sin is an Antichrist. What it does say is that in the time of him writing this, they believed antichrist will come as a prophecy....and he follows up saying they are in that time already as "whereby we know its the last time" because "now there are many antichrist." If it read, Little children it is the last time and as you have heard that the spirit that denies Christ came in the flesh (2 John 1:7 the definition of Antichrist) should come, even now there are many spirits that deny Christ came in the flesh. Therefore, we know it is the last time. How then would you take it?

disagreeing with God's written Word. I say the latter.

As I said, myself and OTHER's disagree with you. The NT is clear, we are the temple. And anyone that defiles it will be destroyed.

You gonna' try and tell me that SPIRITUAL TEMPLE that is built upon the "foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief corner stone" CAN BE CORRUPTED??? Absolutely NOT!!!

You can backslide can you not? What is an apostate? Are you telling me a Church could not bring in heresies and other foul things, which they do today, and corrupt those that enter?

1 Cor 3:17
If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

So yes, I'm going tell you according to that verse, the spiritual temple which we are can be defiled and if it is, God will destroy those persons.

 

[David in NJ]

Many claim Jesus will literally return and rule "On This Earth" In A Millennium, this being false in deception

Jesus warned his followers against this teaching, Jesus wont be found anywhere upon this earth as many claim

The Antichrist will be in Jerusalem, claiming to be God-Messiah Returned, "Beware"!

"Believe It Not" "Go Not Forth"

Matthew 24:23-27KJV
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Revelation 13:13-14KJV
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

Revelation 19:20KJV
20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Amazing - now we have earthlings thinking they can tell the LORD Jesus where HE can and cannot be.

Zechariah 14:1-5
Behold, a day of the LORD is coming when your plunder will be divided in your presence. 2For I will gather all the nations for battle against Jerusalem, and the city will be captured, the houses looted, and the women ravished. Half of the city will go into exile, but the rest of the people will not be removed from the city.

3Then the LORD will go out to fight against those nations, as He fights in the day of battle.
4On that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half the mountain moving to the north and half to the south.
5You will flee by My mountain valley, for it will extend to Azal. You will flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come, and all the holy ones with Him.

 

[Keraz]

The wrath of God is not something we are to be part of.

1 Peter 4:12 shows how wrong you are:
Friends; do not be surprised at the fiery trial which will come to try you.......

2 Peter 3:7 tells us what that trial will be;
The world is reserved unto fire, a terrible Day of Judgment when the wicked peoples will be destroyed.

Hebrews 12:8 But if you be without trials and testing, then you are not His children.

 

[Davy]

Nothing there says the man of sin is an Antichrist. What it does say is that in the time of him writing this, they believed antichrist will come as a prophecy....and he follows up saying they are in that time already as "whereby we know its the last time" because "now there are many antichrist." If it read, Little children it is the last time and as you have heard that the spirit that denies Christ came in the flesh (2 John 1:7 the definition of Antichrist) should come, even now there are many spirits that deny Christ came in the flesh. Therefore, we know it is the last time. How then would you take it?

As I said, myself and OTHER's disagree with you. The NT is clear, we are the temple. And anyone that defiles it will be destroyed.
....

I'm done trying to talk sense with you. It is obvious you are more interested in following the doctrines of men instead of listening to The LORD in His Word. Welcome to my IGNORE list.

 

[No Pre-TB]

Welcome to my IGNORE list.

I did not say anything hateful to you. Why do people that confess their Christians do such things? Are we here to talk or not? It seems If I don't like what you have to say, I get ignored.

It is obvious you are more interested in following the doctrines of men instead of listening to The LORD

No, I do my best to listen to God in all things though I admit I don't always, I ask God to help me when I struggle. I want to please Him but I am flesh and it hurts that no matter how often I would want to do what is right, the flesh wants me to do wrong.

My opinion on something shouldn't cause you to get frustrated that you /ignore people.
How will you ever witness to a non believer?

When trials come, ignoring them wont help you.

 

[No Pre-TB]

1 Peter 4:12 shows how wrong you are:
Friends; do not be surprised at the fiery trial which will come to try you.

That single verse I never hear from Pre-Tbbers. What fiery trial is Peter referring to if we are outta here in Heaven?

The word rendered "fiery trial" (πυρώσει purōsei) occurs only here and in Revelation 18:9, Revelation 18:18; in both of which latter places it is rendered burning.

It only appears in both those Revelation verses, and in each the referral is to Mystery Babylon being destroyed. Hmm, could this be the hr of trial/testing that comes on the whole world? Do you think Christians will be faithful enough to stand when Babylon is destroyed and all the things their soul lusts after they either, like Lot's wife, turn their hearts back or do they press forward with Christ?

 

[dad]

CORRECT - our physical bodies die and are buried in the earth = "sleep in the earth"

No physical bodies descend to earth with the Lord Jesus Christ at His Coming.

Of course they don't. Jesus does not descend at the rapture either. We ascend! And since the bodies of the believers are rasised to the air, any saints who may be with Jesus in the air could not have their bodies raised yet. We shall be like Him. It seems to me that whhen we die and go to be with Him our bodies are still here and therefore not raised from the dead yet.

ONLY the spirits of the Saints who died are coming back with the LORD Jesus Christ for the RESURRECTION

Great, and they get a new complete eternal body like Jesus also then. Remember Jesus was bodily raised from the dead?

No one goes back to heaven and then returns for a 3rd Time - No one!

We remain with the LORD and enter with Him into the 1,000 Year Reign in Glorified Resurrected/raptured Bodies

Forget third. I expect to commute when ruling the earth with Him from New Jerusalem!