Once Saved....always Saved - Results of Questionnaire.

[Taken]

You're trying to get me to say that we are saved by our works - which I won't.
"Obedience" means just what you think it means: DOING the will of the Father (Matt. 7:21).

Obedience keeps us in God's grace. Just because we come to belief and are baptized and born again does NOT mean that we can now abdicate our responsibility because we have a "guarantee" of Heaven. We DON'T - unless we remain faithful.

No. I can not "get you" to say anything, but what you believe.

I am sure some might simply say "works", but I do not believe THAT is it.

I believe; the obedience IS doing:
IS doing..the Commands of Jesus.

The "work's" are the results of being obedient, to Jesus' commands, which IS the will of the Father.

The "work's" IN Obedience, Glorify God, and shall be rewarded.

The "work's" NOT IN Obedience, NOR Glorifying God, SHALL not be rewarded, and SHALL be burned...,<--- that applies to a born again man.
Non glorifying works, does not men SIN, it simply means, it is NOT something you are doing that glorifies God.
Playing with your puppy does not glorify God.
Exalting God, glorifies God.

ONLY a born again man CAN be obedient TO Jesus' commands and glorify God.

When you speak Gods word of truth, telling another, according TO His truth, it glorifies God.

When you speak of how you won an argument with another man, it does nothing to glorify God....thus shall be burned.

Every born again man does both..

The key to being Obedient TO Chirst, is to KNOW what HE commands. A man WHO obeys those commands Glorifies God.

The Key to Knowing HOW WE can accomplish Christ's commands, IS KNOWING, we have learned His commands and thus Know His expectation;...and further KNOW, we accomplish those commands, BY and THROUGH His Power IN us.

 

[GodsGrace]

The important thing to remember is that it doesn't matter if ALL of the Bishops and priests don't believe that it's a sacrifice. It doesn't "cease" being a sacrifice based on the faithlessness of some within the Church.

Of course this is true. But if it continues like this, a couple of generations down and Catholicism won't even be recognizable anymore. Of course, we may not last that long...

 

[Taken]

BOL ~

My reference to KNOWING Jesus' commands...are commands Jesus' Himself said. It begins being said to a natural man...and continues as the natural man obtains a Converstion.

Commands;
Repent
Follow me
Let your light shine
Be reconciled
Do not lust
Keep your word
Love your enemies
Be Perfect
Practice secret disciplines
Lay up treasures in heaven
Seek Gods Kingdom
Judge not
Ask, seek, knock TO Jesus, He is the Door
Do unto others
Choose the narrow way
Beware of false prophets
Pray for laborers
Be wise
Fear not
Hear His voice
Deny yourself
God to offenders
Beware of covetousness
Forgive offenders
Honor marriage
Ask in faith
Aid the poor
Love your neighbor
Await my return
Take, eat, drink
Be born again
Watch and pray
Receive Gods Power...

Probably some more...
These are Jesus' commands. A man who does thes things, are being obedient to Jesus' commands.
A man who is being obedient to Jesus' IS glorifying God and Doing the WILL of the Father.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Of course this is true. But if it continues like this, a couple of generations down and Catholicism won't even be recognizable anymore. Of course, we may not last that long...

People have been predicting the demise of the Church for 2000 years. It has survived greater hurdles than this.
Jesus guaranteed that the gate of Hell would NOT prevail against His Church (Matt. 16:18).

 

[GodsGrace]

Okay. And what would you say, is the obedience a man must do ?

IOW, is there specific things that entails being "obedient" ?

And what would those "things" be called?

Well Taken, BoL seems to be afraid of the word works, but I'm not.
Try reading Mathew 25 --- Jesus tells us a whole bunch of things we should do:
Like feed the hungry and cloth the poor, etc.
Try reading Mathew 5, Jesus tells us how we are to behave at the beginning of the beatitudes.

Here are some more:
Ephesians 2:10
Acts 10:37-38
Galatians 6:9-10
Luke 6:27-36
1 Peter 3:8-13
1 Peter 3:10-12
Hebrews 13:16

and so many more.
But, of course, we each only see what we want to see.

 

[Taken]

BOL ~

Then there are ALSO "PRECEPTS"...
Precepts are more like the "MANNER" in which one is DOING or trying to effect accomplishing the commands.

Kind, loving, truthful, patient, etc.

Or with hate, disgust, malice, fear, bulling, etc.

 

[BreadOfLife]

No. I can not "get you" to say anything, but what you believe.

I am sure some might simply say "works", but I do not believe THAT is it.

I believe; the obedience IS doing:
IS doing..the Commands of Jesus.

The "work's" are the results of being obedient, to Jesus' commands, which IS the will of the Father.

The "work's" IN Obedience, Glorify God, and shall be rewarded.

The "work's" NOT IN Obedience, NOR Glorifying God, SHALL not be rewarded, and SHALL be burned...,<--- that applies to a born again man.
Non glorifying works, does not men SIN, it simply means, it is NOT something you are doing that glorifies God.
Playing with your puppy does not glorify God.
Exalting God, glorifies God.

ONLY a born again man CAN be obedient TO Jesus' commands and glorify God.

When you speak Gods word of truth, telling another, according TO His truth, it glorifies God.

When you speak of how you won an argument with another man, it does nothing to glorify God....thus shall be burned.

Every born again man does both..

The key to being Obedient TO Chirst, is to KNOW what HE commands. A man WHO obeys those commands Glorifies God.

The Key to Knowing HOW WE can accomplish Christ's commands, IS KNOWING, we have learned His commands and thus Know His expectation;...and further KNOW, we accomplish those commands, BY and THROUGH His Power IN us.

I agree.
What I don't agree with is the idea we have no choice in the matter.

 

[Taken]

Well Taken, BoL seems to be afraid of the word works, but I'm not.
Try reading Mathew 25 --- Jesus tells us a whole bunch of things we should do:
Like feed the hungry and cloth the poor, etc.
Try reading Mathew 5, Jesus tells us how we are to behave at the beginning of the beatitudes.

Here are some more:
Ephesians 2:10
Acts 10:37-38
Galatians 6:9-10
Luke 6:27-36
1 Peter 3:8-13
1 Peter 3:10-12
Hebrews 13:16

and so many more.
But, of course, we each only see what we want to see.

I don't think BOL is afraid of the word WORK, inasmuch as him not wanting to leave an opening to be misunderstood.

Works is simply us doing something.
For WHO, and in what manner...distinguishes the WORK acceptable to God, or Not.

Work in cooking your husband a nice meal, is acceptable to God, and to your husband...

But it does not Glorify God.
Only certain works Glorify God.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[BreadOfLife]

I don't think BOL is afraid of the word WORK, inasmuch as him not wanting to leave an opening to be misunderstood.
Works is simply us doing something.
For WHO, and in what manner...distinguishes the WORK acceptable to God, or Not.
Work in cooking your husband a nice meal, is acceptable to God, and to your husband...

But it does not Glorify God.
Only certain works Glorify God.

God Bless,
Taken

I would disagree with you here.
The good works of a wife for her husband absolutely glorify God in the holy union of Matrimony.

 

[Heb 13:8]

Exactly - and we cannot abdicate OUR role in our salvation and still expect to be saved.

How do we abdicate something that was never ours?

Eph 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--

 

[Taken]

I agree.
What I don't agree with is the idea we have no choice in the matter.

You do have a choice.
No one makes you believe, follow, give your life to God, receive His gifts.

You make your choice WITH the freewill..of the natural thing you are....

You are told and warned, your choice is permanent to become born again.

You are told and revealed, your natural shall become dead and your corrupt soul and natural spirit changed.

You do not KEEP the Change Changed...God does with His Power.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Heb 13:8]

You are told and warned, your choice is permanent to become born again.

and i choose eternal life

 

[Taken]

I would disagree with you here.
The good works of a wife for her husband absolutely glorify God in the holy union of Matrimony.

You are too concentrated on the carnal.
Set that aside.
Sure the wife CAN be helpful to her husband, they each decide in harmony who does what in their marriage.

However a wife can prepare a good healthy full of vitamins and minerals out of locally grown food.....prepare them to delicious perfection...

But bummer if every food she has prepared is food her husband hates!

If my spouse prepared me fresh goat, fresh peas, turnips....while healthy....eweee...I hate all of those foods.

 

[Taken]

People have been predicting the demise of the Church for 2000 years. It has survived greater hurdles than this.
Jesus guaranteed that the gate of Hell would NOT prevail against His Church (Matt. 16:18).

Well the gates of hell will not prevail against His Church.

However men decide what IS "His Church"...this Church or that Church built with mens hands....Gods Church is built without mens hands.

 

[Taken]

and i choose eternal life

Amen!

God Bless.
Taken

 

[GodsGrace]

I don't think BOL is afraid of the word WORK, inasmuch as him not wanting to leave an opening to be misunderstood.

Works is simply us doing something.
For WHO, and in what manner...distinguishes the WORK acceptable to God, or Not.

Work in cooking your husband a nice meal, is acceptable to God, and to your husband...

But it does not Glorify God.
Only certain works Glorify God.

God Bless,
Taken

Incorrect Taken.
After we become saved, and others know this, everything we do glorifies God.
Colossians 3:17
1 Corinthians 10:31

 

[GodsGrace]

You are too concentrated on the carnal.
Set that aside.
Sure the wife CAN be helpful to her husband, they each decide in harmony who does what in their marriage.

However a wife can prepare a good healthy full of vitamins and minerals out of locally grown food.....prepare them to delicious perfection...

But bummer if every food she has prepared is food her husband hates!

If my spouse prepared me fresh goat, fresh peas, turnips....while healthy....eweee...I hate all of those foods.

Why would your wife make you food you hate???
Does she not love you?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Well the gates of hell will not prevail against His Church.

However men decide what IS "His Church"...this Church or that Church built with mens hands....Gods Church is built without mens hands.

Exactly.
WHO said that it was built with human hands?

 

[BreadOfLife]

How do we abdicate something that was never ours?
Eph 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--

It was NEVER your responsibility to do God's will??
It was NEVER your responsibility to to be accountable for your actions??

What Bible are YOU reading??

 

[BreadOfLife]

You do have a choice.
No one makes you believe, follow, give your life to God, receive His gifts.
You make your choice WITH the freewill..of the natural thing you are....

You are told and warned, your choice is permanent to become born again.

You are told and revealed, your natural shall become dead and your corrupt soul and natural spirit changed.
You do not KEEP the Change Changed...God does with His Power.

God Bless,
Taken

This is absolutely untrue.

The idea that we cannot fall from grace and walk away from God is anti-Scriptural (Matt. 5:13, Matt. 7:21, Rom. 11:22, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Peter 2:20-22, 2 Peter 3:17, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).