Not Born with Sin Nature

[1stCenturyLady]

Those of you who deny whatt probably is misnamed... Soul sleep.... Could you please explain the following.
KJV Luke 8:50-55
50 But when Jesus heard it, he answered him, saying, Fear not: believe only, and she shall be made whole.
51 And when he came into the house, he suffered no man to go in, save Peter, and James, and John, and the father and the mother of the maiden.
52 And all wept, and bewailed her: but he said, Weep not; she is not dead, but sleepeth.
53 And they laughed him to scorn, knowing that she was dead.
54 And he put them all out, and took her by the hand, and called, saying, Maid, arise.
55 And her spirit came again, and she arose straightway: and he commanded to give her meat.

Backlit, that is off topic. Why don't you copy and paste this into a new post. But just for your ears, soul sleep was for the OT saints. They couldn't go straight to heaven like we can because the Messiah was still to come, die and rise again. And when Jesus rose from the dead, so did all the OT saints who were seen walking around Jerusalem. They didn't die again - they were taken to heaven. Now is the New Covenant with new promises.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

They don't seem to mind like shallow men do. That was written for that age, but not forever. BTW, you haven't a clue who I am, or anything about me.

You sound like a woman who was influenced by the Women's Lib movement and that fleshly part of you remained - 1 Tim. 2:11-14 is for today and all time, has been since the fall.
To the woman He said,

“I will greatly multiply
Your pain in childbirth,
In pain you shall deliver children;
Yet your desire will be for your husband,
And he shall rule over you.” Gen. 3:16

Women have been struggling with God's order to woman to be under a man's authority, ber husband's thumb, and in work and government, etc., etc., since the original sin. Look at history, with very few exceptions, God has ordained men to be the leaders in authority and specifically priests/ pastors. Women up there in the pulpit don't work. Oh, they try and many are knowledgable.
Take it from the Lord, He said it.
I would add also that the 1st Century woman was quite different than the modern womaen's lib type today. I picture a graceful, gentle and peaceful woman - like Mary, never saying a bad word about anyone, even if she thought it ... always forgiving, helpful, kind ... a servant at heart, obedient to her husband, a Proverbs 31 woman. Our church often exemplified and taught the Proverbs 31 woman as a model for all women.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

You sound like a woman who was influenced by the Women's Lib movement and that fleshly part of you remained - 1 Tim. 2:11-14 is for today and all time, has been since the fall.
To the woman He said,

“I will greatly multiply
Your pain in childbirth,
In pain you shall deliver children;
Yet your desire will be for your husband,
And he shall rule over you.” Gen. 3:16

Women have been struggling with God's order to woman to be under a man's authority, ber husband's thumb, and in work and government, etc., etc., since the original sin. Look at history, with very few exceptions, God has ordained men to be the leaders in authority and specifically priests/ pastors. Women up there in the pulpit don't work. Oh, they try and many are knowledgable.
Take it from the Lord, He said it.
I would add also that the 1st Century woman was quite different than the modern womaen's lib type today. I picture a graceful, gentle and peaceful woman - like Mary, never saying a bad word about anyone, even if she thought it ... always forgiving, helpful, kind ... a servant at heart, obedient to her husband, a Proverbs 31 woman. Our church often exemplified and taught the Proverbs 31 woman as a model for all women.

You are amazing, but not in a good way.



Curious, are you married?

 

[robert derrick]

The soul that sinneth, it shall die.

Souls made with sin are souls made dead by God.

Souls only die by sinning, not by being stillborn with sin: DOA.

He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.

God does not make souls dead with sin: He is not the God of the dead created with sin.

God makes all souls alive like Adam from the beginning: He is the God of the living souls only.

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.

Them that believe and trust in a god that makes souls dead with sin and born into the world as sinners, are believing and trusting in the devil as the creator and father.

And the devil's sins and trespasses they continue to do:

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him.

 

[robert derrick]

I do not believe that our souls are our bodies, nor do I teach that. I distinctively said our soul is invisible: mind, will, emotions, personality, or did you miss that part?


I believe I stated that, where did I imply any different. Stop twisting what I say. Last time I got into it with you, you did the same thing.


I never said the soul was the physical body. Baring false witness against your neighbor again. When in doubt make up stuff about the other person, slander. That is your style right, you must be a Democrat, that is in their playbook!


See I never said any of this. You twist and distort, slander, because you have no other recourse.

I do not believe that our souls are our bodies, nor do I teach that.

Yes you do, and you don't know it when you say it.

Do you understand what our flesh is? It is not just our physical being, it also includes our soul.

The flesh does not include the soul: the soul is not in the flesh itself.

We walk in the flesh of natural bodies, but we are not flesh nor bodies, we are souls.

Souls are made by God and wrapped in flesh from the womb.

Clothes do not include the body: the body is not in the clothing itself, but only walks with clothes on the body.

Within lies the sin, it dwells in the members of our flesh.

If a soul sins in the flesh, it is the soul sins and has sin, not the flesh.

If a person sins in clothes, is the persons that sins, not the clothes.

You doctrine has sins in flesh itself, that you may blame your body for the sins you do with it.

 

[robert derrick]

I do not believe that our souls are our bodies, nor do I teach that. I distinctively said our soul is invisible: mind, will, emotions, personality, or did you miss that part?


I believe I stated that, where did I imply any different. Stop twisting what I say. Last time I got into it with you, you did the same thing.


I never said the soul was the physical body. Baring false witness against your neighbor again. When in doubt make up stuff about the other person, slander. That is your style right, you must be a Democrat, that is in their playbook!


See I never said any of this. You twist and distort, slander, because you have no other recourse.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

"The spirit is not flesh, and the flesh is not spirit, neither can one become the other."

I believe I stated that, where did I imply any different. Stop twisting what I say. Last time I got into it with you, you did the same thing.

You neither said it nor quoted the Scripture. You said the flesh includes the soul and that our body is our soul:

but sin still dwells in the members of our flesh and that is our soul.

The only thing included in the flesh are atom molecules of soft tissue: man is a soul wrapped in flesh, not a body that is a soul.

"Our souls dwell in earthen vessels. Our souls are not earthen vessels, nor are earthen vessels sinful and unclean of themselves."

See I never said any of this. You twist and distort, slander, because you have no other recourse.

I know you never did, which is why you need to do so, rather than saying things that show you don't know what you are talking about.

Be disciplined to say things more accurately or be ready to clarify them. Crying about it doesn't help.

 

[robert derrick]

Twisting and distorting what I said. The spirit and flesh are separated. God lives in our spiritual compartment, but we still have the flesh where sin dwells. We were freed from it's bondage, our spirits are clean, but sin still dwells in the members of our flesh and that is our soul. You cannot differentiate between the soul and the spirit can you? We have spirit, soul and body. Our spirits separate from our fleshy part of us, when we die. The perfect part of us, our spirit, goes to be with the LORD.


I actually stated that the heart of man was not the heart that pumps blood. You are distorting my words or not reading, therefore I am wasting my time with you once again.


Christians do the same things as natural men at times. The world sees us and points us out when we sin. It is rare to find someone one who does not sin. Mother Teresa, Billy Graham, people like that gave their all, but even they would not say they were without sin.

At this point, you don't seem to be able to discern what I wrote correctly, let alone the scriptures properly. I don't think we can have any rational dialogue.
A final note: We are all born with a SIN NATURE. You have done nothing but bared false witness against me ... must mean your sin nature is working overtime?

God lives in our spiritual compartment.

Our spirits do not have 'compartments', unless it is some glass container in the sky, that you people think you are now forever preserved in like so much jam and jelly, while your bodies go on sinning back on earth.

And God doesn't live in the souls of sinners, that are daily made dead by their sins and trespasses.

 

[robert derrick]

Twisting and distorting what I said. The spirit and flesh are separated. God lives in our spiritual compartment, but we still have the flesh where sin dwells. We were freed from it's bondage, our spirits are clean, but sin still dwells in the members of our flesh and that is our soul. You cannot differentiate between the soul and the spirit can you? We have spirit, soul and body. Our spirits separate from our fleshy part of us, when we die. The perfect part of us, our spirit, goes to be with the LORD.


I actually stated that the heart of man was not the heart that pumps blood. You are distorting my words or not reading, therefore I am wasting my time with you once again.


Christians do the same things as natural men at times. The world sees us and points us out when we sin. It is rare to find someone one who does not sin. Mother Teresa, Billy Graham, people like that gave their all, but even they would not say they were without sin.

At this point, you don't seem to be able to discern what I wrote correctly, let alone the scriptures properly. I don't think we can have any rational dialogue.
A final note: We are all born with a SIN NATURE. You have done nothing but bared false witness against me ... must mean your sin nature is working overtime?

I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.

Your teaching not only makes the spiritual to be flesh, but you also make what is nothing of itself unclean, to be unclean and sinful.

Twisting and distorting what I said... but we still have the flesh where sin dwells... but sin still dwells in the members of our flesh.

The argument is about sin being in the physical flesh of mortal bodies. Scripture says no: there is nothing in nature unclean of itself. Flesh and blood, animal bodies, trees and bees have no sin dwelling in them. Only molecules and tissue. They are neither sinful nor spirit creatures.

Only the soul sins, not the body, and only the sinning soul has sin, not the body. Flesh and blood has no condemnation for the sins of the soul with the body.

Correcting what you plainly say several times is not distorting what you say. Accusing the correction of distorting what you say, is refusing to be corrected, when you have no answer for it.

 

[robert derrick]

Twisting and distorting what I said. The spirit and flesh are separated. God lives in our spiritual compartment, but we still have the flesh where sin dwells. We were freed from it's bondage, our spirits are clean, but sin still dwells in the members of our flesh and that is our soul. You cannot differentiate between the soul and the spirit can you? We have spirit, soul and body. Our spirits separate from our fleshy part of us, when we die. The perfect part of us, our spirit, goes to be with the LORD.


I actually stated that the heart of man was not the heart that pumps blood. You are distorting my words or not reading, therefore I am wasting my time with you once again.


Christians do the same things as natural men at times. The world sees us and points us out when we sin. It is rare to find someone one who does not sin. Mother Teresa, Billy Graham, people like that gave their all, but even they would not say they were without sin.

At this point, you don't seem to be able to discern what I wrote correctly, let alone the scriptures properly. I don't think we can have any rational dialogue.
A final note: We are all born with a SIN NATURE. You have done nothing but bared false witness against me ... must mean your sin nature is working overtime?

We were freed from it's bondage, our spirits are clean, but sin still dwells in the members of our flesh

If you were freed from sin, then you wouldn't be doing your sins with your members.

This is the learned hypocrisy of OSAS: 'unconditionally saved' souls are no longer judged for their sins, because their spirit is 'freed' from the flesh and therefore no more responsible for the deeds of the body. They blame their ongoing sins and trespasses on flesh that has no sin nor trespass in it, and on physical bodies that have no say about it.

You cannot differentiate between the soul and the spirit can you? We have spirit, soul and body.

You don't make difference between soul and spirit, and the physical body.

Instead you transfer the sins of the soul and spirit to the body, that the soul is unconditionally saved, and the spirit is 'free', while the old man of the physical body still goes on sinning.

The soul is the man, and the spirit is the mind of the soul, which is called the mind of the spirit.

The soul does the sinning with a carnal mind of an unclean spirit, and the body does what it is made to do: the body does nothing of itself according to rational thought, and the flesh is not unclean of itself according to Scripture.

The only thing about a man that is without free will, nor any will at all, is the physical body, which is the earthen vessel in which the soul dwells and the spirit thinks.

People who teach their bodies are sinful, and their spirits are 'free' and not responsible for the sinful deeds of the body, are psychotic to the world, and spiritually delusional to Scripture.

OSAS is hippy-dippy 'free spirit' corruption on spiritual steroids.

 

[robert derrick]

Twisting and distorting what I said. The spirit and flesh are separated. God lives in our spiritual compartment, but we still have the flesh where sin dwells. We were freed from it's bondage, our spirits are clean, but sin still dwells in the members of our flesh and that is our soul. You cannot differentiate between the soul and the spirit can you? We have spirit, soul and body. Our spirits separate from our fleshy part of us, when we die. The perfect part of us, our spirit, goes to be with the LORD.


I actually stated that the heart of man was not the heart that pumps blood. You are distorting my words or not reading, therefore I am wasting my time with you once again.


Christians do the same things as natural men at times. The world sees us and points us out when we sin. It is rare to find someone one who does not sin. Mother Teresa, Billy Graham, people like that gave their all, but even they would not say they were without sin.

At this point, you don't seem to be able to discern what I wrote correctly, let alone the scriptures properly. I don't think we can have any rational dialogue.
A final note: We are all born with a SIN NATURE. You have done nothing but bared false witness against me ... must mean your sin nature is working overtime?

Christians do the same things as natural men at times.

Sinful Christians such as yourself do, and the deeds of your father you will continue to do, because you declare it is impossible to do otherwise.

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him.

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

The world sees us and points us out when we sin.

The world sees you and points out your hypocrisy.

It is rare to find someone one who does not sin. Mother Teresa, Billy Graham, people like that gave their all, but even they would not say they were without sin.

First you say all Christians will sin from time to time just like natural men, and then you say it is rare when they don't, and so you don't know what you are saying nor talking about.

And you use examples that you have no clue about, but only what you've read and seen on TV.

It proves your carnal mindedness, that cannot judge rightly at all, only going by appearance and sight, and not by faith in Scripture of God:

Ye are witnesses, and God also, how holily and justly and unblameably we behaved ourselves among you that believe.

Blessed are they that keep judgment, and he that doeth righteousness at all times.

But God shall wound the head of his enemies, and the hairy scalp of such an one as goeth on still in his trespasses.

 

[robert derrick]

Twisting and distorting what I said. The spirit and flesh are separated. God lives in our spiritual compartment, but we still have the flesh where sin dwells. We were freed from it's bondage, our spirits are clean, but sin still dwells in the members of our flesh and that is our soul. You cannot differentiate between the soul and the spirit can you? We have spirit, soul and body. Our spirits separate from our fleshy part of us, when we die. The perfect part of us, our spirit, goes to be with the LORD.


I actually stated that the heart of man was not the heart that pumps blood. You are distorting my words or not reading, therefore I am wasting my time with you once again.


Christians do the same things as natural men at times. The world sees us and points us out when we sin. It is rare to find someone one who does not sin. Mother Teresa, Billy Graham, people like that gave their all, but even they would not say they were without sin.

At this point, you don't seem to be able to discern what I wrote correctly, let alone the scriptures properly. I don't think we can have any rational dialogue.
A final note: We are all born with a SIN NATURE. You have done nothing but bared false witness against me ... must mean your sin nature is working overtime?

Christians do the same things as natural men at times.

Once again the declaration of OSAS sinners.

He that is convinced to sin at times through life, is committed to sin for life.

Because it is become natural to do so, not because of being born with it.

A final note: We are all born with a SIN NATURE.

Until you address the first main point of the entire thread, then your cornerstone lie for continuing in your sins and trespasses is fallen.

You have done nothing but bared false witness against me ... must mean your sin nature is working overtime?

It means your lie is greater than Scripture: you are not correctible.

But, keep it coming. You have added much to the storehouse for future use.

 

[robert derrick]

You are amazing, but not in a good way.



Curious, are you married?

Amazingly brutish.

Women have been struggling with God's order to woman to be under a man's authority, under husband's thumb,

It's really something how the big mouth will always speak of their own condemnation: submission is under the husband's thumb.

This is the long-corrupted version of headship by carnal minded men, that abuse Scripture to keep women 'in their place'.

They love to quote all about man being the head of the woman, even as Christ is head of the church, but they stop there and do not continue with even as God is the head of Christ.

Christ is not under the thumb of God, nor does God want Him to be.

Many Christian marriages end, when the good woman no longer puts up with the failed leadership of a foolish man, who is not only a loser, but also becomes more tyrannical and vengeful of any 'dissent'.

I picture a graceful, gentle and peaceful woman - like Mary, never saying a bad word about anyone, even if she thought it...

I.e. "don't give me no back-talk woman!"

Since this is only his picture, then obviously no such woman is having anything to do with this clown. He is idealizing a godly woman that does not exist: intelligent and submissive to stupid.

Funny how the same guy that is so sloppy with Scripture, to excuse his own sins and trespasses, is also an idealist disciplinarian of Scripture for women.

There are times when the name fits, such as Bruno.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

You are amazing, but not in a good way.



Curious, are you married?

Yes, my words sting sometimes. But hey, the scripture is there. It's always interesting when a scripture dies not conform to your belief system, one tends to nullify it, distort it, or say that is not applicable for today as you did.

I am happily married, to that very woman who I described, a Proverbs 31 woman, so unselfish, a calm peaceful spirit, eho djesn't have a bad word to say about others, a servant to others to the point at which I scold her about it. I tell her to take care of herself first. She seems to put others first all the time and forgets to take care of her own health. She gets up everyday thinking about what she can do for others. It's "love your neighbor as yourself", not "more than yourself" or "Don't love yourself, just love others"! She's not perfect though and neither am I.
To be honest, I am more balanced, leaning on the selfish side and God is working on that. I guess God put js together so I could take care of her since she is busy with others and for her generosity to rub off on me.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

The flesh does not include the soul: the soul is not in the flesh itself

That is where you err.
"Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be kept complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Thes. 5:23
They are all highly integrated ... "we are fearfully made"! However, if the soul were the same as the body or the spirit, this verse would not make sense. Furthermore, if the soul was the same as the spirit they could not be separated. Yet we find that they can be ny the WORD.
"For the word of God is sharper than a two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit ..."
Heb. 4:12
" I say then: Walk in the Spirit and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusts after the Spirit and the Spirit against the flesh and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish."
Galaltians 5:16-17
Wait a minute, if we no longer have the flesh, (as you and 1stCenturyLady presume) how could there be any war going on between the two? And why would it be necessary to warn us about lusting when we are Christians? Because we can be carnal Christians, immature and so.etimes backsliding into our old ways. The Corinthians, Galatians, Romans and all were warned about this behavior we needed to control.

The flesh is the soul, which is the mind, will, emotions, personality - not the body. Where do fleshly desires begin? Your eyes see something or you think of something that you want/lust after. It begins in your mind as thoughts. This is why the Old Self_ after being Born Again_ still has remnance. There are memories of your old ways, desires, lusts, dislikes, hatred, evil thoughts and they resurface. We are no longer slaves to them but must contend with them as Paul did and everyone does. Our spirit is cleansed and sealed, but we still have to control the flesh and it gets easier as we grow spiritually.

The flesh does not include the soul: the soul is not in the flesh itself.

We walk in the flesh of natural bodies, but we are not flesh nor bodies, we are souls.

The Bible reminds us over and over to walk in the Spirit and not in the flesh. If it were automatic at our conversion, the world would see perfect Christians walking around full of love for everyone. Do they? Does everyone who knows you see you as a perfect expression of Christ? Waiting for that answer.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

"The spirit is not flesh, and the flesh is not spirit, neither can one become the other."

Absolutely, I did differentiate the two.

Our spirits do not have 'compartments', unless it is some glass container in the sky, that you people think you are now forever preserved in like so much jam and jelly, while your bodies go on sinning back on earth.

"Spiritual compartment" is a phrase used for the reader to distimguish the location of God within us. As the Most Holy Place was the area in the Old Temple where God dwelded that was separated by a veil, so it is with the New Creature, the Temple of the Holy Spirit is in our Holy Place , separate from our flesh (the "outer court" if your will.

And God doesn't live in the souls of sinners, that are daily made dead by their sins and trespasses

Absolutley.

This is the learned hypocrisy of OSAS: 'unconditionally saved' souls are no longer judged for their sins, because their spirit is 'freed' from the flesh and therefore no more responsible for the deeds of the body. They blame their ongoing sins and trespasses on flesh that has no sin nor trespass in it, and on physical bodies that have no say about it

Isn't that what Paul claimed that, "It is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me." Rom. 7:17.???
Be was speakimg of his present condition. Study the context.
We are conditionally saved, a condition is required is it not? We must believe in JESUS. We are responsible for sins after we become saved - they ha e consequences BUT they aren't sins unto death. We have been freed if thay penalty. For God, it is purely His will, but for us, we must believe it.

You don't make difference between soul and spirit, and the physical body.

Instead you transfer the sins of the soul and spirit to the body, that the soul is unconditionally saved, and the spirit is 'free', while the old man of the physical body still goes on sinning

The Bible says, as I quoted in a previous post, we are made with a spirit, a soul and a body.

OSAS is hippy-dippy 'free spirit' corruption on spiritual steroids.

What does Born again mean to you? What does it mean when you are "sealed" by the Holy Spirit mean? Does He seal some and then unseal them?

Sinful Christians such as yourself do, and the deeds of your father you will continue to do, because you declare it is impossible to do otherwise.

Oh, you are saying that my father is Satan?
Take the plank out of your eye. You have sinned against me several times already. Be careful. The Pharisees accused Jesus miracles coming from Satan. And if what I am saying is truth from the Holy Spirit, you have said it is from Satan.
WE ARE DONE!

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Yes, my words sting sometimes. But hey, the scripture is there. It's always interesting when a scripture dies not conform to your belief system, one tends to nullify it, distort it, or say that is not applicable for today as you did.

I am happily married, to that very woman who I described, a Proverbs 31 woman, so unselfish, a calm peaceful spirit, eho djesn't have a bad word to say about others, a servant to others to the point at which I scold her about it. I tell her to take care of herself first. She seems to put others first all the time and forgets to take care of her own health. She gets up everyday thinking about what she can do for others. It's "love your neighbor as yourself", not "more than yourself" or "Don't love yourself, just love others"! She's not perfect though and neither am I.
To be honest, I am more balanced, leaning on the selfish side and God is working on that. I guess God put js together so I could take care of her since she is busy with others and for her generosity to rub off on me.

Ron, can you hear God's voice? I couldn't for the first 30 years of going to church, until I was filled to overflowing with the fullness of God's Spirit 45 years ago. I still hear Him clearly. He even answers 100% of my prayers, because He first tells me what to pray.

A while ago after I started on the forums I was bullied by men like you and cried out to God if I was sinning (because I would cancel my accounts on multiple forums if I was. I lead my life without willful sin.) He spoke immediately and told me the truth behind Paul's words. A great weight from the bullying was lifted, and it is confirmed that He wouldn't have given me the office of teacher (spoken to me in 2000) if Spirit-filled women could not teach men. If you keep up the bullying, I will have to put you on ignore. God's words to me are more important than yours.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Amazingly brutish.

Women have been struggling with God's order to woman to be under a man's authority, under husband's thumb,

It's really something how the big mouth will always speak of their own condemnation: submission is under the husband's thumb.

This is the long-corrupted version of headship by carnal minded men, that abuse Scripture to keep women 'in their place'.

They love to quote all about man being the head of the woman, even as Christ is head of the church, but they stop there and do not continue with even as God is the head of Christ.

Christ is not under the thumb of God, nor does God want Him to be.

Many Christian marriages end, when the good woman no longer puts up with the failed leadership of a foolish man, who is not only a loser, but also becomes more tyrannical and vengeful of any 'dissent'.

I picture a graceful, gentle and peaceful woman - like Mary, never saying a bad word about anyone, even if she thought it...

I.e. "don't give me no back-talk woman!"

Since this is only his picture, then obviously no such woman is having anything to do with this clown. He is idealizing a godly woman that does not exist: intelligent and submissive to stupid.

Funny how the same guy that is so sloppy with Scripture, to excuse his own sins and trespasses, is also an idealist disciplinarian of Scripture for women.

There are times when the name fits, such as Bruno.

Read what happened to me in #240.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Ron, can you hear God's voice? I couldn't for the first 30 years of going to church, until I was filled to overflowing with the fullness of God's Spirit 45 years ago. I still hear Him clearly. He even answers 100% of my prayers, because He first tells me what to pray.

A while ago after I started on the forums I was bullied by men like you and cried out to God if I was sinning (because I would cancel my accounts on multiple forums if I was. I lead my life without willful sin.) He spoke immediately and told me the truth behind Paul's words. A great weight from the bullying was lifted, and it is confirmed that He wouldn't have given me the office of teacher (spoken to me in 2000) if Spirit-filled women could not teach men. If you keep up the bullying, I will have to put you on ignore. God's words to me are more important than yours.

Not audibly, but, itnis kind of an unction or intuitive suggestion I ought to go this way or to do or not to do something. That is an inner guiding voice, the same one that called me, confirmed me and when I feel His presense, He brings scripture to my remembrance and directs me in assisting others. I can say at times, He takes over the conversation and later I look back and admit, that wasn't me - I usually can't remember anything.
I am not a bully. You just reminded me if a self righteous women's libber. I do believe women should nit preach in the pulpit. I would approve of children's church. So throwing 1 Timothy 2:11-14 at you was not bullying, it's a scripture that many women struggle with. And the way you attacked JM, AND that you struggled for 30 years with male authority is telling. You said you found peace by what, eliminating church ... or just male Pastors?

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Read what happened to me in #240.

That is an expression that my Mom used (a classic feminist from the 70's) because all her life, she rebelled against submitting to a man, " I won't be under a man 's thumb. she'd say!. She left a great guy to try to fulfill her lustful desires with younger men that she could control - but it didn't work. She blew it and could have had a nice life with my Dad and I told her that none of the guys she ever had could shine my Dad's shoes. She was silent. That was her not wanting to be "under a man's thumb" attitude all her life and of those from her ilk. That is not my attitude, my wife isn't under my thumb, it's more like she's riding on my back and I'm carrying her. And that is NOT the attitude that a Christian woman should have either. It isn't a negative thing, to be submissive. I submit to her in tender ways. Men and women have roles to play and we are wired differently - to compliment eachother - God made us that way and has a purpose for us. But bottom line, I'm the boss and Christ is my boss. There is no strict demanding, or an abusive dictatorship, it is a loving imperfect but complimentary relationship that works.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Not audibly, but, itnis kind of an unction or intuitive suggestion I ought to go this way or to do or not to do something. That is an inner guiding voice, the same one that called me, confirmed me and when I feel His presense, He brings scripture to my remembrance and directs me in assisting others. I can say at times, He takes over the conversation and later I look back and admit, that wasn't me - I usually can't remember anything.
I am not a bully. You just reminded me if a self righteous women's libber. I do believe women should nit preach in the pulpit. I would approve of children's church. So throwing 1 Timothy 2:11-14 at you was not bullying, it's a scripture that many women struggle with. And the way you attacked JM, AND that you struggled for 30 years with male authority is telling. You said you found peace by what, eliminating church ... or just male Pastors?

"That I struggled with male authority"? No. Its been in recent years that forum members like you have tried to shove that verse down my throat when it was not a commandment of God, but what Paul, himself, will not permit. Read it again. "I will not permit..." Paul stuck to Jewish customs to not jeopardize the appearance of evil for his beloved brethren. If you can hear God then ask him. He will not tell you something different than He told me. And then maybe you can stop this nonsense with women.

I wasn't going to tell you exactly what God said, but I will now. He said, "I didn't tell him (Paul) that." Those were uninspired words in a private letter to Timothy. And that bit about Eve was also no where else in scripture as a reference to all women. If you remember her sin was unintentional, and that is why they didn't know they were naked immediately following her trespass. But Adam's sin was willful and intentional and in full rebellion against God. THEN they saw their nakedness, hid from God, and Satan took over as the god of this world. Therefore, that confirms that God didn't inspire those words either. Even in 1 Cor. 7 Paul says what are his own words, and what are commandments from God. So Paul does write his own words from time to time. Not very often, thank God, but he was capable of it.

Be careful if you are now going to mock what God told me, because you won't be mocking me, but God.