It is time to give Pretrib a decent burial

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WPM

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The ones left behind of mat 24 and 25 are indeed martyred.
The rapture is the times of Gentiles completed. The ones left behind follow them via martyrdom ,Opening God's attention to the Jew via the gt.
We need to understand the purpose of the gt.
It is the tool to bring the covenant Jew BACK IN.
Note, ONLY THE JEW is protected during the trib.
Ahem...protected via that dreaded removal by God. To possibly petra.


Rev 19
The bride has become the wife in heaven.
How did she get there?
We see the Jew gathered in Rev 14
We see the bride gathered vividly in mat 24 and mat 25.
She got there with the marriage of the Lamb at the consummation in Revelation 19. Revelation 19:7-8: Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready. And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.”

All Premils agree, the marriage here happens at the second coming and involves a wedding.

Revelation 21:2: I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.”

Revelation 21:2 also depicts a wedding. The bride is suitably adorned for her husband on their wedding day. Are their 2 weddings then? If no then this is evidence that Revelation 20-21 is simply a recap of Revelation 17-19. If yes then there must be 2 brides and 2 husbands then? Why would the bride be prepared for her husband again 1,000 years+ after she had done the same at the second coming in Revelation 19? This doesn’t make sense. Premils sees double. They duplicate things. What Revelation places after the millennium Premil force before. They have to invent another new heavens and new earth.

I think you are trying to justify the unjustifiable. There is so much about Premil that duplicates. I have no doubt we are looking at the same event in Revelation 19 and Revelation 21. There is only one elect, one bride, one groom and one marriage. This is classic Pretrib reasoning. Again, Scripture elsewhere shows the new heavens and new earth appearing at the coming of Christ. This is more evidence to prove that Rev 20 is just a recap and the final parallel in Revelation relating to the intra-Advent period.
 

rebuilder 454

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I like that to myself as, we are all on the same path of the Lord. The narrow path. So it's like the Yellow Brick Road. We all walk the Yellow Brick Road, but some are ahead of us and some are behind us on the road. Not a huge deal unless missing the rapture is a concern for you? It is to me. I hope and pray that I be found worthy to escape what is coming upon the earth! So some are ahead of us and some are behind us. This equates to learning in a way. Some are younger Christians in Christ and some have been pressing in for awhile now!

Besides, we're all one body in Christ. So maybe they are of the ankle where others are of the elbow. They have different tasks in their specialty. So how could an ankle understand an elbow. It cant. All one body but got taught the same yet differently at the same time. The same truth, but us humans have trouble seeig the bigger picture.

I fixed the 2nd line of your quote, lol! (Right?)
I report the bible..
They can not debate me honestly.
Accuse us of lying, Antichrist, call us fibers, false prophets, weoponize the Bible in some false goofy character assassination.
Proving they can not debate me.
I post verses
They say I don't.
Then they ask for verses.
Hamster wheel mentality of their utter nothingness. Running in place and decrying " look at me run"
My job is easy.
I have most verses in my spirit.
I simply force them to go against the bible.
Nothing to it.
Their job is to refute verses...not me
They are indeed embarrassed.
Hence the shoddy character exposed.
Very juvenile.
Very shallow.
 
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WPM

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I report the bible..
They can not debate me honestly.
Accuse us of lying, Antichrist, call us fibers, false prophets, weoponize the Bible in some false goofy character assassination.
Proving they can not debate me.
I post verses
They say I don't.
Then they ask for verses.
Hamster wheel mentality of their utter nothingness. Running in place and decrying " look at me run"
My job is easy.
I have most verses in my spirit.
I simply force them to go against the bible.
Nothing to it.
Their job is to refute verses...not me
They are indeed embarrassed.
Hence the shoddy character exposed.
Very juvenile.
Very shallow.
More projection! More lies!
 

rebuilder 454

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Why do insist on lying?

You have not yielded a single scripture that states: "I will pre-trib rapture my elect/saints/church"

Try setting aside your pre-trib rapture belief that NEVER came out of the Mouth of God!

Your argument is from the mouth of the Serpent = twist words, deny the Truth, accuse the opposition

My Lord and Savior says:
“Consider carefully what you hear,” he continued. “With the measure you use, it will be measured to youand even more."
Take a look at davidpt post 1034

Thoughtful
No name calling
Just giving his 2 cents in a normal tone.
Ask him to give you lessons
 

rebuilder 454

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Jesus told his disciples "Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake"

Jesus told His disciples: "And I say to you, My friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do."

His Apostles say: "that no one should be shaken by these afflictions; for you yourselves know that we are appointed to this.
For, in fact, we told you before when we were with you that we would suffer tribulation, just as it happened, and you know."

His Apostles say: "we ourselves boast of you among the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that you endure, which is manifest evidence of the righteous judgment of God, that you may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you also suffer;

Turn away from the lie of pre-trib and turn towards JESUS who never spoke a lie.
Yes
You 100% have an appointment with martyrdom.
It is your prophesy over yourself.
 

The Light

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What is your view of the first 6 seals in relation to trumpet 1 and the other 6 trumpets that follow that?
There is no relation. The first 6 seals happen and then the 7th seal is opened and the trumpets of wrath happen.

Do you think all 6 seals are fulfilled first followed by the fulfilling of the trumpets?

Absolutely. That's why they are numbered. They happen in order.
If you were to place the first 6 trumpets in Matthew 24 somewhere, where would you place them?
The trumpets are not in Matthew 24. The 1st six seals are in Matthew 24.

Here are the 1st four seals.

Matthew 24
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.

7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.

Here is the fifth seal.

Matthew 24
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Here is the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal.

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Jesus returns at the 6th seal for a harvest. All go to heaven for the marriage supper. That is why there is a great multitude in heaven in Revelation 7. Then the 7th seal is opened, and the wrath of God begins. These are the trumpets. After the 6th trumpet is opened the armies of heaven return for Armageddon.

Keeping in mind that Matthew 24:29, for instance, is undeniably involving the 6th seal.
Yes it is.

And that Matthew 24:15-21 appears to be involving the 42 month reign of the beast,
Part of the 42 months is in these verses. The beast continues to reign during the 1-year wrath of God.

and that we already know from Revelation 11 that the 42 month reign of the beast appears to be sometime during the 6th trumpet,
This is not correct. The Day of the Lord, the wrath of God is 1 year long.......12 months. The witnesses come during the tribulation. The tribulation and the wrath of God is 42 months total.

Revelation 11
11 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

the fact the 2Ws are testifying during the 6th trumpet, and it is not until they finish their testimony that the beast that ascends out of the pit then makes war with them and kills them.
The two witnesses testify for 42 months. That means the testify 30 months during the tribulation and 12 months during the first six trumpets of wrath.
 

WPM

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Take a look at davidpt post 1034

Thoughtful
No name calling
Just giving his 2 cents in a normal tone.
Ask him to give you lessons
Look in the mirror. Your nastiness and belittling permeates your arguments. I try to keep to Scripture despite your taunts. Check my posts.
 

WPM

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There is no relation. The first 6 seals happen and then the 7th seal is opened and the trumpets of wrath happen.



Absolutely. That's why they are numbered. They happen in order.

The trumpets are not in Matthew 24. The 1st six seals are in Matthew 24.

Here are the 1st four seals.

Matthew 24
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.

7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.

Here is the fifth seal.

Matthew 24
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Here is the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal.

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Jesus returns at the 6th seal for a harvest. All go to heaven for the marriage supper. That is why there is a great multitude in heaven in Revelation 7. Then the 7th seal is opened, and the wrath of God begins. These are the trumpets. After the 6th trumpet is opened the armies of heaven return for Armageddon.


Yes it is.


Part of the 42 months is in these verses. The beast continues to reign during the 1-year wrath of God.


This is not correct. The Day of the Lord, the wrath of God is 1 year long.......12 months. The witnesses come during the tribulation. The tribulation and the wrath of God is 42 months total.

Revelation 11
11 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.


The two witnesses testify for 42 months. That means the testify 30 months during the tribulation and 12 months during the first six trumpets of wrath.
Not true! The seventh seal is silence in heaven. Read it. Stop adding on to the Bible. The seventh seal is silence in response to the destruction of the world in the sixth seal. Rev 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.”
 

David in NJ

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Do you mean when I said it is a nutty question? I said no offense intended. Geez what more do you want. Your not going to play a victim card on me are you?

Can't men have a conversation without going all emotional like the women do? I dint take a swing at you, I said that seems nutty. So bg s=deal. It does seem nutty to me. DOnt be so thin skinned, geezow Brother.

I didnt address this because I think it's a nutty response (no offense). What many young Christians are failing to realize is that it is not edifying to argue doctrine from a carnal perspective.
Your responses are to the scripture of TRUTH i have been posting for everyone to see and believe.

Calling Hebrews 13:5 "nutty" and "doctrine from a carnal perspective" reeks of carnality!

YES, that is what you are calling the undeniable Scriptural evidence that exposes the lie of "Left-Behind".
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


This is Godly humility in CHRIST:

i will FULLY apologize and REJOICE in TRUTH if you can just find the TRUTH by answering the following with Scripture:

1.) Scripture from any OT Prophet, JESUS or the Apostles that proclaim/prophecy of the Rapture of His Bride BEFORE the Resurrection at His Coming.

2.) Scripture where JESUS proclaims: My elect/saints/bride/church will NOT see the AoD

3.) Scripture where the Apostles proclaim: My elect/saints/bride/church will NOT see the AoD

4.) OT Prophets proclaiming/prophecy of a pre-trib rapture for the saints/elect/congregation BEFORE Tribulation and/or the AoD

5.) NT declaration/prophecy of separating Jew from Gentile in the Body of Christ.

6.) Scripture from any OT Prophet, any of the Apostles and/or the LORD proclaiming His elect/saints/bride/church will NOT suffer tribulation unto death via a pre-trib rapture.
*** with the EXCEPTION of those who will be alive and remaining at His Coming = 1 Thess 4:17**
 
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WPM

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Take a look at davidpt post 1034

Thoughtful
No name calling
Just giving his 2 cents in a normal tone.
Ask him to give you lessons

Yea, right? More projection. Just like you communicate with those who disagree with you:

rebuilder 454

You rode that beast/doctrine that carried you into the desert and I slew it ... Be free and agree with Jesus and His Holy Book.

rebuilder 454 said:

You are sitting there with so much egg on your face you can not see that your house is on fire, but you turn to your air purifier for a ridiculous remedy.

rebuilder 454 said:

Let's calm down and try to remedy your facesmear with all that gooey egg.
We can start with retrieving your needed omissions.

rebuilder 454 said:

You are one miserable individual. Take a break, get some spirit in you and then debate without all the hateful mess.

rebuilder 454 said:

You 100% have an appointment with martyrdom.
It is your prophesy over yourself.

rebuilder 454 said:

You stumble all over yourself because you do not know the bible.

rebuilder 454 said:

(Not that anything from the Bible matters to you. )

This sums up the crude disrespectful and demeaning ad hominem that exemplifies the approach of most Pretribbers here when they notice they have no response to God's Book.
 
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David in NJ

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@MA2444 @rebuilder 454 @The Light

Godly humility in a christian will always yield to the TRUTH of God's words.

Carnality, self, pride and religion will always seek to resist "It is written" to avoid EXPOSURE

We SEE this with Adam & Eve after they believed a lie.
We SEE this with those who opposed Christ and His words.
We SEE this with the persecution of Stephen in Acts chapters 6 and 7


Are you humble enough to answer these 3 simple questions by the Word of the LORD spoken in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18

#1 - What location is JESUS leaving when He comes for the rapture?

#2- Who is HE bringing with Himself?
a.) "the dead in Christ" or
b.) previously raptured saints

#3 - Which occurs FIRST?
a.) the Resurrection or
b.) the Rapture
 
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The Light

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Matt 24:38 = DURING & AFTER the Tribulation and BEFORE the WRATH
Negative. Matthew 24 is before wrath. Noah is in the ark BEFORE the flood. The flood is wrath. Noah enters the ark before both tribulation and wrath. Whereas Lot leave Sodom the day destruction happens. That day destruction happens is the Day of the Lord.

Rev 14:14 = AFTER the Tribulation/Persecution of the saints in Rev ch14 verses 9-13
Yeah. You got one. Yes Jesus comes immediately after the tribulation and before the wrath of God.

FIRST the WARNING: do not take the Mark = Rev ch14 verses 9-11
Yeah. You got another one. Revelation 9-11 happens during the seals and before the wrath of God.

SECOND = the saints are put to death for not taking the Mark = Rev ch14 verses 12-13

Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
Then I heard a voice from heaven saying to me,
“Write: ‘Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on.’ ”
Yeah. You are cooking. This is the Great Tribulation of Matthew 24 and it occurs during the 5th seal.............BEFORE the wrath of God.

THIRD = "AFTER the Tribulation of those days" verse 14 = Then I looked, and behold, a white cloud, and on the cloud sat One like the Son of Man
Yeah. You are really cooking. The is the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24. This is the 6th seal.

After this, the seventh seal is opened, and those trumpets of wrath and the vials of wrath are upon the world.

Revelation 14
19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

We see the same event at the 6th seal.

Revelation 6
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
 

David in NJ

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Negative. Matthew 24 is before wrath. Noah is in the ark BEFORE the flood. The flood is wrath. Noah enters the ark before both tribulation and wrath. Whereas Lot leave Sodom the day destruction happens. That day destruction happens is the Day of the Lord.


Yeah. You got one. Yes Jesus comes immediately after the tribulation and before the wrath of God.


Yeah. You got another one. Revelation 9-11 happens during the seals and before the wrath of God.


Yeah. You are cooking. This is the Great Tribulation of Matthew 24 and it occurs during the 5th seal.............BEFORE the wrath of God.


Yeah. You are really cooking. The is the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24. This is the 6th seal.

After this, the seventh seal is opened, and those trumpets of wrath and the vials of wrath are upon the world.

Revelation 14
19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

We see the same event at the 6th seal.

Revelation 6
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
YES my Brother in CHRIST

We ALL AGREE that we who belong to CHRIST shall NEVER suffer the WRATH of God and the Lamb


"to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead—Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath." - 1 Thess 1:10
 

The Light

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Not true! The seventh seal is silence in heaven. Read it. Stop adding on to the Bible. The seventh seal is silence in response to the destruction of the world in the sixth seal. Rev 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.”
Yeah. I added those trumpets to the Bible. Baloney.

Revelation 22
19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

You are taking away words from the prophecy. You pretend the trumpets do not occur in the 7th seal.

Your doctrine fails so you have to leave out half of the Bible to make it work.
 

David in NJ

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Take a look at davidpt post 1034

Thoughtful
No name calling
Just giving his 2 cents in a normal tone.
Ask him to give you lessons
This is worth MUCH more then 2 cents

“Consider carefully what you hear,” he continued. “With the measure you use, it will be measured to you—and even more."
 

The Light

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YES my Brother in CHRIST

We ALL AGREE that we who belong to CHRIST shall NEVER suffer the WRATH of God and the Lamb


"to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead—Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath." - 1 Thess 1:10
So why do you have the Church still on the earth during the wrath of God? And if we really want the truth, why do you have the Church going through the tribulation?

We can escape ALL THESE THINGS and stand before the Son of man.
 

WPM

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Yeah. I added those trumpets to the Bible. Baloney.

Revelation 22
19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

You are taking away words from the prophecy. You pretend the trumpets do not occur in the 7th seal.

Your doctrine fails so you have to leave out half of the Bible to make it work.

LOL. Just because I disagree with your location of the 7 trumpets, I am taking away from Scripture and leaving half the Bible out. Your arguments are so petty and infantile it is hard to take you serious at times.

As you study the 7 vials and compare them to the 7 trumpets you cannot help but see that they parallel each other. This negates the chronological approach.

Note what is highlighted in blue, and see the parallel.

FIRST TRUMPET - upon the earth

Revelation 8:7-13 says, “The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.”

The wrath poured out in the first trumpet is specifically directed “upon the earth” – or upon the land. The character of the wrath is described as “hail and fire mingled with blood” The consequence of this action is that the “third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.”

FIRST VIAL -
upon the earth

Revelation 16:2-9 says, “And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.”

The first vial is also directed “upon the earth” however our attention is here brought to the consequence for the inhabitants of the land rather than the land itself. It also proves that the mark of the beast is not some last-of-the-last-days phenomenon; it has been around since Cain.

SECOND TRUMPET -
upon the sea

Revelation 8:8-9 says, And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea: and the third part of the sea became blood; And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.”

The wrath poured out in the second trumpet comes in the form of what is described as, “as it were a great mountain burning” which is cast into “the sea.” This event causes the third part of the sea to turn to blood. The consequence being that “the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.” Thus we see that a third part of the fish life is destroyed in this incident. Furthermore, the third part of the ships that were in the sea are destroyed.

SECOND VIAL - upon the sea

Revelation 16:3 says, And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.

The second vial is also poured out upon the sea again causing it to become as blood. However, instead of addressing the creatures in the sea or even the ships upon the sea, this passage looks at the souls (or human beings) in the sea. We learn that, “every living soul died in the sea.” This does not in any way contradict the parallel with the second trumpet as it is worth noting here that animals or fish life don’t have souls.

The result of this catastrophic judgment is that:-

1. Every living soul died in the sea.
2. The third part of the creatures which were in the sea died
3. The third part of the ships were destroyed

I believe there is a clear distinction between all three.

THE THIRD TRUMPET - upon the rivers and fountains of waters

Revelation 8:10-11 says, And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters (the nations) became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.”

The judgment of the third trumpet, in the form of a great star, falls upon “the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters.” We are again reminded that the source from whence this judgment came is “from heaven.”

Wormwood is a poisonous plant of great bitterness which is alluded to from time to time in Scripture. It is a substance that can be drank and is repeatedly given to men as a means of judgment. It is always employed in Scripture in the context of bitterness, sorrow and calamity.

Lamentations3:15 says, “He hath filled me with bitterness, he hath made me drunken with wormwood.”

Jeremiah 23:15 says, “Behold, I will feed them with wormwood, and make them drink the water of gall.”


It is interesting that when this judgment is poured out in the third trumpet it is directed towards the source of mans drinking water - the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters.

Regardless of the symbolic nature of this usage, the consequence of this judgment is that the waters become undrinkable. This passage says that “the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.”

THIRD VIAL - upon the rivers and fountains of waters

Revelation 16:4-7 says, And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood. And I heard the angel of the waters (the nations) say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus. For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy. And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.”

Whilst the third vial confirms that the judgment is directed towards “the rivers and fountains of waters,” the third trumpet details the fact that this judgment poisons “the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters.” The third vial, however, explains how this judgment causes the “the rivers and fountains of waters” to become “blood.” The vial and the trumpet here, in agreement, describe how a large part of the world’s drinking water becomes undrinkable.

Finally, the third vial outlines the reason why the waters are turned to blood, explaining, “For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.”
 
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WPM

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Yeah. I added those trumpets to the Bible. Baloney.

Revelation 22
19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

You are taking away words from the prophecy. You pretend the trumpets do not occur in the 7th seal.

Your doctrine fails so you have to leave out half of the Bible to make it work.
FORTH TRUMPET - upon the sun

Revelation 8:12-13 says, “And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise. And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!”

FOURTH VIAL - upon the sun

Revelation 16:8-9 says, “And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire. And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.”

The forth vial concentrates solely upon the greater light the sun, with its pre-eminent light, describing how God smites it and employs it “to scorch men” with “great heat.” This results in the damned blaspheming “the name of God”

Significantly, the fourth angel, of the fourth trumpet, looks ahead to the impending final three trumpets and cries, “Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!” The worst is still yet to come.

FIFTH TRUMPET - the followers of anti-Christ afflicted with grievous pain

Revelation 9:1-4: “And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power. And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.

Revelation 9:5-11: “And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them. And the shapes of the locusts were like unto horses prepared unto battle; and on their heads were as it were crowns like gold, and their faces were as the faces of men. And they had hair as the hair of women, and their teeth were as the teeth of lions. And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle. And they had tails like unto scorpions, and there were stings in their tails: and their power was to hurt men five months. And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.”

FIFTH VIAL - the followers of anti-Christ afflicted with grievous pain

Revelation 16:10-11 says, “And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast (the anti-Christ system of this world - intra-Advent); and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain, And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.”

SIXTH TRUMPET
– a catastrophic final battle emanating from that great river Euphrates

Revelation 9:14-21: “Saying to the sixth angel which had the trumpet, Loose the four angels which are bound in the great river Euphrates. And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men. And the number of the army of the horsemen were two hundred thousand thousand: and I heard the number of them. And thus I saw the horses in the vision, and them that sat on them, having breastplates of fire, and of jacinth, and brimstone: and the heads of the horses were as the heads of lions; and out of their mouths issued fire and smoke and brimstone. By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths. For their power is in their mouth, and in their tails: for their tails were like unto serpents, and had heads, and with them they do hurt. And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk: Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.”

Here we see modern day armoury described in 1st century language. How else would even the most meticulous of disciples describe a modern day tank or a modern day battlefield. How else could he express to early believers a future scene which was amazing to his eyes.

The casualty list is unprecedented in modern day warfare when the “third part of men” are slain.

SIXTH VIAL – a catastrophic final battle

Revelation 16:12-16 says, “And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared. And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of [1] the dragon, (Satan) and out of the mouth of [2] the beast, and out of the mouth of [3] the false prophet. For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty."

The reading finishes with an admonition to the reader, saying, “Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.”

Whilst it would be possible to surmise that the beast (the anti-Christ system of this world - intra-Advent ) is ‘all those who belong to the devil’, Revelation 20 seems to disprove that possibility as the beast (the anti-Christ system of this world - intra-Advent ) precedes (verse 10) all those who are not found within the book of life (verse 20).
 
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