It is very clear to me that you have nothing to teach me. You have been taught wrong and now you're trying to teach others that same false doctrine you have been taught.
I'm fully aware of that and that isn't what I was saying. The concept of trib saints is not taught in scripture. You try to create separate groups that belong to Christ, but scripture never does. We (believers in Christ) are all one in Christ Jesus (Galatians 3:26-29).
It does not say "THE great tribulation" in the original Greek (no Greek word for "the" is there). It's referring to great tribulation that all believers go through.
Acts 14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that
we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.
That's not trib saints, that's Christians who are in the church. All Christians for the past almost 2,000 years have needed to endure and keep their faith. The beast is not just an entity that appears for a short time near the end of the age. John said "the beast was" before he wrote the book (Rev 17:8). It "is not" in some sense at the time he wrote the book, but one of it's heads "is" at the time he wrote the book. That means the beast was around, but its power was restrained. Many Christians have been persecuted for a long time now, so what that passage describes is nothing new.
2 Timothy 3:12 Yea, and
all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
What is the point of referencing this verse? None of these verses support the false idea of "trib saints". Saints have been going through tribulation for almost 2,000 years now, so all who are in the church are "trib saints".
There is no such thing as "trib saints" apart from the church. That is completely imaginary dispensational nonsense.
You need to learn how to interpret scripture. Your words mean nothing to me if they can't be supported by scripture. And they can't.
Since when does God not want those in the church to be tried and tested?
Revelation 2:8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive; 9
I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan. 10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold,
the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.
The people in the church in Smyrna would have laughed at the idea of a pre-trib rapture. I guarantee that. Jesus told them to be faithful unto death and He would give them a crown of life. That is what Jesus says to all of us. But, you think you will be taken off of the earth instead of having to be faithful unto death. That is a doctrine of demons because it promotes the fear of persecution and tribulation and can cause you to not be prepared to stand up for your faith if you are persecuted.
What does 1 Thess 4:14 mean when it talks about "them also which sleep in Jesus" being with Him when He comes? Do you believe in soul sleep or something? Is that why you are not addressing what I'm saying about them being the souls of the dead in Christ who will be with Him when He comes?
No, it does not. It refers to the earth's atmosphere. What evidence do you have to support that it refers to heaven? If it referred to heaven, then why didn't Paul just say we will meet Him in heaven? Any other time he spoke of heaven he referred to it as....heaven.
The Greek word translated as "the air" in 1 Thess 4:17 is "aēr" and it never means heaven in scripture.
View attachment 50669
I'm sorry you have to deal with that, but you are doing nothing to prove me wrong about anything. You're not addressing who it is that will be with Jesus when He comes, as 1 Thess 4:14 alludes to. That verse is talking about those who will be with Him before the dead in Christ are resurrected and before they (the resurrected dead in Christ), along with those who are alive and remain, are caught up together to meet the Lord in the air.
