Is Any Denomination Saved?

[BreadOfLife]

I would say 99% of RCC doctrine is unscriptural and counting.

And a person as ignorant as yourself would have a HECK of a time trying to prove that . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Lol, that's exactly what it says.

Uh huh - but this is what YOU sad:
"The Pope is the head of the church and has the authority of Christ (CCC 2034)"

That's NOT what the Catechism says in paragraph 2034.

 

[BreadOfLife]

No, it claims Christ's disciples had his authority, not any church. He didn't give that authority to the pope.

WRONG.
Christ's Apostles were the LEADERS of His Church.

The verses I gave you illustrate that Sacred Tradition is ON PAR with Scripture.
Paul, writing to the Thessalonians under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit states this EXPLICITLY:

2 Thess 2:15
"Stand firm and hold fast to the Traditions you were taught, EITHER by an ORAL STATEMENT - OR by a letter from us."

Oh, by the way - there is NO expiration date on 2 Thess. 2:15 . . .

 

[Truther]

And a person as ignorant as yourself would have a HECK of a time trying to prove that . . .

Roman Catholics are the easiest to disprove.

Just quote scriptures at them and they are instantly wrong.

They even deny the Bible is the word of God in their defense.

 

[Truther]

What does the verse say, Einstein??

1 Thess. 4:17
After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

Honestly - sometimes I wonder how you grew up in this world with such abject ignorance . . .

What I am saying is Roman Catholics do not get the Holy Ghost with tongues as evidence.

If they do, they bolt out of there eventually.

The Pope does not recommend tongues, just tongue lashings.

 

[BreadOfLife]

You are way too insulting to bother with. If you grow up and want a civil discussion, I'm game.

Funny how you call me "insulting" - when YOU are the one who posted these references from the Catechism so dishonestly by paraphrasing them with your anti-Catholic slant.
I had to correct you one EACH one.

Question: Why couldn't you just post them as they are written in the Catechism?
Answer: Because you are dishonest.

Your hypocrisy is astounding . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Roman Catholics are the easiest to disprove.
Just quote scriptures at them and they are instantly wrong.
They even deny the Bible is the word of God in their defense.

Then WHY haven't you been able to do this yet??

Just asking . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

What I am saying is Roman Catholics do not get the Holy Ghost with tongues as evidence.
If they do, they bolt out of there eventually.
The Pope does not recommend tongues, just tongue lashings.

Sooooo, if a person doesn't speak in tongues - they DON'T have the Holy Spirit?
Is that what you're saying??

 

[Truther]

Sooooo, if a person doesn't speak in tongues - they DON'T have the Holy Spirit?
Is that what you're saying??

The evidence of having the Holy Ghost is found here....


45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

46 For they heard them speak with tongues, .....



...which the RCC thinks is unnecessary.

 

[BreadOfLife]

He will come to judge His House first before the coming great tribulation.

1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? 18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? 19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

I apply verse 19 to the promise that He will keep the souls of His unrepentant saints left behind to suffer the fire coming on the earth and the coming great tribulation as a result.

Here is one judgment on the church in getting left behind for not repenting from spiritual fornication in the Book of Revelations.

Revelation 2:18 And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass; 19 I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first. 20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. 21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. 24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden. 25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.

So that is why the pre great tribulation rapture will happen first; to judge the House of God for the Bridegroom to receive the abiding bride of Christ to the Marriage Supper above in Heaven and to cast away those not found abiding in Him to resurrect later on after the great tribulation.

Any saint that dies left behind, their spirit is with the Lord because they were saved by believing in the Lord Jesus Christ & that God raised Him from the dead after all.

2 Corinthians 5:6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

Thank you for that verbose diatribe - but you have FAILED once again to show me where this "Pre-Trib Rapture" is mentioned ANYWHERE in relation to the coming tribulations.
This is all just YOUR take one it . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

The evidence of having the Holy Ghost is found here....

45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

46 For they heard them speak with tongues, .....
...which the RCC thinks is unnecessary.

That's what I thought you'd say.
Time for another Bible lesson, Einstein . . .

1 Cor. 12:27-31
Now you are the body of Christ and individually members of it. And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, helping, administrating, and various kinds of tongues. Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all possess gifts of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret? But earnestly desire the higher gifts.

Tongues is ONE of the Spiritual gifts.
It is not the ONLY gift of the Spirit - and is not the ONLY evidence of it.

Your lack of Biblical knowledge is an embarrassment . . .

 

[Renniks]

Li

Funny how you call me "insulting" - when YOU are the one who posted these references from the Catechism so dishonestly by paraphrasing them with your anti-Catholic slant.
I had to correct you one EACH one.

Question: Why couldn't you just post them as they are written in the Catechism?
Answer: Because you are dishonest.

Your hypocrisy is astounding . . .

Like I said, constantly insulting, but no substance to your argument.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Li
Like I said, constantly insulting, but no substance to your argument.

I gave you PLENTY of substance back in post #291.
If you find my exposing of your LIES to be "insulting" - why don't you find your LIES to be "insulting"??

Here it is again for your review . . .

Infallibility of the Catholic Church (CCC 2035)

The BIBLE makes this clear: Matt. 16:18-19, Matt. 18:16-18, Luke 10:16, John 16:12-15, John 20:21-23

Only the Roman Catholic Church has authority to interpret Scripture (CCC 100)

That’s NOT what it says.
It says:

100 The task of interpreting the Word of God authentically has been entrusted solely to the Magisterium of the Church, that is, to the Pope and to the bishops in communion with him.

The Pope is the head of the church and has the authority of Christ (CCC 2034)

That‘s NOT what it says.
It says:

2034 The Roman Pontiff and the bishops are "authentic teachers, that is, teachers endowed with the authority of Christ, who preach the faith to the people entrusted to them, the faith to be believed and put into practice." The ordinary and universal Magisterium of the Pope and the bishops in communion with him teach the faithful the truth to believe, the charity to practice, the beatitude to hope for.

The Roman Catholic Church is necessary for salvation (CCC 846)

That’s NOT what it says.
It says:

846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers? Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:


THEN, it goes on to say . . .

847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:
Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.

Sacred Tradition equal to scripture (CCC 82)

The BIBLE makes this claim: Luke 10:16, 2 Thess. 3:6, 2 Tim. 2:2, 1 Cor. 11:2

Do you see a pattern here??
Your claims are totally DISHONEST because you not only RE-WORDED the teachings – you failed to list the corresponding Scripture verses.

So much for your FALSE claim that the Catholic Church is “90%” Tradition . . .

 

[Enow]

Thank you for that verbose diatribe - but you have FAILED once again to show me where this "Pre-Trib Rapture" is mentioned ANYWHERE in relation to the coming tribulations.
This is all just YOUR take one it . . .

Well, if you are not leaning on Jesus Christ to help you see the truth in His words, but the Catholic Church, go check with them then.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Well, if you are not leaning on Jesus Christ to help you see the truth in His words, but the Catholic Church, go check with them then.

Thank you for once again showing that you do NOT know Christ.
Time for another Bible lesson . . .

- Jesus established ONE Church (Matt. 16:16-19). He prayed fervently that this Church remain ONE - as He and the Father are ONE (John 17:20-23). There is NO other.

- Jesus is Truth itself (John 14:6).

- Jesus promised His Church that the Holy Spirit would guide her to ALL Truth (John 16:12-15).

- The Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).

- The Church is the Body of Christ and He is the Head (1 Cor. 12:12-31, Eph. 4:3-6, Col. 1:8).

- The Church is the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).

- Jesus identifies His very SELF with His Church (Acts 9:4-5).

- Jesus gave the Church supreme Authority on earth and whatever it ordains on earth is also ordained in heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, 18:15-18, Luke 10:16, John 20:21-23).


It’s not Christ OR the Church.
Jesus Christ and His Church are inseparable.

 

[Renniks]

That’s NOT what it says.
It says:

100 The task of interpreting the Word of God authentically has been entrusted solely to the Magisterium of the Church, that is, to the Pope and to the bishops in communion with him.

Same exact thing.

 

[Renniks]

That’s NOT what it says.
It says:

846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers? Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:


THEN, it goes on to say . . .

847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:
Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation

Which means what? That the Catholic church is necessary for salvation. I did not say they had to be members of the church to be saved.
You said: "all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:"
This is speaking of the Catholic church, so it's saying all salvation comes through the Catholic church. Total nonsense, of course, Christ isn't limited to working through any particular church.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Same exact thing.

WRONG.

First of all - there is no "Roman" Catholic Church.
"Roman" simply refers to a Liturgical Rite - of which there are some TWENTY that comprise the Catholic Church.
Among these Rites are the Byzantine, Roman/Latin, Melkite, Maronite, Ruthenian, etc.

The official name of the Catholic Church is . . . . "The Catholic Church."

 

[BreadOfLife]

Which means what? That the Catholic church is necessary for salvation. I did not say they had to be members of the church to be saved.
You said: "all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:"
This is speaking of the Catholic church, so it's saying all salvation comes through the Catholic church. Total nonsense, of course, Christ isn't limited to working through any particular church.

And YOU erroneously stated:
"The Roman Catholic Church is necessary for salvation (CCC 846)"

As I educated you before - there is no "Roman" Catholic Church.
Furthermore - salvation comes FROM Christ - but it comes THROUGH His Church, which has Supreme earthly Authority (Matt. 16:18-19,Matt. 18:15-18, Luke 10:16, John 16:12-15, John 20:21-23).

 

[Enow]

Thank you for once again showing that you do NOT know Christ.
Time for another Bible lesson . . .

- Jesus established ONE Church (Matt. 16:16-19). He prayed fervently that this Church remain ONE - as He and the Father are ONE (John 17:20-23). There is NO other.

- Jesus is Truth itself (John 14:6).

- Jesus promised His Church that the Holy Spirit would guide her to ALL Truth (John 16:12-15).

- The Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth (1 Tim. 3:15).

- The Church is the Body of Christ and He is the Head (1 Cor. 12:12-31, Eph. 4:3-6, Col. 1:8).

- The Church is the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).

- Jesus identifies His very SELF with His Church (Acts 9:4-5).

- Jesus gave the Church supreme Authority on earth and whatever it ordains on earth is also ordained in heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, 18:15-18, Luke 10:16, John 20:21-23).


It’s not Christ OR the Church.
Jesus Christ and His Church are inseparable.

And yet Jesus is called the Savior, not the Church by Peter.