Here is why, as an Adventist, I believe America is in Trouble.

[David in NJ]

Need to read your Bible my brother...
Revelation 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

i have always stated this: "If you love Me keep MY commandments".

"His commandments" is not the old covenant.

"His commandments" are found in the Gospel and the Apostles Letters.

Thus Christ never once established the 4th commandment under the law EXCEPT as it pertains to Him/Gospel.
This TRUTH was and is the Edification of the Book of Hebrews.

Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it.
For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them,
not being mixed with faith in those who heard it.
For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said:

“So I swore in My wrath,
‘They shall not enter My rest,’ ”

 

[Ziggy]

Paul says faith ("substance & evidence") in God is the means by which we're saved - not by works.

James says true faith - "living faith" - is demonstrated by keeping the Law of Liberty - Ten Commandments.

John says living faith is demonstrated by obedience, and those who claim living faith but don't obey are liars.

Can you see how James, John, and Paul are on the same page ? If no, then why not?

Obedience.
Do you love God with all your heart mind and soul?
Do you worship Idols?
Do you take the name of the Lord your God in vain?
Do you keep HIS Sabbath?
Do you honour your parents and respect them?
Do you kill people even in your heart to hate someone without a cause?
Do you steal?
Do you lie about people?
Do you commit adultery even in your heart to lust after someone?
Do you desire any one else's things for your own?

Me too.
But I don't need a law to tell me to do them.
Once upon a time, when I was a child, my parents taught me that these things were wrong.
We didn't keep the Sabbath or any other day for that matter.
And did I always do the right thing? Umm NO, and I would get punished for it. But no one stoned me to death.

Since I was a child, I been studying the bible and listenig to Jesus and reading the letters that Jesus told Paul to write.
And during those years those "lessons" , became engraved in my heart and mind.
I simply don't do bad things. There's a lot of times I think about it, but I quickly check myself and replace it with the right thing to do.

We're all a work in progress.

You seem stuck on the 4th commandment even though Jesus himself did not give us a commandment to do so.
He said we need to abide in Him. We need to keep him and HIS commandments, the same way He kept His Father's commandments.
The Father said we are to Listen to the Son. So Jesus' commandments are greater than the Father's.
Not because their easier, in fact they are harder.
No longer is it only about the flesh and it's sins. Now it's about your very thoughts and what's in your heart before ever performing such deeds in the flesh.


You have to change the inner man. The outer man is already dead. You washed it away in baptism.
Were you baptised?
I been sprinkled and dunked.
But that's still only on the outside. The true baptism is done on the inside when one dies to self and picks up that cross and follows Jesus.
You are no longer your own self, You belong to Jesus. And it is HIS commandments we are told to obey.
And not only HIS commandments but His testimony as well. The Gospel truth of the ressurection to those who put their faith in him.


You can't see this yet. Your still under the schoolmaster.
What you don't realize is that once you accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour, you no longer needed the schoolteacher according to the law. You have the very Spirit of Christ in you teaching you and leading you into all truth.
Your trust in the law of Moses won't save you.
Your trust in your Lord and Savior will.
Listen to His words. Follow Him.
That's what the Father told us to do.
So if you want to obey God's commandments then do what Jesus says and follow Him.

Your going to have to decide at some point if your going to listen to the Father and follow Jesus,
or if your going to listen to Jesus and follow Jesus.
Either way, you already know the difference between good and evil. You don't need the law to tell you what you already know.

I don't have anything more to say on the matter.
I have shown you what is written in the Gospel.
It is your own choice to remain under the law.
I can't persuade you, but perhaps someday Jesus will open your eyes and your ears and you will see and hear the truth.

You are FREE from the law of condemnation.
If you do something wrong you will get stoned to death. That doesn't exist anymore.
We don't kill people for lying or stealing or even committing adultery.

Unless you've obeyed the law to the letter and been out stoning people who don't keep the Sabbath?
If your not stoning them to death then you make the law a lie.

Think about that.

But what does Jesus say?
Father, FORGIVE them for they know not what they do.

The time of condemnation is over for those who have FAITH in the Lord.
The time of condemnation remains for those who trust the law instead of Faith in the Lord.

Where is your faith man?

Trust Jesus.
He loves you and gave his life for you, so that wherever he is you can with him 24/7/365 and beyond.
Don't let this promise pass you by. Grab on to it, cling to it.. because it is your very life.

Much Love
Hugs

 

[Phoneman777]

God Won = when HE sent His Son to carry our "burdens(sins)" to the Cross along with the oc law.

All i did/do is follow the TRUTH where it leads us to = MESISIAH

The Messiah SDAs follow says, "If ye love Me, keep My commandments"....does yours?

Others are not satisfied with His Righteousness and attempt to add to the Finished Work of God.

The Ten Comms are only "grievous" to those who say they love Jesus, but actually hate Him and love sin.

Every false doctrine/teaching seeks to do three things:
a.) Bring into question every word of God
b.) Alter God's words, ever so slightly, in order to substantiate the error they are promoting
c.) replace and/or diminish or ADD to the Finished Work of God

d.) allow those who love sin to cling to sin and salvation at the same time.

Example: Romans 10:3 NIV
For they do not understand God’s way of making people right with himself.
Refusing to accept God’s way, they cling to their own way of getting right with God by trying to keep the law.

Bro, we've told you many times our position is that obedience cannot obtain salvation, but is merely the evidence it's been obtained by grace through faith, as taught by Paul, James, John, etc.

If it weren't for Strawman arguments, you'd have no arguments at all.

 

[Brakelite]

God did not "reverse" the 7th day = HE FULFILLED it as it was all about Him from the Beginning

Therefore a New Covenant and a New Law that is only Fulfilled in Christ.

When we obey the LORD Jesus Christ, we fulfill the Law of Christ = no old law remains

All that remains is Christ and His commandments = If you love Me keep My commandments

There is no saturday sabbath commandment from the LORD or the Apostles.

As a matter of FACT, under Christ any day of the week is for gathering in His Name for fellowship and worship.
There no longer remains any commandment to saturday rest in the Gospel.

Colossians 2:16-19
So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ. Let no one cheat you of your reward, taking delight in false humility and worship of angels, intruding into those things which he has not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, and not holding fast to the Head, from whom all the body, nourished and knit together by joints and ligaments, grows with the increase that is from God.

Where is the "shake ones head in despair" emoji when you need it.

 

[Phoneman777]

Obedience.
Do you love God with all your heart mind and soul?
Do you worship Idols?
Do you take the name of the Lord your God in vain?
Do you keep HIS Sabbath?
Do you honour your parents and respect them?
Do you kill people even in your heart to hate someone without a cause?
Do you steal?
Do you lie about people?
Do you commit adultery even in your heart to lust after someone?
Do you desire any one else's things for your own?

Me too.
But I don't need a law to tell me to do them.
Once upon a time, when I was a child, my parents taught me that these things were wrong.
We didn't keep the Sabbath or any other day for that matter.
And did I always do the right thing? Umm NO, and I would get punished for it. But no one stoned me to death.

Since I was a child, I been studying the bible and listenig to Jesus and reading the letters that Jesus told Paul to write.
And during those years those "lessons" , became engraved in my heart and mind.
I simply don't do bad things. There's a lot of times I think about it, but I quickly check myself and replace it with the right thing to do.

We're all a work in progress.

You seem stuck on the 4th commandment even though Jesus himself did not give us a commandment to do so.
He said we need to abide in Him. We need to keep him and HIS commandments, the same way He kept His Father's commandments.
The Father said we are to Listen to the Son. So Jesus' commandments are greater than the Father's.
Not because their easier, in fact they are harder.
No longer is it only about the flesh and it's sins. Now it's about your very thoughts and what's in your heart before ever performing such deeds in the flesh.


You have to change the inner man. The outer man is already dead. You washed it away in baptism.
Were you baptised?
I been sprinkled and dunked.
But that's still only on the outside. The true baptism is done on the inside when one dies to self and picks up that cross and follows Jesus.
You are no longer your own self, You belong to Jesus. And it is HIS commandments we are told to obey.
And not only HIS commandments but His testimony as well. The Gospel truth of the ressurection to those who put their faith in him.


You can't see this yet. Your still under the schoolmaster.
What you don't realize is that once you accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour, you no longer needed the schoolteacher according to the law. You have the very Spirit of Christ in you teaching you and leading you into all truth.
Your trust in the law of Moses won't save you.
Your trust in your Lord and Savior will.
Listen to His words. Follow Him.
That's what the Father told us to do.
So if you want to obey God's commandments then do what Jesus says and follow Him.

Your going to have to decide at some point if your going to listen to the Father and follow Jesus,
or if your going to listen to Jesus and follow Jesus.
Either way, you already know the difference between good and evil. You don't need the law to tell you what you already know.

I don't have anything more to say on the matter.
I have shown you what is written in the Gospel.
It is your own choice to remain under the law.
I can't persuade you, but perhaps someday Jesus will open your eyes and your ears and you will see and hear the truth.

You are FREE from the law of condemnation.
If you do something wrong you will get stoned to death. That doesn't exist anymore.
We don't kill people for lying or stealing or even committing adultery.

Unless you've obeyed the law to the letter and been out stoning people who don't keep the Sabbath?
If your not stoning them to death then you make the law a lie.

Think about that.

But what does Jesus say?
Father, FORGIVE them for they know not what they do.

The time of condemnation is over for those who have FAITH in the Lord.
The time of condemnation remains for those who trust the law instead of Faith in the Lord.

Where is your faith man?

Trust Jesus.
He loves you and gave his life for you, so that wherever he is you can with him 24/7/365 and beyond.
Don't let this promise pass you by. Grab on to it, cling to it.. because it is your very life.

Much Love
Hugs

"Love is the fulfilling of the law."

How can we say we love God or our neighbor if we are breaking any of the first four or the last six?

 

[David in NJ]

Where is the "shake ones head in despair" emoji when you need it.

Simple FIX = Post the scripture where the Lord/Gospel declared we are to continue under the Mosaic law.

 

[David in NJ]

"Love is the fulfilling of the law."

How can we say we love God or our neighbor if we are breaking any of the first four or the last six?

Because you cannot love MESSIAH and keep the old covenant.

 

[Phoneman777]

Where is the "shake ones head in despair" emoji when you need it.

I keep picturing an angry child with both hands covering his ears. Have you ever seen such stubborn use of strawman argument due to inability to answer the actual argument of one's opposition?

 

[David in NJ]

@Brakelite @Phoneman777

This is a Grade school level grammar test.

What is the meaning of Romans 10:4 ?

"For Christ is the end of the law, to bring righteousness to everyone who believes."

 

[Phoneman777]

Simple FIX = Post the scripture where the Lord/Gospel declared we are to continue under the Mosaic law.

You've been shown many times from Scripture the Ten Commandments are not Mosaic - they existed before Moses and continue beyond the Cross for all eternity.

Let's lay aside the warm fuzzies and bulldookey and get the the heart of the matter:

The reason you refuse to publicly declare Christians are free to break the Ten Commandments is because you know deep down you don't believe that - but your unwillingness to repent from breaking the Sabbath commandment leaves you no choice but to manufacture false ideas to justify your rebellion...exactly what Satan did in heaven.

 

[David in NJ]

You've been shown many times from Scripture the Ten Commandments are not Mosaic - they existed before Moses and continue beyond the Cross for all eternity.

Let's lay aside the warm fuzzies and bulldookey and get the the heart of the matter:

The reason you refuse to publicly declare Christians are free to break the Ten Commandments is because you know deep down you don't believe that - but your unwillingness to repent from breaking the Sabbath commandment leaves you no choice but to manufacture false ideas to justify your rebellion...exactly what Satan did in heaven.

+lol x10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

 

[Phoneman777]

@Brakelite @Phoneman777

This is a Grade school level grammar test.

What is the meaning of Romans 10:4 ?

"For Christ is the end of the law, to bring righteousness to everyone who believes."

You've already been shown that "end" doesn't mean "no longer exist" - it means "purpose".

The purpose of the law is to show us our need for Christ - just as "the end of the Lord" concerning Job was to show Satan the "patience of Job" in remaining faithful.

Will you stop falsely using the word "end" now that you've been shown the truth? Not likely. The same spirit of rebellion that resides in you is seen in leftist college students who find themselves confronted with unanswerable arguments but stubbornly refuse to change their minds.

 

[David in NJ]

@Brakelite @Phoneman777

This is a Grade school level grammar test.

Q1.- What is the meaning of Romans 10:4 ?

"For Christ is the end of the law, to bring righteousness to everyone who believes."

Q2.- Where in the Gospel did the Lord command us to keep the 4th commandment?

Q3 - Where did the Apostles instruct the Church to keep the saturday observance?

 

[David in NJ]

@Brakelite @Phoneman777

This Question is a little harder then the other 3.

In Galatians 3:23-25, where are we instructed to keep the law?

before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed.
Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

 

[Phoneman777]

+lol x10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

Where I'm from, a real man steps up when he's been challenged and shakes hands when he's beaten - while cowardly boys mock in their own defense.

Again, I challenge you to publicly declare the Christian is free to disregard the Ten Commandments.

 

[David in NJ]

Where I'm from, a real man steps up when he's been challenged and shakes hands when he's beaten - while cowardly boys mock in their own defense.

Again, I challenge you to publicly declare the Christian is free to disregard the Ten Commandments.

This was even BETTER then before - lol x100

 

[David in NJ]

Where I'm from, a real man steps up when he's been challenged and shakes hands when he's beaten - while cowardly boys mock in their own defense.

Again, I challenge you to publicly declare the Christian is free to disregard the Ten Commandments.

JESUS never reiterated the 4th commandment because HE is the FULFILLMENT of it.
This is why HE never commanded it in the Gospel but rather HE defied it and said: IAM LORD of the Sabbath
This is why HE so eagerly worked on the sabbath = "My Father works and now I WORK"

When JESUS said "IT IS FINISHED" He completed the Work of the Law and Ended it for all who will believe on Him.
All TEN Commandments are TRUTH and they ALL were placed inside the Ark of the Covenant = UNDER the Mercy Seat.

Our commandments are those which Christ commanded us in the Gospel and by the Apostles.

It is a 'no-brainer' that the Ten commandments are to be kept - but not under the old covenant = SEE Jeremiah 31:31

Please read(again) the Gospel, then Acts, Hebrews, Romans, Galatians, Ephesians

 

[Phoneman777]

@Brakelite @Phoneman777

This is a Grade school level grammar test.

Q1.- What is the meaning of Romans 10:4 ?

"For Christ is the end ("purpose") of the law" - dictionary much?

Q2.- Where in the Gospel did the Lord command us to keep the 4th commandment?

"If ye love Me, keep MY commandments" - the Ten Commandments are the "commandments of Christ" given on Mount Sinai by the pre-incarnate Christ, as any scholar worth his salt will testify.

He also said Christians were to pray that their escape not be necessary on the Sabbath, which means He expected us to be observing it decades into the future.

Q3 - Where did the Apostles instruct the Church to keep the saturday observance?

They instructed by example - there are many many instances of Christians continuing to keep the Sabbath in the NT and not a single instance of Sunday keeping.

You keep asking questions, and when we answer them, you don't address the answers. Do you not care that your refusal to do so only serves to further diminish credibility in what you claim?

 

[Phoneman777]

This was even BETTER then before - lol x100

C'mon, Dave, we publicly declare God requires those who are saved to live according to the Ten Commandments - why won't you publicly declare we're free to break them? The public is waiting...

 

[Brakelite]

I keep picturing an angry child with both hands covering his ears. Have you ever seen such stubborn use of strawman argument due to inability to answer the actual argument of one's opposition?

The arguments being used by Dave, big troll, are getting more and more desperate, and in that desperation, more and more extreme and nonsensical. I simply cannot believe that they could, in a week's time, explain even to themselves why they used them and said some of the things they said .
Neither of them can focus on any given point. Most posts they offer in response, don't have diddly squat to do with the topic.
I chose 'brakelite' as a user name, because I want people to react the same to my posts as they would if they were on the freeway and 50 yards ahead, the car in front displayed it's brake-lights. But the people here are doing everything except what you would expect.
A. Slow down.
B. Consider the options, because seriously, its a life and death situation.
C. Respond accordingly. Either U-turn, deviation, continue with caution.

But everyone here is just shooting from the hip, and not actually engaging in discussion. Just driving straight through traffic regardless the warning signals, and weaving in every direction possible to avoid engaging in the actual potential crisis ahead. Here's an example... Another straw man...

Simple FIX = Post the scripture where the Lord/Gospel declared we are to continue under the Mosaic law.