Why do you make assumptions about what I believe.
From experience those who stress personal revelation over the bible end up believing error.
Our final authority is always the bible.
Hearing the Lord, and pride vs humility
- Thread starter Karl Peters
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From experience those who stress personal revelation over the bible end up believing error.
Our final authority is always the bible.
No, the bible is where we start.
God is the final authority. He must be because man has translated the Bible from a foreign language and has induced many errors by word choices and punctuation.
Then, since so many do not understand the Hebrew culture at the time of the original writings, some things make so sense to us. We get confused. We don't know what life in a Patriarchy is like, we have no concept of the time it took for the written letters to circulate around the Mediterranean and be available. We don't know what life is those churches were like.
We don't understand the cultural influence of the New Covenant and the associated changes made by it.
I think the most difficult issue is the time that we don't devote to searching, not only the scriptures, but the understandings of the things we don't know.
When faced with those issues, I await God to give me the truth, and when He does; it becomes not only a belief but also a conviction.
We must diligently search for truth, and the Bible is the primary resource, not the only one.
You are so right... and today maybe most people are following the teachers rather than learning by the Holy Spirit, I think people are not taught to "ASK GOD" haha so they depend their knowledge by what heard from a teacher. The foundation we do have and should start with are to me the words in red in the gospels. Christ will as He said bring them to your remembrance. I tell people to start with the book of John for many reasons.
The above is actually a correct and very wise statement - but only if you understand that Jesus is the Word of God and He is a person, even the Son of God and the KING OF KINGS AND LORD OR LORDS, whom His Father place on the throne over all things!!
Sadly a religious spirit has people looking to the things of God instead of The Word of God (Jesus Christ) and listening to Him, via His Holy Spirit.
So we see a "replacement theory", in the clear sense that people replace Jesus Christ with the Scriptures! Which is to say they make an idol out of their Bible.
And we see that when people write that reading the "The Word" is hearing from Him.
You can read a book of your favorite author all you want and never know him. In the same way you can read the Bible, which has many words that are from The Word of God (the Christ), and never know Him!! Simply because everyone knows that reading is not hearing!! Yet that tricky snake (Satan) has be deceiving people from long ago to know, simply by telling them, "Did God really say?" And by telling them, "You can be like God".
So they eat of the Bible (spiritually speaking) and think that they reading of it has made them like God. And then concluded that they don't actually need Jesus Christ and His understanding. Thus they say in their hearts, "Let not God speak to us!", and fall into the delusional state of thinking that Jesus has either died or is in some far-off place called heaven, so that they can reason in themselves that they don't and can't actually speak back and forth with Him.
So then they have to say the Bible is The Word of God and reading it is hearing Jesus Christ, so they are saved by reading the Bible and the reading the Bible is somehow believing in Jesus Christ, and also that reading the Bible means they know Him!
It is a twisted, nonsensical conclusion that snake who twists and turns logic, lead them to. They have gotten wrapped up in the logic of that lying snake, like a person might get wrapped in the coils of a large snake. And the words of that snake with now come out their own mouth are like the words of a viper. They are poison to all bitten by their logic. They are like John the Baptist said, "But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming for baptism, he said to them, “You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?" (Mat 3:7)
And what should be more terrifying to the was that the Word or God Himself (Jesus Christ) said:
Mat 23:27-33 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead men’s bones and all uncleanness.
“So you, too, outwardly appear righteous to men, but inwardly you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.
“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous,
and say, ‘If we had been living in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’
“So you testify against yourselves, that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets.
“Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers.
“You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?
And so we see that they are not following Jesus Christ and listening to Him by their own testimony:
The Teacher, Jesus Christ, will speak to your via His Holy Spirit to your spirit, about every page of the Bible, but the reading the Bible is not hearing His voice!! Most of the words in the Bible are not His words!! He asked people to write them, to be sure, but even above we reading how John the Baptist called those religious leaders who were promoting themselves instead of the Christ as the Word of God, vipers!! He almost certainly heard the Holy Spirit of the Lord also call them vipers, and we know Jesus did and said only what His Father told Him, and He confirmed what John the Baptist said. But the words were spoken by John the Baptist and recorder in the Bible, then confirm by Jesus Christ, The Word of God.
So we know that John the Baptist heard from the Lord, but the Pharisees did not! And there is nothing new under the sun!!!
People - don't believe the vipers!!! Jesus Christ is the Word of God, because He owns the words of God, and the Holy Spirit gets His words from Him and brings them to your spirit, so that the Word of God we preach is near us - and is found in our mouth and hearts - so not "on every page of the Bible" - like that snake would like you to believe!! God did say, and He is still saying Today!!
So
Heb 3: 8,9 Therefore, just as the Holy Spirit says,
“TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE,
DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS AS WHEN THEY PROVOKED ME,
AS IN THE DAY OF TRIAL IN THE WILDERNESS,
If anyone does not know Jesus Christ personally - meaning you do not have personal conversations with Him - meaning talking back and forth with Him personally - there is GOOD NEWS for you!! You too can get to personally know, meaning talking back and forth with Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit!! In fact that is what He wants - a personal relationship with you!!
So He had Isaiah write:
Is 1:2 Listen, O heavens, and hear, O earth; For the LORD speaks,
and
Is 1:10 Hear the word of the LORD,
You rulers of Sodom;
Give ear to the instruction of our God,
You people of Gomorrah.
and Isaiah even gave you some words directly from Him:
Is 1:18 “Come now, and let us reason together,”
Says the LORD,
“Though your sins are as scarlet,
They will be as white as snow;
Though they are red like crimson,
They will be like wool.
and do you not read that when Isaiah directly quoted the Lord he himself put in 'Says the LORD', so that you would know what the Word of God says to us personally, as opposed to the instruction Isaiah is passing on in his words, per the Lord.
so "Is 1:2 Listen, O heavens, and hear, O earth; For the LORD speaks," is obviously Isaiah's words because he did not quote the Lord by writing "Say the LORD", there but he is telling you to listen and hear for the Lord speaks!! That is what Isaish knew, because he heard from the Lord personally!! And that is what I am telling you, for the same reason.
And so again the Good News is that you too can get to know Him personally!!
Rev 3:19,20 ‘Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent.
‘Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.
Those verses above are good for "anyone", but how will those vipers be able to receive that information?
"“You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell? (Mat 23:33)
The answer to that question is in Rev 3:19,20 - but will they repent of their sins, be zealous for Him instead of their Bible, and so repent of their ways, and then hear His voice and open up to Him??
It seems that would be impossible - but He tells me to write because all things are possible to Him. Perhaps they will repent and seek Him instead of leaning on their own understanding??????????????????????
Behold
Well-Known Member
Jesus is indeed the Word.... John 1
IN Human form, as found in John 1:10, Hes the same.
I think of The Holy Bible, the Scriptures, as "Spiritual Dictation".. .The Holy Spirit dictated it to the Men who wrote it down.
Can you catch the Vision...... of God's hand Holding the "HOLY BIBLE"...... as His Arm Extends out of a Golden Heaven to offer His word to the Human Race?
The word of God, is not a Book.. .tho its shaped like a book and has words... in it.
Its really so much more.
Its Light.
Its Food
Its a Map to Heaven
Its Revelation
Its Spiritual
Its Truth
Its the Container of the word of God.
Jesus, who is in all the Born again, is also in the BIBLE.
God, who is in all the Born again, is also in the Bible.
So, when you Study the bible, you are studying THEM, and they will show you that this is true., the more """ you study to show yourself approved UNTO GOD""". As Paul Teaches.
The first words the Lord told me personally were "READ YOUR BIBLE", but in doing so I found it written:
Rev 1:17When I saw Him, I fell at His feet like a dead man. And He placed His right hand on me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last,
Rev 22:13 “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end.”
So according to the Bible, which you are putting your faith in as opposed to Jesus Chrsit, you are wrong!!!
The all Scriptures are good for study and reproof, but will you accept reproof found in the Scriptures?
Will you even turn to Jesus Christ, because He reproves those He loves, and actually listen to Him??
Did you not even notice in my testimony, the Word of God spoke to me telling me to reading the Bible before my reading of the Bible. So the Lord came first!! But if you are reading the Bible and not listening to Him, you need be born again first!! And if born again you will hear the sound of the wind (The Holy Spirit of God bringing His words to your spirit). Then you will know that the One who first told me "Read Your Bible" was not the Bible but the Lord who gives us instructions and teachings, and reproof!!
Have you not even read:
Gal 3:22 But the Scripture has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.
So are you sin now under sin, that you think the promise by faith is the Scriptures?
Did you not even read how the whole world cannot contain Him? So you think He is in your Bible?? Amazingly.
The Word of God (Jesus is near us) at all times!! So we go to the grocery store and talk to Him about what to buy. We go to work and get advise on what to do. We can hear Him anytime and in anyplace, and even down to when to turn to the right or to the left! Or did you not read:
Is 30:20,21 Although the Lord has given you bread of privation and water of oppression, He, your Teacher will no longer hide Himself, but your eyes will behold your Teacher. Your ears will hear a word behind you, “This is the way, walk in it,” whenever you turn to the right or to the left.
But would you even listen to Him if He was standing there speaking to you at all times?? Or are you still saying in your heart that He is not hear you, after all I have explained and proven to you via the very Bible you think is God.
Paul had this same type discussion, because he wanted to help them
Rom 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and my prayer to God for them is for their salvation.
They don't even understand that desire that God has to help them!!! They think I am out to deceive them, but that has been done already. Like Paul, I am out to help them by actually turning them to Jesus Christ, and not just in name but Him in person! He is not their Bible, He is supposed to be their Lord who they hear from, but they are unwilling to believe in Him, that He is near them and He is even found in their mouths and hearts at time, because He is just standing their trying to speak to them. But their pride from listening to that snake how got them questioning, "did God really say" so that they don't believe that He said something to them even when He does. So they don't seek the Christ but the Bible as a replacement for Him!! So sad, so very sad. But the Lord is still standing their for them, but a day of reconning will come to those who don't believe in Him!!
They should have believed what was written, because it was written to lead them to Him!!
Rom 10: 4 -8For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge.
For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.
For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
For Moses writes that the man who practices the righteousness which is based on law shall live by that righteousness.
For I testify about them that they have a zeal for God, but not in accordance with knowledge.
For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.
But the righteousness based on faith speaks as follows: “DO NOT SAY IN YOUR HEART, ‘WHO WILL ASCEND INTO HEAVEN?’ (that is, to bring Christ down),
or ‘WHO WILL DESCEND INTO THE ABYSS?’ (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).”
But what does it say? “THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART”—that is, the word of faith which we are preaching,
Maybe it is not too late? But how many times have I written an explained. It is time for me to move on with the Lord this day.
Behold
Well-Known Member
God is in every Holy Bible, on every Holy Page.
That you dont understand this, is what is "amazing".
God told us to ""Study the word""", and its found in every Holy bible.
Start anytime you like @Karl Peters
The bible does not become the word of God, it is the word of God.
All messages, voices, visions etc are subject to scripture.
You can test this, ask your guide to confirm that his messages are to be checked against scripture.
If the message is from God you will get immediate confirmation with no quibbling or half messages.
Anything else is coming from the devil.
All messages, voices, visions etc are subject to scripture.
You can test this, ask your guide to confirm that his messages are to be checked against scripture.
If the message is from God you will get immediate confirmation with no quibbling or half messages.
Anything else is coming from the devil.
Your response simply shows that you have placed all your faith in a translation of scripture and ignore the original context.
Before the last 30 years, man had very few resources to study scripture. Because of that, many bodies of believers divided and warred between themselves. The lies about the contents of scripture began during the first century A.D. and grew worse as time went on. Many will not bother to "search the scriptures" in context which requires a dedication to finding truth.
Translators amended scripture with poor word selection and punctuation. Before them scribes placed notes and additions to scripture that became "the text."
But, an amazing thing still exists. For the one who has the capacity, it is possible to let scripture validate the context of passages. The downside of that happens when we then let our individual brand of logic determine which passages have been altered. I know of so few people who will bother to go to that degree in their search. Our spirits are too weak.
In a Christianity which is based on false translations, our self-righteousness will cause more division. We will accuse brothers and sisters while closing our minds to any suggestions that we may not know truth. Our human nature will not be squelched so that we can consider things said by others.
When that happens, we are no longer a discussion board because we become a war front.
I think this is a process it doesn't happen with the start of your walk. You start in the red text the gospels and get led by word searches from the Lord to the OT and further searching as I have done lots even into reading gnostic texts and all sorts of things. That is all a process of growing and desiring more truth from the Lord, and came for me when I asked the Lord the question. It is not how you begin to follow the Lord. To me you are explaining growing further in knowledge. I don't think all that is necessary for salvation do you? God is simple to me, your ways sounds difficult, but are things done by those who have walked for years with the Lord and have more questions of the Lord..
Well, Cyd, from the day we are justified, we are to work on becoming sanctified. If we fail to do that, then we fail to follow Christ in our lives. Searching for truth is important. It can be done if one seriously spends time in the entirety of scripture, but we all have minds that function differently. Each of us must choose the way we need to do that.
While there are those who think that salvation is a one-time done deal like buying fire insurance, they will be surprised in the end. (Some churches imply that to be the case.) None of us want to hear "depart from me, I never knew you."
In my honest opinion, if God is simple to me, then I have not invested my life according to his commands. If I remain ignorant of His commands, I may sin while believing that He is smiling at me because I am being like a little child who simply believes but never grows - so I never know the truth. That is entirely possible because the only things I know are what someone else told me. If man "knew the truth," we would not have denominations.
My faith and trust are in God and His Son, not in the studies of man.
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I believe Jesus said his sheep hear his voice. It's often a still small internal voice for me but its not me. I have be still and listen by faith.
It's beautiful to hear both correction and affirmation from God. And it does take humility to take time alone to do this.
It's beautiful to hear both correction and affirmation from God. And it does take humility to take time alone to do this.
How silly?
There are words from Satan in the Bible - So Satan's words are now the Word of God???
Jesus however is the Word of God - that is in fact His name according to the Bible:
Rev 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.
So the book you are calling 'the word of God' is calling Jesus Christ the Word of God - therefore the 'word of God' saying you are wrong (if you want to call the Bible the 'word of God' is proving you wrong!
And more incredibly, Jesus is recorded as calling the first five books in the Bible is the writings of Moses!
Jn 5:46“For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me, for he wrote about Me.
And further more Jesus makes a difference between His words and the writings of Moses!
Jn 5:47 “But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?”
And the way Jesus makes that difference refers to how if people do not believe the writings of Moses, then questions how you will believe His words!! That obviously points to a conclusion that if you are calling the Bible the word of God then you probably are not believing in Him speaking!!!
And if we check Jn 5 out, that seems to be an further explanation of what Jesus had said that, as recorded earlier in Jn 5:
Jn 5:39,40 “You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.
So there seems to be a connection between people searching the Scriptures for eternal life, as opposed to coming to Him, and them thinking the sacred writings are His words as opposed to crediting the writers, like Moses, with writing them and their writings being their words, not His words!!
So those people claiming the Bible is the Word of God, are those same people who are not listening to Him like they should!!
And that is incredibly silly!!!
A book does not talk to you, so reading a book is not hearing from the author of the book and even the books in the Bible, though we know they were inspired by God, are still the writings of those who wrote them - and that according to Jesus Christ, as recorded in the Bible - so according to the Sacred writings!!
So the Sacred Writings are good for study and reproof, but if you don't believe they are correct, then you are not going to except the reproof they have, and the reproof mainly comes down to a reproof about us not listening to Him by faith!!!
All that brings up the question Paul had:
Gal 3:2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
Christians are His sheep, and we hear His voice, and that through His Holy Spirit speaking to our spirit! If you are indeed born again, then you hear the sound of the wind - which is NOT reading the words in the Bible!! It is what we know and often refer to as that small voice, because we pick it up in our hearts, not from our reading, and sometimes we also realize that His words are found coming out our mouth, because what is on the heart tends to come out the mouth.
So if a person is writing that the Bible is the word of God, as opposed to Jesus Christ, then that is what is in their spirit, and we should know that the Holy Spirit is proclaiming that Jesus Christ is Lord, not the Bible, but Jesus Christ! So even the writing:
"bible does not become the word of God, it is the word of God." like "Windmill Charge" is saying the Bible is their lord (their idol) and that they do not actually know Jesus Christ, personally!! If they knew Him, they would know that they are the temple of God where He abides, so not the bible but us, is His dwelling place. Or did we never read about this? That the Word of God we preach is near us, even found in our mouth and heart.
Of course the real way we know that Jesus Christ is the Word, is to actually believe in Him, that He never leaves us, that He talks to us personally, so that we listen to Him everyday called Today!! And that is the case we have heard words from The Word of God every single day!!
The most common thing I hear from Him is, "Karl, I love you." There have been days I have heard Him tell me that a dozen times. He will tell you when to do what, and even down which way to turn. The believer should know this, right!
Is 30:21 Your ears will hear a word behind you, “This is the way, walk in it,” whenever you turn to the right or to the left.
So a person can read it, but only the person hearing the Lord, as their Lord, can understand it!! What Isaiah wrote he meant - and Isaiah wrote, "Your ears will hear a word behind you, “This is the way, walk in it,” whenever you turn to the right or to the left.", because that was the way it was with Isaiah!! Isaiah was hearing the Teacher and the Teacher, who has always been the Christ, had been telling Isaiah when to turn to the left of the right, even on the day Isaiah wrote what he wrote!
If you had believed what Isaiah had written, and has been preserved and recorded in our American language to today, then you would have believed in Jesus Christ and would know that He will even guide you as to when to turn to the right or to the left, but as it is too many are saying that Bible is the word of God to them, as opposed to Jesus Christ!!
Jesus Christ used to take me on yard sales on Saturday morning to get me used to Him telling me when to turn to the right or to the left. Later He put me in a Christian healing ministry for five years, and expected me to listen to Him for not only when to turn to the right or to the left, but as to how to minister what and when, so the people might get healing!
Ex 15:26 and said, “If you diligently heed the voice of the LORD your God and do what is right in His sight, give ear to His commandments and keep all His statutes, I will put none of the diseases on you which I have brought on the Egyptians. For I am the LORD who heals you.”
But like the Pharisees and Sadducees that Jesus spoke to:
Jn 5:38 “You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent.
You are putting your faith in you understanding of the Scriptures, as the word of God, instead of believing in Jesus Christ and coming to Him, like the Scriptures tells us to do!! What an incredible mistake!! That is religion, not a relationship with Him. Large is that door and many are trying to get to heaven via religion - but you have to know Him as the door, and few find Him!!
YES, YES, YES!!
THIS IS SO RIGHT!!
If we are proud, we are not going to seek Him, but just go along thinking we don't need Him!
WE won't take the time we have to hear what He has to say to us via the "small internal voice" of His.
Now if anyone is worried about, or thinking that He won't have you read the Bible, well that is simply wrong. He is the Teacher, and the Bible is like a textbook He uses! But He also created all things, so He will talk to you about all things, and not just the Bible. Yet if anyone is thinking that they have the textbook, so they don't need to take the class that includes the Teacher, they are wrong. That will not get them to heaven! You must know the Lord, and that means you must know about that "still small internal voice", because Jesus Christ is the Word of God we preach because He speaks to us in our heart, and sometimes we find His words in our mouth because what is in the heart comes our the mouth.
His sheep, like Wynona, know this because they personally know Him!!
I will not this though: While it is far easier to hear Him when we are still and listen by faith, it is still possible to hear from Him even when we are not still nor in a quite place. It is not as easy, but it is still written that if we seek we will find. So we should also practice hearing from Him in the busy and noisy places. It get easier the more we practice. Just FYI!
Nice post Wynona!
If everyone knew Him like you it would be a much better place that we live in!
You say that is a mistake, yet it is scripture that tells us about Jesus, it is scripture under the guidance of the spirit that instructs us.
You also are not willing to do what you instruct others to do.
To pray about your ' voice ' and its submission to scripture.
Relaying on unstabstanciated vissions, messages a d feelings is a sure way of being deceived
Is it really the Scriptures or Jesus that tell us about Jesus?
The fact is that the Scriptures are meant to give us the wisdom that can lead us to Jesus!!
2 Tim 3:15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus
and if you do find Him, you find out that He is the Teacher!!
Mt 3:28 “But do not be called Rabbi; for One is your Teacher, and you are all brothers.
And if He is the One Teacher, and we are all brothers and sister in Him, then who is to use the Scriptures for reproof, correction, and training in righteousness?? Is it not the Teacher???
2 Tim 3:16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;
So the purpose for the Scriptures is to lead us to the Teacher, and then be taught by Him!!!!
Jn 6:45 “It is written in the prophets, ‘AND THEY SHALL ALL BE TAUGHT OF GOD.' Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father, comes to Me.
But if we don't listen to the Teacher we are not being taught of God!!!!!!!!!!!
So we don't " To pray about your ' voice ' and its submission to scripture." - instead we listen to His voice and summit to Him, as our Teacher Lord, and even King!!!
The problem with saying " submission to scripture" is a problem I have been discussing here!! It is the problem of substituting Jesus Christ with the Scriptures, as your lord!!! That is not a problem those who wrote the Scriptures, per the Lord, had!!
So this is why it is written:
2 Tim 4:1-3 I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom: preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with [great patience and instruction.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires,
What happens then - is that people turn from preaching Jesus Christ as the Word, to making the Scriptures an idol by calling them The Word of God, and they then try and learn from each other and from leaning on their own understanding, instead of listening to the Lord's voice So they write things like "To pray about your ' voice ' and its submission to scripture."!!!
That is sooooooooooo wrong, it is in fact discussed in the next verse:
2 Tim 4:4 and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths.
Did you not read that Jesus Christ is the Truth!! And did we not read that we are commanded to listen to Him!! And are not His sheep supposed to follow Him, and that by following His voice!!!
Now, I have seen that 'Windmill Charge' does at times hear from the Lord via the small voice, but then she writes " To pray about your ' voice ' and its submission to scripture."- thus making it about a person voice and not His voice, and about submitting to the writings as opposed to submitting to Him!! How does that happen???
Luke 7:24 When the messengers of John had left, He began to speak to the crowds about John, “What did you go out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken by the wind?
What happens in our lives is that the devil comes in at times and causes us to not believe in Jesus Christ, just like it happen to John the Baptist which was the greatest born of women.
Mat 11:11 “Truly I say to you, among those born of women there has not arisen anyone greater than John the Baptist! Yet the one who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
John one day was telling everyone about Jesus and how he was not worthy to tie His shoes and the next day he is asking if Jesus was the One!! Isn't that why ''Windmill Charge' change from discussing about hearing the voice of the Lord's to discussing about submitting to the Scriptures instead of submitting to the Lord who speaks!!
She forgot the command:
Luke 9:35 Then a voice came out of the cloud, saying, “This is My Son, My Chosen One; listen to Him!”
She went from hearing by faith to leaning on her own understanding of the Scripture - and that because she is blowing in the wind - no surprise - it happens to the best of us!
Gal 3:2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
Hearing the Spirit by faith is not reading the Sacred writings!! It does not take faith to read the Bible, it does take faith that the Lord is there to speak to you to actually seeking His voice and hear from Him. And that snake of old, since he is around and a concern, says "Did God really say" - which is nothing but getting us to doubt that God is there to hear from. So it was out of doubt, that Windmill Charge wrote "Relaying on unstabstanciated vissions, messages a d feelings is a sure way of being deceived" The Lord is not "unstabstanciated" or even unsubstantiated!! He is there, and that is a fact but who will believe that - and stop getting blown around in the wind???
I have been talking back and forth with Him for well over 20 years now, and while He is wierd and sometimes (even often) the devil tries to come in with the doubt by saying, "Did God really say", in one way or another. The fact is that He does say - He is there to speak to me and you!! So I preach the Word of God and that to mean Him!!! That is His name, "The Word of God"!! He is called that because we believers do indeed hear from Him on that day called "Today"!!! He is not a feeling!!! He is not a vision!! And He does have a voice, that small voice we pick up in our hearts and more often even in our mouth, if we are not paying attention like we should!!!
And that devil, that says "Did God really say", or "Relaying on unstabstanciated vissions, messages a d feelings is a sure way of being deceived" - which is the same thing, can and will go back to where he belongs!! The Holy Spirit says Jesus Christ is Lord!! So who told you that we are relying on "Relaying on unstabstanciated vissions, messages a d feelings is a sure way of being deceived" - and that so that you would go back to leaning on your own understanding!!!
Didn't the Holy Spirit ever tell you "We don't use the Lord to preach the Scriptures. We use the Scriptures to preach the Lord!"
So who told you to "submission to scripture"???
The Holy Spirit tells you "To pray about your ' voice ' and its submission to scripture."?? It was not the Holy Spirit!! Because He tells you to hear the Lord or God Jesus Christ and submit to Him as Lord!!!
In your thinking I was deceived you got deceived!! You should have made it about hearing Him by faith instead of leaning on your understanding of the Scriptures!! Then what you say will match up with the Scriptures, because He is still the same Today, that day we are to hear from Him!!
And "Windmill Charge" did you not even see how many Scriptures I use to preach Him??? I am doing as asked!! I use the Scriptures to preach the Word of God - who is Jesus Christ!! And He is a person that we can and do hear from!! And if we practice hearing from Him, we can even hear from Him any place where we go and at any time, and not only in the quite place! We hear Him in words!! not just some feeling or vision also!! Yet it is written that some are dull of hearing!
Heb 5:11 Concerning him we have much to say, and it is hard to explain, since you have become dull of hearing.
This should not be difficult to explain, but if you are dull of hearing, so that you think hearing from Him is "unstabstanciated vissions, messages a d feelings", then you need to practice hearing from Him more!! That is not preaching the "Word" of God!!! And so you are in need of reproof!! So I do it with great patience - as told and as written!
again - 2 Tim 4:2 "preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction."
That is what's happening here!! I am preaching the word "in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction" That is what He told me to do!!!
To me, this is so sad!!
Spyder is looking to the Scriptures, and is saying in his heart that Jesus the Christ is either dead or in a far away place called heaven so people (meaning himself) cannot possibly hear from Him Today!!
That is the reason people write things like: "In a Christianity which is based on false translations, our self-righteousness will cause more division. "
True Christianity is based upon hearing the Lord and following Him!! Enoch walked with God, and that without any Scriptures being written. Adam and Eve did not have Scriptures, yet they decided to listen to that snake instead of God and cause a fall. So following the Christ (through whom all things were created) was never about a "translation", or about writings!!! It was always about listening to the One True God and doing what He asks of us.
So why were the Sacred Writings written?? Do you not know??
There were written because people did not listen to Him!! Yet Spyder concludes it is about having the correct translation! He makes no sense at all!!! If a person was of any nation and they truly sought God could not they find Him? He does exists!! Yet if a person studies all translations, he will not find Him if He does not believe in Him!!! Their translation because their god in whom they have placed their hope!!
As for Christianity we have a large variety of translation. Indeed, the Bible has been translated in most every tongue, and all of them tell the person of whatever language, to seek Jesus Christ and listen to Him!!
Regularly the Lord sets up divine appointments between me and a group with their own New Word translation of the Bible. And when I talk to them they want to tell me about Jesus Christ, so I start by simply asking them what they have heard from Him Today? And it turns out that none of them who I have talked to has ever heard from Him, personally!! And even their version of the Bible tells them to listen to Him, as does the better versions that exist Today. So neither they nor those posting about the problem with translations, hear from Him.
The translations of the Bible are not the problem, out rebellious attitude toward God has always been the problem!!
God is omni-present - so what excuse do you have for not seeking Him and listening to Him?
Why have you not gotten to know Him????
Have you not read :
Mat 7:23 “And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'
Well - whether you have or have not, it will not do you any good unless you really came to know Him!!!!
If you have come to know Him then you will have been talking back and forth with Him, but if you haven't your translation will not save you!!
And if you are writing about whether the translation is correct or not, you are looking to the translation instead of Him!!! So you don't know Him!! You should have believed what was written, and sought Him and His voice!!
Jn 5:46,47 “For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me, for he wrote about Me.
“But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?”
Moses was clear enough, no matter what translation you have of his writings. Did not Moses say "Hear, O Israel"? So did you keep that command and hear the Lord? And did not Moses explain that the word was near you, so why did you make it about the translation instead of seek the word which is found in your mouth and heart?
Is your translation so poor as to not have something like:
Deut 30: 19,20 “I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live, you and your descendants, by loving the LORD your God, by obeying His voice, and by holding fast to Him; for this is your life and the length of your days, that you may live in the land which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them.”
And yet the heaven and earth witnesses against those who do not "obey His voice", because they don't even seek His voice and listen, just like Moses wrote! They don't hold fast to Him, but to a translation. So, they will not ever live in the land which the Lord has promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
Never-the-less, the command has also gone out to preach the Word of God, which is the name of Jesus Christ. But to avoid listening to Him, they have now called their translation by His name, because they is where they have placed their faith!!
Rev 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.
Gen 15:1 After these things the word of the LORD came to Abram in a vision, saying,...
Gen 15: 4 Then behold, the word of the LORD came to him, saying,
Gen 15:6 Then he believed in the LORD; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness.
So without the Scriptures Abram heard from the word of the Lord and believed, but with a number of translation so many people will not hear and believe in Him!!! So He never knew them!! So He will tell them I never knew you and - "DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'
That is your unfounded accusation. You do not seem to understand that you quote scripture as authorities in one sentanc3 and the next are calling it an idol.
No doubt you claim to have a balance between reading and believing and idol worship.
Strange how you assume no-one else is not aware of it.
You still refuse to test your voice, vision or what ever.
You have completely missed what I wrote, and then made unfounded accusations. I suspect that you may not be aware of the history of how the scriptures in our language came to be and why we must examine them with the resources available. It is in small communities of believers that we discuss and discern; finally asking God for truth. If any petition to Yahweh for truth is not answered for me, it simply becomes a sticky note until I get the answer. Those things that are validated are etched in my granite tablet.
The "sacred writings" which we have available are true, and Yahweh through His Son can settle any disagreements between the Son's followers. The thing that is truly sad is that the follower's have not trusted God to validate our views about what was written. We, instead, choose man who professes to know, and THAT is why we have denominations.
My Yeshua is alive and well; serving as the mediator between His Father and I.
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