Fear God or Presume acceptance

[mjrhealth]

David was lost for at least 9 months until his son was born. David was only a man after God's own heart in his repentance; not his sin.

You missed it all, so busy trying to be a good child, David was a man after Gods own heart because HE want Perfect and understood who God was. HE was what God desires us to be, but christians need to boast.

 

[mjrhealth]

The Bible is against sin from cover to cover, and it is also an astonishing religious book in that it shows the frailties and failures of people that are of that faith. The first lie in the Bible is the lie that you can sin and not die spiritually. Why should the devil change a lie that people will so easily accept? How is it that that first lie and deception still runs rampant and is believed more than what God says about it?

But one must strain to 1 Jn. 1:8 to defend the devil and their sin. It is dealing with Gnosticism and Gnostics within the church that John is writing to. Verse 7 already states that Jesus Christ cleanses from ALL sin. How much sin is left if ALL is already cleansed? In verse 9, says if we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us ours sins, and to cleanse us from ALL unrighteousness. John's rhetoric by using "we" is to a mixed group, and in no way says that John or his Christian part of his audience ever said that they never sinned or had any sin to be cleansed of; but the Gnostics believed that! John no more is saying that Christians sin in verse 8 than he says in verse 9 where he uses "we", that their are Christians and he himself have never confessed their sins , had them forgiven and cleansed.

Take a step back to verse 7. The opposite is inevitable.... if you do not walk in the light as He (Jesus) is in the light, you do not have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son does not [present tense] cleanse you!

The apostle John writes in his First Epistle, “My little children, these things I write unto you, that ye sin not.” (Gk, a singular act of sin.) (2:1). “And if any man sin” (not “when”). (2:1).., “He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.” (2:4). “He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.” (2:10). “Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.” (3:6). “He that committeth sin is of the devil.” (3: 8). “Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin;” (3:9). Notice that this does not speak of maturity, advanced sanctification, education, etc., it speaks of the grace to not sin occurring at the New-Birth. “Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.” (3:7). “For whatsoever is born of God overcommeth the world: and this is the victory that overcommeth the world, even our faith.” (5:4). “We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and the wicked one toucheth him not.” (5:18). “If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth.” (1:6). John says point blank that sinning, or walking in the darkness was incompatible with being a Christian. The same writer of 1 Jn. 1:8 could not say all the things he said against sin and not be the most self-contradictory writer in the Bible. But if we observe that First Chapter attacks the Gnostic beliefs, it is easy to avoid such contradiction and wrench 1 Jn. 1:8 out of its context to promote what the Bible everywhere says is not so.

The meager 4-5 twisted Scriptures that are thrown around as if they were the Gospel that defy every other passage in the Bible concerning sin, is why the Church is failing. God is against sin. The wages if sin is death. Jesus came to save His people from their sins, not in their sins.

The misapplied passages that people use to excuse their sin and still be a Christian reminds me of the story of when W.C. Fields was in the hospital a friend stopped by to see him. He was shocked to see W.C. Fields reading a Bible. Seeing the expression on his friends face he said, "I'm looking for loopholes!"

You still dont get it at all, in fact it sound like another, too much bible and very little Jesus. Always get Him so wrong.

All that nonsense ended with Christ, that bit that christians are still trying to finish, as if the works of Christ was never enough for them.

And Jesus said

Mat_19:14 But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

but so little child like faith in Christians, it is our faith that pleases God, will HE find any when HE comes,

HE certainly gets a lot of this

Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

 

[Candidus]

You missed it all, so busy trying to be a good child, David was a man after Gods own heart because HE want Perfect and understood who God was. HE was what God desires us to be, but christians need to boast.

Salvation by a better education, special Gnosis... that's not Bible!

 

[Candidus]

You still dont get it at all, in fact it sound like another, too much bible and very little Jesus. Always get Him so wrong.

All that nonsense ended with Christ, that bit that christians are still trying to finish, as if the works of Christ was never enough for them.

And Jesus said

Mat_19:14 But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

but so little child like faith in Christians, it is our faith that pleases God, will HE find any when HE comes,

HE certainly gets a lot of this

Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

You can squawk the name of Jesus over and over to defend living in sin, but such a Jesus is what Paul calls "another Jesus" that is not the One that is in the Bible. It's not so much that Christians are trying to finish, but that it is clear in Scripture that God is trying to finish His will in the believer. Coming to Christ, believing and being regenerated is the Beginning of the road, not the end of it. The Scripture know nothing of a past tense Christianity that does not involve continuing in the faith, and perfecting holiness in the fear of the Lord.

 

[mjrhealth]

Salvation by a better education, special Gnosis... that's not Bible!

What are you on about, have you not read,

Joh 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
Joh 5:40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
Joh 5:41 I receive not honour from men.

do you know why He gets no honour, because mankind stole His name, the Word of God and gave it to the bible, because man kind forever glorify the bible, because men put the bible first before Him, so He gets no Honour.

Gal_1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

God doesnt need the bible men do. They wont listen to God yet they claim to know Him like this bit

Act_17:23 For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you.

Pride is a terrible sin, when "christians" cant even admit there fallibility lest they be found out by men, but God is out judge.

 

[mjrhealth]

You can squawk the name of Jesus over and over to defend living in sin, but such a Jesus is what Paul calls "another Jesus" that is not the One that is in the Bible. It's not that Christians are trying to finish, but that it is clear in Scripture that God is trying to finish His will in the believer. Coming to Christ, believing and being regenerated is the Beginning of the road, not the end of it.

Whose defending living in sin, im just stating plain facts, you cant even admit the truth, is it so shamefull

Rom_9:33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

I am not ashamed, and HE knows all my faults. Nothing to hide like some.

 

[Episkopos]

Whose defending living in sin, im just stating plain facts, you cant even admit the truth, is it so shamefull

Rom_9:33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

I am not ashamed, and HE knows all my faults. Nothing to hide like some.

Alright....but the verse you quoted has to do with a future judgment (Bema) whereby believers will be separated into they who are to honour and they who are to dishonour...and to what degree.

They who are not set for dishonour are they who don't stumble over Christ and the truth. They are not offended by Him. The carnal mind is definitely set against the truth and there is a scandal there that God would expect perfection from us. Many refuse to believe this.

 

[mjrhealth]

Alright....but the verse you quoted has to do with a future judgment (Bema) whereby believers will be separated into they who are to honour and they who are to dishonour...and to what degree.

But you see you too missed the point, for many thats already happened, you know that bit about God resisting the proud

Jas 4:5 Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?
Jas_4:6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

so few will humble themselves, so many need to be approved of by men and that is there downfall.

 

[Episkopos]

But you see you too missed the point, for many thats already happened, you know that bit about God resisting the proud

Jas 4:5 Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?
Jas_4:6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

so few will humble themselves, so many need to be approved of by men and that is there downfall.

..and many also have approved themselves based on their own understanding. These have made their own assurance based on their reading of the bible...and have no sense of reality or truth. In their mind they see themselves as justified. But these lack real humility and the fear of the Lord.

But, yes, approval is of God alone and they whom He approves He also empowers to walk as Jesus walked.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You are half correct: God changes the sinner into the saint, God works holiness in the believer. You out of one side of your mouth that God is the Cause and gets the credit, and out of the other side of your mouth that God is inept or incapable of doing what He requires in the one that is trusting and believing God.

Holiness is required: "Pursue peace with all people, and holiness, without which no one will see the Lord:" Hebrews 12:14.

You seem hard of hearing

your the one who seems to think God can not do what he said he will do, not me, I KNOW god will do what he promised, I am not the doubter you are

So why don’t you stop denying the power of God, and praising him for what he has done and will do.

 

[Episkopos]

You seem hard of hearing

your the one who seems to think God can not do what he said he will do, not me, I KNOW god will do what he promised, I am not the doubter you are

So why don’t you stop denying the power of God, and praising him for what he has done and will do.

Modern believers usually understand things backwards. They see deliverance from sin as a future event....at death...and the assurance of a race well run at the beginning.

So all that's missing is a reality check...and some truth. :)

 

[mjrhealth]

..and many also have approved themselves based on their own understanding. These have made their own assurance based on their reading of the bible...and have no sense of reality or truth. In their mind they see themselves as justified. But these lack real humility and the fear of the Lord.

But, yes, approval is of God alone and they whom He approves He also empowers to walk as Jesus walked.

Amen to that one, but than of course if God says it is done He means it.

 

[CharismaticLady]

God has all the time in the world. He spends every second of my life with me. Being justified from sin, there need never be any break, only when someone forgets that it is by Jesus' obedience, not our own, that we are justified.

and

We are justified by Jesus' obedience, not our own.

Yes, I see what you are saying. If Jesus hadn't obeyed God and allowed His crucifixion, we could not be justified of our past sins after we repent unto Him. That is the beginning of our walk. From then on, we, ourselves, obey because His Spirit that did not sin is now in us.

Did Jesus sin sins "not unto death", or was it that He committed No sin?

He committed no sin. Even when he was angry and turned over the tables of the money-changers, that was righteous indignation. We can be angry and sin not.

You keep talk about being "covered", that is Old Testament, kophar, cover, atone.

In the OT, sins were covered. Now, God creates a new man. Born of God. Sharing God's nature. This is how we are justified away from sin. Freed from sin. The new man. A new creation. Righteous and Holy. Put him on.

Yes, I keep talking about being "covered," but that is not my belief, but my quoting what others believe - a false doctrine. Yes, it was OT, I agree.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I do not believe the solution to this question is found in seeing two kinds of sin, rather, in two different natures which are conflicted.

It is God that sees two types of sin, and I believe Him.

 

[CharismaticLady]

For me, to put on the new man is to recognize that there Is a new man, that God created me new, patterned after Him, and that this new man reflects God's character. So that at any time in an was I realize I'm not reflecting God's character in my thoughts, words, actions, then I refocus on the fact that I am a new creature, who was born of God, and that all that I am, all I'm made to be, is summed up being in a love relationship with my Creator God.

In Him is eternal life. Life in Him transcends all else. And yes, sometimes we need to "put on the new man". Even if it is just in releasing anger and forgiving someone else, because we weren't living in love.

In Him we love.

I agree.

 

[CharismaticLady]

This is saying that the sermon on the mount is the "Law of the New Covenant", but I don't think that is correct. The law of the new covenant is love, is Christ. To live as He lives. Remember, God was in Christ not counting their sins against them.

Yes, the Ten Commandments were surface laws that made no man perfect, because they did nothing to overcome iniquity in the heart. The Sermon on the Mount was introducing them to a new way of understanding. New Covenant laws of the Spirit go far deeper to the unseen spirit where the fruit of the Spirit grow. And number one fruit is love.

Jesus said, neither do I condemn you, though He was the One Who could. The law of love does not register a wrongdoing against us. We're not to concern ourselves with that. God is the righteous judge. I'm not to go around saying so and so did this wrong to me, so now I have to forgive them, no, we simply loves others in whatever way that love is at that moment.

If we never get our feelings hurt, or get angry that someone on the forum is putting words in our mouth and wrongly accusing us, then we are perfect. Or that we misunderstand someone and do the same to them. These are trespasses that I commit just about daily. Knowing that unforgiveness is a sin, and wanting to please God, I forgive. And then, God forgives my trespasses. And my joy returns. I would never murder because it is not in my nature, the new man. That would be a willful sin of lawlessness. My own willful sin of lawlessness before I became born again was adultery. I couldn't stop, and I tried for months to no avail. I was too "in love" and too weak. But the baptism of the Holy Spirit stopped that desire in an instant. I know the reality of Jesus taking away our sin, not just covering up our sin while we continue to sin willfully. Jesus takes away the whole desire from our nature. (And there again, covering our sin is what people on the forum keep saying concerning their flesh.)

 

[CharismaticLady]

This is pretty stupendous. I read it very fast and need to read it again slower because I forget if you included this one:
If we abide in Him we do not sin.
Hogwash! If we abide in Him we WILL still sin!

Its a two way street. If we just abide in Him we will sin, but if He abides in us too, we can't.

1 John 3:24
Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

 

[CharismaticLady]

@marks

I think I answered them all. But if I missed a question or a statement you wanted me to comment on, please repeat it.

 

[CharismaticLady]

God's power is to bring victory over sin. To deliver the repentant believer. Holiness is not legalism; it is the will of God. Any "grace" that does not have the power to regenerate and change someone, is not real grace. Ineffectual, powerless grace is no grace at all.

If God cannot deliver you from sin here and now, there is no evidence that He would have the power to do it after you are dead.

Antinomianism is rampant in the Church today.

Yes, I agree. Antinomianism started 500 years ago and has infiltrated the whole Church in some way or another turning the definition of grace into unmerited favor, instead of the power of God given to us to fulfill the righteous requirements of the eternal laws of God.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Modern believers usually understand things backwards. They see deliverance from sin as a future event....at death...and the assurance of a race well run at the beginning.

So all that's missing is a reality check...and some truth. :)

Well when you find some truth, let me know

I know of know one who thinks deliverance from sin is a future event.

God delivered us from the power of sin now.

Now. whether we chose to follow God or our flesh in any given moment, That still is up to us..

But it does not mean God has not delivered us.