Exploring Trinitarian Logic

[Ritajanice]

I needed to understand this idea you have of being born with a dead spirit. I've never heard this before,

Ephesians 2:1-10New Century Version (NCV) In the past you were spiritually dead because of your sins and the things you did against God. Yes, in the past you lived the way the world lives, following the ruler of the evil powers that are above the earth. That same spirit is now working in those who refuse to obey God

its new. Man & Woman in nature and life are no different to the animals. So I'm wrestling with how you think you were born with something which is dead.

F2F

There is no point discussing with you any further, I have posted umpteen scriptures, describing how we were in sin..

Sorry. My patience is wearing thin, I’m being prompted to cease discussion with you in that area...you have been firing questions, which I’ve answered...unfortunately you have answered none of mine...therefore it’s a one way discussion...which is no discussion at all.

Let’s stick with the Trinity from now on...thank you very much.

 

[Ritajanice]

Sorry, I had to post separately as I’d reached my quota of words...

Aunty Jane said:
What can it mean? It has only one meaning as the rest of Scripture demonstrates…..


Here is more of the word Aunty...let’s focus intently on what is being said.

John 1:1​

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”

 

[Ritajanice]

Here is another summary regarding the trinity.

John 1:1, 14 — In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. ... And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, full of grace and truth; we have beheld his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father.

This is one of the most well-known “proof texts”. Jesus is eternal (here, “beginning” means “eternity past”). He was with God the Father, and is God the Son. To make sure that the reader has no misunderstanding, John (v. 14) reiterates that the “Word” referred to is the Son, and notes that he “became flesh” (the incarnation). Only the Son has a body. The Word = Jesus = God.

John 10:30 — I and the Father are one.

Jesus' hearers, unbelieving Jews, certainly understood his intent in saying this, because they tried to stone him, as the next verse informs us, since they didn't believe his claim, which, if indeed untrue, would be intolerable blasphemy. John 10:33 informs us that they tried to stone him because (in their words) “you, being a man, make yourself God.”

John 20:28 — Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!”

This had to do with the famous “Doubting Thomas” incident. Thomas didn't believe Jesus had risen, so Jesus appeared for his sake and told him to touch the wound in his side. Then Thomas believed and said this. If it were untrue, Jesus would have corrected him, but he didn't; He commended Thomas because he “believed.”

Colossians 1:19 — For in him all the fulness of God was pleased to dwell.

In context, it is the Son who is being described (1:13); he is eternal (1:15, 17-18), the Creator (1:16), and the unifying principle of the universe (1:17; cf. Heb 1:3): all attributes true only of God. Paul makes the notion even more explicit in the next chapter:

Colossians 2:9 — For in him the whole fulness of deity dwells bodily ...

2 Peter 1:1 — ... our God and Savior Jesus Christ ...

St. Paul uses the same phrase in Titus 2:13 as well.

Hebrews 1:8 — But of the Son he says, ‘Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever, the righteous scepter is the scepter of thy kingdom.’

This is a remarkable passage, in which God the Father calls his Son “God.” It is a reference to the Old Testament passage, Psalms 45:6-7.

In Hebrews 1:6, God the Father also says that all the angels should worship God the Son. Worship can only be rightly applied to God, as we know from Exodus 34:14 and Deuteronomy 8:19. Yet Jesus accepted worship of himself on many occasions (e.g., Matthew 14:33; 28:9) and stated that he should be honored equally with the Father (John 5:23). In Revelation 5:8, 12-13 and Colossians 2:6-7, we find that Jesus is worshiped in every way that the Bible specifically describes worship of God the Father, with all the same words used (see: Revelation 4:9-11, 5:13; 7:11-12, and Romans 11:33).


Jesus is omnipotent (possesses all power):

Philippians 3:20-21 — ... the Lord Jesus Christ, who will change our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power which enables him even to subject all things to himself.

Jesus is omniscient (all-knowing):

Colossians 2:2-3 — ... Christ, in whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.

Jesus is omnipresent (present everywhere):

Ephesians 1:22-23 — ... the Church, which is his body, the fulness of him who fills all in all. (cf. Colossians 3:11)

Another astonishing passage along these lines is one where Jesus speaks about historical events described as being done by God the Father in the Old Testament. He casually applies them to himself (what might be called “the Divine ‘I’”):

Matthew 23: 34, 37 — Therefore I send you prophets and wise men and scribes, some of whom you will kill and crucify, and some you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from town to town. ... O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, killing the prophets and stoning those who are sent to you! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you would not!

Many attributes that are said to belong only to “God” are applied to Jesus in Scripture. God the Father said, “besides me there is no savior” (Isaiah 43:11; cf. 1 Timothy 4:10). Yet Jesus is called the “savior” of mankind in passages like Luke 2:11 and many others.

God the Father stated, “To me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear” (Isaiah 45:23). The same exact description is also applied to Jesus (Philippians 2:10-11).


The Bible teaches that “God” is judge (1 Samuel 2:10; Psalm 50:6; Ecclesiastes 12:14; many others). But so is Jesus (John 5:22, 27; 9:39; Acts 10:42; 2 Timothy 4:1). Therefore he is God.

God the Father sits on his throne in heaven (1 Kings 22:19; Psalm 11:4; 47:8). Jesus is on the same throne, too (Revelation 7:17; 22:1, 3).

At every turn in the Bible, only one conclusion is possible, to make sense of all these statements, taken together as a whole: Jesus is God the Son. He is the eternal, all-powerful, all-loving, self-existent Creator God.

 

[St. SteVen]

Here is another summary regarding the trinity.

This is one of the most well-known “proof texts”. Jesus is eternal (here, “beginning” means “eternity past”). He was with God the Father, and is God the Son. To make sure that the reader has no misunderstanding, John (v. 14) reiterates that the “Word” referred to is the Son, and notes that he “became flesh” (the incarnation). Only the Son has a body. The Word = Jesus = God.

I have a different understanding of this.
As the scripture says: The Word (Logos) was from the beginning.
The Word (Logos) was with God, and the Word (Logos) was God.
The Word (Logos) became flesh (Jesus) and made his dwelling among us.

Therefore, Jesus memory of having been with the Father in the beginning was as the Logos (Word) of God.
The man Jesus was not in the beginning. The Father, the Word (Logos) and the Spirit were from the beginning.
Jesus returned to the Father, having previously been the Word (Logos) of God. IMHO

John 1:1, 14 NIV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory,
the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

• John 1:18
  No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God
  and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.
  
  
• John 5:37
  And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me.
  You have never heard his voice nor seen his form,
  
  
• John 6:46
  No one has seen the Father except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father.
  
  
• John 8:38
  I am telling you what I have seen in the Father’s presence,
  and you are doing what you have heard from your father.”

[

 

[Ritajanice]

I have a different understanding of this.
As the scripture says: The Word (Logos) was from the beginning.
The Word (Logos) was with God, and the Word (Logos) was God.
The Word (Logos) became flesh (Jesus) and made his dwelling among us.

Therefore, Jesus memory of having been with the Father in the beginning was as the Logos (Word) of God.
The man Jesus was not in the beginning. The Father, the Word (Logos) and the Spirit were from the beginning.
Jesus returned to the Father, having previously been the Word (Logos) of God. IMHO

John 1:1, 14 NIV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory,
the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

• John 1:18
  No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God
  and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.
  
  
• John 5:37
  And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me.
  You have never heard his voice nor seen his form,
  
  
• John 6:46
  No one has seen the Father except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father.
  
  
• John 8:38
  I am telling you what I have seen in the Father’s presence,
  and you are doing what you have heard from your father.”

[

Thanks for voicing what you believe./ opinion.

 

[St. SteVen]

Thanks for voicing what you believe./ opinion.

Have I convinced you that Jesus was not from the beginning?

The Word (Logos) became flesh (Jesus) and dwelt among us.

[

 

[Ritajanice]

Have I convinced you that Jesus was not from the beginning?

The Word (Logos) became flesh (Jesus) and dwelt among us.

[

No love...you haven’t ,lol....it’s not about convincing @St. SteVen...it’s about God’s truth...the trinity I believe will always be a mystery...none of us will ever come to the full truth, as much as we think we can.imo anyway...it’s all down to human interpretation of the scriptures ..no human teaching can be trusted..

 

[Wrangler]

Acts 13:32-33, "God has raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, 'You are My Son, today I have begotten You.'"

Additionally, a son standing at his father's right hand is associated with being the firstborn (Genesis 48:13-16), and after his resurrection, Christ was exalted to sit at God’s right hand (Acts 2:32, ; Hebrews 1:3).

I find it a case study in willful ignorance that trinitarians invoke Hebrews 1 as support for Jesus deity while over looking these time dependent statements of his creation and sonship.

 

[APAK]

Dear @APAK,
The Love of God asks you to please review carefully - Thank You

Watchtower NWT Bible = In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god.

No one can be saved by the god of Watchtower.

"a god" cannot save you or anyone = Isaiah 45:5

I am the Lord, and there is no other;
There is no God besides Me.

There is only ONE Way to Salvation = the Word was God and the Word became flesh = Immanuel, God with us

Lord Jesus Christ = "IAM the WAY the TRUTH the LIFE, no one comes to the FATHER but thru ME"

Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

the Lord Jesus Christ
Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.” - Acts 4:12

Dear @APAK, the FATHER will only accept you if you come to the Lord Jesus Christ

Why all the JW thought in John 1 and then skirting around or doing circles around the pole of indecision.

I already said what you are still trying say as you continue to wrestle with what is salvation and then if you are saved.

You have not said anything to tell me you are saved mate. Nice words, although do you experience and live with the spirit of Christ within you today is the real question? Have you known your mind and actions change for the better over the years because you are living with Christ, everyday! Have you shown the fruits of the Spirit of God; and you will know if have, believe me?

Gotta have the spirit of Christ else one is not saved...

 

[APAK]

You are posting your own opinion and belief here my friend.

We are partakers Of the divine nature, as a Born Again, ?

We are not our own, we were bought for a price, we belong to the Spirit Of God, I know in my spirit that I’m in the world, but, I am not of the world.i am Gods Spirit child, ....


@APAK says here, just trying to understand where you are coming from.

and If we extend this to a genuine believer's life, possessing the spirit of Christ and thus the spirit of the Father God, then you or I then are also divine -




RJ. says, The Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are the children of God, he does this all day every day, witnessing Gods truth to our heart/ spirit, as the Spirit permanently indwells our spirit as it’s been birthed,
Spirit gives birth to spirit....the Spirit is Alive in our spirit, ?

We are Spirit led children?....we grow up in the Holy Spirit, why, because we have been Born Again of imperishable seed, that imperishable seed that birthed our spirit is a Living seed?...the Holy Spirit...how do you know that he is Alive and Active in your heart/ spirit?

Jesus blood was pure, Holy, otherwise how could he atone for our sins?

Do you think that Jesus was an ordinary human at birth?...do you believe that he had the same fallen nature that we had, before our spirit became Born Again?..even though he grew from the seed of God?

He didn’t grow from Joseph’s seed/ sperm did he?

My belief is ,that Jesus grew in Mary’s womb as a divine being, he had to Of, because he wasn’t conceived by the sperm of a man.....he was conceived by divine intervention / conceived of the power of the Holy Spirit...therefore you tell me how that can’t make him divine?

He was divine imo right from his conception....even though he was Born like you and I were, we were born to fallen parents who inherited the sin of the world.

Jesus was Born to Mary who was a sinner, yet as he was growing in her womb as a divine being, the Spirit protected him from any sin of Mary ...God just used her womb as a means to grow his divine Son....

God had already planned the birth of Jesus before the foundation of the world, he also planned our spirit birth before the foundation of the world...all according to his purpose and plan.

God has planned everything from beginning to end...he has planned our lives from beginning to end.....

Everything that I have posted have been my thoughts, a little bit of scripture thrown in...it may be complete and utter rubbish what I’ve posted, who knows, ....I just typed exactly what was on my heart to post....it just came out.....and so the Trinity will always be a mystery...it can’t be proven either way..imo.

Back to the brush off with the opener of this is just my opinion yet again.

.what are you afraid of RJ?

Look RJ partaking in the divine nature as Christ did does not make YOU divine and also Christ...the key word is PARTAKING!

And that is not just an opinion, it is knowing the meaning of the pertinent scripture from whence it originated.
If we do not attempt to understand scripture we are with the mob of mindless inquisition and gossip, some deadly.

And then you lay on me the same canned verbiage of personally being saved and why. I know all this RJ, already. It does not add to the subject at hand, it just cluttered and handicaps the discussion and the communique. There's much emotion in your words, and it's not necessary at all, IMO!

BL RJ, without sugar coating it, if one is truly saved they are NOT divine, as God Almighty. They partake of his divinity and this nature, and now possess divine characteristics in their corrupt body, characteristics I night say as, of Christ, the image of God.


Anyway, did you actually read my post as I first asked concerning how important it is to know the context surround scripture?...

 

[David in NJ]

Why all the JW thought in John 1 and then skirting around or doing circles around the pole of indecision.

I already said what you are still trying say as you continue to wrestle with what is salvation and then if you are saved.

You have not said anything to tell me you are saved mate. Nice words, although do you experience and live with the spirit of Christ within you today is the real question? Have you known your mind and actions change for the better over the years because you are living with Christ, everyday! Have you shown the fruits of the Spirit of God; and you will know if have, believe me?

Gotta have the spirit of Christ else one is not saved...

Good Morning @APAK

Why all the JW thought in John 1 = the Word was "a god"

Truth Answer #1 -Deuteronomy 5:6-7

‘I am the Lord your God who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
‘You shall have no other gods before Me."

you are still trying say as you continue to wrestle with what is salvation

Truth Answer #2
Lord Jesus Christ is the STONE WHICH WAS REJECTED by you, THE BUILDERS, but WHICH BECAME THE CHIEF CORNERSTONE.
And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among mankind by which we must be saved.” - Acts 4:11-12

You have not said anything to tell me you are saved mate.

Truth Answer #3
Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, who, as He already existed in the form of God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but emptied Himself by taking the form of a bond-servant and being born in the likeness of men.
And being found in appearance as a man,
He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death: death on a cross.

For this reason also God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name,
so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven
and on earth
and under the earth,
and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

for us(who are SAVED) there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we exist.
And there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we exist.

 

[Ritajanice]

I Back to the brush off with the opener of this is just my opinion yet again.

.what are you afraid of RJ?

Afraid?

Look RJ partaking in the divine nature as Christ did does not make YOU divine and also Christ...the key word is PARTAKING!

That’s exactly what I posted, we are “ partakers “Of the divine nature, which stands to reason if our spirit is Born Again..

And that is not just an opinion, it is knowing the meaning of the pertinent scripture from whence it originated.
If we do not attempt to understand scripture we are with the mob of mindless inquisition and gossip, some deadly.

It’s your understanding of the scripture, which doesn’t make it Gods truth..

And then you lay on me the same canned verbiage of personally being saved and why. I know all this RJ, already. It does not add to the subject at hand, it just cluttered and handicaps the discussion and the communique. There's much emotion in your words, and it's not necessary at all, IMO!

I voiced my belief / opinion, just as valid as yours, I don’t think it does clutter the discussion, if one doesn’t understand the Living spiritual rebirth, how can you understand anything to do with the trinity, ...show me the emotion in my words?

BL RJ, without sugar coating it, if one is truly saved they are NOT divine, as God Almighty.

I don’t think I said we are divine like God, a Born Again is a partaker Of the divine nature, we are spirit children, by the way, we aren't saved not until .....Spirit gives birth to spirit?

That is a Living spiritual birth that one never forgets.

They partake of his divinity and this nature, and now possess divine characteristics in their corrupt body,

We honour the Spirit Of God in our bodies, because we are Born Again.

1 Corinthians 6:19-2019 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20 you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your bodies.

Ezekiel 36:26-27​

​

King James Version​

​

​

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

characteristics I night say as, of Christ, the image of God.

Our characteristics do not come from a corrupt body, our body is dead , our spirit is Alive, the characteristics come from the Holy Spirit, who indwells our spirit.....we are spiritually reunited back to God, hence being Born Of the spirit.

ESV But if Christ is in you, although the body is dead because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness.


The Holy Spirit doesn’t indwell our body , he indwells our spirit, our body houses the Holy Spirit, ....our spirit is Born Again not our body.

Anyway, did you actually read my post as I first asked concerning how important it is to know the context surround scripture?...

Did you actually read my post, maybe you need to listen to what others have to say, instead of dismissing members beliefs/ opinions.also making accusations about their salvation....just because my testimony or anyone else’s , doesn’t fit in with what you believe/ understand, doesn’t mean they aren’t Born Again...everyone is on their own journey with the Lord, you like everyone else on the board, post your belief/ testimony and opinions...

If you want a discussion with me , make it 2 way...and not “your” one way...as that’s all I ever see from you..you tell people what they should believe,.that is not a discussion....

 

[Wrangler]

As the scripture says: The Word (Logos) was from the beginning.

Well of course, God has a mind. He does not act before his mind is made up about what action to take, just like everyone else who is sentient.

 

[St. SteVen]

St. SteVen said:
As the scripture says: The Word (Logos) was from the beginning.

Well of course, God has a mind. He does not act before his mind is made up about what action to take, just like everyone else who is sentient.

I guess you missed the point...
However, I am gland that you understand that the Word (Logos) was the mind (purpose/plan) of God.
In fact, the Word (Logos) was with God, and the Word (Logos) was God.

The Word (Logos) became flesh (Jesus) and made his dwelling among us. (John 1:14)

Therefore, Jesus memory of having been with the Father in the beginning was as the Logos (Word) of God.
The man Jesus was not in the beginning. The Father, the Word (Logos) and the Spirit were from the beginning.
Jesus returned to the Father, having previously been the Word (Logos) of God. IMHO

[

 

[Johann]

St. SteVen said:
As the scripture says: The Word (Logos) was from the beginning.

I guess you missed the point...
However, I am gland that you understand that the Word (Logos) was the mind (purpose/plan) of God.
In fact, the Word (Logos) was with God, and the Word (Logos) was God.

The Word (Logos) became flesh (Jesus) and made his dwelling among us. (John 1:14)

Therefore, Jesus memory of having been with the Father in the beginning was as the Logos (Word) of God.
The man Jesus was not in the beginning. The Father, the Word (Logos) and the Spirit were from the beginning.
Jesus returned to the Father, having previously been the Word (Logos) of God. IMHO

[

"THE GOSPEL OF JOHN"

The Pre-existence Of Christ (1:1-5)

INTRODUCTION
The gospel of John was written for a simple purpose...
To produce faith in Jesus as the Christ, the Son of God - Jn 20:30-31a
To share the "life" that comes through such faith - Jn 20:31b
To encourage us to have faith in Jesus Christ...
John begins his gospel with a prologue - Jn 1:1-18
In which he makes several claims as to who Jesus was
He refers to Jesus in this prologue as "the Word"
That he refers to Jesus is evident from verses 14-18

The very first claim pertains to the pre-existence of Christ...
That He existed in the beginning, long before being born of Mary - cf. Jn 1:1-2
That His work in the beginning has great significance for us - cf. Jn 1:3-5
[John is not alone in proclaiming "The Pre-Existence Of Christ." Elsewhere in the Scriptures we find...]

EVIDENCE FOR THE PRE-EXISTENCE OF CHRIST
FORETOLD BY THE PROPHETS...

Micah prophesied of the pre-existence of the Messiah to come - Mic 5:2
Isaiah spoke of the King to come as "Everlasting Father" - Isa 9:6-7
Zechariah recorded the Messiah's own promise to come - Zech 2:10-11

AFFIRMED BY JESUS HIMSELF...
In His claim to have existed in Abraham's day - Jn 8:56-58
In His prayer shortly before His arrest and crucifixion - Jn 17:4-5,24
In the revelation He gave to John - Re 22:13

DECLARED BY HIS APOSTLES...
By John in his gospel, and also his epistle - Jn 1:1-4; 1Jn 2:14
By Paul in his epistles
To the church in Corinth - 1Co 10:1-4; 2Co 8:9
To the church in Philippi - Php 2:5-8
To the church in Colosse - Col 1:16-17

ILLUSTRATED BY THE CREATION...
All things were created by Jesus - Jn 1:3; He 1:2-3
Necessitating His existence before creation - Col 1:16-17
Implying His own eternal power and divine nature - Ro 1:20
[These are remarkable claims concerning Jesus, even blasphemous if not true. Yet if true (and John's gospel is design to prove that it is), consider...]

SIGNIFICANCE OF THE PRE-EXISTENCE OF CHRIST
HE IS DEITY...!

Especially when we consider the nature of His pre-existence
His going forths were "from everlasting" - cf. Mic 5:2
He was the eternal "I Am" - Jn 8:58; cf. Exo 3:13-14
As made clear in John's prologue - Jn 1:1-2
He was "with" God (implying a personal communion with God)
He "was" God (explicitly stating His deity)
-- Thus He is worthy of our love and adoration - cf. Jn 20:28
HE IS LIFE...!
By virtue of being the Creator and the Sustainer of life
All things were made by Him - Col 1:16
All things are held together (NASV, NRSV) by Him - Col 1:17
Again, as John makes clear in his prologue - Jn 1:3-4
Without Him, nothing was made
In Him was life itself
-- Thus He gives us hope for our own resurrection! - cf. Jn 5:21; 11:25

HE IS LIGHT...!
We live in a world of darkness...
Where people spend their lives stumbling in ignorance
Alienated from the life of God because of their ignorance - cf. Ep 4:17-19
As the Creator and Sustainer of life itself...
Jesus is uniquely qualified to bring light into the world - Jn 1:4
He calls for us to believe that we might become "sons of light" - Jn 12:35-36
-- Thus Jesus offers us the "light of life" - Jn 8:12

CONCLUSION
Sadly, many resist the life and light Jesus offers...
Some tried to destroy Him, but did not succeed - cf. Jn 1:5 (NRSV)
Many try to avoid Him, knowing that it will mean changes to their lifestyle - cf. Jn 3:19-20
But for those willing to come to Jesus...
He offers us hope and guidance in this life - cf. Mic 5:4-5a
He is capable of fulfilling His promises - cf. Mt 11:28-30
For He is no mere man, whose existence began when born by Mary, but "whose goings forth are from of old, From everlasting." - Mic 5:2

J.

 

[Ritajanice]

Especially when we consider the nature of His pre-existence

Because Jesus nature was already in God, before the foundation of the world...would you agree?

 

[Ritajanice]

CONCLUSION
Sadly, many resist the life and light Jesus offers...
Some tried to destroy Him, but did not succeed - cf. Jn 1:5 (NRSV)
Many try to avoid Him, knowing that it will mean changes to their lifestyle - cf. Jn 3:19-20
But for those willing to come to Jesus...
He offers us hope and guidance in this life - cf. Mic 5:4-5a
He is capable of fulfilling His promises - cf. Mt 11:28-30
For He is no mere man, whose existence began when born by Mary, but "whose goings forth are from of old, From everlasting." - Mic 5:2

Amen!

 

[St. SteVen]

"THE GOSPEL OF JOHN"

The Pre-existence Of Christ (1:1-5)

John 1:1-5 says nothing about the pre-existence of Christ.

Christ is not introduced until verse fourteen.
Which disproves the pre-existence of Christ.

John 1:14 NIV
The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us.
We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son,
who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

[

 

[Johann]

Because Jesus nature was already in God, before the foundation of the world...would you agree?

I fully concur sister.

J.

 

[Wrangler]

In fact, the Word (Logos) was with God, and the Word (Logos) was God.

This is a play on words. The work of a person is not another person.