Do I Have To Go To Church?

[FHII]

No one can go to church as you are the church so you can't go to yourself.

Well that is simply wrong. Yes, the Body of Christ is the Church, but that does not mean they can't "go to Church". Individuals are not "the Church". It's one body with many members. And at set times the many members gather together. When that happens, they go to church.

1 Corinthians 11:18 KJV
For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.

What I put in bold is the "church" of one body, many members. But what is underlined shows a designated meeting place, which "the church" was to gather at. So the people were the church, but so was the meeting place. The meeting place isn't special EXCEPT for the fact that it was where the Church is gathering at.

Marksman, you are not the Church. I am not the Church. The pastor isn't either. The church is a complete body of many members. And this verse says they meet in one place.

Yes, it is a rebuke, but not that they met in one place, but what happened when they did. There were divisions. Well, you can't have divisions if you are the Church by yourself!

By the way, the meeting place was a church; not a house! It might've been someone's home, but it ceased being so during the service. It became the Church BUILDING. otherwise, Paul would not have asked the rhetorical question of whether or not they had houses of their own to eat in.

The bottom line is that even though the Corinthians were doing wrong, they gathered together in a Church. So no... Your statement is not correct. The Church does indeed go to Church.

 

[Episkopos]

there is that out that.. but as a preacher man use to say preaching is like eating chicken, you eat the meat throw the bones away . if you go to Church expecting looking for something from the Lord odds are you will get it . Church . the local assembly is important .it has been said if you find the perfect church and start going. it won't be perfect very long your/ we are there,

A lady went to her Pastor and said “Pastor, I won't be going to your church anymore.” The Pastor responded “But why?” The lady said “Ah! I saw a woman gossipping about another member; a man that is a hypocrite; the worship team living wrong; people looking at their phone during service; among so many other things wrong in your church.”

The Pastor replied “OK. But before you go, do me a favor: take a full glass of water and walk around the church three times without spilling a drop on the ground. Afterwards, leave the church if you desire.” The lady thought: too easy! She walked three times around the church as the Pastor had asked. When she finished she told the Pastor she was ready to leave.

The Pastor said, “Before you leave I want to ask you one more question. When you were walking around the church, did you see anyone gossipping?” The lady replied “No.” “Did you see any hypocrites?" The lady said "No." "Anyone looking at their phone?” “No.” “You know why?” “No.”

“You were focused on the glass, to make sure you didn't stumble and spill any water. It's the same with our life. When we keep our eyes on Jesus, we don't have time to see the mistakes of others. We will reach out a helping hand to them and concentrate on our own walk with the Lord."

But this could also have been said about the Germans during the Nazi regime. They were so focused on their own lives they didn't notice how evil the society had become.

 

[Stumpmaster]

 

[FHII]

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Well that sounds nice and all... But looking at it carefully it looks alot like Judges 17:6.

 

[mjrhealth]

what does all this have to do with 'ought I to go to church' (which was my original point)???

Hebrews 10:24-25 (KJV) And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works: Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

And that has what to do with church, we can do that on a forum, in a pub., like Christ on a hill; top, in a boat. On the train while driving you car, done that a few times with workmates, even at work.

 

[mjrhealth]

If you went to church you might be a little more solid on your theology.

1. Id rather be grounded in Christ the rock who is our foundation.
2. What was it Paul said of all his learning.
Php 3:5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
Php 3:6 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
Php 3:7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
Php 3:8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
Php 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
Php 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;

God Bless

 

[stunnedbygrace]

1. Id rather be grounded in Christ the rock who is our foundation.
2. What was it Paul said of all his learning.
Php 3:5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
Php 3:6 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
Php 3:7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
Php 3:8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
Php 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
Php 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;

God Bless

1 Cor 3:18
Stop deceiving yourselves. If you think you are wise by this world’s standards, you need to become a fool to be truly wise.

 

[Giuliano]

Hahaha! And we've sure got 'em
They stick out like sore thumbs, and make themselves look ignorant.

I think it may be a blessing from God to be able to see ourselves close to the way other people do.

Ha, I surely have my flaws, but I try not to let them show -- not to inflict them on others. I wonder if some people would call me a hypocrite?

 

[stunnedbygrace]

I think it may be a blessing from God to be able to see ourselves close to the way other people do.

Ha, I surely have my flaws, but I try not to let them show -- not to inflict them on others. I wonder if some people would call me a hypocrite?

It is not hypocrisy to see your own inanities and not want to torture others with them.

Hypocrisy would be to rail against the inanities of others and think you have none and not see that people are being very longsuffering with you.

 

[Giuliano]

It is not hypocrisy to see your own inanities and not want to torture others with them.

Hypocrisy would be to rail against the inanities of others and think you have none and not see that people are being very longsuffering with you.

Thanks. Although I feel slightly guilty about allowing people to have a higher opinion of me than is realistic, I figure the alternative would be worse.

I see another positive aspect too. Seeing my own flaws has made me more sympathetic with others. If they exhibit openly the flaws I suppress, it puts me in a better position to understand them. If we ever get to talking about such things, I may admit to them I have the same flaws. It can encourage some people when I admit that.

 

[amadeus]

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Maybe when the real ministers of God have finished their work, we'll have moved up to here?

"Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:" Eph 4:13

 

[amadeus]

And that has what to do with church, we can do that on a forum, in a pub., like Christ on a hill; top, in a boat. On the train while driving you car, done that a few times with workmates, even at work.

Indeed, is this not what Jesus is also saying here?

"For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them." Matt 18:20

People do not know or have forgotten what it means to be "in His name". Being "in His name" means much more than meeting some place and saying the name, Jesus. Don't people gather in barrooms and say, "Jesus" at times as well? People should talk to Him about what it means to be "in His name" so as not to miss having Him there in their midst!

 

[Nancy]

Thanks. Although I feel slightly guilty about allowing people to have a higher opinion of me than is realistic, I figure the alternative would be worse.

I see another positive aspect too. Seeing my own flaws has made me more sympathetic with others. If they exhibit openly the flaws I suppress, it puts me in a better position to understand them. If we ever get to talking about such things, I may admit to them I have the same flaws. It can encourage some people when I admit that.

Understood Giuliano,
I could say the same here. I'm ONLY going to be 62 :) and since my early 50's my "active" life has been taking quite the hit. I sure don't want to burden others with my physical limitations - especially those in their 70's and 80's! All of my issues stem from two different accidents in the mid 1980's. At first, I know it was pride getting in the way as, I've always done what needed to be done by myself, can no longer do them and, I never wanted anyone to think I was lazy so, I would lift things, clean rooms and serve meals at Church functions. And let me tell you, I put a hurtin on myself that lasted for days just to show them I wasn't lazy! Yes, pride got in the way but, not anymore. It is what it is and others can think what they like. Because my balance is off, and I had an older lady (stern lady) pull me aside one day after Sunday school and asked me if I was drinking!!! I was horrified! So, I felt I had to tell her of some of my issues that cause my imbalance, she just walked away from me at that point...I SURE wasn't looking for pity but I felt pitiful. Glad to have left that place...that was just a few short years ago. Now, I will bring a cane with me and that in and of itself embarrasses me (yep, that ugly pride again) but, it keeps my balance and keeps me from falling because of foot drop! Unable to wear the brace (the one that lifts the foot when walking) any longer because it causes much pain so, I have tripped on curbs, twisted my ankles countless times over the years so much so that my ankles look hobbled! Dead nerves in lower legs, metatarsal padding under the toes are all destroyed, blah, blah,blah. My issues are complicated but, I'm learning my limits :/

 

[Marymog]

imo if you are the Church as Scripture says, really there is no "where" to go, and it is a mistake to even call congregating "church?"

Hi bbyrd,

When Christians do congregate, read Scripture and do what He told us to do when we congregate what is it called if not "church"?

Mry

 

[prism]

Why so we can be joined to the harlot.

1Co 6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
1Co 6:16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.
1Co 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

Your response above is to this original post of mine...

To the question, "Do I have to go to Church", I believe the answer would be 'no, you don't have to go but you ought to go.'.

To call God's church a harlot is to spit on those whom He shed His blood to purchase...

Acts 20:28 KJVS
[28] Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

Besides showing a self righteous attitude of being too good for His Body.

Maybe before we go further in this crazy exchange...define 'church'.

 

[Windmill Charge]

Face facts windmill, the mature Christian is so often the one person the pastor fears the most because if he gives him something to do he will be shown up to be the shallow person that he is. I have one theological degree, one undergrad uni degree, and two post-grad uni degree. I am a uni trained teacher, have taught complex subjects that need specialized knowledge to high school students. I have been told through prophecy that I have been given the gift of teaching but have yet to be in a single church that utilises these skills and abilities because I am not "ordained" by man, only by the Holy Spirit and the secular world.

I have had to sit through sermons given by trained denominational pastors and the whole thing has been a joke from start to finish. I call it resplendent rubbish. I have sat through sermons given by female leaders where verses have been taken totally out of context to prove that God approves of female leaders.

Nuf said as the fact is for too many leaders they are there for their benefit, not the benefit who have to suffer their machinations.

That you have churches staffed by insecure ministers must be deeply disappointing.
It does not change what I said or the validity of what I said.

May I make a suggestion.
Contact the minister of the church whose teaching is the most biblical and ask him whether you could serve him in any way.
You want to serve and you can see the insecurities of many ministers, are you humble enough to willingly submit to their authority.

Story for you.
Duncan Campbell was converted at a mission near to his village and his life changed. He scontinued to attend the local 'kirk' despite finding nothing that fed his spiritual hunger.
It was several years later that he learnt that the unsaved minister had been deeply challenged by Duncan's faithfulness in attending his church and it played a big part in his eventual conversion.

Your faithfull service could lead to many Les well educated or spiritual aware leaders being taught and learning about the spirits leading.

 

[Windmill Charge]

When the Sheep are being Fed by the true Shepherd they will never hunger or thirst.

Joh_4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
Joh_6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

As for dying Embers, that Spirit that God gives the fire that burns within, will never die.

Joh_10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
Joh_10:29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Even Jesus needed fellowship with his Father making time to be alone with him. Few of us have the spiritual stature of Jesus, few of us have even the spiritual stature of great Christians of the past and they found church attendance vital for there well being.

 

[Marymog]

Indeed, is this not what Jesus is also saying here?

"For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them." Matt 18:20

People do not know or have forgotten what it means to be "in His name". Being "in His name" means much more than meeting some place and saying the name, Jesus. Don't people gather in barrooms and say, "Jesus" at times as well? People should talk to Him about what it means to be "in His name" so as not to miss having Him there in their midst!

Hi Amadeus,

The Jews that Jesus was speaking to at the time would have known of passages in Deuteronomy concerning the law. Deuteronomy 17 and 19 speak of 2 or 3 witnesses gathered to testify in court. The witnesses were necessary to establish a case in court.

With that in mind the Matthew 18:20 passage you reference should be put in context. In context that passage is about dealing with Sin in the Church or disciplining an erring brother. Or in a nutshell it deals with Church discipline.


Bible study Mary

 

[bbyrd009]

Hi bbyrd,

When Christians do congregate, read Scripture and do what He told us to do when we congregate what is it called if not "church"?

Mry

yes, mary, that part is not the problem imo, its that we still call it "church" when its locked up and no ones there, which is the vast majority of the time, im sure? For most "churches" anyway? Iow "church" becomes associated with a place

hmm, just like heaven does! ha!

 

[Helen]

I think it may be a blessing from God to be able to see ourselves close to the way other people do.

Ha, I surely have my flaws, but I try not to let them show -- not to inflict them on others. I wonder if some people would call me a hypocrite?

Nah...as Paul... being all things to all people. :)