Christians and Jews are both anti Acts 2:38.

[user]

Water Baptism, a study by John MacArthur.
Water baptism does not seem to be what Peter has in view in 1 Peter 3:21.

1 Peter 3:21 says...
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

Note the "good conscience toward God."

Any attempt to to render baptism optional ignores the fact that the water of Noah's flood was not an option in the saving of his family. That Noah's family entered the ark was evidence of their faith, but it was also an essential act of obedience if they hoped to survive the flood. Baptism constitutes the good conscience toward God and Noah's entrance into the ark demonstrated his conscience was clear with God, and nothing stood between him and obedience to God's command.

This is the New Testament plan of salvation...

Acts 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart(they now believe), and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
[38] Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
[39] For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

 

[Scott Downey]

In the New Covenant, no one is taught by any man to know the Lord.
They simply know Him as they are born of God, the Spirit teaches them.
It is a part of their now supernatural newly created being, becoming one spirit with Him.
And so then they believe in their hearts.
You CAN NOT teach the old man to believe in Christ.

Ephesians 2
11 Therefore remember that you, once Gentiles in the flesh—who are called Uncircumcision by what is called the Circumcision made in the flesh by hands— 12 that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

20 But you have not so learned Christ,
21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus:

John 6
35 And Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.
36 But I said to you that you have seen Me and yet do not believe.
37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.
38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.
39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.
40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”

Rejected by His Own
41 The Jews then complained about Him, because He said, “I am the bread which came down from heaven.” 42 And they said, “Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How is it then that He says, ‘I have come down from heaven’?”
43 Jesus therefore answered and said to them, “Do not murmur among yourselves.
44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.
45 It is written in the prophets, ‘And they shall all be taught by God.’ Therefore everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to Me.
46 Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father.
47 Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.

And this about how the NC established in His blood works differently from the OC. v10 is showing the inner transformation by the Spirit of being born again, by the new nature they simply have His laws put into their minds by the Spirit, and the Spirit writes them upon their hearts and they know Him now. And God declares, they SHALL BE HIS PEOPLE, THIS IA AN ABSOLUTE GUARANTEE

Hebrews 8
A New Covenant
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 9 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the Lord.

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”

13 In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

 

[PinSeeker]

1 Peter 3:21 says...
"The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ: Note the "good conscience toward God."

Yes, please, note Peter's phrase there concerning a good conscience toward God. In 1 Peter 3, a comparison is drawn between salvation in the Noah's ark and baptism. In both instances, believers are saved through the waters of judgment, since baptism portrays salvation through judgment. The mere mechanical act of baptism does not save, for Peter explicitly says, "not as a removal of dirt from the body," meaning that the passing of water over the body does not cleanse anyone. Baptism saves you because it represents inward faith, as evidenced by one's appeal to God for the forgiveness of one's ins (for a good conscience). Furthermore, baptism "saves" only insofar as it is grounded in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Water baptism is a visual representation of the fact that Christians are clothed with Christ (Galatians 3:27), and in union with Christ they share in His victory over sin. Though Christians have disagreed about the proper mode of water baptism ever since the early history of the church, Christians have generally agreed (irrespective of denominational differences) that water baptism is an outward sign ~ as was circumcision in the Old Testament ~ of the inward reality of regeneration ~ baptism by fire, which is the result of the work of the Holy Spirit, which may be received only by grace through faith, which, as Paul says in Ephesians 2, is entirely of God.

Any attempt to to render baptism optional...

Nobody here is doing that. But water baptism is not efficacious in conferring salvation upon any person. Only the baptism by fire, which is the work of God via His Holy Spirit, is efficacious in the conferral of salvation upon any person. Salvation is of the Lord.

...ignores the fact that the water of Noah's flood was not an option in the saving of his family.

No, but rather conveys a correct understanding of it ~ if that connection is even realized, which it may not be, but does not negate it in any way. See above.

That Noah's family entered the ark was evidence of their faith, but it was also an essential act of obedience if they hoped to survive the flood. Baptism constitutes the good conscience toward God and Noah's entrance into the ark demonstrated his conscience was clear with God, and nothing stood between him and obedience to God's command.

This is the New Testament plan of salvation...

Acts 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart(they now believe), and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
[38] Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
[39] For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

No, God's plan of salvation is the same throughout the Old Testament and the New Testament. It was always a heart matter, a God-given faith matter, and will always be.

Grace and peace to all.

 

[Titus]

It does not matter if a silly name is posted on a church door, as long as the name of Jesus is posted over us in our baptism.

God does not honor the building at all.

The building is not the house of God.

The saints are.

If we have to rent a Mormon building, God cannot be offended...even by statues of Moroni in there.

Same with renting the RCC building.

Now Sir, I asked you if the bride can wear another bridegrooms name. You did not give me answer.

Building? Please quote me where I was referring to buildings, homes, tabernacle etc.

I am talking about the body and Head of the church.
I am aware that the church is not a building.
The church is those who have been called out of darkness and translated into the kingdom(church).
Colossians 1:13-14
He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love.
As Paul taught here in Colossians 1:13-14 , we are in the kingdom. Which is His church,
Matthew 16:18-19
And I say to you that you are Peter and on this rock I will build My CHURCH, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.
And I will give you the keys of the KINGDOM of heaven and and whatever you bind on earth on earth will be bound in heaven in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

The church keys fit the kingdom. And the kingdoms keys fit the church. Therefore they are one in the same.

We see the church is here and therefore must also be the kingdom,
Colossians 1:13-14 ;
Revelation 1:9,
I John both your brother and companion in the tribulation and KINGDOM and patience of Jesus Christ, was on the island that is called Patmos for word of God and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.

John and Paul confirm the kingdom has already come. And that kingdom is the Lords church/body
The church/Kingdom will be delivered up to Jesus when He returns.
1Corinthians 15:24
Then cometh the end, when He shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when He shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

It does not matter if a silly name is posted on a church door, as long as the name of Jesus is posted over us in our baptism

It doesn't matter if Jesus' bride posts silly names?
Do you think Jesus is not offended when His bride refers to Him with silly names?

We must respect, honor and give all glory to Jesus by the bride of Christ, proudly wearing the bridegrooms name.
Ephesians 5:25-27
Husbands love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for it.
That Jesus might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water bynthe wotd.
That He might PRESENT IT TO HIMSELF a GLORIOUS church, not having SPOT or WRINKLE or in ANY SUCH THING; but that it should be Holy and without BLEMISH.

As a husband who desires his wife to honor you with respect.
How can we present ourselves i.e. the church to Christ as without spot or WRINKLE IN ANY SUCH THING,
But in holiness to Christ if we refer to the bridegroom with any silly name?
Does the church bring glory to Jesus when we wear the names other than His?

Paul condemned the use of other names for the baptism done IN JESUS' NAME.

1Corinthians 1:12-13
Now this I say, that everyone of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
IS CHRIST DIVIDED? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

Paul had understanding that it was an abomination to give MEN THE GLORY for the Baptism that Jesus bleed and died for to save us.
Yet we can understand this is shameful to Christ.
But we think we can give glory, honor and respect to Jesus by using silly names other than His.

Gloryland, Jesus, Holy Saints of heavenly places, hallelujah angel band etc church".

Etc.?

Spiritual established church of Christ in the new testament had a identifying name, description.
There would be nothing wrong with using it, Romans 16:16. In fact it is Biblically correct.
To use another name, description not found in the new testament, is from the mind of men and not Inspired.

Paul was inspired by the Holy Spirit when he said, Romans 16:16.

 

[user]

Yes, please, note Peter's phrase there concerning a good conscience toward God. In 1 Peter 3, a comparison is drawn between salvation in the Noah's ark and baptism. In both instances, believers are saved through the waters of judgment, since baptism portrays salvation through judgment. The mere mechanical act of baptism does not save, for Peter explicitly says, "not as a removal of dirt from the body," meaning that the passing of water over the body does not cleanse anyone. Baptism saves you because it represents inward faith, as evidenced by one's appeal to God for the forgiveness of one's ins (for a good conscience). Furthermore, baptism "saves" only insofar as it is grounded in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Water baptism is a visual representation of the fact that Christians are clothed with Christ (Galatians 3:27), and in union with Christ they share in His victory over sin. Though Christians have disagreed about the proper mode of water baptism ever since the early history of the church, Christians have generally agreed (irrespective of denominational differences) that water baptism is an outward sign ~ as was circumcision in the Old Testament ~ of the inward reality of regeneration ~ baptism by fire, which is the result of the work of the Holy Spirit, which may be received only by grace through faith, which, as Paul says in Ephesians 2, is entirely of God.


Nobody here is doing that. But water baptism is not efficacious in conferring salvation upon any person. Only the baptism by fire, which is the work of God via His Holy Spirit, is efficacious in the conferral of salvation upon any person. Salvation is of the Lord.


No, but rather conveys a correct understanding of it ~ if that connection is even realized, which it may not be, but does not negate it in any way. See above.

That Noah's family entered the ark was evidence of their faith, but it was also an essential act of obedience if they hoped to survive the flood. Baptism constitutes the good conscience toward God and Noah's entrance into the ark demonstrated his conscience was clear with God, and nothing stood between him and obedience to God's command.


No, God's plan of salvation is the same throughout the Old Testament and the New Testament. It was always a heart matter, a God-given faith matter, and will always be.

Grace and peace to all.

This is what you believe...

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water(Holy Spirit) and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

-Whew!

 

[Titus]

This is what you believe...

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water(Holy Spirit) and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

-Whew!

Some teach John 3:5 the water is the natural birth.
Why would Jesus say less ye be born and born of the Spirit ye shall not enter the kingdom?
Some things just go without saying.
Does Jesus really need to explain that if you are not physically born you cannot be in the Kingdom?

Who is really that dense?

 

[user]

Some teach John 3:5 the water is the natural birth.
Why would Jesus say less ye be born and born of the Spirit ye shall not enter the kingdom?
Some things just go without saying.
Does Jesus really need to explain that if you are not physically born you cannot be in the Kingdom?

Who is really that dense?

Yes. You are absolutely correct!

 

[Titus]

Yes, will be saved, but this is also absolutely going to happen as a done deal.
Prior to them believing and confessing Christ as Lord, people are born again of the Spirit of God as the first step, otherwise they will not be believing in their heart due to the enmity that is within them as they are carnally minded. Only after being born again are they spiritually minded, read Romans 8.

Paul also says this about the unbelieving, that they have no hope and are without God in the world, Ephesians 2, so a carnal mind full of enmity against God and Christ will not believe, for by Grace are you saved.

That blindness of their hearts is because their wills are bound to the devil, and their desire is to follow the devil and the lusts of the flesh. That ENMITY is only overcome by God creating in them the new man of the Spirit, the old man of the flesh is never going to believe what Christ says or who He is, as they do NOT have the love of God in them.

Ephesians 4
17 This I say, therefore, and testify in the Lord, that you should no longer walk as the rest of the Gentiles walk, in the futility of their mind,
18 having their understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God, because of the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart;
19 who, being past feeling, have given themselves over to lewdness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.

20 But you have not so learned Christ,
21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus:
22 that you put off, concerning your former conduct, the old man which grows corrupt according to the deceitful lusts,
23 and be renewed in the spirit of your mind,
24 and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness and holiness.

Friend TU.I.L.P. is heresy,
Cornelius was not regenerated before he obeyed the gospel and was saved.

It is unbiblical to teach regeneration first
Then Faith
Then salvation.
Regeneration, justification, and salvation all occur when the blood of Jesus Christ is applied to our sins.
Regeneration is being born again.

Born again is saved.
Therefore regeneration occurs by the saving power of the gospel. When we believe and obey it. Then we contact the blood of Christ, Matthew 26:28 ; Acts 2:38.

Mr. Downey,
Please give book, chapter and verse where we are miraculously Holy Spirit baptized then regenerated before we come to faith by hearing the gospel, Romans 10:17?
Sir you are not letting the scriptures speak for themselves.
Cornelius was saved after he heard the gospel. That means he could not of been born again before he heard the gospel. If he was born again, hevwas born again without believing in Jesus!

 

[Scott Downey]

Friend TU.I.L.P. is heresy,
Cornelius was not regenerated before he obeyed the gospel and was saved.

It is unbiblical to teach regeneration first
Then Faith
Then salvation.
Regeneration, justification, and salvation all occur when the blood of Jesus Christ is applied to our sins.
Regeneration is being born again.

Born again is saved.
Therefore regeneration occurs by the saving power of the gospel. When we believe and obey it. Then we contact the blood of Christ, Matthew 26:28 ; Acts 2:38.

Mr. Downey,
Please give book, chapter and verse where we are miraculously Holy Spirit baptized then regenerated before we come to faith by hearing the gospel, Romans 10:17?
Sir you are not letting the scriptures speak for themselves.
Cornelius was saved after he heard the gospel. That means he could not of been born again before he heard the gospel. If he was born again, hevwas born again without believing in Jesus!

Your missing what is being spoken about there
They are hearing by the word of God.
Basically, Faith comes by hearing God speak to you on the inside into your spirit.

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?” 17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Word means the living word of God, from His Spirit to our spirits the things of God this is how truths are revealed to us, no one is taught by man to know the Lord, but you apparently despise the words of God.

1 Corinthians 2
9 But as it is written:

“Eye has not seen, nor ear heard,
Nor have entered into the heart of man
The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.”

10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.

And what about Paul using this quote from Isaiah?
Let us see what it says, the complete verse.

Isaiah 53 is about the Christ, who Jesus was and is.
1 Who has believed our report?
And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?

NOW WHOM IS RESPONSIBLE FOR REVEALING WHO CHRIST IS TO PEOPLE?

What does Christ say about this very thing?
Matthew 16
13 When Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, “Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?”

14 So they said, “Some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”

15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?”

16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

17 Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

But you do err, as you do not believe this, your telling people that human preachers reveal Christ to the people.
Your religion is entirely man centered on who gets to find out the truth about Jesus Christ, and that it is an act of a human will and their choice only.

LETS SEE WHAT CHRIST SAYS ABOUT THIS VERY THING AS WELL
Luke 10
Jesus Rejoices in the Spirit
21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, “I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.
22 All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and who the Father is except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.”

In order for you to know who Christ is and believe in Him, this has to be willed unto you by God and the Son.
Otherwise that is hidden from you by both God and Christ.
No one knows them unless they sovereignly will it so, and only then do they know God and Christ.

I am going to put you on ignore now, God uses preachers to preach, but they do not know Christ and are not saved by hearing words spoken into the air. God gives ears to hear what the Spirit is saying.

Deuteronomy 29:4
Yet the Lord has not given you a heart to perceive and eyes to see and ears to hear, to this very day.

John 8
42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me.
43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word.
44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.
45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me.
46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me?
47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.”

To be of God means to have been born of God

Bye, I wont see anymore from you, as your not listening to the word. But I am sure some others do hear

 

[PinSeeker]

This is what you believe...

Right, I believe it, because the Holy Spirit said it, quite clearly. :)

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water(Holy Spirit) and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

The phrase "born of water and the Spirit" is not to be separated in the way that you suppose. Jesus's whole context is of being born again, which is wholly of the Spirit and not in any part of man. So, the phrase "born of water and the Spirit" refers to spiritual birth, which cleanses from sin and brings spiritual transformation and renewal, which are all acts of God and God only. "Water" here does not refer to the physical water of water baptism, which is an act of man. The background here is Ezekiel 36:25-27, where God promises, "I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean... And I will give you a new heart... And I will put my Spirit within you."

Grace and peace to you.

 

[user]

"Water" here does not refer to the physical water of water baptism, which is an act of man. The background here is Ezekiel 36:25-27, where God promises, "I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean... And I will give you a new heart... And I will put my Spirit within you."

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water(Holy Spirit) and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water(non-psychical undetermined clean water which is not water) and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.


Keep digging, you'll eventually dig yourself out.
-Whew!

 

[Christ4Me]

Then why do you disobey Acts 2:38?

Why do you oppose Peter's command to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins?

Do you actually think God will let you pull that off on judgement day?

I would not take that chance ever in my life.

You got guts.

I got scripture.

1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.... 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

I had obeyed the commandment of water baptism in being His disciple, but I also had done it enough times before when once was enough to be His disciple. Does that make me more saved than you? Do believers get second class status for getting sprinkled by water rather than baptism by immersion? Does the Catholic Church has the right to say any one water baptized outside the Catholic Church per their Catechism are not saved?

I am testifying to the power of God in being able to save those who believe the preaching of the cross as Paul did without water baptism.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

That Noah's family entered the ark was evidence of their faith, but it was also an essential act of obedience if they hoped to survive the flood. Baptism constitutes the good conscience toward God and Noah's entrance into the ark demonstrated his conscience was clear with God, and nothing stood between him and obedience to God's command.

The Flood is not congruent or symbolic with the concept of water baptism. They were faithful and obedient, yes. Water baptism is not likened to the Flood of Noah. They weren't baptized by water. The water was judgment that they were kept from. The Ark, was however symbolic for Christ. Being "in Christ" saves us from judgment.

 

[Scott Downey]

Acts 1:4-6
New King James Version

4 And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me;
5 for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.”
6 Therefore, when they had come together, they asked Him, saying, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?”

BUT, not AND, it means a contrast, something different

but
[bət]
CONJUNCTION

1. used to introduce a phrase or clause contrasting with what has already been mentioned.

 

[Titus]

Your missing what is being spoken about there
They are hearing by the word of God.
Basically, Faith comes by hearing God speak to you on the inside into your spirit.

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?” 17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Word means the living word of God, from His Spirit to our spirits the things of God this is how truths are revealed to us, no one is taught by man to know the Lord, but you apparently despise the words of God.

1 Corinthians 2
9 But as it is written:

“Eye has not seen, nor ear heard,
Nor have entered into the heart of man
The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.”

10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.

And what about Paul using this quote from Isaiah?
Let us see what it says, the complete verse.

Isaiah 53 is about the Christ, who Jesus was and is.
1 Who has believed our report?
And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?

NOW WHOM IS RESPONSIBLE FOR REVEALING WHO CHRIST IS TO PEOPLE?

What does Christ say about this very thing?
Matthew 16
13 When Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, “Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?”

14 So they said, “Some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”

15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?”

16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

17 Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

But you do err, as you do not believe this, your telling people that human preachers reveal Christ to the people.
Your religion is entirely man centered on who gets to find out the truth about Jesus Christ, and that it is an act of a human will and their choice only.

LETS SEE WHAT CHRIST SAYS ABOUT THIS VERY THING AS WELL
Luke 10
Jesus Rejoices in the Spirit
21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, “I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.
22 All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and who the Father is except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.”

In order for you to know who Christ is and believe in Him, this has to be willed unto you by God and the Son.
Otherwise that is hidden from you by both God and Christ.
No one knows them unless they sovereignly will it so, and only then do they know God and Christ.

I am going to put you on ignore now, God uses preachers to preach, but they do not know Christ and are not saved by hearing words spoken into the air. God gives ears to hear what the Spirit is saying.

Deuteronomy 29:4
Yet the Lord has not given you a heart to perceive and eyes to see and ears to hear, to this very day.

John 8
42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me.
43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word.
44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.
45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me.
46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me?
47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.”

To be of God means to have been born of God

Bye, I wont see anymore from you, as your not listening to the word. But I am sure some others do hear

You accuse me of denying the Power of God.
By a misrepresentation that "My" doctrine is man centered. I dont have a doctrine. I follow the doctrine of Christ.
The reality is you are guilty of the very things you accuse of me!

Cornelius had to have a Holy man of God come to him and speak The truth to him. Without Peter, Cornelius could have never known the Christ on his own.

You give one example while Jesus' new testament came into effect, where someone was saved by a direct operation of God? Hint: You will not find it because no one was saved under Jesus' will and testament directly spoken to by God.

Even Paul while spoken to directly from Jesus after he left earth. Was told by Jesus that some other man would instruct him on what he must do to be saved,
Acts 9:1-19

That other man was Ananias who TAUGHT Paul the gospel of Christ.
The new testament clearly teaches we are saved by what is WRITTEN!
Not before we learn the written gospel of Christ like you wrongly teach.

1John 5:13
These things I have WRITTEN TO YOU who believe in the name of the Son of God, that YOU MAY KNOW THAT YOU HAVE ETERNAL LIFE, AND THAT YOU MAY CONTINUE TO BELIEVE IN THE NAME OF THE SON OF GOD.

It is by the revelation of the Holy Spirit i.e. the Inspired Holy Word of God that we get understanding.

1Corinthians 2:13
These things which we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

The teachings of the Holy Spirit are written down in the Bible for our learning.
You have DENYED the power of the written word in it's all sufficient completion.

Jude 3
Beloved while I was very diligent to WRITE to you concerning our common salvation, I found it necessary to WRITE to you exhorting you to contend earnestly for the Faith WHICH WAS ONCE FOR ALL DELIVERED TO THE SAINTS.

Once for all DELIVERED. Completed! Perfect!
You deny the power of Gods revelation when you teach man cannot be saved by it ALONE!

You wrongly teach that the Word of God is not all powerfull for you teach we must be saved apart from the gospel of Jesus Christ.

For you, there must be something outside the Bible that will save us.
Therefore you deny the sacred power of the COMPLETED Word of God.

All false teaches lead people away from the Bible.
If you can convince folks that the Bible cannot teach them the will of
God. And that they cannot know God only by His all powerful message of love.
Then the false teacher can manipulate the hearer into believing they must listen to them. And what they teach as supposed truth.
Rather than putting ALL Their trust in Jesus' Word. Dont try to put doubt in me Sir!

Hebrews 4:12
For the word of God is LIVING AND POWERFUL and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the division of SOUL AND SPIRIT and of joints and marrow, and is a DISCERNER of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

You teach the Biblical written revelation, the gospel of Jesus Christ is not enough.
We need something else that must be done by God to save us!

You do not believe the Holy Bible. It equips all of us to know the will of God!

2Timothy 3:16-17.
All scripture is given by inspiration of God and is profitable for DOCTRINE, FOR REPROOF, FOR CORRECTION, FOR INSTRUCTION IN RIGHTEOUSNESS.
THAT THE MAN OF GOD MAY BE COMPLETE, PERFECT THROUGHLY EQUIPPED FOR EVERY GOOD WORK.

No other revelation from God outside His completed revelation is needed. Otherwise His Word, revelation is not completed as you teach!

You deny the way God has chosen to draw all men to Him.
It is by the POWER of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Romans 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ For it is the POWER of God to salvation for everyone who believes for the jew first and also the greek.
Where do we learn who God is? How do we learn the righteousness of God.
Outside the Bible as you teach?
17 For in it the righteousness of God is REVEALED FROM FAITH TO FAITH; AS IT IS WRITTEN, THE JUSTIFIED SHALL LIVE BY FAITH.

No one comes to God in these last days outside the teaching of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Romans 10:16-17
For they have not all obeyed the Gospel, for Isaiah, says, Lord who has believed OUR report, (men gave the report. (not directly from the Holy Spirit before they heard the gospel).

So then faith cometh by hearing(The Holy Spirit outside the gospel? No faith from hearing the Gospel)
And hearing by the word of God.
By the written word of God is how we hear today.

Hebrews 1:1-3
....By the WORD OF HIS POWER.
Deny the Gospel cannot do it all is to deny the power of God!

 

[Titus]

Are we regenerated i.e. born again before we hear and believe the gospel as Scott Downy teaches?
Scott Downy teaches Cornelius was saved before he believed in the death, burial and ressurection of Jesus Christ. Is his doctrine Biblically correct?

1Peter 1:23
Having been BORN AGAIN, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through THE WORD OF GOD which lives and abides forever,

Bible teaches regeneration is through the incorruptible seed, this is how we are born again.

That seed is the word of God, the gospel of Jesus Christ,
Luke 8:11
Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God.
Begotten of the gospel never before as Mr. Downy wrongly teaches.
1Corinthians 4:15

 

[Phoneman777]

I just trip on my own walk with God, and when I am doing good, I tell folks follow me as I follow Christ.

That is the best process to rearrange someones fruit basket.

Fact is, if I am a cusser then I can't inspect a liar etc.

Can you show me where the Bible says it's OK to disregard "fruit inspector" deputy badges Jesus gave us because sometimes we, too, mess up? If not, you need to put the badge back on and start holding the brethren accountable.

I think the reason church is so out of hand with girls sitting their with open Bibles half naked and men getting crooks in their necks trying to look while facing the pulpit is because church standards have given way to the false "feel good" Gospel, IMO. If there was ever a need of "the discipline of the church" for Christians, it's now. After all, why should the unchurched "come out from among them and be ye separate" if what they enter into looks like, talks like, thinks like, is hungover on Sunday morning like, etc., the world?

 

[Titus]

The Flood is not congruent or symbolic with the concept of water baptism. They were faithful and obedient, yes. Water baptism is not likened to the Flood of Noah. They weren't baptized by water. The water was judgment that they were kept from. The Ark, was however symbolic for Christ. Being "in Christ" saves us from judgment.

I know this is not addressed to me.
Sir, You are incorrect. The type is the WATER that saved Noah and his family.
The antitype is the baptism in the name of Jesus that saves us today.

1Peter 3:20-21
Who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, in which a few that is, eight souls were saved through WATER.
There is also an antitype which now saves us---Baptism, (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the ressurection of Jesus Christ.

Water baptism is likened to the flood water that saved Noah. It is the type. The baptism is the antitype.

 

[Titus]

LOL!! Dude, this post made me laugh out loud. Ruin your reputation?? An online forum??

You need to know, your despair is caused by the false religion you have been indoctrinated into.
My Granddad was too honest like you to be a calvinist. He never got anything that convinced him he was chosen, elected, regenerated.
His life was miserable because he was an honest person.
Until he found out that the church he was involved with taught error.
He learned that God loves everyone. God wants everyone to come to the knowledge of the truth,
1Timothy 2:4.

Friend, if You are not totally depraved with an inherited sin nature.
Then you can turn to God! And God will happily save you!
No wonder you have addictions. I would be so messed up if I believed God hated me and would not allow me to chose Him over sin, if that is my desire.

Look, getting saved does not mean your physical addictions get miraculously healed.
You will still have to overcome them. But God will be with you. He will love you, despite your struggles.

If I can prove to you that you are not a totally depraved reprobate inherently.
Then you will be free from the chains that are holding you back from becoming a child of God. God loves you right now Lifelong sinner. You have good in You. That's all the proof you need that you are not born Totally depraved.

Here is the proof,

We are not born in sin.
You base your interpretation off of a false premise.

Words don't have any real meaning taken out of context.
The message being given defines the meaning of the words used by the author.

If all men inherited a sinful, depraved nature and guilt of sin like any other man then:

1. Jesus had an advantage in overcoming sin that we do not. Therefore the following facts are true.

2. Jesus was NOT made like His brethren in all things,
Hebrews 2:14-18
Inasmuch then as children have partaken of flesh and blood, He Himself LIKEWISE SHARED THE SAME, that through death He might destroy him who had power of death, that is the devil,

Point: If calvinism be true then Jesus did not share the same, because all men are born wicked, depraved. Jesus was born sinless. Calvinism is refuted. Calvinism contradicts the Bible.

Verse 15 and release those who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
16 For indeed He does not give aid to angels, but He does give aid to the seed of Abraham.
17 Therefore in ALL, ALL, ALL ALL, things He HAD TO BE MADE LIKE HIS BRETHREN, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people.

Point: If Calvinism be true Christ was not made in all things like His brethren, for His brethren are created totally depraved and He was born totally sinless/perfect. Calvinism refuted. Calvinism is heresy.

Verse 18 For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.

Point: If Calvinism be true man is different in how he has been created, to desire nothing but sin. Whereas Jesus was only tempted to sin but not born completely depraved without any ability to resist sin.
Calvinism refuted. Calvinism is heresy.

3. Jesus was not tempted in all things just as we are,
Hebrews 4:15
For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was IN ALL, ALL, ALL, POINTS TEMPTED AS WE ARE, YET WITHOUT SIN.

Point:
If Calvinism be true then Jesus was not tempted, made like us to sin from birth like we are.
Jesus was sinless, perfect and able to resist sin. Calvinism even teaches Jesus was incapable of sinnig.
100% opposite of what the scriptures teach about Jesus being like us in all points.
Calvinism refuted. Calvinism is heresy.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

. The type is the WATER that saved Noah and his family

THE ARK SAVED THEM, NOT THE WATER. It just seems like you have no discernment. You've been misterpretating every scripture you present.
Baptism by the Holy Spirit is essential. You aren't listening to me, so I gave you a teaching from one of the best and you reject it. I'm done.