Am I the only one on the planet who understands Romans 7?

[Peterlag]

The Holy Spirit indwells His Born Again child..

You must know in your spirit that you are Born Again?

Being born again by having the spirit within is not the same as walking in him or walking in the spirit. Do you not understand the following verse? In one little short verse it's mentioned twice. Two different concepts. One received Christ within and then walk in him. Receive Christ is one concept and walking in him is another. They are not the same.

Colossians 2:6
As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

 

[Ritajanice]

Being born again by having the spirit within is not the same as walking in him or walking in the spirit. Do you not understand the following verse? In one little short verse it's mentioned twice. Two different concepts. One received Christ within and then walk in him. Receive Christ is one concept and walking in him is another. They are not the same.

Colossians 2:6
As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

Listen, I can only be taught by the Holy Spirit, as he’s a Living Spirit, who lives in my heart/spirit.

I am being made into the image of Jesus, therefore I walk in the Spirit daily, now, that’s not to say I won’t walk in my old mindset at times, sometimes as I’m sure you know, self can take over?

In the most basic sense, to walk in the Spirit means to live a life that depends on the Spirit's power to (1) grow in godliness, (2) obey God's commands, and (3) experience increasing intimacy with God.

Now, please tell me, how do you walk in the Spirit daily?

Do you experience the power of God at work within you?

I 100% know his power has been transforming me..to become more humble, more patient, more careful with my words to others...he can and does correct us through others, you know in your heart when he does this.

 

[Ritajanice]

There's no verse anywhere in the Epistles that says Gentile Christian. You may talk like this or even think like this and can write all kinds of topics about it. But the Bible does not talk like that anywhere in the Epistles. And this is important because we need to know what the Scriptures are talking about when they use words.

I don’t think I said there was?...show me where I said Gentile Christian, if I did, it was a mistake.

As a Born Again we have been grafted into the vine,?....are you denying this, if so, our discussion is over, as I’m not going to try and force you to believe what I believe?

John 15:1-8

King James Version

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15 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.

 

[CadyandZoe]

There's no reason for me to read past your first paragraph because we are not on the same page. You are saying the exact opposite of what I'm saying. I'm saying we no longer have a sin nature when the spirit of Christ enters the Christian. You are saying we sin because that is who we are. The difference between you and me is this...

The victory in the Christian life is as simple as renewing our minds to who we are and what we have already received in Christ. It’s not the struggle of two natures inside of us. We will continue to struggle with sin if we see ourselves as old sinners saved by grace. And so it's also true we will manifest the change that took place in our new nature when we understand we are not old sinners saved by grace. Thus, we act like being part of the senses world when we see ourselves as being part of the senses world. We act like being part of the Christian world when we see ourselves as being part of Christ—i.e., in our born-again spirits.

Yes, I intend to disagree with your position because it is wrong and dangerous. Your claim that we no longer have a sinful nature is unsupported by the scriptures. In fact, according to Paul, our sinful nature is located at the core of our being. He teaches you this in Romans 7. I say dangerous because some Christians, living under this doctrine committed suicide in despair of not achieving "victory."

You have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Ritajanice]

Yes, I intend to disagree with your position because it is wrong and dangerous. Your claim that we no longer have a sinful nature is unsupported by the scriptures. In fact, according to Paul, our sinful nature is located at the core of our being. He teaches you this in Romans 7. I say dangerous because some Christians, living under this doctrine committed suicide in despair of not achieving "victory."

You have no idea what you are talking about.

That’s sad to hear about those committing suicide, I always have believed that it’s God in us who achieves the victory?...not sure if that’s biblical, Cady,

He started a work in us and only he can bring it to completion?

I don’t worry about anything, he started a work in me the day he made me Born Again.

What is our spirit according to the Bible?
It refers to the part of man that connects and communicates with God. Our spirit differs from our soul because our spirit is always pointed toward and exists exclusively for God, whereas our soul can be self-centered. The joy, comfort and peace of God's presence can only be experienced through our spirit.

This sin business concerns me because, if we are Born Again of incorruptible seed, how can we sin any longer?...as Gods word says...

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◄ Romans 8:9 ►

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Verse (Click for Chapter) King James Bible But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

What does John say ?

Romans 7​

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King James Version​

​

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7 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

 

[rebuilder 454]

No I do not know what you are talking about. I have gotten into many debates on this site with all kinds of people who make stuff up that is not in the Bible. And the term sinless perfection is not in the Scripture. There was another guy a few months ago trying to convince me that there were Gentile Christians. And he would tell me how many friends he personally knows who have never been Jewish but are now Christian. So he should write his own book about his friends because the Bible does not have words that talk about a Gentile Christian. Such a concept does not exist in Scripture.

So much of this is wrong.
You think you are a bible expert, and yet you er on the trinity , the old nature, and the gentile bride.

So Paul picked up bis cross daily for nothing because he misunderstood that he had no old nature and his spirit was innocent when he did sin.
When you yourself sin, you sin spirit, soul, and body.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Being born again by having the spirit within is not the same as walking in him or walking in the spirit. Do you not understand the following verse? In one little short verse it's mentioned twice. Two different concepts. One received Christ within and then walk in him. Receive Christ is one concept and walking in him is another. They are not the same.

Colossians 2:6
As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

Everyone knows this.

You really should re read romans 8.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Yes, I intend to disagree with your position because it is wrong and dangerous. Your claim that we no longer have a sinful nature is unsupported by the scriptures. In fact, according to Paul, our sinful nature is located at the core of our being. He teaches you this in Romans 7. I say dangerous because some Christians, living under this doctrine committed suicide in despair of not achieving "victory."

You have no idea what you are talking about.

He is basing his entire doctrine on the notion that rom 7 is before salvation and rom 8 is now addressing a believer.
So he concludes there is no sin nature in his self.
No desire to sin.
SMH

 

[rebuilder 454]

IOW in the op's mind there is no sin battle.

The only way that conclusion could remotely or possibly exist, is if he's never come in the presence Holy God.
God Is So holy that should any self-righteous human come in contact with him, they would be knocked down and unable to move ,because He's so Holy that this Mortal man could not stand in his presence.

 

[Behold]

So Paul picked up bis cross daily

Paul was not picking up the Cross that Jesus died on to forgive Paul all his sin.

What Paul was "picking up" was this..

"I die daily". which means "i can do all things through Christ", BECAUSE.. "ITS NOT I who live, but Christ who lives in Me"..

So, to "die daily" is to submit utterly to the Power of Christ that is real discipleship..

Vs, "im trying to be like Christ and give up stuff, as MY SELF RIGHTEOUS = idea of dying daily".

Christianity is not about trying harder to be better, as that is RELIGION.
Christianity...,is submitting to God's authority and power, utterly, so that God lives out HIS Righteousness through the born again, as "I can do all things through Christ", which is REAL discipleship.

So, when a person is trying to DO THAT of themselves...., then Jesus says...>"apart from me you can do nothing".

 

[rebuilder 454]

Paul was not picking up the Cross that Jesus died on to forgive Paul all his sin.

What Paul was "picking up" was this..

"I die daily". which means "i can do all things through Christ", BECAUSE.. "ITS NOT I who live, but Christ who lives in Me"..

So, to "die daily" is to submit utterly to the Power of Christ that is real discipleship..

Vs, "im trying to be like Christ and give up stuff, as MY SELF RIGHTEOUS = idea of dying daily".

Christianity is not about trying harder to be better, as that is RELIGION.
Christianity...,is submitting to God's authority and power, utterly, so that God lives out HIS Righteousness through the born again, as "I can do all things through Christ", which is REAL discipleship.

So, when a person is trying to DO THAT of themselves...., then Jesus says...>"apart from me you can do nothing".

Nope
You need some study on the types of sin.
Just think of all the sins of omission you commit.
But your self righteous position is the low road indeed.
The mature saint is held to a higher standard than a babe in Christ.
Therefore all your sin is judged harshly because you should know better, and yet you fail every day.
Not knowing you fail, is in your not knowing the Holy God you should properly represent.

 

[Behold]

Nope
You need some study on the types of sin.

I don't study sin.
I study Paul's doctrine and so forth.

Paul said that "the old man of sin, is crucified with Christ" and the born again believer is to "reckon Him dead".

You want to study him, instead, @rebuilder 454 ,, which makes you a sin expert but not a Christian, with understanding.
Which explains your theology and your obvious lack of understanding reading this word : CHRISTianity

See, the born again, is "made free from sin"., having become "The RIGHTEOUSNESS of GOD... in Christ".

CHRISTians are not sinners, .. they are Sons/Daughters of God..

Sinners, are unbelievers who are under the law, and the born again, are "not under the law, but under Grace".

And if you ever discover why, then, you've taken your first step into real faith, and your very first step of real discipleship.

I hope you find that day.

 

[Ritajanice]

I don't study sin.
I study Paul's doctrine and so forth.

Paul said that "the old man of sin, is crucified with Christ" and the born again believer is to "reckon Him dead".

You want to study him, instead, @rebuilder 454 ,, which makes you a sin expert but not a Christian, with understanding.
Which explains your theology and your obvious lack of understanding reading this word : CHRISTianity

See, the born again, is "made free from sin"., having become "The RIGHTEOUSNESS of GOD... in Christ".

CHRISTians are not sinners, .. they are Sons/Daughters of God..

Sinners, are unbelievers who are under the law, and the born again, are "not under the law, but under Grace".

And if you ever discover why, then, you've taken your first step into real faith, and your very first step of real discipleship.

I hope you find that day.

I actually felt my burden of sin removed , when I repented of my sin and God forgave me and made me Born Again of imperishable seed..and also gifted me with Faith.

A Born Again cannot sin as they have been Born Again of imperishable seed....it’s my old mindset that is being renewed....God started a work in us the day we became Born Again ..and by his power he will finish it....I feel his power at work in me every day...mind blowing, nothing on the planet like the Living word of God.

My testimony and belief.

 

[Behold]

I actually felt my burden of sin removed , when I repented of my sin and God forgave me and made me Born Again of imperishable seed..and also gifted me with Faith.

My testimony and belief.

So, why would you repent of sin, before you have trusted (had faith) in Christ?

Who were you repenting for?, if you repented BEFORE you had known about Jesus, ?

Can you be more clear? As, why would you want to repent of sin... unless you knew about Jesus, first, and that is the reason you repented.

Explain please.

See, you are, i think, saying that, "i didnt know who Jesus was".. "but i repented of sin", and then after i did that.. God caused me to believe in Jesus, because i didnt know to do this yet, even tho i had repented of my sin".

That is what im hearing, and you need to clear this up a bit.
Ok?

So, explain please, how you can KNOW to repent of sin........and yet, you have no understanding to believe in Jesus, until AFTER you repented of your sin"/

What? ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

 

[Ritajanice]

So, why would you repent of sin, before you have trusted in Christ?

Can you be more clear? As, why would you want to repent of sin... unless you knew about Jesus, first, and that is the reason you repented.

Explain please.

I knew all about Jesus, of course and yes that’s why I repented ...God brought me to believe in Jesus first, then he brought me to repentance and Godly sorrow.

God works his way Brother...not your way @Behold .

I go by the Living word of God, His seed that I received into my heart, where it continues to flourish and grow, because it was planted by God via his Holy Spirit...my faith is Alive and Active as is my relationship with God, through his Living word.

Christ is Alive in me..I’m dead ..

 

[Behold]

I knew all about Jesus, of course and yes that’s why I repented

Yes.

Same as we all came to Jesus.

"faith comes by hearing".

It is the Holy Spirit who takes that "knowledge of Christ" and shows us that its the TRUTH.
This is supernatural.

What Calvin did, was take that, and twist it into..."but only those who God chooses to BELIEVE, can believe it'.

And that is Calvin's Lie., which is "Calvinism".

See Reader, the reason that people went to hell today, is not because God predestined them to go... its because they chose to reject the offer of the Cross of Christ, and when you chose that, and you die, then you chose to NOT go to heaven.

God honors our choice to believe or not to believe... and that CHOICE determines where you end up, in eternity after you die.

Calvin does not agree. Calvin teaches that God makes you believe or prevents you from believing.

And if God prevented you from believing, then God can't hold you accountable for being a Christ Rejector.

So, that would be an Insane God, and that one is Calvin's.. Except, that its Calvin who is insane, and that explains his Theology.

 

[Ritajanice]

Yes.

Same as we all came to Jesus.

"faith comes by hearing".

It is the Holy Spirit who takes that "knowledge of Christ" and shows us that its the TRUTH.
This is supernatural.

Of course it’s supernatural, Amen!...many don’t understand that though..

 

[Ritajanice]

See, you are, i think, saying that, "i didnt know who Jesus was

Oh!!!...I knew all about Jesus..you can’t be Born Again without the name of Jesus...it was amazing how God brought Jesus to the forefront of my mind, before he made me Born Of The Spirit....the supernatural Living spiritual rebirth..blew my mind.

My testimony and belief.

 

[Behold]

Oh!!!...I knew all about Jesus..you can’t be Born Again without the name of Jesus...it was amazing how God brought Jesus to the forefront of my mind, before he made me Born Of The Spirit....the supernatural Living spiritual rebirth..blew my mind.

My testimony and belief.

I know of people who say...

"Yes i know its true... I know that Jesus is real, and that i need to be saved, and i know that Jesus is the only Savior"

"BUT, im not ready yet.....im young, and i want to LIVE........i dont want to give up all my FUN yet".


See that one Reader?

They KNOW to believe, because their heart has been opened by the Holy Spirit..... but they are willfully not believing..

Why is that so dangerous..?

It because this Call of God that is God's Grace leading us to believe, ... when you keep not coming to that accepting faith, when you know its true....then.... this call of the Holy Spirit is heard less and less over time. And one day, the call can't be heard anymore in your heart, and that is the day Hell became your eternal home.
Thats a FACT.

Listen...
There is a point in time... where You can't be brought back to repentance from willful unbelieving, if you keep it resisting the Holy Spirit's call,...
= because your heart .. your conscience = will become SEARED over time and then it can't hear the call of God anymore and you are then doomed.
There is no going back., because you crossed a LINE in your hardened heart, whereby the HOLY SPIRIT cannot be heard anymore..

And also.....there is this...

You dont know when you are going to die.
It may be in the next 15 mins reader.. and you have thought that you had more time, and you would believe in Jesus LATER..
And yet, you died first....

This is why the NT tells you.. ."NOW is the time.. .NOW is the Day of Salvation".

See, you dont know when your lifetime is UP, and Hebrews 9:27 will find you., as it finds us all.

Reader, dont wait..
Dont wait.
If you know to Trust in Jesus, and you are "going to do it later" then please dont do that.
Please dont ever do that..
Trust in Christ, now... get your eternity with God settled NOW.... Get God's forgiveness today.. and then Heaven is assured and Hell is forsaken.

Its not a myth.
its not a fantasy.
Jesus DIED for you, to prove its true, and He rose from the DEAD and proved its all REAL.

Believe it.

 

[CadyandZoe]

He is basing his entire doctrine on the notion that rom 7 is before salvation and rom 8 is now addressing a believer.
So he concludes there is no sin nature in his self.
No desire to sin.
SMH

Thank-you