2 Peter 3:10 The Big Whoosh

[WPM]

It is not talking about ruling from heaven. Simply consider the next few verses.

10 All the land will be changed into a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem; but Jerusalem will rise and remain on its site from Benjamin’s Gate as far as the place of the First Gate to the Corner Gate, and from the Tower of Hananel to the king’s wine presses. 11 People will live in it, and there will no longer be a curse, for Jerusalem will dwell in security.

Zechariah is talking about the land surrounding Jerusalem. NOT heaven.

Where does it say Jesus is on earth there? Nowhere! As per normal: you force your beliefs into the sacred text. Adding unto Scripture may be a Premil trait, but it is forbidden by Scripture.

 

[WPM]

This is a very wrong and unbiblical belief.
That Jesus will be physically on earth when He Returns is clearly stated. He comes down from heaven and is present in His Holy Temple, in Jerusalem, as many scriptures tell us. Zechariah 14:16-21, Isaiah 2:1-4, Psalms 45.46. 47, & 48

This is a Premil trait, you reference Old Testament passages that do not say what you say they do as if they do. To quote them in full and highlight the inspired detail would be to expose your whole thesis.

 

[Keraz]

I have decades of biblical experience and have never seen anything like this in scripture. Nothing of this sort is found in the OD or same timeframe passages in Rev. There is trib from satan for years before the second coming, no firey wrath from God during any of that time.

Seems you have missed quite a lot of the prophetic Word. Read and understand these Prophesies:

The following seventy three Bible verses describe the forthcoming Day of the Lords vengeance and wrath, which will take the form of a Coronal Mass Ejection: an explosion of the suns surface. This is the next prophesied event, the fulfilment of Psalms 83 and the Sixth Seal of Revelation. Note that in three quarters of these verses, it categorically states how it is the Lord who instigates this fire judgement.

Deuteronomy 32:22 For fire is set ablaze by My anger, it burns to the depths of Sheol, it devours the increase of the earth, its flames reach into the mountains.

2 Samuel 22:9-10 He parted the heavens, with smoke, devouring fire and searing heat.

Job 18:5 The tents of the evildoer are burned and brimstone destroys them.

Psalms 11:6 He will rain down burning coals and brimstone upon the godless peoples.

Psalms 18:7-15 The earth quaked as the Lord came in devouring fire. He covered Himself in

Psalms 21:8-9 You burn up Your enemies, like a fiery furnace, You consume them. [darkness

Psalms 29:7 The Lord’s shout strikes with flaming fire.

Psalms 37:20 Evil people will die, they will be incinerated and go up in smoke.

Psalms 50:3 Our God is coming, a consuming fire runs ahead of Him and around Him a storm rages

Psalms 66:12 You allowed men to rule us, we passed through fire, now we live in safety.

Psalms 83:14-15 As fire rages through a forest, as flames on the hills – terrify them with storms.

Psalms 97:3-4 Fire goes before Him, all around it burns up His enemies, the whole earth sees Psalms 140:10 May the Lord throw my enemies into the fire. [and trembles.

Psalms 144:5-6 Lord, part the heavens and come down, cause volcanoes and flashes of fire.

Isaiah 1:31 The deeds of the unrighteous will be as a spark, all will burn together with no one to put out the fire.

Isaiah 4:4 At that time the Sovereign Lord will cleanse Jerusalem with a judgement of fire.

Isaiah 9:18-19 For evil burned and went up in smoke, the Land was scorched and the people were fuel for the fire.

Isaiah 10:17 The Light of Israel will become a fire, it will burn and consume His enemies in a day

Isaiah 13:13 The heavens and the earth will shake on the Day the Lord vents His blazing anger.

Isaiah 24:1-4 Be warned: the Lord is about to strip the earth and scatter its inhabitants. The earth will dry and wither up.

Isaiah 26:11 You, O Lord are ready to act, but people don’t see it. Let the fire reserved for Your enemies consume them.

Isaiah 29:6 Punishment will come from the Lord, with thunder, earthquakes, storms and consuming flames of fire.

Isaiah 30:26-28 On that Day, the sun will shine seven times brighter. The Lord comes in anger, His tongue a devouring fire, to sieve the nations.

Isaiah 31:9 They will surrender their stronghold to the Lord, the One whose fire blazes in Zion.

Isaiah 47:14 Astrologers and divinators will be as stubble as the fire burns them up.

Isaiah 50:11 Look: all you who start a fire, that is what you will receive from Me.

Isaiah 62:1 For Zion’s sake, I will not remain quiet. Her deliverance comes, burning like a torch.

Isaiah 66:15-16 The Lord comes in fire, like a whirlwind, bringing retribution in His furious anger. He will judge with fire and many will be slain by Him.

Jeremiah 4:4 Dedicate yourself to the Lord, if not, My anger will blaze up in flaming fire.

Jeremiah 5:14 ...those people will be like firewood, that My fiery judgement will burn up.

Jeremiah 6:29 The fiery bellows of judgement burn fiercely to refine My people.

Jeremiah 7:20 The Lord says: My raging fury will be poured out, it will burn un extinguished.

Jeremiah 11:16 You were a beautiful tree, but I will set you on fire, a mighty blaze.

Jeremiah 15:14...For My anger is like a fire that will flare up against you.

Jeremiah 17:27 ...if you disobey, I will set Jerusalem on fire, no one will be able to put it out.

Jeremiah 21:12-14 Dispense justice or the fire of My fury will blaze up and burn unquenched.

Jeremiah 48:45 Flames will burst out and burn the people of Moab.

Jeremiah 49:2 The time is coming when Ammon will be burnt to ashes.

Jeremiah 49:27 I shall set fire to Damascus, it will burn up that city. [around.

Jeremiah 50:32 Babylon will fall, I will set fire to your towns, it will burn up everything

Lamentations 2:3 In His fierce anger, He withdraws His protecting hand and He blazes in Judah as a raging fire.

Ezekiel 15:6-8 ...the residents of Jerusalem will be as fuel for the fire. I will make their Land desolate.

Ezekiel 19:14 Fire bursts forth in the vine, [Israel] burning up its shoots. It has no strong branch anymore, no sceptre for those who bear rule.

Ezekiel 20:47-48 I will start a fire in the Land, flames that will scorch all the area. All will see that it is I, the Lord who has set it ablaze.

Ezekiel 21:15 My sword of wrath, ready to kill – flashing like lightning.

Ezekiel 21:28 A sword is drawn for slaughter against the Ammonites – flashing like lightning.

Ezekiel 22:20 As metal is smelted in a furnace, so I will deal with you, Israel.

Ezekiel 30:16 I will set Egypt on fire.

Hosea 8:14 Israel and Judah have forgotten their Maker – I will send fire upon them.

Joel 1:19-20 To You, Lord, I cry out, for fire has consumed the pastures and trees of the Land.

Joel 2:3 It comes in devastating fire, as a leaping flame, leaving behind a desolate waste.

Joel 2:30-31 On the great and terrible Day of the Lord, the sky and the earth will show blood, fire and smoke.

Amos 1:4 Therefore, I shall send fire on Damascus [Syria]

Amos 1:7 Therefore, I shall send fire on Philistia. [Palestine]

Amos 1:10 Therefore, I shall send fire on Tyre. [Lebanon]

Amos 1:12 Therefore, I shall send fire on Edom. [the ungodly nations]

Amos 1:14 Therefore, I shall send fire on Ammon. [Jordan]

Amos 2:2 Therefore, I shall send fire on Moab. [Southern Jordan]

Amos 2:5 Therefore, I shall send fire on Judah and Jerusalem. [The State of Israel]

Micah 1:3 No one can withstand His fierce anger, His wrath is like a volcanic fire.

Zephaniah 1:18 ..the whole land will be consumed by His fiery wrath, destruction comes to all the earth. He will make a sudden and terrifying end to all who live in the Land.

Zephaniah 2:2 Prepare yourselves before the Lord’s burning anger comes upon you.

Zephaniah 3:8 Wait for Me, for the Day that I accuse you and pour out My burning anger, the whole earth will be consumed by the fire of My wrath.

Haggai 2:21-22 I shall shake the heavens and the earth and break the powers of the heathen.

Zechariah 12:6 On that Day, Judah will be as a torch that will burn up the surrounding nations.

Zechariah 13:9 I shall pass the remaining third through the fire and refine them.

Malachi 3:2-3 Who can endure that Day? He is like refiners fire, testing and purifying.

Malachi 4:1 The Day comes; burning like a furnace. That Day will burn up all evildoers.

Matthew 3:12 ...the chaff, He will burn up in an inextinguishable fire.

2 Peter 3:7 The present heaven and earth are reserved for fire, on the Day of judgement. 1 Corinthians 3:13 Every persons works will be revealed by fire. The destruction of the ungodly peoples.

Hebrews 8:26-27 For if we deliberately persist in sin after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there remains only the terrifying expectation of a fierce fire that will consume God’s enemies.

Revelation 14:18 Then the angel who has authority over fire called out; Now is the time to reap the earth. The harvest is ripe to be gathered into the great winepress of God.

Reference: REB, NIV, NET. Some verses abridged.

 

[Keraz]

This is a Premil trait, you reference Old Testament passages that do not say what you say they do as if they do. To quote them in full and highlight the inspired detail would be to expose your whole thesis.

Psalms 2:7-9 ...the Decree of God to His Son... I shall give you the nations as your domain, the earth to its furthest ends as Your possession.....

Of course Jesus will; physically Return, He said He would, Matthew 9:27, and the angels confirmed it. Acts 1:11 Also; Hebrews 9:28,
It is the AMillennium thesis that is wrong. You are denying and rejecting a basic Christian doctrine; of the second coming of the Lord Jesus, as King of Kings and Lord of Lords. As opposed to His First Advent: as the suffering servant.

 

[Taken]

First of all, Zechariah 14 makes absolutely no allusion to a future 1,000 years after the second coming, or does Zechariah 14 compare with any of the detail outlined in Revelation 20 (start, middle or finish). The detail occurring at the end of Revelation 20 only compares with the many passages relating to Christ’s one final future all-consummating Second Advent – there we see the destruction of every enemy of Christ and righteousness.

A helpful pointer that should aid the open-minded reader dissect the book of Zechariah is the phrase “in that day.” It connects the whole book together. It is mentioned 20 times in this Old Testament prophecy. It is extremely notable that reference after reference to “in that day” actually refers to the 1st Advent. Zechariah 14 also describes AD 70 and the spread of the Gospel to the darkened nations.

AD 70 is referenced in Zechariah 13 and 14 but generally it is a symbolic looking at Christ's ministry. There are a mixture of events relating to the life and ministry of Christ, Jerusalem's judgment (AD 70), the going out of the Gospel to the Gentiles. Notwithstanding, these are all tied together in Christ – and cannot be divorced one from another. Jerusalem was destroyed because of their rejection of Christ. The Gentiles came against the city, but the Gospel in turn went out among the Gentiles with great success.

Second, as you study the New Testament you see that the wicked are all destroyed when Jesus comes, this disallows the placing of this after the second coming. There will be no mortals or no sinners to populate the new earth, what is more, they are prohibited from inheriting it (Matthew 25:34 &25:46, 1 Corinthians 6:9, and 1 Corinthians 15:50).

Thirdly, the keeping of the Judaic sacrificial system has been eternally abolished (see Galatians 4:9-10, Colossians 2:14, 16, 20-22 ). Many of the place names in Jerusalem don't exist anymore. Localized worship in a brick temple in Jerusalem has gone forever. We now worship God in spirit and in truth John 4:21).

* It is the “Lord” that descends to the clouds to call up to Him those IN Christ.
* It is the “Lamb” of God in Heaven that opens the Seals and “His” Wrath/Tribulation (for rejection) is sent upon the Earth.
* It is the “Son” of God on a Cloud that reaps the Earth.
* It is the “King of kings” that returns to Earth and reigns for 1,000 years, IN His Kingdom, with His saints, / mortal believers / (not killed during the Tribulation, but not confessed saved), repopulate the earth...ie Remnant.
* After 1,000 years, wars...all anti-spirits sent to hell eternally and any anti-mortals killed.

God is omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient....by what name He is called notifies us what particular prophecy is being fulfilled.

King “OF” kings is Jesus ruling His Earthly Kingdom OVER EARTHLY kings.

After NO mortals EXIST, there are no “Earthly kings”.... God is not called King...He is call “glorified men’s”....”GOD”, and glorified men are call God’s People.

 

[ewq1938]

Seems you have missed quite a lot of the prophetic Word. Read and understand these Prophesies:

The following seventy three Bible verses describe the forthcoming Day of the Lords vengeance and wrath, which will take the form of a Coronal Mass Ejection: an explosion of the suns surface. This is the next prophesied event, the fulfilment of Psalms 83 and the Sixth Seal of Revelation. Note that in three quarters of these verses, it categorically states how it is the Lord who instigates this fire judgement.

Deuteronomy 32:22 For fire is set ablaze by My anger, it burns to the depths of Sheol, it devours the increase of the earth, its flames reach into the mountains.

2 Samuel 22:9-10 He parted the heavens, with smoke, devouring fire and searing heat.

Job 18:5 The tents of the evildoer are burned and brimstone destroys them.

Psalms 11:6 He will rain down burning coals and brimstone upon the godless peoples.

Psalms 18:7-15 The earth quaked as the Lord came in devouring fire. He covered Himself in

Psalms 21:8-9 You burn up Your enemies, like a fiery furnace, You consume them. [darkness

Psalms 29:7 The Lord’s shout strikes with flaming fire.

Psalms 37:20 Evil people will die, they will be incinerated and go up in smoke.

Psalms 50:3 Our God is coming, a consuming fire runs ahead of Him and around Him a storm rages

Psalms 66:12 You allowed men to rule us, we passed through fire, now we live in safety.

Psalms 83:14-15 As fire rages through a forest, as flames on the hills – terrify them with storms.

Psalms 97:3-4 Fire goes before Him, all around it burns up His enemies, the whole earth sees Psalms 140:10 May the Lord throw my enemies into the fire. [and trembles.

Psalms 144:5-6 Lord, part the heavens and come down, cause volcanoes and flashes of fire.

Isaiah 1:31 The deeds of the unrighteous will be as a spark, all will burn together with no one to put out the fire.

Isaiah 4:4 At that time the Sovereign Lord will cleanse Jerusalem with a judgement of fire.

Isaiah 9:18-19 For evil burned and went up in smoke, the Land was scorched and the people were fuel for the fire.

Isaiah 10:17 The Light of Israel will become a fire, it will burn and consume His enemies in a day

Isaiah 13:13 The heavens and the earth will shake on the Day the Lord vents His blazing anger.

Isaiah 24:1-4 Be warned: the Lord is about to strip the earth and scatter its inhabitants. The earth will dry and wither up.

Isaiah 26:11 You, O Lord are ready to act, but people don’t see it. Let the fire reserved for Your enemies consume them.

Isaiah 29:6 Punishment will come from the Lord, with thunder, earthquakes, storms and consuming flames of fire.

Isaiah 30:26-28 On that Day, the sun will shine seven times brighter. The Lord comes in anger, His tongue a devouring fire, to sieve the nations.

Isaiah 31:9 They will surrender their stronghold to the Lord, the One whose fire blazes in Zion.

Isaiah 47:14 Astrologers and divinators will be as stubble as the fire burns them up.

Isaiah 50:11 Look: all you who start a fire, that is what you will receive from Me.

Isaiah 62:1 For Zion’s sake, I will not remain quiet. Her deliverance comes, burning like a torch.

Isaiah 66:15-16 The Lord comes in fire, like a whirlwind, bringing retribution in His furious anger. He will judge with fire and many will be slain by Him.

Jeremiah 4:4 Dedicate yourself to the Lord, if not, My anger will blaze up in flaming fire.

Jeremiah 5:14 ...those people will be like firewood, that My fiery judgement will burn up.

Jeremiah 6:29 The fiery bellows of judgement burn fiercely to refine My people.

Jeremiah 7:20 The Lord says: My raging fury will be poured out, it will burn un extinguished.

Jeremiah 11:16 You were a beautiful tree, but I will set you on fire, a mighty blaze.

Jeremiah 15:14...For My anger is like a fire that will flare up against you.

Jeremiah 17:27 ...if you disobey, I will set Jerusalem on fire, no one will be able to put it out.

Jeremiah 21:12-14 Dispense justice or the fire of My fury will blaze up and burn unquenched.

Jeremiah 48:45 Flames will burst out and burn the people of Moab.

Jeremiah 49:2 The time is coming when Ammon will be burnt to ashes.

Jeremiah 49:27 I shall set fire to Damascus, it will burn up that city. [around.

Jeremiah 50:32 Babylon will fall, I will set fire to your towns, it will burn up everything

Lamentations 2:3 In His fierce anger, He withdraws His protecting hand and He blazes in Judah as a raging fire.

Ezekiel 15:6-8 ...the residents of Jerusalem will be as fuel for the fire. I will make their Land desolate.

Ezekiel 19:14 Fire bursts forth in the vine, [Israel] burning up its shoots. It has no strong branch anymore, no sceptre for those who bear rule.

Ezekiel 20:47-48 I will start a fire in the Land, flames that will scorch all the area. All will see that it is I, the Lord who has set it ablaze.

Ezekiel 21:15 My sword of wrath, ready to kill – flashing like lightning.

Ezekiel 21:28 A sword is drawn for slaughter against the Ammonites – flashing like lightning.

Ezekiel 22:20 As metal is smelted in a furnace, so I will deal with you, Israel.

Ezekiel 30:16 I will set Egypt on fire.

Hosea 8:14 Israel and Judah have forgotten their Maker – I will send fire upon them.

Joel 1:19-20 To You, Lord, I cry out, for fire has consumed the pastures and trees of the Land.

Joel 2:3 It comes in devastating fire, as a leaping flame, leaving behind a desolate waste.

Joel 2:30-31 On the great and terrible Day of the Lord, the sky and the earth will show blood, fire and smoke.

Amos 1:4 Therefore, I shall send fire on Damascus [Syria]

Amos 1:7 Therefore, I shall send fire on Philistia. [Palestine]

Amos 1:10 Therefore, I shall send fire on Tyre. [Lebanon]

Amos 1:12 Therefore, I shall send fire on Edom. [the ungodly nations]

Amos 1:14 Therefore, I shall send fire on Ammon. [Jordan]

Amos 2:2 Therefore, I shall send fire on Moab. [Southern Jordan]

Amos 2:5 Therefore, I shall send fire on Judah and Jerusalem. [The State of Israel]

Micah 1:3 No one can withstand His fierce anger, His wrath is like a volcanic fire.

Zephaniah 1:18 ..the whole land will be consumed by His fiery wrath, destruction comes to all the earth. He will make a sudden and terrifying end to all who live in the Land.

Zephaniah 2:2 Prepare yourselves before the Lord’s burning anger comes upon you.

Zephaniah 3:8 Wait for Me, for the Day that I accuse you and pour out My burning anger, the whole earth will be consumed by the fire of My wrath.

Haggai 2:21-22 I shall shake the heavens and the earth and break the powers of the heathen.

Zechariah 12:6 On that Day, Judah will be as a torch that will burn up the surrounding nations.

Zechariah 13:9 I shall pass the remaining third through the fire and refine them.

Malachi 3:2-3 Who can endure that Day? He is like refiners fire, testing and purifying.

Malachi 4:1 The Day comes; burning like a furnace. That Day will burn up all evildoers.

Matthew 3:12 ...the chaff, He will burn up in an inextinguishable fire.

2 Peter 3:7 The present heaven and earth are reserved for fire, on the Day of judgement. 1 Corinthians 3:13 Every persons works will be revealed by fire. The destruction of the ungodly peoples.

Hebrews 8:26-27 For if we deliberately persist in sin after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there remains only the terrifying expectation of a fierce fire that will consume God’s enemies.

Revelation 14:18 Then the angel who has authority over fire called out; Now is the time to reap the earth. The harvest is ripe to be gathered into the great winepress of God.

Reference: REB, NIV, NET. Some verses abridged.

None of those have anything to do with events that take place ten years before the second coming.

 

[Keraz]

None of those have anything to do with events that take place ten years before the second coming.

Provide proof of your assertion.
None of the scriptures in #183 relate to the glorious Return of Jesus. or even the final remake of the earth after the Millennium.

They ALL refer to the forthcoming Day the Lord will send fire to destroy His enemies; at the next prophesied event, the Sixth Seal.

 

[ewq1938]

Provide proof of your assertion.

You are the one with assertions. I looked at your list, none of those are ten years prior to the second coming and none are second coming. You started this in error, not knowing the 6th seals speaks of second coming events. That's the foundational error that the rest is wrongly built upon. You literally just take any OT verses that mention fire and group them together as if they have any relation to each other in the slightest.

 

[WPM]

* It is the “Lord” that descends to the clouds to call up to Him those IN Christ.
* It is the “Lamb” of God in Heaven that opens the Seals and “His” Wrath/Tribulation (for rejection) is sent upon the Earth.
* It is the “Son” of God on a Cloud that reaps the Earth.
* It is the “King of kings” that returns to Earth and reigns for 1,000 years, IN His Kingdom, with His saints, / mortal believers / (not killed during the Tribulation, but not confessed saved), repopulate the earth...ie Remnant.
* After 1,000 years, wars...all anti-spirits sent to hell eternally and any anti-mortals killed.

God is omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient....by what name He is called notifies us what particular prophecy is being fulfilled.

King “OF” kings is Jesus ruling His Earthly Kingdom OVER EARTHLY kings.

After NO mortals EXIST, there are no “Earthly kings”.... God is not called King...He is call “glorified men’s”....”GOD”, and glorified men are call God’s People.

Can you address my post instead of outlining your theology?

 

[WPM]

Psalms 2:7-9 ...the Decree of God to His Son... I shall give you the nations as your domain, the earth to its furthest ends as Your possession.....

Of course Jesus will; physically Return, He said He would, Matthew 9:27, and the angels confirmed it. Acts 1:11 Also; Hebrews 9:28,
It is the AMillennium thesis that is wrong. You are denying and rejecting a basic Christian doctrine; of the second coming of the Lord Jesus, as King of Kings and Lord of Lords. As opposed to His First Advent: as the suffering servant.

Hello! Neither Psalms 2:7-9 Matthew 9:27, Acts 1:11 and Hebrews 9:28 make reference to some imaginary future millennium. You force that into the text. They are talking about the here-and-now. They are talking about the Gentiles embracing the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

 

[Keraz]

You are the one with assertions. I looked at your list, none of those are ten years prior to the second coming and none are second coming. You started this in error, not knowing the 6th seals speaks of second coming events. That's the foundational error that the rest is wrongly built upon. You literally just take any OT verses that mention fire and group them together as if they have any relation to each other in the slightest.

A lot of opinion; no proofs yet to be seen.

You say; 'none are second coming', and then you say the Sixth Seal, Day of the Lord's wrath; as is graphically described in all of my quotes, refers to events of the second coming. Very confusing!

Hello! Neither Psalms 2:7-9 Matthew 9:27, Acts 1:11 and Hebrews 9:28 make reference to some imaginary future millennium. You force that into the text. They are talking about the here-and-now. They are talking about the Gentiles embracing the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

A totally unsupported conjecture.
Jesus will Return and He will rule and reign on earth. It is His reward and ours too, as we Christians will live in perfect harmony with our God, in His Creation, for a thousand years.
Zechariah 9:10....He will proclaim peace for all the nations and His rule will extend from sea to sea...to the ends of the earth.

 

[Truth7t7]

Zechariah 14 also describes AD 70 and the spread of the Gospel to the darkened nations.

AD 70 is referenced in Zechariah 13 and 14 but generally it is a symbolic looking at Christ's ministry. There are a mixture of events relating to the life and ministry of Christ, Jerusalem's judgment (AD 70), the going out of the Gospel to the Gentiles.

Your claim is "False", Zechariah 14 pertains to events surrounding the "Future" Day Of The Lord, and the "Eternal Kingdom" that follows, your reformed preterist claims of 70AD fulfillment are "False"

Zechariah 14:1-12 below shows the Lords return to earth in fire in final judgement.

(Verse 1) shows "The Day Of The Lord" also seen in 2 Peter 3:10-13 "Fire Judgement" below

(Verse 2) Shows that all nations are gathered for the final battle of armageddon.

(Verses 3-5) shows the Lords return, and his eternal feet touch down on the earthly Mt, of Olives, and in the "Twinkling Of An Eye" 1 Cor 15:52 takes place, in the catching up, resurrection, final judgement by fire, and the New Heavens, Earth, and Jerusalem being revealed for eternity, judgement complete, eternity begins.

(Verses 6-7) Eternal light seen, in the eternal kingdom, Rev 22:1-5

(Verse 8) The river of life is seen, Rev 22:1-5

(Verse 10) The New creation is being revealed, the plain is lifted up.

(Verse 12) "The Day Of The Lord" showing the "Last Day" judgement by the Lords fire, as men are consumed as they stand on their feet, 2 Peter 3:10-13

2 Peter 3:10KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Revelation 22:1KJV
And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.

"The Eternal Kingdom"!

Zechariah 14:1-12KJV
14 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.
2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:
7 but it shall be one day which shall be known to the Lord, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.
8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.
9 And the Lordshall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.
10 All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin’s gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, and from the tower of Hananeel unto the king’s winepresses.
11 And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

 

[Truth7t7]

Zechariah 14 also describes AD 70 and the spread of the Gospel to the darkened nations.

AD 70 is referenced in Zechariah 13 and 14 but generally it is a symbolic looking at Christ's ministry. There are a mixture of events relating to the life and ministry of Christ, Jerusalem's judgment (AD 70), the going out of the Gospel to the Gentiles. Notwithstanding, these are all tied together in Christ – and cannot be divorced one from another. Jerusalem was destroyed because of their rejection of Christ. The Gentiles came against the city, but the Gospel in turn went out among the Gentiles with great success.

Second, as you study the New Testament you see that the wicked are all destroyed when Jesus comes, this disallows the placing of this after the second coming. There will be no mortals or no sinners to populate the new earth, what is more, they are prohibited from inheriting it (Matthew 25:34 &25:46, 1 Corinthians 6:9, and 1 Corinthians 15:50).

Thirdly, the keeping of the Judaic sacrificial system has been eternally abolished (see Galatians 4:9-10, Colossians 2:14, 16, 20-22 ). Many of the place names in Jerusalem don't exist anymore. Localized worship in a brick temple in Jerusalem has gone forever. We now worship God in spirit and in truth John 4:21).

Zechariah 14:16 Who Will Be Left Of The Nations?​

You will closely note, Zechariah 14:16 & Isaiah 4:3-4 are "Parallel" readings of the same event, as Isaiah gives a clear account of those who are left, those who are found in the book of life, the final judgement has passed, eternity has begun "After" The Day Of The Lord

You will closely note in Isaiah 4:4 below, Jerusalem will be purged by the spirit of (Judgement) & (Burning)

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Only The Righteous Are Left, The Book Of Life "Was" Opened (Every One That Is Written Among The Living)

Zechariah 14:16KJV
16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

Isaiah 4:3-4KJV
3 And it shall come to pass, that he that is left in Zion, and he that remaineth in Jerusalem, shall be called holy, even every one that is written among the living in Jerusalem:
4 When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning.

Revelation 21:24-27KJV
24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

 

[WPM]

A lot of opinion; no proofs yet to be seen.

You say; 'none are second coming', and then you say the Sixth Seal, Day of the Lord's wrath; as is graphically described in all of my quotes, refers to events of the second coming. Very confusing!

A totally unsupported conjecture.
Jesus will Return and He will rule and reign on earth. It is His reward and ours too, as we Christians will live in perfect harmony with our God, in His Creation, for a thousand years.
Zechariah 9:10....He will proclaim peace for all the nations and His rule will extend from sea to sea...to the ends of the earth.

Zechariah 9:9-10 predicted: “Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass … and he shall speak peace unto the heathen: and his dominion shall be from sea even to sea, and from river even to the ends of the earth.”

The prophets recognised that this “peace” was not simply an ethnic thing pertaining exclusively to natural Israel but was a spiritual thing that would affect all nations. This is what Isaiah 2:2-4 and Micah 4:1-3 is speaking of. We learn: “the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.” What is more we don’t need to speculate about the time-period in view, the text confirms: “in the last days it shall come to pass.”

This passage vividly shows salvation going out to the nations of the world after the cross. It shows the establishment of the kingdom of God (described here as “the mountain of the Lord's house”), above all other kingdoms of the earth (described here as mountains) and smaller ethnic groups (described here as hills).

Isaiah 57:19-21 predicts in tandem with Isaiah 2 and Micah 4:1 reference the promised peace for all nations that attends entering the kingdom: “Peace, peace to him that is far off (the Gentiles), and to him that is near (the Jews), saith the LORD; and I will heal him. But the wicked are like the troubled sea, when it cannot rest, whose waters cast up mire and dirt. There is no peace, saith my God, to the wicked.”

This is talking about the great commission!!!

Isaiah receives a symbolic vision 500 yrs before Christ of an approaching new order of peace. Isaiah described the blessing that this new order would bring and the scale of its influence. Interestingly (and graciously for us) it was a new arrangement that would embrace “all nation.” Gentiles would be brought unto an equal footing with Jews in regard to the Gospel opportunity.

Ephesians 2:13-15 confirms this, saying: “now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace.”

The nations have been united in peace through the Prince of peace, and His shed blood on Calvary.

Colossians 1:19-20: “For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell; And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him.”

Christ is our peace - now! A major difficulty I have with Premillennialism is that it postpones so much current blessing and projects it into a supposed period in the future that (I believe) will never be. It therefore totally nullifies countless ongoing fulfilments. This is a disturbing factor engrained within the doctrine. This passage under review is a case-in-point.

Because Christ is peace, He imparts that peace to us upon salvation. When we receive Him we receive peace. We get the full package. Jesus said in John 16:33, “in me ye might have peace.” Colossians 3:15 consequently instructs us: “let the peace of God rule in your hearts.”

Many that live in nations that would be viewed in an earthly sense as peaceful or free are in reality filled with strife, hatred and turmoil. Scripture makes it clear: “There is no peace, saith the LORD, unto the wicked” (Isaiah 48:22). Conversely, Scripture after Scripture repeatedly depicts entry into the kingdom of God and a relationship with Christ as man’s only true peace. In fact Romans 14:17 tells us "the kingdom of God is ... peace."

Peace only comes through salvation. Jesus said in that wonderful passage in John 14:27 during His earthly ministry, “Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.” If someone is redeemed then they have entered into the peace of God through the Prince of Peace. Here was the fulfilment of this reading in operation. Here was the “Prince of Peace” in operation. Peace is not merely a future hope, it is a present reality. It’s an intimate relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ. Philippians 4:7 says, “the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.”

The redeemed of all nations that come into the kingdom of God no longer “lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more." They have experienced true peace and have been reconciled unto a holy God. As a consequence, their weapons of war have been made redundant; they now operate with the tools of peace. Former enemies are miraculously reconciled “in Christ” through the blood of Jesus. The prince of peace has affected a supernatural change by way of conversion. Out goes the old and in comes the new. What was once used to destroy others has been supernaturally changed to bless others. Ancient enemies are unified within God’s great spiritual kingdom. They enter into heaven's peace.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Where does it say Jesus is on earth there? Nowhere! As per normal: you force your beliefs into the sacred text. Adding unto Scripture may be a Premil trait, but it is forbidden by Scripture.

The text says he is there. I wonder why you can't see it? Stop talking about "forced beliefs" and start looking at the scriptures with an open mind.

4 In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which is in front of Jerusalem on the east; and the Mount of Olives will be split in its middle from east to west by a very large valley, so that half of the mountain will move toward the north and the other half toward the south.

 

[Taken]

Can you address my post instead of outlining your theology?

Already did.
* Jesus rules “His Kingdom ON Earth”....”Supreme “KING” over “MORTAL kings and KINGDOMS” for 1,000 years.
(The Lord Gods “present KINGDOM is HEAVEN.)
* The Lord God Almighty’s “KINGDOM” thereafter SHALL BE: HEAVEN and “ALL OF EARTH”.
* The Lord God SHALL BE: “GOD” OF HIS “IMMORTAL PEOPLE ON EARTH”...
AND “GOD” OF HIS “faithful spirit servants” (present ON Heaven and Earth”.

Gods ORDER and WAY.
* Gods Creation. Heaven AND Earth.
* Gods Making. Holy Celestial Beings, Estate Heaven.
* Gods Making. Good Terrestrial Beings. Estate Earth.
** Satan Corrupted Heaven’s Holiness. LIED. Cast OUT of Heaven to Earth.
* Gods Making. Garden of Eden. A Holy Place. Put First Created and Made man IN a Holy Place WITH Gods Presence. (Garden).
* Satan Entered Gods Garden. Corrupted man WITH Satan’s CUNNING LIE.
* Gods Holy Place Corrupted (by man).
* Man Cast OUT of Gods Holy Garden.
* Man, Satan, Satan’s Following of other Fallen Celestials (from Holiness), OCCUPY the Earth.
* Satan Continues Corrupting Mankind upon the Earth, WITH his CUNNING LIES.
** God becomes ANGRY. Gods ANGER waxes GREAT. God Sends “HIS” Tribulations UPON the EARTH, To Destroy mankind “THAT Rejects God”.
** OF ALL the population of mankind UPON the face of the Earth; “EIGHT” of mankind WERE SAVED FROM Gods DESTRUCTION UPON The EARTH.
** THE EIGHT SAVED, WERE LIFTED UP OFF THE FACE OF THE EARTH...TO THE CLOUDS....WHILE God DESTROYED ALL LIFE “ON” the Face of the Earth.

NOTHING NEW UNDER the SUN! WHAT WAS...SHALL BE AGAIN...ONLY ONCE MORE.

Ecc 1:
[9] The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.

Matt 24:
[21] For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

The PARALLELS...
* Population UPON the EARTH continues.
* Garden of Eden...ie WITH God. Men IN Christ...ie WITH God.
* Garden of Eden...A Holy PLACE...Christ Jesus’ Earthly KINGDOM..a Holy PLACE.
* OUTSIDE the Garden...Men WITHOUT God....OUTSIDE of Christ Jesus’ Earthly KINGDOM...Men WITHOUT God.

THE INVITATION....(Offering OF God)...
* Adam/Eve....EAT of the TREE OF LIFE and BECOME immortal (never AGAIN subject to DEATH).

Gen 2:
[8] And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.
[9] And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Gen 3:
[22] And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Mark 14:
[22] And as they did eat, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and brake it, and gave to them, and said, Take, eat: this is my body.

The Parallel IS: Eternal Life IS OFFERED every man.
The FACT IS: Every INDIVIDUAL must of his OWN FREEWILL (REACH OUT AND “TAKE” Gods OFFERING)....before that man POSSESSES Gods Offering.

ONCE a man TAKES Gods OFFERING...FOREVER that man SHALL BE “WITH GOD”...PERIOD.

ONCE a man TAKES Gods OFFERING...THAT MAN “IS NOT” subject TO Gods Anger, Gods Wrath, Gods Tribulation.

ONCE a man TAKES Gods OFFERING...THAT MAN “IS”: FOREVER subject TO Gods Peace, Rest, Comfort, Protection, Salvation.

As IN NOAH’S DAY, ALL men WHO HAVE TAKEN Gods OFFERED SALVATION, THEY TOO SHALL BE LIFTED UP OFF THE FACE OF THE EARTH, TO THE CLOUDS.............WHEN GODS ANGER INCREASES (Against men who Have Rejected Him AND His Word).......WHILE GOD SENDS His Tribulation UPON the Face of the Earth TO DESTROY men (Against God) WITH the Earth.

Gen 6:
[13] And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.

* Then for 1,000 years... KING Christ Jesus SHALL rule the World, FROM His KINGDOM, WITH His IMMORTAL saints...OVER all (remnant) BELIEVING mortal kingdoms.
(VOID OF SATANS PRESENCE).

* After 1,000 years....SATAN IS ONCE AGAIN Given ACCESS TO THE Face of the Earth AND Mortal men.
* Once AGAIN MANY mortal men, YEILD to Satan’s cunning Trickery and Follow after Satan‘S Anti-Christ rhetoric.
* THEN....SHALL...Holy Celestial spirits DEFEAT Satan and his band of fallen angels....THEY CAST TO the pits of Hell Forever.
* THEN....SHALL...THE Two edged Sword OF Christ Jesus’ “SPOKEN WORD”...
Defeat, Kill ALL remaining ANTI-Christ Mortal men UPON the Face of the Earth.
* THEREAFTER...JUDGEMENT...of all Celestial and Terrestrial Beings.
* FINAL SEPARATION...of ALL UNGODLY Celestial and Terrestrial Beings.
* THEREAFTER...SHALL God RENEW the Heavens’ and Earth and Jerusalem’s THRONE.
* THEREAFTER SO SHALL IT BE FOREVER; AS it is IN Heaven, SO shall it BE ON EARTH........ONLY EVER LIVING FAITHFUL celestial and terrestrial Beings “WITH” God.
* God SHALL BE THEIR God....and THEY SHALL BE “HIS PEOPLE”.

Zech 13: (during Gods Tribulation...Gods fulfillment of Saving ISRAEL/remnant)
[9] And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.

END of Tribulation...END of Jesus’ 1,000 yr reign...Final Separation of Godly FROM UnGodly...Lord God Almighty RULES entire Heaven and Earth.

2 Cor 6:
[16] And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Nothing New.
What WAS shall be. Learn WHAT WAS to KNOW WHAT SHALL BE according to Gods ORDER and WAY.
ONCE a man HAS (TAKEN) / RECEIVED Gods OFFERING...
Eternal PEACE IS WITH and IN THAT individual man “FOREVER”!!

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

The text says he is there. I wonder why you can't see it? Stop talking about "forced beliefs" and start looking at the scriptures with an open mind.

4 In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which is in front of Jerusalem on the east; and the Mount of Olives will be split in its middle from east to west by a very large valley, so that half of the mountain will move toward the north and the other half toward the south.

YES!

God IS the GIVER and TAKER of LIFE.
God IS the DIVIDER (as spoken and observed from the Beginning...Day/Night; Light/Dark; Up/Down; With/Without....
God IS Light/Power......that IS Gods Glory.
God Gives HIS GLORY...to no one.
God SHINES HIS GLORY (REFLECTIVELY) UPON that which IS “WITH” Him.

God DIVIDES ALL that IS “WITH” Him......FROM ALL that IS “WITHOUT” Him.
God SHALL “DESTROY” ALL that IS “WITHOUT” Him.
God SHALL “KEEP FOREVER” ALL that is “WITH” Him.

The “FOREVER KEEPING”...HAS BEEN and Continues “IN PROCESS”...
IT IS the “FINAL DESTRUCTION and SEPARATION” we WITHIN wait FOR to come into fruition....THAT ^ Occurs during Gods Tribulation UPON those WITHOUT Him....

AND Meantime, WE WITH God still IN our mortal flesh UPON the face of the Earth....SUFFER the Tribulations of Evil spirit and Wicked men UPON the face of the Earth...............Having solace of Gods INTERNAL Comfort and Peace.

Praising our Great God Almighty, Observing the prophecies of Signs and Thanking....Our God of His Promise to Come quickly.

Men IN Christ ARE NOT subject to the Lamb’s end of days Tribulation
...(SEALS: Rev 6: 16-17)
NOR the Devil’s end of days Tribulation
...(TRUMPS: Rev 12:12)
NOR or Gods end of day Tribulation
...(VIALS: Rev 16:1)


Glory to God,
Taken

 

[rwb]

Already did.
* Jesus rules “His Kingdom ON Earth”....”Supreme “KING” over “MORTAL kings and KINGDOMS” for 1,000 years.
(The Lord Gods “present KINGDOM is HEAVEN.)
* The Lord God Almighty’s “KINGDOM” thereafter SHALL BE: HEAVEN and “ALL OF EARTH”.
* The Lord God SHALL BE: “GOD” OF HIS “IMMORTAL PEOPLE ON EARTH”...
AND “GOD” OF HIS “faithful spirit servants” (present ON Heaven and Earth”.

Can you provide the verse or verses that say Christ will reign in His Kingdom ON THIS earth?

 

[CadyandZoe]

Can you provide the verse or verses that say Christ will reign in His Kingdom ON THIS earth?

Remember the Lord's prayer.

 

[rwb]

Remember the Lord's prayer.

If we isolate the prayer from the rest of Scripture we might think His Kingdom will be on THIS earth. But when we understand the prayer in light of other verses we understand His Kingdom will not be on this earth, but will come to the new earth after this first earth has passed away. That's why Christ says His Kingdom NOW is not from this world, but will come down from heaven after He returns the second time.

Matthew 6:9-15 (KJV) After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread. And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen. For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

John 18:36 (KJV) Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.