Once Saved Always Saved

[Ferris Bueller]

No you posted stop believing

different word, I can believe and not trust,

In the context of this thread believing MEANS trusting.

...whoever hears My word and believes Him who sent Me has eternal life and will not come under judgment. John 5:24

Truly, truly, I tell you, he who believes has eternal life. John 6:47
​

Surely, this is not talking about believers who do not trust.

 

[Taken]

ummmmm, can you show me the verse that makes your claim above in RED?

christ's Church is VISABLE entity.

Matt 16
[16] ..."Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God"

[18] ....upon "this" rock I will build "my church"...

Pss 51
[13] Then will I teach transgressors thy ways; and sinners shall be converted unto thee.

Eph 1:
[22] And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
[23] Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You don't have to be a Calvinist to believe the part of the Calvinist teaching that says true believers will always believe and can't stop believing. That teaching comes from the 'P' in the larger 'TULIP' teaching of Calvinism.

Once again

faith is not the same as belief

I will not say it again

 

[Eternally Grateful]

In the context of this thread believing MEANS trusting.

...whoever hears My word and believes Him who sent Me has eternal life and will not come under judgment. John 5:24

Truly, truly, I tell you, he who believes has eternal life. John 6:47
​

Surely, this is not talking about believers who do not trust.

Wrong

John 6 is not mere belief.

second, how can I have life eternal if I could lose it, that makes it conditional life not eternal

 

[Wrangler]

Once again

faith is not the same as belief

Agreed. But trust is not the difference. Trust is an emotion. Faith = Belief + Action.

I will say it again. :)

 

[FHII]

That verse has nothing to do with any but the apostles.

Well that sets a very dangerous precedence which I don't agree with. If nothing Jesus spoke to the Apostles concerns us (and only the Apostles) then we can also say that nothing he told Jews concerns us who aren't Jews. He spoke very little to any gentile, so we can conclude nothing Jesus said matters to any non Jew Christian.

We can take it to another level by saying nothing Paul told the Galatians matter to anyone other than the Galatians. Nothing he wrote to the Corinthians concerns anyone other than the Corinthians. Furthermore, I have no idea what to do with. This verse:

Matthew 4:4 KJV
But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

He was quoting scripture that originally was intended for the Hebrews, but he told it to Satan. So does it only apply to Hebrews and Satan?

Golly gee! The entire OT God was dealing with the Hebrews/Jews/Israel... And in the Gospels Jesus was still looking to deal with that group, and much of what Jesus said was to the Apostles... And the epistles were written to specific groups... So what part of the Bible is meant for us modern day folk?

I like your list... But are the rules the same?

16. We are predestined

Well Paul told the Romans that and Ephesians that. But I an not Roman or Turkish! By your precedence
These verses don't apply to me.

So, our conversation is about matthew 10:22.

Matthew 10:22 KJV
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

It says we are going to be hated because we follow Jesus but if we endure to the end we will be saved. Or does that really only apply to the Apostles?

Peter, John and Paul made similar comments, but the were adressing specific groups. So by your precedence, I can't bring up those verses!

There are so many questions! But I will just ask ine of you:

Must we persevere to the end, or if one time we believed in Christ and then stopped believing, we are good to go?

 

[Wrangler]

I believe and am saved, so now I can commit every sin under heaven with impunity?!

 

[FHII]

That verse has nothing to do with any but the apostles.

Oh... And by the way... I have one verse that says it was ALL written for us! But I'm not telling yet!

 

[HisLife]

I believe and am saved, so now I can commit every sin under heaven with impunity?!

Lol It doesn't work like that, lets say If you could and there was no consequence What Sin would you want to go and do?

 

[FHII]

I believe and am saved, so now I can commit every sin under heaven with impunity?!

I am going to be the one to say it: sins as pertaining to the flesh... YES! Spiritual sins, NO! That's the bottom line. But there are other things to consider. Lusts and sins of the flesh can take infect the spiritual man in you, and can derail you spiritual growth and actually ruin it. Furthermore, yes you can still sin in the flesh and be saved, but that doesn't mean you will be free of consequences. And many of those consequences will stunt and may ruin your spiritual growth.

1 Corinthians 6:12 KJV
All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.

ALL THINGS ARE LAWFUL! Paul said that and it is truth! But of course we have to read the whole verse and the whole chapter... Even the whole letter because Paul was dealing with one heckuva mess. And I think he reiterated it at a later verse.

All things are lawful ... Covered by grace. But Paul was concerned and disgusted enough to bring them up.

 

[Wrangler]

Lol It doesn't work like that,

How else could OSAS work?

lets say If you could and there was no consequence What Sin would you want to go and do?

It's not the consequence. It's knowing Sin is separation from God that I do not want. In 2020 I had 5 grandkids born. I yearn to be with them. And I am now! There is no thought about consequences if they are not in my life (separation). The overwhelming thought is to be with them as much as I can. Being close to God is a little like that.

Having said that, I guess I would commit the sin of impatience in wanting Jesus to return already.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Agreed. But trust is not the difference. Trust is an emotion. Faith = Belief + Action.

I will say it again. :)

Actually your wrong

faith = trust and assurance in the one your trusting

I can believe in someone yet not trust them

if you trust them you tend to do what they say.

if you just believe, you tend to continue to only do what you want.

 

[Wrangler]

Actually your wrong

faith = trust and assurance in the one your trusting

Well, we will have to part company here. Emotion is not the driver in Scripture but I understand your embrace of the feminization of Christian theology. My pastor disagrees with you. I'll side with my Pastor - and Jesus.


Not everyone who says to Me, “Lord, Lord,” will enter the kingdom of heaven. Simply calling Me “Lord” will not be enough. Only those who do the will of My Father who is in heaven will join Me in heaven.
Matthew 7:21 (Voice)

 

[kcnalp]

So?

No one is Excluded by Gods Word, to Hear Gods Word.

Become Changed, "acceptable to God"(according to Gods Word) that He may Change you, and KEEP you, and Seal you, Perfect you and Claim you unto His own For ever.

OSAS is total nonsense. Why don't you preach the fear of God? I think you're just trying to convince yourself of OSAS.

 

[kcnalp]

God Proclaims it, I Agree.
Jesus came to Earth in the LIKENESS AS A MAN, to teach, by Gods Word, to show, by Example...and reveal....EVERY earthly man, WHO...acceptes HIS OFFERING to BECOME,
Forgiven, restored, Save, Quickened...
BECOME "MADE" IN HIS LIKENESS...
Born of God...Free from Sin...and NEVER AGAIN can SIN AGAINST GOD.

Did you Claim, Take, Receive, the GIfts the Lord OFFERED? Forgiveness, Mercy, Grace, Righteousness, Soul Salvation, Spirit Quickening, His Seed, HIS SPIRIT, His "sonship", give your body unto death?

Why would you then NOT ALSO "acknowledge" His Power within you, TO KEEP YOU IN BELIEF, IN FAITH, FREE FROM EVER AGAIN SINNING AGAINST HIM?

Do you think, God bestows all such wonderful Gifts and MAKES a man "changed"....but God skipped the most IMPORTANT thing...
And oops.....BIRTH from HIS SEED....SINNERS?

1 John 3:
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

So you're saying John wasn't a Christian?

1 John 1:8-9 (NKJV)
8 If WE say that WE have no sin, WE deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in US. 9 If WE confess OUR sins, He is faithful and just to forgive US OUR sins and to cleanse US from all unrighteousness.

 

[kcnalp]

Nope

because until haveto come in faith, if you do not your not saved

You must judge me as unsaved to "prove" OSAS. Like I said, OSASers are some of the most judgmental people on Earth!
Matthew 7:1-2 (NKJV)
1 "Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you.

sadly, as they pass you on their way to heaven, you will have no hope because you trusted self and denied the power of God

Now you're just plain LYING!

 

[kcnalp]

If you trusted God you would trust he did change you and has the power to keep you,

the fact you don’t prove I was right


OSAS does Not teach mere belief saves. So you would Not be saved

I think it's against Forum rules to declare me as unsaved. Is everyone who denies OSAS unsaved?

 

[kcnalp]

What if you are?

What if I'm wrong about what? OSAS? The Bible is the written Word of God. Jesus is my Savior. What am I wrong about? OSASers are so judgmental!

 

[Ferris Bueller]

second, how can I have life eternal if I could lose it, that makes it conditional life not eternal

A person who does not believe that osas is true can tell you how.

 

[Enoch111]

OSAS is total nonsense.

This remark shows that you really do not understand God's plan of salvation and Christ's finished work of redemption. The eternal security of the believer (wrongly termed OSAS) is a fundamental Gospel truth.