The Eternal Security Heresy: A Comprehensive Refutation of OSAS

[Ferris Bueller]

.. we are not all called to be Nuns.. but, if only one can avoid doing nasty things to others - "less often :) " .. the world would be a better place

That is exactly what comes to my mind when I think of obedience to God. That light went on for me not too long after I was born again. Seems few in the church have this knowledge. I had the privilege of having a pastor who taught these things.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

One does not need to pro-actively go out and find good things to do ..

The opportunities to be kind, forgiving, loving, patient, and so forth are abundant. But few Christians know it's in these things that our obedience to God is seated. Works seem to instantly give us thoughts of standing in soup kitchen serving lines and stuff like that. That's all well and good, but maybe we should just get a handle on getting along with our families and our neighbors and co-workers according to the fruit of the Spirit first.

 

[Heyzeus]

That is exactly what comes to my mind when I think of obedience to God. That light went on for me not too long after I was born again. Seems few in the church have this knowledge. I had the privilege of having a pastor who taught these things.

The opportunities to be kind, forgiving, loving, patient, and so forth are abundant. But few Christians know it's in these things that our obedience to God is seated. Works seem to instantly give us thoughts of standing in soup kitchen serving lines and stuff like that. That's all well and good, but maybe we should just get a handle on getting along with our families and our neighbors and co-workers according to the fruit of the Spirit first.

Stepping back out of the Christian Bubble - saying to oneself "Self" how to teach the world to sing .. and while not perfect harmony .. at least in some semblance together.

These are the principles - that I abide by - and on which we should all be able to agree - We need to be uniting people on principles on which we can agree - rather than fighting over whether or not Allah was a better prophet than Jesus .. or whether Gods name is El .. or YHWH or Jesus.

Islam has the principle .. "there is no coercion in Islam" ahaa .. some common ground .. the Golden rule is stated in there somewhere as well .. OK .. Good .. lets work with that.

Of course this teaching in Islam goes completely against "Sharia Law" - but hey .. just highlighting the greatness of Islam :) Don't shoot the messenger :) ..

Divided we fall.

 

[justbyfaith]

I made no such assumption .. and you were completely wrong.

Bottom line .. the Greek Orthodox Church was established by Paul near 2000 years ago - and this Church does not accept Sola Fide.

If the Eastern Orthodox Church, and the Greek Orthodox Church, are one and the same, then no, it was not established by Paul.

For the Holy Spirit forbad him to preach to Bithynia (Acts of the Apostles 16:7), which was in the east.

 

[justbyfaith]

Jesus thought very little of the Pharisees and the Lawgivers - the bar is low.

The people that Jesus was speaking to thought highly of them...they saw their impeccable righteousness and felt that they could not measure up...

So, the bar that Jesus set was high.

No such thing as a free pass through the pearly gates .. all will face judgement.

I beg to differ (see John 5:24 (kjv)).

Islam has the principle .. "there is no coercion in Islam"

So, it says bald-faced lies about itself...that's interesting...at least we can see that you are not promoting Islam here.

 

[Heyzeus]

If the Eastern Orthodox Church, and the Greek Orthodox Church, are one and the same, then no, it was not established by Paul.

For the Holy Spirit forbad him to preach to Bithynia (Acts of the Apostles 16:7), which was in the east.

Humorous ... The entire Church was founded by Paul .. Orthodox and Catholic .. which was one "Universal Church" until the Schism in 1000 AD .. and neither accepted Sola Fide. This doctrine did not even exist until the 1400's

You need to brush up on your church history .. you are making claims that are simply false.

 

[brightfame52]

Quit the reverse dear Watson - tis you who can not handle "The Truth" .. Faith alone is a flawed doctrine .. and "Faith Alone" and Grace are two separate things/concepts .. often conflated as one.

Why are you still posting with me ? Your antics are dishonest

 

[justbyfaith]

Humorous ... The entire Church was founded by Paul .. Orthodox and Catholic .. which was one "Universal Church" until the Schism in 1000 AD .. and neither accepted Sola Fide. This doctrine did not even exist until the 1400's

You need to brush up on your church history .. you are making claims that are simply false.

Peter wrote an epistle to different places; one of which had been influenced majorly by Paul (Galatia) and another which the Holy Spirit had forbidden Paul to preach at (Bithynia). There were also a few other locations; but these locations stand out to me.

See 1 Peter 1:1.

And maybe you should also memorize Acts of the Apostles 16:7.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Of course this teaching in Islam goes completely against "Sharia Law" - but hey .. just highlighting the greatness of Islam :) Don't shoot the messenger :) ..

I'm not even remotely interested in Islam. There is only one non-works 'religion', and that is Christianity. Even if any other religion has the greatest of principles if it doesn't have the removal of sin guilt through the grace of forgiveness it is a big nothing. Because no one can be good enough for God. Forgiveness is the only way to be free of sin guilt. Christianity is the only 'religion' that provides that forgiveness. I've tried the works route. Been there, done that. That's a dead end road.

 

[justbyfaith]

This doctrine did not even exist until the 1400's

Hab 2:2, And the LORD answered me, and said, Write the vision, and make it plain upon tables, that he may run that readeth it.
Hab 2:3, For the vision is yet for an appointed time, but at the end it shall speak, and not lie: though it tarry, wait for it; because it will surely come, it will not tarry.
Hab 2:4, Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.

 

[Heyzeus]

I'm not even remotely interested in Islam. There is only one non-works 'religion', and that is Christianity. Even if any other religion has the greatest of principles if it doesn't have the removal of sin guilt through the grace of forgiveness it is a big nothing. Because no one can be good enough for God. Forgiveness is the only way to be free of sin guilt. Christianity is the only 'religion' that provides that forgiveness. I've tried the works route. Been there, done that. That's a dead end road.

My point was not to be interested in Islam ... but to share the principles of Jesus - with respect to works. They can believe what they like ..just follow the Golden Rule ..

These principles go beyond the boundaries of belief in Jesus .. or Allah ..or Zeus .. as the "Most High" .. The way .. the Truth .. the Light.

Eventually you will find the source .. and get rid of the source of the false influence.

 

[Heyzeus]

Why are you still posting with me ? Your antics are dishonest

Should I not respond to your false accusations ? State one dishonest thing rather than sitting in the peanut gallery slinging mud - back up your claim for a change.

 

[Heyzeus]

Peter wrote an epistle to different places; one of which had been influenced majorly by Paul (Galatia) and another which the Holy Spirit had forbidden Paul to preach at (Bithynia). There were also a few other locations; but these locations stand out to me.

See 1 Peter 1:1.

And maybe you should also memorize Acts of the Apostles 16:7.

The Greek Orthodox Church was founded by Paul - the first Orthodox Church - one of the First Churches .. in Thessolonica, Corinth, The Phillipeans, Collosians .. .. the first Christians were these people .. and they do not accept "Sola Fide" - not back then .. not for 1400 years until Martin ... and not after Martin either.

Now you are jumping round away from Paul ? desperate to avoid reality.

I don't get it .. what is the big deal here. Just because Paul's Church does not accept Sola Fide .. does not mean it is wrong .. but just don't be thinking that Sola Fide Adherents are the only Christians .. others believe differently.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

In order to "cash in", you must repent of your sins.

$ 1000 to you if you show me ONE PLACE in the KJV where it says, “ We must repent of our Sins, in order to be Saved......
You are on VERY dangerous ground, my friend .....You are TEACHING a “Perverted” , False Gospel That adds to 1Cor15:1-4.......
Galatians clearly teaches that if one adds to the Gospel of Grace that Paul preached—- you have “ Fallen From Grace”. Some excellent Bible Teachers say that means you are damned....
Galatians also clearly teaches there is no “ wiggle - room” when it come to those that TEACh these False Gospels Of Adding Human Merit to what Christ accomplished alone at the Cross ....they are “ Accursed” —- Damned By God forever....
If one does not believe the Gospel , but later undergoes “a mind change” ( Metanoia ...Greek ) and actually starts Trusting in that Gospel he previously denied .....this “ change of mind” is the type of “ Repentance “ that saves a soul.....
One can Repent without Believing , but it is impossible to BELIEVE without Repenting....
“Unbelief” in Jesus to “Belief” In Jesus is the only “ Repenting “ one needs to concern themselves with as far As Salvation is concerned .....
Newbies—— The Gospel is all about what God did for man—- NOT what man does for God.Don't “ fall from Grace” by adding Human effort ( religion, in other words ) to this: Jesus died for your sins and rose from the Grave . Rest in that, Plus nothing else , for your Salvation. Here is how you recognize a false Teacher —— When Anybody says , “Jesus Saves—BUT” .....know for sure you are hearing a False, Perverted Gospel being taught by a Teacher that is “ Accursed” for teaching it .Harsh Stuff, for sure ....read the short Book Galatians and then try to tell me that I am wrong....Trifling with God’s Gospel— no matter HOW “ good” it sounds to human reasoning is a VERY serious wrong—- Serious enough to send you to Hell....
You wanna “ cash in “ on the Grace That is the only thing that can save you ? You “ cash in” with your Faith . Faith in the Gospel . “ By GRACE you are Saved....through FAITH!” I just can’t seem to find in the Bible where it says, “ By Grace thou art Saved through REPENTANCE “ or “ God took the Repentance Of Abraham and counted it as Righteousness “......
Perhaps the great Bible Scholar, Homer Simpson was Right...these verses that others want to go by ? They must be located “ somewhere” in the Bible , right? As Homer said—-They must be “ somewhere in the back”..... lol.......

 

[Cooper]

$ 1000 to you if you show me ONE PLACE in the KJV where it says, “ We must repent of our Sins, in order to be Saved......
You are on VERY dangerous ground, my friend .....You are TEACHING a “Perverted” , False Gospel That adds to 1Cor15:1-4.......
Galatians clearly teaches that if one adds to the Gospel of Grace that Paul preached—- you have “ Fallen From Grace”. Some excellent Bible Teachers say that means you are damned....
Galatians also clearly teaches there is no “ wiggle - room” when it come to those that TEACh these False Gospels Of Adding Human Merit to what Christ accomplished alone at the Cross ....they are “ Accursed” —- Damned By God forever....
If one does not believe the Gospel , but later undergoes “a mind change” ( Metanoia ...Greek ) and actually starts Trusting in that Gospel he previously denied .....this “ change of mind” is the type of “ Repentance “ that saves a soul.....
One can Repent without Believing , but it is impossible to BELIEVE without Repenting....
“Unbelief” in Jesus to “Belief” In Jesus is the only “ Repenting “ one needs to concern themselves with as far As Salvation is concerned .....
Newbies—— The Gospel is all about what God did for man—- NOT what man does for God.Don't “ fall from Grace” by adding Human effort ( religion, in other words ) to this: Jesus died for your sins and rose from the Grave . Rest in that, Plus nothing else , for your Salvation. Here is how you recognize a false Teacher —— When Anybody says , “Jesus Saves—BUT” .....know for sure you are hearing a False, Perverted Gospel being taught by a Teacher that is “ Accursed” for teaching it .Harsh Stuff, for sure ....read the short Book Galatians and then try to tell me that I am wrong....Trifling with God’s Gospel— no matter HOW “ good” it sounds to human reasoning is a VERY serious wrong—- Serious enough to send you to Hell....

Acts 3:19 Acts 2:38 Acts 17:30 Matthew 3:2 Matthew 4:17 Luke 13:3 and many more places.
.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

My point was not to be interested in Islam ... but to share the principles of Jesus - with respect to works. They can believe what they like ..just follow the Golden Rule ..

These principles go beyond the boundaries of belief in Jesus .. or Allah ..or Zeus .. as the "Most High" .. The way .. the Truth .. the Light.

Eventually you will find the source .. and get rid of the source of the false influence.

I see what you're saying. I thought you were endorsing Islam, lol.

I remember years ago seeing a TV program where they were interviewing a young Muslim boy. Apparently he didn't have a stitch of knowledge about Jesus. I think it was about how he and his community were starving. In the interview he said he would rather die than steal food because thieves go to hell. And I remember thinking he was what Paul was talking about when he said the gentiles have the law of God written on their hearts and that if he did die for not stealing he would be judged accordingly at the resurrection.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

$ 1000 to you if you show me ONE PLACE in the KJV where it says, “ We must repent of our Sins, in order to be Saved......
You are on VERY dangerous ground, my friend .....You are TEACHING a “Perverted” , False Gospel That adds to 1Cor15:1-4.......
Galatians clearly teaches that if one adds to the Gospel of Grace that Paul preached—- you have “ Fallen From Grace”. Some excellent Bible Teachers say that means you are damned....
Galatians also clearly teaches there is no “ wiggle - room” when it come to those that TEACh these False Gospels Of Adding Human Merit to what Christ accomplished alone at the Cross ....they are “ Accursed” —- Damned By God forever....
If one does not believe the Gospel , but later undergoes “a mind change” ( Metanoia ...Greek ) and actually starts Trusting in that Gospel he previously denied .....this “ change of mind” is the type of “ Repentance “ that saves a soul.....
One can Repent without Believing , but it is impossible to BELIEVE without Repenting....
“Unbelief” in Jesus to “Belief” In Jesus is the only “ Repenting “ one needs to concern themselves with as far As Salvation is concerned .....
Newbies—— The Gospel is all about what God did for man—- NOT what man does for God.Don't “ fall from Grace” by adding Human effort ( religion, in other words ) to this: Jesus died for your sins and rose from the Grave . Rest in that, Plus nothing else , for your Salvation. Here is how you recognize a false Teacher —— When Anybody says , “Jesus Saves—BUT” .....know for sure you are hearing a False, Perverted Gospel being taught by a Teacher that is “ Accursed” for teaching it .Harsh Stuff, for sure ....read the short Book Galatians and then try to tell me that I am wrong....Trifling with God’s Gospel— no matter HOW “ good” it sounds to human reasoning is a VERY serious wrong—- Serious enough to send you to Hell....
You wanna “ cash in “ on the Grace That is the only thing that can save you ? You “ cash in” with your Faith . Faith in the Gospel . “ By GRACE you are Saved....through FAITH!” I just can’t seem to find in the Bible where it says, “ By Grace thou art Saved through REPENTANCE “ or “ God took the Repentance Of Abraham and counted it as Righteousness “......
Perhaps the great Bible Scholar, Homer Simpson was Right...these verses that others want to go by ? They must be located “ somewhere” in the Bible , right? As Homer said—-They must be “ somewhere in the back”..... lol.......

Repentance does mean making an about face from sin......

Hebrews 6:1
1Therefore let us leave the elementary teachings about Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works,a and of faith in God

Repentance from dead works doesn't earn justification. The value in repentance from sin is you can't be damned for sin you haven't committed. The teaching that makes salvation a license to sin is just as damnable as the teaching that good works earn justification.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

$ 1000 to you if you show me ONE PLACE in the KJV where it says, “ We must repent of our Sins, in order to be Saved......

The person who isn't changed by faith in God into a person who repents of their sin will not be saved when Jesus comes back.

Hebrews 10:26-27
26If we deliberately go on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no further sacrifice for sins remains, 27but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume all adversaries.

There is no salvation without repentance from sin. Repentance has no value in earning a declaration of righteousness but it is a required outcome of faith in God that one must have in order to be saved from the just wages of that sin.

 

[Taken]

Stepping back out of the Christian Bubble - saying to oneself "Self" how to teach the world to sing .. and while not perfect harmony .. at least in some semblance together.

These are the principles - that I abide by - and on which we should all be able to agree - We need to be uniting people on principles on which we can agree - rather than fighting over whether or not Allah was a better prophet than Jesus .. or whether Gods name is El .. or YHWH or Jesus.

Islam has the principle .. "there is no coercion in Islam" ahaa .. some common ground .. the Golden rule is stated in there somewhere as well .. OK .. Good .. lets work with that.

Of course this teaching in Islam goes completely against "Sharia Law" - but hey .. just highlighting the greatness of Islam :) Don't shoot the messenger :) ..

Divided we fall.

That's already on the table- " Chrislam "
Along with- Government Social Marxism-

All foretold- World Government- World Prophet side kick.

All man planned- whoop whoop ...the World in complete harmony, no division, by the hand of man!

 

[Heyzeus]

That's already on the table- " Chrislam "
Along with- Government Social Marxism-

All foretold- World Government- World Prophet side kick.

All man planned- whoop whoop ...the World in complete harmony, no division, by the hand of man!

T - long time no talk :) Think you may have jumped in on this one and not understood what was being said. Happens sometimes when certain words come up - Islam being on of them when not in conjunction with a purjorative. tone. Folks are trained .. myself included - filters come up. So that incoming information gets changes prior to your conscious processing of that information.

Powers at be got this one down to a science - you should have a look into "Media Relations" / "Public Relations" - starting with studying just a little of "Edward Bernays - Propaganda" The manipulation of the American mind: Edward Bernays and the birth of public relations

Getting you to think a certain way is a multi multi Billion dollar industry - and these organizations are global.. and I am excluding advertizing here .. the less nefarious use of this technology... its the money that goes into "nefarious" use of this science .. that we want to focus on.

OK .. so back to my post - The idea is not to create Chislam .. not even close... the idea was to turn Islam from its evil ways .. realize how false their religious belief is... but doing so by not criticizing them directly - just promoting certain principles from Jesus in relation to how to conduct one's life .. in relation to works .. this has nothing to do with a salvation converation .. other than the ones from Islam that would turn would turn to prophet Jesus .. rather than the other fellow.

Communism - is a whole other issue .. and we should not use this term as it does not well describe what is happening. This is better described as "Collectivism" - and we need to shoot our arrows straight here .. dont' want to wound the enemy .. we want to kill it. Can get into why this is the case if you are interested.