Fear God or Presume acceptance

[mjrhealth]

Look at that again. I am not come to call the righteous, but sinner TO REPENTANCE. What do you think happens after repentance. Let us reason together. Does Christ just take away the condemnation of the sin, or the sin itself?

I will stay up for awhile if you would like to converse. If I don't hear back, I'll go back to bed and read. I'm not sleepy, though it is 1 am.

He removes the condemnation, we are washed clean, as HE said to a friend of mine, come any time you need , or as He said to me once, " why do you kick yourself so hard", He just smiles, we are Gods children, for you to be who you say you are you would have to be Jesus.

No angry thoughts,
no hate,
no bitterness
no condemnation,
forgiven everyone,
never think a bad thought
never lie,
always be honest
like I said, you would have to be Jesus than you wouldnt need Him

 

[CharismaticLady]

He removes the condemnation, we are washed clean, as HE said to a friend of mine, come any time you need , or as He said to me once, " why do you kick yourself so hard", He just smiles, we are Gods children, for you to be who you say you are you would have to be Jesus.

No angry thoughts,
no hate,
no bitterness
no condemnation,
forgiven everyone,
never think a bad thought
never lie,
always be honest
like I said, you would have to be Jesus than you wouldnt need Him

The condemnation is removed for those who walk in the Spirit. However, that is for those who have already repented and been cleansed. Thereafter, we are given His Spirit, and we must begin to walk in the Spirit and not grieve the Spirit. We have power to no longer sin once empowered and born again. Do you realize that?

There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.

There is a condition. We cannot go ahead and sin and expect no condemnation. Do you agree?

I hope you will tell me if you want to discontinue. Then I'll go back to bed. But if I don't hear from you soon, I'll assume...

 

[mjrhealth]

There is a condition. We cannot go ahead and sin and expect no condemnation. Do you agree?

Can your spirit sin, did you miss this bit

Rom_8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

God isnt interested in your flesh the vessel, He came for your Spirit, it cannot sin.

If you are asking me than you are just assuming much.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Can your spirit sin, did you miss this bit

Rom_8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

God isnt interested in your flesh the vessel, He came for your Spirit, it cannot sin.

If you are asking me than you are just assuming much.

Have you been taught that you can sin in the flesh, just not in the Spirit.

Galatians 5:19-21
Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

 

[CharismaticLady]

He removes the condemnation, we are washed clean, as HE said to a friend of mine, come any time you need , or as He said to me once, " why do you kick yourself so hard", He just smiles, we are Gods children, for you to be who you say you are you would have to be Jesus.

No angry thoughts,
no hate,
no bitterness
no condemnation,
forgiven everyone,
never think a bad thought
never lie,
always be honest
like I said, you would have to be Jesus than you wouldnt need Him

Sorry, I didn't address your list. I don't know how old you are, but I'm 72 and have overcome those a long time ago. After all, I've been filled with the Spirit for 43 years. You will too if you have the fear of the Lord, which is the beginning of wisdom.

 

[mjrhealth]

Sorry, I didn't address your list. I don't know how old you are, but I'm 72 and have overcome those a long time ago. After all, I've been filled with the Spirit for 43 years. You will too if you have the fear of the Lord, which is the beginning of wisdom.

Sorry He started this not me, and age has nothing to do with it, there are 5 year old kids that have a better grasp of this than most adults you know that bit, come to me like little children

If you have overcome all that, than you are better than everyone, plenty to boast about.

Have you been taught that you can sin in the flesh, just not in the Spirit.

IS not your Spirit from God?? If so how can it possibly sin.

 

[CharismaticLady]

IS not your Spirit from God?? If so how can it possibly sin.

Are you talking about everyone's spirit? Even the unbeliever?

 

[mjrhealth]

You will too if you have the fear of the Lord, which is the beginning of wisdom.

I met wisdom one long time ago, teaching Gods children,

 

[mjrhealth]

Are you talking about everyone's spirit? Even the unbeliever?

If one doesnt believe, than one doesnt have Gods Spirit, does He

 

[CharismaticLady]

If one doesnt believe, than one doesnt have Gods Spirit, does He

What I asked you that you seemed to avoid, is what does your flesh do while your spirit doesn't sin?

 

[mjrhealth]

What I asked you that you seemed to avoid, is what does your flesh do while your spirit doesn't sin?

What do you not understand, you flesh is a vessel God didnt come to save the vessel, but your spirit

Rom_8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Ever seen the alien movie, where they open up what they think is a body and find a little alien inside, thats a bit like we are. Before we came to Christ every thing we did affected our Spirit. just look at drug addicts, all that slowly kills that Spirit in them and that is reflected on the outside, when we are in Christ what the outside does has no influence on what is on the inside we are protected in Him, if we have died with Him than He has raised up up into the newness of His life, that happened to me years ago, and I am 20 years your junior.

 

[CharismaticLady]

What do you not understand, you flesh is a vessel God didnt come to save the vessel, but your spirit

Rom_8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Ever seen the alien movie, where they open up what they think is a body and find a little alien inside, thats a bit like we are. Before we came to Christ every thing we did affected our Spirit. just look at drug addicts, all that slowly kills that Spirit in them and that is reflected on the outside, when we are in Christ what the outside does has no influence on what is on the inside we are protected in Him, if we have died with Him than He has raised up up into the newness of His life, that happened to me years ago, and I am 20 years your junior.

Paul is talking of two different things called flesh. The main one is our carnal nature where sin resides. Verse 10 you quoted is there because it means 'not to be confused with' our body. And that is exactly what you are doing.

What becomes born again is our nature. The carnal nature/flesh no longer has control over us when we have the Spirit (which not every Christian has, even if they believe by faith that they do, but show no evidence). So now that we have that straight, do you believe a Christian's nature is still prone to sin, or to not sin? That is the kind of "flesh" Paul is talking about in Romans 8:9, not to be confused with our body (vs. 10) that will die eventually and be changed into an immortal body.

Please answer, and I'll answer tomorrow. Good night.

 

[mjrhealth]

but show no evidence)

That depends on what you are looking for, if its perfection you are asking to much of men. Thats Christs domain. And yes as long as we live in this body as long as we have this mind, you know that bit about the renewing of your mind, and I certainly have my moments of both, but funny thing is for all the concerns that people have Jesus isnt fussed, once we believe it is enough, its all he needs Faith. As for perfection

1Co_15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

we havnt got there yet, we are not quiet' as on earth as it is in heaven" if it where so, we would not suffer any pain any sickness but we do, if it where so we had being changed it would reflect in our outside it is impossible for it not to.

As for the flesh, well we will see, and no you havnt made it straight.

 

[Candidus]

God always knew his children wouldnt be perfect, but they love to claim they are. like a 6 month old baby that never poohs itself, because its so clever, you dont need grace if you are perfect. you know this bit.

The Theological Argument applied:

Commanded to be perfect with God. Deut. 18:13... God commands impossibilities! Ignore it! Grace, Grace, Grace!
Walk before me and be thou perfect. Gen. 17:1... Just more taunting from God?
Be perfect as your Father is perfect. Matt. 5:48... Why didn't the people shout out "Nonsense Jesus!"?
Go on to perfection. Hebrews 6:1... Antinomian Translation: "Make your way to La La Land!"
We wish your perfection. 2 Cor. 13:9... Antinomian Translation: "I wish you weren't so flawed... I accept it!"
Epaphras prays for your perfection. Col. 4:12... Interpreted by Paul to mean.... "Epaphras does not believe in grace!"
I pray night and day for your perfection. 2 Thes. 3:10... Woops! There goes that Paul again! The anti-grace Apostle!
Scriptures are given: that the man of God may be perfect. 2 Thes. 3:10... So, why all those verses if it is impossible? God needs to get over it!
We preach to present every man perfect. Col. 1:28... We know they really preached "Just accept it: God knows you will always be imperfect!"
Finally farewell. Be perfect. 2 Cor. 13:11... Those of us with a superior theology say that the Bible is wrong again!
God gave some apostles, some evangelists... for the perfecting of the saints. Eph. 4:11-13... Antinomian Translation: "A REAL Evangelist will preach that we will always be imperfect, there must be a mistranslation!
If thou will be perfect. Matt. 19:21... Apparently, just more airy nonsense from Jesus!
Made perfect in one John. 17:23... Impossible!
Same is perfect man. James 3:2... We know better! Tear this Book against the REAL Grace of God out of our Bibles!
Perfect in love. 1 John 4:17, 18... Go ahead and nurture your hate, for we all know this cannot be! Grace, Grace, Grace!
Love the bond of perfectness Col. 3:14... That appearently will NEVER be realized!
Mark the perfect man Ps. 37:37... The Bible lied about Mark.
Noah was perfect in his generation. Gen. 6:9... The bible lied about Noah.
Hezekiah had a perfect heart. 2 Kings 20:3... the Bible lies about Hezekiah's heart.
Asa's heart was perfect. 2 Chron. 15:17... There is no way these people had any perfection; otherwise they would not need the Grace of God!
I will walk with a perfect heart. Ps. 10:1, 2... Impossible! Why even try?
Job a perfect man. Job 1:1-8... Antinomian Translation: "Job, a man who did not need Grace!"

You don't need GRACE if you are Perfect! The BIBLE say so!... I don't know where is ever says such a thing, but it has to be in there somewhere! DEATH is our Sanctifier and Perfecter... Accomplishing what God the Creator, the Atonement of Christ, and the Work of the Holy Spirit cannot!

 

[Angelina]

The Theological Argument applied:

Commanded to be perfect with God. Deut. 18:13... God commands impossibilities! Ignore it! Grace, Grace, Grace!
Walk before me and be thou perfect. Gen. 17:1... Just more taunting from God?
Be perfect as your Father is perfect. Matt. 5:48... Why didn't the people shout out "Nonsense Jesus!"?
Go on to perfection. Hebrews 6:1... Antinomian Translation: "Make your way to La La Land!"
We wish your perfection. 2 Cor. 13:9... Antinomian Translation: "I wish you weren't so flawed... I accept it!"
Epaphras prays for your perfection. Col. 4:12... Interpreted by Paul to mean.... "Epaphras does not believe in grace!"
I pray night and day for your perfection. 2 Thes. 3:10... Woops! There goes that Paul again! The anti-grace Apostle!
Scriptures are given: that the man of God may be perfect. 2 Thes. 3:10... So, why all those verses if it is impossible? God needs to get over it!
We preach to present every man perfect. Col. 1:28... We know they really preached "Just accept it: God knows you will always be imperfect!"
Finally farewell. Be perfect. 2 Cor. 13:11... Those of us with a superior theology say that the Bible is wrong again!
God gave some apostles, some evangelists... for the perfecting of the saints. Eph. 4:11-13... Antinomian Translation: "A REAL Evangelist will preach that we will always be imperfect, there must be a mistranslation!
If thou will be perfect. Matt. 19:21... Apparently, just more airy nonsense from Jesus!
Made perfect in one John. 17:23... Impossible!
Same is perfect man. James 3:2... We know better! Tear this Book against the REAL Grace of God out of our Bibles!
Perfect in love. 1 John 4:17, 18... Go ahead and nurture your hate, for we all know this cannot be! Grace, Grace, Grace!
Love the bond of perfectness Col. 3:14... That appearently will NEVER be realized!
Mark the perfect man Ps. 37:37... The Bible lied about Mark.
Noah was perfect in his generation. Gen. 6:9... The bible lied about Noah.
Hezekiah had a perfect heart. 2 Kings 20:3... the Bible lies about Hezekiah's heart.
Asa's heart was perfect. 2 Chron. 15:17... There is no way these people had any perfection; otherwise they would not need the Grace of God!
I will walk with a perfect heart. Ps. 10:1, 2... Impossible! Why even try?
Job a perfect man. Job 1:1-8... Antinomian Translation: "Job, a man who did not need Grace!"

You don't need GRACE if you are Perfect! The BIBLE say so!... I don't know where is ever says such a thing, but it has to be in there somewhere! DEATH is our Sanctifier and Perfecter... Accomplishing what God the Creator, the Atonement of Christ, and the Work of the Holy Spirit cannot!

Interesting concept. Perhaps I have the wrong end of the stick here but are you saying @Candidus that death will bring us sanctification and perfection in Christ? Is that what you are saying? because if you are, then please note that without the blood of Jesus shed for us on the cross in the first place or the seal of the Holy Spirit indwelling the believer, the likelihood of such sanctification and perfection is zero!

 

[Candidus]

What I asked you that you seemed to avoid, is what does your flesh do while your spirit doesn't sin?

You caught the Gnosticism in all it's glory!

 

[Candidus]

Interesting concept. Perhaps I have the wrong end of the stick here but are you saying @Candidus that death will bring us sanctification and perfection in Christ? Is that what you are saying? because if you are, then please note that without the blood of Jesus shed for us on the cross in the first place or the seal of the Holy Spirit indwelling the believer, the likelihood of such sanctification and perfection is zero!

No, look to the prior posts that deny Perfection and make it only occur at the hand of DEATH. If DEATH cleanses us from sin and makes us Perfect, then no one would need Christ and His Atonement! My post is just following the dogmatic assumptions and logic that some are making, and taking it to it's logical end.

 

[bbyrd009]

id be careful there, Esau at least felt he needed the Red Stew, or he would die, right?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The Pharisee is the one that justifies his salvation IN his sins. The repentant one realizes that he is not doing as he should.

The pharisee is the one who justifies himself through his own merit

the repentant one is the one who became bankrupt and fell to his knees begging for Gods mercy. Knowing what a sinner he was.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

One cannot be "in Christ" and continue in the flesh. Yes, we are not God, we are still in human form, in that sense we are still "flesh", yet not all flesh is = sin or sinfulness. God's qualm is not in how He made us, but in our rebellion to Him and our bent to sinning. "And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth." Jn. 1:14.

Knowledge of being in Christ has a purpose other than forgiveness. Regeneration, conversion, repentance, the New Birth speak of a real change in the individual to a purpose; holiness, God-likeness, character change.

"No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him. Little children, let no man deceive you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous; the one who practices sin is of the devil;..." 1 Jn. 3:6-7.​

God demands holiness in the believer, so when God "saves to the uttermost" he fails because your flesh is too powerful for Him? Being saved to the uttermost is much more than some cosmic transaction, it is a real change in the believer from darkness to light, from sin to holiness.

Flesh is no longer king when a believer is saved. God is enthroned, the Holy Spirit abides and directs the believer. ​

Scripture speaks of several things concerning a believer. First, it speaks of coming to Christ to have our sins forgiven. But the Bible does not stop there! It constantly and consistently seeks to align the Believer with God's nature; holiness. As He is, so are we in this world. (1 Jn. 4:17). Yes, one has to be forgiven, be converted, repent, receive a new nature through regeneration; the New-Birth. This is salvation, but the central idea of Christianity is not regeneration; it is holiness. It is the highest state in which Scripture claims a believer can (through grace and the work of God in their lives) become! Why command obedience, why demand holiness, why all the pleading to remain in Christ if there is nothing left to do for the regenerate, Born-Again Believer?

If this is not true, then the vast majority of the Bible from Romans through Revelation has no real meaning. Unbeliever's are told to repent, believe, have faith, and get saved. Believers are exhorted to remain in the faith, abide in Christ, lay hold on eternal life, continue in Christ, be holy, be perfect in love, sin not, we are to: "Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the LORD: Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;" Hebrews 12:14-15.

A child of God can not live in sin because he has born of God

1 John 3 tells us this fact,

why do people continue to deny the power of God to change lives?