The Doctrine of Purgatory in Catholic Biblical Perspective

[Taken]

Jesus is human accoding to Scripture. That's the point.

According to Scripture...

Jesus was manifested to Humans, in a fashion, that Jesus LOOKED LIKE a Human man.

According to Scripture...

Jesus DID NOT LOOK LIKE an Angel.

HOWEVER...what a Human SEES when LOOKING at a PERSON...IS the other persons IMAGE.

Jesus' IMAGE...To Human EYES LOOKED like a HUMAN.

Yet Scripture says...JESUS is the EXPRESS IMAGE of Gods Person.

How do you explain...men SEEING Jesus, and SEEING His IMAGE that "LOOKS LIKE" A HUMAN Person, but IS IN FACT the EXPRESS IMAGE of Gods Person...that Human men can not SEE?


I, understand it as, what Scripture teaches...
A HUMAN, with HUMAN EYES, Can NOT SEE GOD.

Yet God manifested HIMSELF In a Fashion that MEN COULD SEE, WHILE REMAINING in His EXPRESS IMAGE that human men can not see.

Because...God DOES NOT CHANGE.

You are accepting what MEN SAID...
Jesus LOOKS like a Human...therefore He "IS" a Human.

I am accepting of what Scripture says...
God is INVISIBLE to Human Eyes.
God Cannot Change.
God APPEARED in a Fashion that LOOKS like a human man.
God IS NOT Human.
Humans come from dust and return to dust.
Gods Word, IS God.
Gods Word came forth out from God.
Gods Word was Manifested IN a BODY prepared of God.
The body God prepared, LOOKED similar to a Humans body.
The body God prepared, had pure flesh, pure blood, bones and Was the Acceptable TO GOD, Offering to Corrupt Humans...
For the purpose of Every Corrupt Human to
ACCEPT Gods "OFFERING", and the Human BECOME "CHANGED".


No, I do not believe God IS or WAS ever "A" Human.

I believe God "IS" Spirit and HAS ALWAYS existed.

There is a huge difference between ...
Appearing AS A HUMAN...
Men calling Jesus A HUMAN..
And Jesus BEING A HUMAN.

Jesus' BEING IS Spirit.
Jesus' IMAGE is God.
Jesus' LIKENESS is the Same as a Faithful Jew.

ONE day...Converted Reconcilled Human men WILL SEE God....AS HE IS...

Human men have SEEN God...
Looking LIKE a Bright Light
Looking LIKE an Angel
Looking LIKE a Human man

And when a Human man SAW God,
Looking LIKE an Angel...they called Him an Angel.

When a Human man SAW God,
Looking LIKE a Human man....they called Him a man...or more extreme, called Him a Human man.

Does God change and BECOME an Angel, because men CALL Him an Angel?

Does God change and BECOME a Human man because men CALL God A HUMAN man?

Apparently so...since men have this nifty way of equating GOD to an asinine mathematical equation...100% Human and 100% God...

LOL...100% IS the WHOLE...
(cc BreadOFLife)

Anyway...

How do you explain...men SEEING Jesus, and SEEING His IMAGE that "LOOKS LIKE" A HUMAN Person, but He IS IN FACT the EXPRESS IMAGE of Gods Person...that Human men can not SEE?

 

[Taken]

I have PLENTY of your "LOL" posts - but no real answers.

Are you going to address the use of "Anthropos" in 1 Tim. 2:5 - or are you just going top ask an endless line of questions?
Address the use of "Anthropos" please . . .

Already did.

 

[Taken]

Everyone likes to think of the Jesus which WAS, not the Jesus Lamb Of God which IS!

Hi Helen...

I would say...

The Jesus that WAS...always WAS...but MOST human men could NOT SEE IT.

They ONLY saw a man. Even His chosen disciples. UNTIL...

It was hearing, learning, observing...His own disciples began SEEING in their Heart...(not their human eyes)...SEEING He IS the Christ, God Himself.

2 Cor 5
[16] Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.
(After the flesh).


God didn't change...some men do, some men don't.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[CovenantPromise]

I am not a marathon poster like you and @Taken ...so I won't argue the point here... :)

But when we read the description of The Lamb Of God in the book of Revelation ....it is nothing at all like what He was like here when He took on the flesh as a Son Of Man.

Everyone likes to think of the Jesus which WAS, not the Jesus Lamb Of God which IS! The paintings and pictures amazingly choose the man who walked 33 yrs...not the Jesus which IS today..they feel more comfortable to relate to what was , not that really IS!!

Revelation 1
13 "And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of Man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.
14 His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire;
15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.
16 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and His countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. "
and..
Revelation 19-
12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God."

Blessing...Helen

Huh. And I just thought all was/is Jesus. I thought all was one and the same. I never knew he had a corruptible body like someone pointed out (I guess the Incorruptible bodies of the saints of his denomination need to be reclassified LOL!). I knew He had a bruised body, but I always thought He was a lamb without blemish. I mean the unblemished lambs of sacrifice were a symbolism of the TRUE Lamb of God , I mean that is what I always thought. And as I said I never separated Jesus into parts , of Jesus. I know the OC had many types, who were precursors to the ORIGINAL, but I never thought Jesus was different. I think all is fine and I think He chooses to look both ways . As you point out in Revelation and how He looked on earth. At the Resurrection..... do you think that is why at first His followers did not recognize Him? I would think He was quite the presence . Either way all is Christ, and we all shall see Him as He is for we all shall be like Him.
1 John 3:2
Children of God
1Behold what manner of love the Father has given to us, that we should be called children of God. And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know Him. 2Beloved, we are now children of God, and what we will be has not yet been revealed. We know that when Christ appears, we will be like Him, for we will see Him as He is. 3And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as Christ is pure.…

We are all going to have some powerful countenances , I mean given the Revelation account.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I am not a marathon poster like you and @Taken ...so I won't argue the point here... :)

But when we read the description of The Lamb Of God in the book of Revelation ....it is nothing at all like what He was like here when He took on the flesh as a Son Of Man.

Everyone likes to think of the Jesus which WAS, not the Jesus Lamb Of God which IS! The paintings and pictures amazingly choose the man who walked 33 yrs...not the Jesus which IS today..they feel more comfortable to relate to what was , not that really IS!!

Revelation 1
13 "And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of Man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.
14 His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire;
15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.
16 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and His countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. "
and..
Revelation 19-
12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God."

Blessing...Helen

Hi Helen -
We must remember that Revelation is full of symbolism. Jesus is also described as a slain Lamb (Rev. 13:8).

Jesus is truly human and truly God - but He is in his glorified state.
After the Resurrection, we read that he was able to change His appearance so as not to be immediately recognized by His friends, He appeared in a locked room, etc.

Prior to this, He was beaten and pierced and he bled and felt pain - and eventually died. This could never happen to Him in His glorified state. 1 John 3:2 says that we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is. We will ALSO have glorified bodies. That doesn't mean we won't be human. We will be glorified humans with incorruptible bodies.

There is God.
There are Angels.
There are Humans.

We can't be God and we will never be Angels.
Just food for thought.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Already did.

Just show me where you addressed this and we can move on.
Post #, please . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

No, I do not believe God IS or WAS ever "A" Human.
There is a huge difference between ...
Appearing AS A HUMAN...
Men calling Jesus A HUMAN..
And Jesus BEING A HUMAN.

And according to Sacred Scripture - you're DEAD WRONG . . .

1 Tim. 2:5
For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the MAN (Anthropos) Christ Jesus.

The NAS New Testament Greek Lexicon
Strong's Number: 444 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
anqropoß from (435) and ops (the countenance, from (3700)); man-faced, i.e. a HUMAN BEING
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Anthropos 1:364,59
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
anth'-ro-pos Noun Masculine
Definition
1) a HUMAN BEING, whether male or female
generically, to include all HUMAN individuals
to distinguish man from beings of a different order
a) of animals and plants
b) of from God and Christ
c) of the angels

 

[Taken]

And according to Sacred Scripture - you're DEAD WRONG . . .


Definition
1) a HUMAN BEING, whether male or female
generically, to include all HUMAN individuals
to distinguish man from beings of a different order
a) of animals and plants
b) of from God and Christ
c) of the angels

I already mentioned this...


And you are now quoting HUMANS are NOT;
Animals, plants, God, Christ, or angels...in an effort to Prove I am "dead wrong"...?

LOL LOL LOL...duh your own quote just proved I am correct!

HUMAN Individuals...
...to distinguish man from beings of a different order
a) of animals and plants
b) of from God and Christ
c) of the angels

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[BreadOfLife]

I already mentioned this...


And you are now quoting HUMANS are NOT;
Animals, plants, God, Christ, or angels...in an effort to Prove I am "dead wrong"...?

LOL LOL LOL...duh your own quote just proved I am correct!

HUMAN Individuals...
...to distinguish man from beings of a different order
a) of animals and plants
b) of from God and Christ
c) of the angels

Glory to God,
Taken

And yet, the linguistic fact remains:
Anthropos = HUMAN

You LOSE because you think the NT was written in King James English. instead of Koine Greek.
You adhere age-old heresy of Docetism that was defeated back in the 4th century.

 

[Taken]

And yet, the linguistic fact remains:
Anthropos = HUMAN

You LOSE because you think the NT was written in King James English. instead of Koine Greek.
You adhere age-old heresy of Docetism that was defeated back in the 4th century.

LOL ~ regarding your infantile claims...
I have lost nothing!

Your failure to comprehend YOU declaring Jesus Christ A HUMAN Being...does not CHANGE The Lord God Almighty into
"A" HUMAN Being...

Pitiful!

 

[Taken]

Jesus is truly human and truly God - 1 John 3:2 says that we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is. We will ALSO have glorified bodies. That doesn't mean we won't be human. We will be glorified humans with incorruptible bodies.

There is God.
There are Angels.
There are Humans.

Then there is BOL~

Jesus is truly human and truly God.

1 John 3:2 says that we will be like Him

So BOL...you are going to be:
Truly Human And Truly God?

Fascinating!

 

[reformed1689]

LOL ~ regarding your infantile claims...
I have lost nothing!

Your failure to comprehend YOU declaring Jesus Christ A HUMAN Being...does not CHANGE The Lord God Almighty into
"A" HUMAN Being...

Pitiful!

Can you even interact with the Greek words that @BreadOfLife has posted regarding this issue?

 

[Taken]

Can you even interact with the Greek words that @BreadOfLife has posted regarding this issue?

1 Tim. 2:5
For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the MAN (Anthropos) Christ Jesus.

The NAS New Testament Greek Lexicon
Strong's Number: 444 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
anqropoß from (435) and ops (the countenance, from (3700)); man-faced, i.e. a HUMAN BEING
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Anthropos 1:364,59
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
anth'-ro-pos Noun Masculine
Definition
1) a HUMAN BEING, whether male or female
generically, to include all HUMAN individuals
to distinguish man from beings of a different order
a) of animals and plants
b) of from God and Christ
c) of the angels

Sure David...
He quotes as above and then uses his own words to INCLUDE Christ IN the ORDER of Human beings ... oxymoron.

 

[reformed1689]

Sure David...
He quotes as above and then uses his own words to INCLUDE Christ IN the ORDER of Human beings ... oxymoron.

Where did he use his own words? He gave you a lexicon definition of anthropos which is talking about Christ in that verse.

 

[Taken]

Where did he use his own words?

.

Seriously? In every post that he claims JESUS Christ "IS" Human.
Did you forget you agreed with him?

He gave you a lexicon definition of anthropos which is talking about Christ in that verse.

David, do you understand Likeness?

It was necessary for The Word of God To Look in the Likeness as HUMAN Men.
When people SAW Him they SAW a man.

If He has appeared as A horse, what do you think people would have called Him?

He came AS a man to communicate with men directly...since...Gods visions, holy Angels in the Likeness men ( you remember Angels looking LIKE men?, called men? You think they ARE HUMAN Men?) and Gods wonderous Earth was not satisfactory enough for men...and in the OT God called men "stiffnecked" and promised to send men a Messiah.

Scripture is clear...
Christ Jesus is Lord God who came out from God and down to Earth in the Express IMAGE of God, and took upon Himself the Likeness of a faithful Servant, and the seed of Abraham, and thus called the Son of man.

Christ IS the Seed of God.
He came forth out from God.
Was Sent to a Jewish woman's Virgin Womb...
And the moment He came forth from that Jewish woman's womb...He was Lawfully (according to Jewish Law) eligable To Sit on king Davids Everlasting Throne.
And so He shall.
And BTW, king Davids Throne is situated upon LAND Promised to Abraham and hid Descendants...
Which includes Christ Jesus who took upon Himself the seed of Abraham...as does Every Person Who receives The Seed of God...which IS Christ.

Without Jesus having come in the LIKENESS of Jewish men...Gentile's would Not have been entitled by heirship to occupy Abraham's Promised Land or Christ's Kingdom on Earth.

Surely you should know where HUMAN men come from? It's not Heaven.

 

[reformed1689]

Seriously? In every post that he claims JESUS Christ "IS" Human.
Did you forget you agreed with him?

Because Scripture states this. You still have yet to interact with the Greek.

Surely you should know where HUMAN men come from? It's not Heaven.

And if Jesus were ONLY human you would have a leg to stand on.

 

[BreadOfLife]

LOL ~ regarding your infantile claims...
I have lost nothing!
Your failure to comprehend YOU declaring Jesus Christ A HUMAN Being...does not CHANGE The Lord God Almighty into
"A" HUMAN Being...

Pitiful!

So BOL...you are going to be:
Truly Human And Truly God?

Fascinating!

WOW - you missed the point again.

What a surprise . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Sure David...
He quotes as above and then uses his own words to INCLUDE Christ IN the ORDER of Human beings ... oxymoron.

I didn't "include" Christ.
1 Tim. 2:5 does.

YOU reject this because you are blinded by your own arrogance . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

.Seriously? In every post that he claims JESUS Christ "IS" Human.
Did you forget you agreed with him?

David, do you understand Likeness?

It was necessary for The Word of God To Look in the Likeness as HUMAN Men.
When people SAW Him they SAW a man.

If He has appeared as A horse, what do you think people would have called Him?

He came AS a man to communicate with men directly...since...Gods visions, holy Angels in the Likeness men ( you remember Angels looking LIKE men?, called men? You think they ARE HUMAN Men?) and Gods wonderous Earth was not satisfactory enough for men...and in the OT God called men "stiffnecked" and promised to send men a Messiah.

Scripture is clear...
Christ Jesus is Lord God who came out from God and down to Earth in the Express IMAGE of God, and took upon Himself the Likeness of a faithful Servant, and the seed of Abraham, and thus called the Son of man.

Christ IS the Seed of God.
He came forth out from God.
Was Sent to a Jewish woman's Virgin Womb...
And the moment He came forth from that Jewish woman's womb...He was Lawfully (according to Jewish Law) eligable To Sit on king Davids Everlasting Throne.
And so He shall.
And BTW, king Davids Throne is situated upon LAND Promised to Abraham and hid Descendants...
Which includes Christ Jesus who took upon Himself the seed of Abraham...as does Every Person Who receives The Seed of God...which IS Christ.

Without Jesus having come in the LIKENESS of Jewish men...Gentile's would Not have been entitled by heirship to occupy Abraham's Promised Land or Christ's Kingdom on Earth.

Surely you should know where HUMAN men come from? It's not Heaven.

Ummmmmm, show me where 1 Tim. 2:5 says anything about "likeness".
It says explicitly, the man (ANTHROPOS) Christ Jesus

Do I need to post the definition of "Anthropos" again - or did you read it the other three times I posted it?

You have repeatedly failed to properly address this verse because you keep stating that it is something that "BOL claims" - instead of dealing with the fact that it is the inspired Word of Almighty God.

That's why you lose . . .

 

[Taken]

I didn't "include" Christ.
1 Tim. 2:5 does.

YOU reject this because you are blinded by your own arrogance . .

Take off your blinders.
stop pretending accusations make your claims valid.

CC David Taylor

Heb 2
[17] Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation [/B] for the sins of the people.


Your teaching IS, Jesus came to Earth, IN Your Likeness.

No He did Not.

Jesus' IMAGE "IS" Gods EXPRESS PERSON...NOT Humans.

Jesus' GLORY "IS" Gods Glory....NOT
Humans.

Jesus' LIKENESS "IS" a FAITHFUL SERVANT...
NOT "THEM" Humans...Unrreconcilled.

No. Jesus did NOT BEcome in YOUR IMAGE or YOUR LIKENESS.

Jesus came to Earth IN the "LIKENESS" of Jewish faithful men...and the express IMAGE of Gods Person.

Men's WORD teaches GOD in the Flesh, WAS called A HUMAN.

Men's WORD teaches GOD in the Flesh "IS" a HUMAN.

Scripture says that is turning a TRUTH into A LIE.

God was Never "A" Human man.
God was manifested in the LIKENESS of human men.

God IS Everlasting Spirit, WIthout beginning or ending.

Learn what LIKENESS and EXPRESS means.

Learn to TRUST the FACTS and TRUTH of God Over the truths of men.

Listen to yourselves, the absurdity of claiming GOD "IS" "A" created Human man.

Glory to God,
Taken