The resurection at the time of great tribulation

[Scott Downey]

All believers are included in the first resurrection, as their life is hid with Christ in God. Maybe some will see it.

Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Written to the church for them that are in Christ (saved, believers, having eternal life, who will never perish)

Rev 1
4 John, to the seven churches which are in Asia:

Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, 5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth.

To Him who [b]loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood, 6 and has made us [c]kings and priests to His God and Father, to Him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.

7 Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. Even so, Amen.

8 “I am the Alpha and the Omega, [d]the Beginning and the End,” says the [e]Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Revelation 2:11
“He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death.” ’

Revelation 3:21
To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

 

[Scott Downey]

About the resurrection, some are suggesting the first resurrection is 1000 years before the 'second' which is not called the second anywhere in scripture. How can there be a second resurrection then? There is only the second death mentioned. All people die, I take that to mean the first death, the second death is a death in the lake of fire after the dead are judged are judged by their works at the final judgment.

Mark 12:23
Therefore, in the resurrection, when they rise, whose wife will she be? For all seven had her as wife.”

John 11:24
Martha said to Him, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

The way Jesus states it, there is only the resurrection which occurs on the LAST DAY at His returning. No huge amount of time between the just and the unjust being raised. It is contemporaneous. Now factor in that to your reading of Rev 20 and the first resurrection.

28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice 29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

Reading this can you still divide between the two a huge gulf of time?

John 5

24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. 25 Most assuredly, I say to you, the hour is coming, and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God; and those who hear will live. 26 For as the Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son to have life in Himself, 27 and has given Him authority to execute judgment also, because He is the Son of Man.

28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice 29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

30 I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me.

 

[Scott Downey]

Acts 24:15
I have hope in God, which they themselves also accept, that there will be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust.

Acts 24:21
unless it is for this one statement which I cried out, standing among them, ‘Concerning the resurrection of the dead I am being judged by you this day.’ ”

Hebrews 6:2
of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

 

[Scott Downey]

At the resurrection we see all rise up together in the judgment.
All will give an account of themselves to God.
Them of Nineveh who repented will condemn the wicked who rise up with them.
Also, the Queen of Sheba in the same way

Luke 11

29 And while the crowds were thickly gathered together, He began to say, “This is an evil generation. It seeks a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of Jonah [h]the prophet. 30 For as Jonah became a sign to the Ninevites, so also the Son of Man will be to this generation.

31 The queen of the South will rise up in the judgment with the men of this generation and condemn them, for she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and indeed a greater than Solomon is here.

32 The men of Nineveh will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, for they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and indeed a greater than Jonah is here.

 

[tailgator]

All believers are included in the first resurrection, as their life is hid with Christ in God. Maybe some will see it.

Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Written to the church for them that are in Christ (saved, believers, having eternal life, who will never perish)

Rev 1
4 John, to the seven churches which are in Asia:

Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, 5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth.

To Him who [b]loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood, 6 and has made us [c]kings and priests to His God and Father, to Him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.

7 Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. Even so, Amen.

8 “I am the Alpha and the Omega, [d]the Beginning and the End,” says the [e]Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Revelation 2:11
“He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death.” ’

Revelation 3:21
To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

If all believers were resurrected the first resurection ,then there would be no reason to open the book of life after the last resurection.


Revelation 20
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.




Let's not add a multitude to the few believers who actually overcome the beast.We both know you and I have not been killed by the beast for testifying of Jesus ,so we should not expect every Christian who has died of natural causes in the last 2000 years would reign with the few who actually are killed for testifying of Jesus.



This is who actually overcomes and reigns with Christ.

Revelation 20
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.






Now I've understood what the beast is,and who they are that overcome for a couple of decades now.I don't even live in the beast's kingdom ,so Its very unlikely I will be reigning in the land currently governed by the beast after it is disposed of.

 

[Scott Downey]

Believers escape the day of judgement, as they are not subject to the second death, their names are already written into the book of life of the lamb when they believed.
If believers are there, then they are witnesses and examples to the wicked as they were already sealed by the Holy Spirit for salvation.

Ephesians 2
13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who[d] is the [e]guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory

Various scriptures show us glimpses of what is happening during that time. As the below shows and also the great white throne judgement shows. Both are true and do happen.

John 5
24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

Matthew 25, Jesus separated sheep from goat at the judgement as he already knows who is who.

31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the [c]holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

44 “Then they also will answer [d]Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ 45 Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ 46 And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

 

[tailgator]

Believers escape the day of judgement, as they are not subject to the second death, their names are already written into the book of life of the lamb when they believed.
If believers are there, then they are witnesses and examples to the wicked as they were already sealed by the Holy Spirit for salvation.

Ephesians 2
13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who[d] is the [e]guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory

Various scriptures show us glimpses of what is happening during that time. As the below shows and also the great white throne judgement shows. Both are true and do happen.

John 5
24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

Matthew 25, Jesus separated sheep from goat at the judgement as he already knows who is who.

31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the [c]holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

44 “Then they also will answer [d]Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ 45 Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ 46 And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Not all believes escape the day of judgement.

Before you go off making such claims,you should study scripture.You would find there are believers in the bible who were false prophets,liers,and even one believer who betrayed Jesus.

Hebrews 6​

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4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,​

​

5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,​

​

6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.​

​

7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:​

​

8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.​

I'd say it's quite clear that there are some who believe who have even recieved the holy Spirit will also be cast alive into a lake of fire and be burned.

If a person were not born again,what need would there be of a second death for that person?

 

[dremnant]

The first resurrection is not their individual resurrection which happens later. In heaven you don't have a resurrected glorified body until the resurrection of all the dead later on at the day of judgment.

You are making a straw man argument. I didn't say it's their individual resurrection.

The first resurrection is Christ, the first fruits of those who have died, so it is His resurrection they take part of in heaven ruling with Him.

Looks like you did not even read the text that I referred to, so I'm going to post what it says...
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. (Rev. 20:5 KJV)

 

[dremnant]

About the resurrection, some are suggesting the first resurrection is 1000 years before the 'second' which is not called the second anywhere in scripture. How can there be a second resurrection then?

You should start paying attention to the verses being quoted and shared to you. Read Revelation 20:5 again and again until you see and understand what it says. And make your calling and election is sure (2 Peter 1:10), because you will fail to see and understand the simplest text of the scriptures no matter how much you read...if you are not elected for salvation.

 

[Hobie]

There is nothing misleading about my posts.

I'm quoting the same verses Jesus quoted in the gospel when speaking of the abomination that causes desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel.

You simply have no comprehension skills on the matter.


Them that sleep in the dust are raised at the time of great tribulation just as Daniel the prophet says.Daniel wrote the truth and you should except the truth .If you trust in a lie and teach a lie then that's on you

"there shall be a time of tribulation, such tribulation as has not been from the time that there was a nation on the earth until that time: at that time thy people shall be delivered, even every one that is written in the book."​

Daniel 12:1-2
And at that time Michael the great prince shall stand up, that stands over the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of tribulation, such tribulation as has not been from the time that there was a nation on the earth until that time: at that time thy people shall be delivered, even every one that is written in the book.
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to reproach and everlasting shame.

This time such as never was is the Seven Last Plagues which we find in Revelation..
Revelation 16:1-17
1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.
2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.
8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.
9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.
10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,
11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.
12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

And Christ tells us much the same as in Daniel..
John 5:29
And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

 

[Scott Downey]

You are making a straw man argument. I didn't say it's their individual resurrection.


Looks like you did not even read the text that I referred to, so I'm going to post what it says...
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. (Rev. 20:5 KJV)

I see nothing about this being their personal resurrection, just that they have a part in the first resurrection. Christ is the first one resurrected from the dead

Firstborn from the dead, meaning His resurrection. For example, believers who die go to be with the LORD in heaven, they are not resurrected at that time.

Colossians 1:18
And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.



Rev 20
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Scott Downey]

And I pointed out before, all people Christ resurrects at the same time. It is called the resurrection of the dead.

AND it happens on the LAST DAY of this world, not before, not after.

The 1000 years millennial reign as taught by many is of THIS earth, which then has left another 1000 yrs which has 1000 times 365 days left to go, so not the last day. This is a serious problem with that interpretation

 

[dremnant]

...

Rev 20
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

You even quoted it back but not notice what it says... (Revelation 20:5)

 

[Scott Downey]

Even so, Daniel 12 from the OT agrees with the one resurrection of the dead, not another of wicked 1000 years later

1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

 

[Scott Downey]

"Sleep" in both OT and NT when referring to the dead, it is the body that sleeps in the ground, but not the spirits of them that died. They remain aware and conscious. The spirit of a person flees the body at death.

 

[Scott Downey]

Not all believes escape the day of judgement.

Before you go off making such claims,you should study scripture.You would find there are believers in the bible who were false prophets,liers,and even one believer who betrayed Jesus.

Hebrews 6​

​

4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,​

​

5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,​

​

6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.​

​

7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:​

​

8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.​

I'd say it's quite clear that there are some who believe who have even recieved the holy Spirit will also be cast alive into a lake of fire and be burned.

If a person were not born again,what need would there be of a second death for that person?

Those are false believers. Never born again, Jesus tells us at the judgment, I never knew you.

If Jesus never knew them then they had no saving relationship with Him. This can not be denied.

 

[dremnant]

I'm actually starting to suspect I'm debating with an AI or a bot. I think we have gotten tricked. Moderators, what is your take?

 

[Scott Downey]

I'm actually starting to suspect I'm debating with an AI or a bot. I think we have gotten tricked. Moderators, what is your take?

So when shown the scripture that reveals the truth, you keep on denying the same. You're hardened.

 

[dremnant]

So when shown the scripture that reveals the truth, you keep on denying the same. You're hardened.

Have you read Revelation 20:5 that directly destroys your proposition?

 

[Scott Downey]

Have you read Revelation 20:5 that directly destroys your proposition?

Why are you so flat minded about this? It does not support what you are saying. And it also does not conform to all the other teachings about our resurrection. Does not fit what you are saying. If you believe it as you say, you are in conflict with other scriptures.

Never make a doctrine based on ONE scripture, this is how cults work.