Exploring Trinitarian Logic

[face2face]

@ProDeo @LatterRain @Wrangler @APAK

Isaiah 9:6 – "Us" refers to Judah. "For unto us a child is born, to us a son is given" points to Christ (Matt. 22:41-46). A son cannot be co-eternal or co-equal with God (John 3:16; John 14:28; 2 Tim 2:5).

• "Wonderful" means "wonder, marvel, a miracle, hard to understand" (Heb. 1:4-5).
• "Counselor" (Isa. 11:1-2; Matt. 17:5; John 7:45-46; Matt. 7:28-29; Rev. 3:18; Zech. 6:12-13).
• "Mighty" refers to a human ruler called "mighty one" (Ezek. 31:11).
• "God" (Hebrew "el") means "God, angels, mighty men, men of rank, etc." This is similar to "Immanuel" and the manifestation of God in the Son, Jesus Christ (Mark 12:29; Deut. 18:15,18-19; 1 Cor. 8:6; Psalm 82:5-7; John 10:29-36; John 17:21-23; 1 Tim. 2:5; Phil. 2:5-11). Jesus did not consider equality with God something to be grasped but humbled himself to death, and God exalted Him, giving Him a name above all names. The title "Prince of Peace" clarifies this.
• "Everlasting Father" (Gen. 45:8 - Joseph was sent by God and made a father to Pharaoh; Isa. 22:20-25 - Eliakim represents Christ as a father to Jerusalem).
• "Prince of Peace" (Eccl. 3:1,8 - a time for war and a time for peace; Matt. 10:34-36 - future peace on earth, as described in Psalm 72:4-8; Psalm 85:9-11; Hosea 3:4-5; Isa. 32:17-18; Luke 2:14; John 14:27; Isa. 53:5; Rom. 10:15; Micah 5:4-5; Psalm 122:6-7; Isa. 66:10-13).

 

[face2face]

You err, but I am being muzzled so I can't give you a sound rebuttal.

J.

We should never muzzle the ox which treads the corn!

 

[face2face]

You err, but I am being muzzled so I can't give you a sound rebuttal.

J.

Everything I have presented is thoroughly supported by Holy Scripture and is not influenced by man-made creeds.

You also know this to be true.

F2F

 

[face2face]

But I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man,[a] and the head of Christ is God 1 Corinthians 11:3

The Apostle Paul must have made a number of mistakes in 1 Corinthians. Someone forgot to explain the Trinity to him and he totally left out the Holy Spirit.

I'm certain there are few in this forum who will correct him if they have the chance.

F2F

 

[MatthewG]

I believe it shows him becoming one with God on the throne.

 

[face2face]

I believe it shows him becoming one with God on the throne.

Matthew,

Matthew 24:36 "But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only."

Maybe you would like to define one?

Also, if you believe Jesus was Divine in Nature, became a Mortal to die and become Divine again - you missed the script!

God can't be a promised son! Promised son's don't exist until they are given life...that's what makes them promised!

F2F

 

[MatthewG]

you can say whatever you want.

Doesn't matter to me.

 

[CadyandZoe]

The truth, as it is written, is being redefined. Core doctrines-such as Jesus Christ, His death on the Cross, His burial, and glorious resurrection-are being redefined. The virgin birth and Immanuel are also being redefined. What, then, do we have left that will not be "redefined"?

J.

Take your time. It gets better after a while. But don't give up. It will be worth it.

 

[face2face]

you can say whatever you want.

Doesn't matter to me.

Do you know how that comes across?

That's right! It doesnt matter to you...

 

[MatthewG]

Thats right, doesn't matter to me.

 

[face2face]

Thats right, doesn't matter to me.

And nor does truth

 

[MatthewG]

2751 posts later still no unity on the logic of the trinity. Fascinating.

 

[MatthewG]

Trust no one, seek the information in the bible and see whats there. Not what people say.

 

[CadyandZoe]

The bias gets removed when you study it carefully. Why doesn't the New Testament make sense after 400 years of translating? There are no changes because there is a vested interest in phallacy and idolatry.

During the Battle for the Bible, someone once told me that "reason isn't the enemy of faith; fantasy is."

 

[face2face]

Take your time. It gets better after a while. But don't give up. It will be worth it.

If he is patient he will get a Bigger God and a more sure foundation!

F2F

 

[MatthewG]

Whats interesting is that salvation (deliverance) is founded in the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. Thankful to the Father in heaven for that, and the Son for all they have done.

 

[face2face]

Trust no one, seek the information in the bible and see whats there. Not what people say.

Good starting point Matthew...take you a long way!

 

[MatthewG]

Love ya.

 

[CadyandZoe]

You say that being baptized in the name (authority) of the Son is the same as being baptized in the name (authority) of the Father and the Holy Spirit, because They don't contradict each other in what They teach (They don't that's correct), but neither did the teachings of John the Baptist contradict Them, yet Jesus didn't include his name in Matt. 28:19. Therefore, Jesus didn't say "baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" for the reason that They don't contradict Eachother.

We have no evidence that John the Baptist contradicted Jesus and his disciples. That is true. But we have evidence that John's teaching was incomplete. Refer to Acts chapter 19.

Nonetheless, my point is this. Even though Peter and the other apostles had the authority to speak for Jesus, even declaring what was open and what was closed, he commanded them against making disciples of their own and make disciples for the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit instead.

I tend to shorten the list to the Son, not to eliminate the Father and the Holy Spirit, but to make writing about it easier and more importantly, Jesus tells us that the Holy Spirit -- the Spirit of Truth -- will not take his own initiative but speak what Jesus spoke. (Review the Upper room discourse.)

 

[face2face]

Love ya.

Don’t be deceived, it’s clear in Matthew.

Keep studying the Bible, and always ask as many questions as you can.

A good question is (often) more valuable than a good answer, because a good answer often ends the conversation, while a good question can lead to more insightful inquiries.

I'll give you an example;

Gen 49:22 Joseph is a fruitful bough, even a fruitful bough by a well; whose branches run over the wall:

23 The archers have sorely grieved him, and shot at him, and hated him:

24 But his bow abode in strength, and the arms of his hands were made strong by the hands of the mighty God of Jacob; (from thence is the shepherd, the stone of Israel:)

25 Even by the God of thy father, who shall help thee; and by the Almighty, who shall bless thee with blessings of heaven above, blessings of the deep that lieth under, blessings of the breasts, and of the womb:

Why does his braches run over the wall?