The broad spectrum of Christianity VERSUS the narrow-minded view

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Lizbeth

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That is a flawed apologetic in my view. ("the human race is without excuse")
Where is Jesus and the gospel seen in creation? No one seeks Jesus in a knowledge vacuum.
Countless billions have gone to the afterlife with no knowledge of Jesus whatsoever.
What will become of them? Your doctrine says they are toast.

[
Don't you know the bible? Romans 1?

That is the point of seeking isn't it? To find what one doesn't yet have? And deep on the inside the HEART knows enough (even when the brain doesn't), to seek what it doesn't yet know.....if they will only do that instead of continuing to reject and rebel against the truth. God knows and sees so much that we don't know and so we should just believe Him. We all had a tiny space of time when we were innocent, like Adam & Eve at first, until we chose to rebel in some way and go our own way and fell......why two year olds are usually so contrary, it began that far back for most. God calls salvation a coming back to the shepherd of our souls:

1Pe 2:25

For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls

Such a beautiful scripture.
 

Lizbeth

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Good Morning @St. SteVen and @Lizbeth

JESUS is the incarnate WORD that was God in the beginning = the WORD became flesh = Immanuel, God with us

the OT saints who BELIEVED the WORD were Born-Again by the Spirit but they could not receive the Baptism of the Holy Spirit
Food for thought there brother, bless you....I'm going to need time to chew on that.
 
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St. SteVen

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Good Morning @St. SteVen and @Lizbeth
Good Morning to you as well. I'll be leaving for work shortly.

the OT saints who BELIEVED the WORD were Born-Again by the Spirit but they could not receive the Baptism of the Holy Spirit
How is it that "the OT saints who BELIEVED the WORD"?

How is it that "the OT saints who BELIEVED the WORD were Born-Again by the Spirit"?

How is it that "the OT saints who BELIEVED the WORD were Born-Again by the Spirit
but they could not receive the Baptism of the Holy Spirit"?

Sorry, I needed to divide the question into three parts.

I understand that the OT saints were BEFORE Pentecost, so would not
receive the Baptism of the Spirit as Jesus explained it. (wait in Jerusalem)
But many of them certainly demonstrated the power that comes with
the Baptism of the Spirit in the miracles God worked through them.

[
 
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St. SteVen

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St. SteVen said:
The wood, hay, and stubble will be burned away, revealing the precious stones.
What precious stones, if one hasn't been building with them...?
Do you really believe that God is incapable of working good in the lives of anyone he chooses?
Perhaps you hold the Calvinist view of total depravity?

[
 

GTW27

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I'm talking about what you would call the Judgement.
What I call an evaluation, with the purpose of restoration and redemption.
Every nation, every leader (both government and religious/church), every tribe, every individual.
The wood, hay, and stubble will be burned away, revealing the precious stones.
And even those with a total loss will "yet be saved."

Malachi 3:2 NIV
But who can endure the day of his coming? Who can stand when he appears?
For he will be like a refiner’s fire or a launderer’s soap.

[
Restoration and redemption was made possible on The Cross. It is finished.
 

Lizbeth

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St. SteVen said:
The wood, hay, and stubble will be burned away, revealing the precious stones.

Do you really believe that God is incapable of working good in the lives of anyone he chooses?
Perhaps you hold the Calvinist view of total depravity?

[
You can reason as a man until the cows come home and be deceived by your own carnal mind which is enmity with God, but there's just one tiny little problem with your gospel there Steven......it isn't what Jesus and the apostles went around teaching and preaching (not to mention laid down their lives for).
 

Lizbeth

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Perhaps you hold the Calvinist view of total depravity?
Depends on what he meant by that I guess, I'm not very familiar with his teachings. But I hold to the view that everyone has eaten from the Tree of Knowledge of both good and evil....man can be good sometimes and evil sometimes. But whatever so-called good there is in man falls short of God's glory and that's the problem with it. It's of the flesh and motivated by self at bottom.........and not being of heaven and incorruptible and eternal it can't save. All man's righteousness is as filthy rags to a holy, heavenly, incorruptible, eternal God. Jesus said there is no one good but God. Why are these things so hard for some to grasp? Blinded by the god of this world and no love of the truth perhaps.
 

Lambano

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Well everyone is going to croak eventually... at least once.

Maybe I actually give a
pile-of-poo-emoji-sticker-feces-emoticon-poop.jpg
about my sister in Christ.
 
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NotTheRock

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There is something to that. But God can use any means to communicate with us.
The means and our abilities matter less than we would think.

I often use the example of the Potter's house. (Jeremiah 18)
Jeremiah was the only one to get that message when God gave it.

[

For sure!
 

Verily

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That's an interesting contradiction.
Should we be perfect, or not?

[
Its not a contradiction though, think about it, God called Job perfect here

And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?

Do a study on this and how perfect is used in many places, its a real eye opener, Job just has an eye for details

Job says if HE said that he (himself) was perfect that would actually prove him perverse

Job 9:20 if I say, I am perfect, it shall also prove me perverse.

Even the LORD called him perfect

The perfect man can better be perceived by the way James sets him forth here

James 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word,
the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

If a man has power to not offend in word (able to bridleth his tongue) this man would also have power in himself to bridle the entire body (so that is real power as far as I am concerned). James says this man with this ability is a perfect man. Such a one would never say "I am perfect" as Job said (who was perfect as the LORD called him so). Anyone who would say this would actually prove themselves perverse. But we are given to know this to be able to reccognize this). Thats also what we are called to grow up unto Ephes 4:13 and for what the scriptures are for when it comes to empowering the man of God to be perfect also 2 Ti 3:17 to be as our master Luke 6:40 and called to be perfect as our heavenly Father is perfect Mat 5:48

And even though Job acknowledges what he does in Job 9:20 the following verse he says,

Job 9:21 Though I were perfect, yet would I not know my soul: I would despise my life.

Paul speaks this way as well, "not as though"

Phil 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

But now go down a few verses, " Let us therefore, as many as be perfect"

Phil 3:15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

That final line, " if in any thing ye be otherwise minded (concerning what he is talking about and how to mind yourselves in this) that God shall reveal even this unto you.

Just to touch upon this, its really a great study.

So whenever you get those challenges, " What? Do you think you are perfect?? huh?? huh??"

You could say, IF I were I sure couldnt say that I was because that would certainly blow my cover clfh
 

David in NJ

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Good Morning to you as well. I'll be leaving for work shortly.


How is it that "the OT saints who BELIEVED the WORD"?

How is it that "the OT saints who BELIEVED the WORD were Born-Again by the Spirit"?

How is it that "the OT saints who BELIEVED the WORD were Born-Again by the Spirit
but they could not receive the Baptism of the Holy Spirit"?

Sorry, I needed to divide the question into three parts.

I understand that the OT saints were BEFORE Pentecost, so would not
receive the Baptism of the Spirit as Jesus explained it. (wait in Jerusalem)
But many of them certainly demonstrated the power that comes with
the Baptism of the Spirit in the miracles God worked through them.

[
i have a lot to do today, and tomorrow i am out-of-town, so i will try to respond later tonight.

SHALOM
 

amigo de christo

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That is a flawed apologetic in my view. ("the human race is without excuse")
Where is Jesus and the gospel seen in creation? No one seeks Jesus in a knowledge vacuum.
Countless billions have gone to the afterlife with no knowledge of Jesus whatsoever.
What will become of them? Your doctrine says they are toast.

[
only AN inclusivian would speak as you do my friend .
You have turned to the dark side my friend and on that path it will end very badly .
You wanna DENY GOD , well that is on you . TO DENY JESUS IS THE CHRIST , IS TO DENY GOD HIMSELF .
Once CHRIST came and the gospel began
the HOPE promised was revealed . BUT if we think the punishment of those
who denied GOD under the old covenant was bad , HOW MUCH SORER for those
who preach a false love gospel that DENIES the DIRE NEED to BELIEVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST
and in effect HAS CALLED GOD A LIAR . You will wail on the day of the LORD
You can cling all day to this diverse inclusive love that has made the road to GOD very broad
as now it even accepts UNBELIEF IN JESUS , but you will wail and wail and plead and beg
BUT WILL be shown NO mercy on the DAY OF THE LORD who this all inclusive social interfaith gospel DENIED .
now friend , if i didnt love you , i would say nothing . You are on the wrong path my friend .
And what i just wrote may even turn more against me . BUT FRIEND LOVE warns . FOR GOD IS LOVE
and HE warns , they all warned . You are on a super deadly path
and frankly i dont care if they ban me for life on this site , just for trying to help you . IT WAS WORTH IT .
IF even you hear and repent later , IT WAS WORTH me being banned for life .
 
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