The Doctrines of Grace

[Nancy]

What exactly was in the book that caused you to lose your joy in salvation?

This was in the early 1990's so all I can remember is that I thought I might not be saved at all. Perhaps the "Irresistible grace" as, being a new Christian-coming from Catholicism I came to the Church kicking and screaming, I was not so very compelled as your "I" insists.

I'd already had doubts in my younger Christian years. My guess is that the whole thing of what I learned about TULIP chipped away from joy and peace because I was afraid it was true and I was not chosen.

 

[Ritajanice]

This was in the early 1990's so all I can remember is that I thought I might not be saved at all. Perhaps the "Irresistible grace" as, being a new Christian-coming from Catholicism I came to the Church kicking and screaming, I was not so very compelled as your "I" insists.

I'd already had doubts in my younger Christian years. My guess is that the whole thing of what I learned about TULIP chipped away from joy and peace because I was afraid it was true and I was not chosen.

Surely you had the Living Holy Spirit testifying to your spirit that you were Gods child?

I had the same as a new babe, because I couldn’t explain then how I became Born Again, people kept saying it was in my emotions, I knew better, I had Gods Living testimony indwelling my heart and testifying with my spirit that I was God’s child.....now I don’t give 2 hoots what humans think of my testimony, I’m here to glorify the power of Gods Holy Spirit...no power in self...all power comes from God!

Plus everyone’s testimony is different, becoming Born Again was irresistible to me...I don’t believe it’s the same for everyone.

I have two friends who kept saying no to God, @Nancy ..they submitted to him in the end..lol...

Everyone’s testimony are different..we need to understand that...we don’t all come to the Lord the same way...

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The unregenerate are blinded by the God of this world.

God's elect only believe.

Those who do not believe are children of the devil and will send themselves to hell.

Well then you just proved my point, God is not a god of unconditional love, He did not unconditionally love the whole world. Only a few select people he held to high regard.

You could say they merited salvation, because God chose them

Which answers your nic name, elect of God.. You or setting yourself up above others.. its the normal response of those who think they are special

 

[ElectedbyHim]

This was in the early 1990's so all I can remember is that I thought I might not be saved at all. Perhaps the "Irresistible grace" as, being a new Christian-coming from Catholicism I came to the Church kicking and screaming, I was not so very compelled as your "I" insists.

I'd already had doubts in my younger Christian years. My guess is that the whole thing of what I learned about TULIP chipped away from joy and peace because I was afraid it was true and I was not chosen.

Thank you for your honesty.

If you are a born again Christian, you are His elect.

Our Lord has chosen you before the foundations of the world for salvation.

Ephesians 1:4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him in love,
Ephesians 1:5 by predestining us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,
Ephesians 1:6 to the praise of the glory of His grace, which He graciously bestowed on us in the Beloved.

Irresistable Grace:
That the saving grace of God is effectually applied to those whom He has chosen to save, overcoming their resistance and leading them to faith in Christ. This doctrine emphasizes that the Holy Spirit never fails to bring to salvation those sinners whom He personally calls to Christ

 

[Eternally Grateful]

My user name is Biblical.

Not sure how you get pride out of that.

If I just put my name, is that prideful as well?

If you are a Christian you are His elect as well.

All Christians are special in the Lords eyes.

Saying you are chosen from a calvinist perspective is pride.

Saying you are saved because of God and his work in you. Not focusing on self. Is humility

Luke said Jesus claimed the mission of the church is to go out and preach repentance for the remission and forgiveness of sins.

You can not teach repentance. If you are unable to repent. This is nonsensical.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The first time I had issue with it was shortly after becoming saved. It was several years before PC's. I was at the library all the time to get my hands on as many "Christian" books as I could. Many were great but this one, cannot remember who wrote it or it's title but, it was all about Calvinism. Well, of course it shook me up pretty good and I lost the joy of my salvation not to mention the little hope I already had had been stomped on. After speaking with my Pastor and good friend and sister in Christ, they calmed me yet, 30 some years later I remain with times of doubt.

Funny thing is that, 13 years ago I decided to walk into a reformed-Baptist church. The new pastor and his wife, not to mention pretty much the whole congregation were unapproachable, the wife literally and blatantly shunned me. I did not know they were Calvinist until I made an appointment with the young new pastor, I outright said something to the effect of "I am NOT a Calvinist, he said "I am a staunch 5 pointer; I think from there on in he could care less. He also said something un-becoming a man of God; "I would say more than half of this congregation was not saved"!
Was a very dry church and most there, had no idea what their pastor believed.
I foolishly stayed on for a couple of years will near zero fellowship. It became unbearable to even drive by that place, I left hurt and yet again questioning my salvation.

I know that Pink, Piper, MacArthur...have some good teachings outside of T.U.L.I.P.

Amen,

That why both fatalism and Arminianism are problems which come from the same root prety much.

If I am not chosen, in the end I will not be saved

 

[ElectedbyHim]

Well then you just proved my point, God is not a god of unconditional love, He did not unconditionally love the whole world. Only a few select people he held to high regard.

You could say they merited salvation, because God chose them

Which answers your nic name, elect of God.. You or setting yourself up above others.. its the normal response of those who think they are special

Well then you just proved my point, God is not a god of unconditional love, He did not unconditionally love the whole world. Only a few select people he held to high regard.

What do you know of God's love?

Do you believe He loves everyon the same equally?

You could say they merited salvation, because God chose them

Define this please.

Which answers your nic name, elect of God.. You or setting yourself up above others.. its the normal response of those who think they are special

You are certainly entitled to your opinion about me.

 

[Ritajanice]

@ElectedbyHim

Jeremiah 1:5- Your Unique Calling and Purpose God has known us and set us apart for His purposes even before we were born. Our uniqueness is part of His divine plan and He has specific roles for us to play in His story. Feel encouraged that you are uniquely chosen and known by God for a special purpose

 

[ElectedbyHim]

Saying you are chosen from a calvinist perspective is pride.

Saying you are saved because of God and his work in you. Not focusing on self. Is humility

Luke said Jesus claimed the mission of the church is to go out and preach repentance for the remission and forgiveness of sins.

You can not teach repentance. If you are unable to repent. This is nonsensical.

It seems you do not understand the Doctrines of Grace.

You got all this from my username?

Ha, only on the internet.

You better believe that I am proud that my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, God elected my evil, sinful self to salvation, because I sure wanted to live my life my way and not His.

If it was not for Him, I would be on my way to hell.

 

[ElectedbyHim]

@ElectedbyHim

Jeremiah 1:5- Your Unique Calling and Purpose God has known us and set us apart for His purposes even before we were born. Our uniqueness is part of His divine plan and He has specific roles for us to play in His story. Feel encouraged that you are uniquely chosen and known by God for a special purpose

This I know, thank you.

 

[Ritajanice]

You better believe that I am proud that my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, God elected my evil, sinful self to salvation, because I sure wanted to live my life my way and not His.

Praise God, for your testimony and glorifying words to God here!..music to my ears and Gods!

All Glory ,Honour and Praise to only our Heavenly Father, by his Grace and Mercy saved us from eternal damnation!

 

[Lambano]

Surely you had the Living Holy Spirit testifying to your spirit that you were Gods child?

Everyone’s testimony are different..we need to understand that...we don’t all come to the Lord the same way...

True. Everybody's testimony is different. God blessed you in a special way, and I give Him thanks and praise for what He's done in your life, but not everybody gets to be so blessed.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It seems you do not understand the Doctrines of Grace.

Oh I do

For we have been saved by grace THROUGH FAITH

You want to remove faith from the equation. And claim God keeps many from having the ability to believe, and picks and choses others and prety much forces them to believe (they have no choice)

You got all this from my username?

Ha, only on the internet.

You better believe that I am proud that my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, God elected my evil, sinful self to salvation, because I sure wanted to live my life my way and not His.

But did he?

If it was not for Him, I would be on my way to hell.

Thank God he offered the whole world salvation (not just you)

If you believed this, than I would think you really did believe in Gods unconditional love

 

[Ritajanice]

True. Everybody's testimony is different. God blessed you in a special way, and I give Him thanks and praise for what He's done in your life, but not everybody gets to be so blessed.

He has no favourites...I can assure you at times ,especially what I am going through at the moment, I don’t feel blessed, I know he is in control, but it doesn’t stop me hurting, especially as I live alone and hardly ever see my family just lately,..I feel very physically alone to be honest, I know I’m not alone in spirit,..but I am physically...I can’t get another dog as my AF has come back....I would appreciate your prayers as quite honestly I’m struggling at the moment, ..family problems and a situation that I have been in for the past 33 yrs...still I wait for God to bring it to fruition...

I’m struggling but it doesn’t stop me praising Gods Name....”.now, “.........all I’ve been doing latey ,past time, is moaning to him..lol...I’ve starting praising him again, even though I’m struggling....when I think of what Jesus must have gone through, ..it helps me with my struggles..ive been crying a lot to God lately, asking him to remove this burden I’ve been carrying for the past 33 yrs, I ask him to take it from me, he does, then I keep taking it back on board, even though it’s not my burden to carry, it involves me......my faith in God is very much up and down at the moment, especially in this 33 yr situation that I’ve never been able to share with anyone....only God...we all have our cross to carry , Brother, we well know, it ain’t no easy road that we walk...I know what you have faced just lately, the heartbreak you both must feel, I pray that God helps to heal that pain of losing a beloved Son....my thoughts and prayers are often with you both..

 

[ElectedbyHim]

Oh I do

For we have been saved by grace THROUGH FAITH

You want to remove faith from the equation. And claim God keeps many from having the ability to believe, and picks and choses others and prety much forces them to believe (they have no choice)


But did he?

Thank God he offered the whole world salvation (not just you)

If you believed this, than I would think you really did believe in Gods unconditional love

You want to remove faith from the equation. And claim God keeps many from having the ability to believe, and picks and choses others and prety much forces them to believe (they have no choice)

Thats not what I believe and thats, your assumption is wrong.

You want to believe you had a choice in salvation, is that correct?

Thank God he offered the whole world salvation (not just you)

Salvation is offered to all humans, but not all humans are saved.

Not all humans have heard the gospel.

If you believed this, than I would think you really did believe in Gods unconditional love

Does God love all humans the same?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Thats not what I believe and thats, your assumption is wrong.

Then you must believe in unlimited atonement

You want to believe you had a choice in salvation, is that correct?

I believe I was saved by grace.

I chose to recieve his grace gift of life. Because he proved to be faithfull.

Salvation is offered to all humans, but not all humans are saved.

if someone is totally unable to even have a chance to be saved, then salvation is not offered to them

It’s like the world is in a burning building, and God has a chance to save them all. but he only saves a chosen few.

Not all humans have heard the gospel.

Romans 1 says they have no excuse. All ot people who were saved never heard the gospel as we know it.

Also. god knows who will believe and who will not. He has proven time and time again when someone is positive to his call. He will do everything to get them the truth

Does God love all humans the same?

For God so loved the world. He gave his only begotten son that whoever believes.

Did God just pick you out and make you special and die for you

Or did he die for everyone (also note. You said salvation is offered to the world. If jesus did nto die for them, salvation can not be offered to them)

So twice in this one post. You seem to refute your own belief system

 

[ElectedbyHim]

Then you must believe in unlimited atonement


I believe I was saved by grace.

I chose to recieve his grace gift of life. Because he proved to be faithfull.




if someone is totally unable to even have a chance to be saved, then salvation is not offered to them

It’s like the world is in a burning building, and God has a chance to save them all. but he only saves a chosen few.




Romans 1 says they have no excuse. All ot people who were saved never heard the gospel as we know it.

Also. god knows who will believe and who will not. He has proven time and time again when someone is positive to his call. He will do everything to get them the truth


For God so loved the world. He gave his only begotten son that whoever believes.

Did God just pick you out and make you special and die for you

Or did he die for everyone (also note. You said salvation is offered to the world. If jesus did nto die for them, salvation can not be offered to them)

So twice in this one post. You seem to refute your own belief system

A lot of bad theology in your post.

I believe I was saved by grace.

I chose to recieve his grace gift of life. Because he proved to be faithfull.

That is human pride on display. The diiference in what we believe is that you think you did something "chose" in salvation. That is, you had free will. This is synergism

Humans want to share in God's glory so they take credit for "choosing" God.

For me, I did absolutely nothing, it was all the work of God (monergism) and He gets all the Glory.

if someone is totally unable to even have a chance to be saved, then salvation is not offered to them

It’s like the world is in a burning building, and God has a chance to save them all. but he only saves a chosen few.

Rom 9:11 for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that the purpose of God according to His choice would stand, not because of works but because of Him who calls,
Rom 9:12 it was said to her, “THE OLDER SHALL SERVE THE YOUNGER.”
Rom 9:13 Just as it is written, “JACOB I LOVED, BUT ESAU I HATED.”
Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there any unrighteousness with God? May it never be!
Rom 9:15 For He says to Moses, “I WILL HAVE MERCY ON WHOM I HAVE MERCY, AND I WILL HAVE COMPASSION ON WHOM I HAVE COMPASSION.”
Rom 9:16 So then it does not depend on the one who wills or the one who runs, but on God who has mercy.

Rom 9:21 Or does not the potter have authority over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use?
Rom 9:22 And what if God, wanting to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath having been prepared for destruction,
Rom 9:23 and in order that He might make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory—

Also. god knows who will believe and who will not. He has proven time and time again when someone is positive to his call. He will do everything to get them the truth

This is not Biblical.

God gives the gift of faith to believe. No human has belief on their own.

A dead man cannot choose life.

For God so loved the world. He gave his only begotten son that whoever believes.

I will ask you for the third time, does God love all humans the same?

Did God just pick you out and make you special and die for you

He did this for all the humans He has chosen for salvation.

That includes you if you are saved.

Romans 8:29 Because those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers;
Romans 8:30 and those whom He predestined, He also called; and those whom He called, He also justified; and those whom He justified, He also glorified.

Ephesians 1:4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him in love,
Ephesians 1:5 by predestining us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,
Ephesians 1:6 to the praise of the glory of His grace, which He graciously bestowed on us in the Beloved.

1 Peter 2:9 But you are A CHOSEN FAMILY, A royal PRIESTHOOD, A HOLY NATION, A PEOPLE FOR God’s OWN POSSESSION, so that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light;
1 Peter 2:10 for you once were NOT A PEOPLE, but now you are THE PEOPLE OF GOD; you had NOT RECEIVED MERCY, but now you have RECEIVED MERCY.

So twice in this one post. You seem to refute your own belief system

"Seem" or you just really do not understand what I believe.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

A lot of bad theology in your post.

scripture is bad theology? I am sad you see this

That is human pride on display. The diiference in what we believe is that you think you did something "chose" in salvation. That is, you had free will. This is synergism

No i did not do anything

The difference between us is you rely on a doctrine. i rely on the word of god

Humans want to share in God's glory so they take credit for "choosing" God.

Well yes. if i tried to earn salvation.

But I can not earn salvation.

Me allowing God to save me is not me saving myself.

For me, I did absolutely nothing, it was all the work of God (monergism) and He gets all the Glory.

You did do something, You called God a god of hate. God chose you and placed you in a pedi stool. While refusing to allow others come to hime

Rom 9:11 for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that the purpose of God according to His choice would stand, not because of works but because of Him who calls,
Rom 9:12 it was said to her, “THE OLDER SHALL SERVE THE YOUNGER.”
Rom 9:13 Just as it is written, “JACOB I LOVED, BUT ESAU I HATED.”
Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there any unrighteousness with God? May it never be!
Rom 9:15 For He says to Moses, “I WILL HAVE MERCY ON WHOM I HAVE MERCY, AND I WILL HAVE COMPASSION ON WHOM I HAVE COMPASSION.”
Rom 9:16 So then it does not depend on the one who wills or the one who runs, but on God who has mercy.

Rom 9:21 Or does not the potter have authority over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use?
Rom 9:22 And what if God, wanting to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath having been prepared for destruction,
Rom 9:23 and in order that He might make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory—

Yes, this refutes the discussion that Israel was chosen by human standard.

it does not say God saved one fetus and condemned another fetus/

This is not Biblical.

God gives the gift of faith to believe. No human has belief on their own.

I member said they did, again, stop listening to men and doctrine, and listen to what people are telling you

A dead man cannot choose life.

Then no one can be saved. Because until you’re justified. Your dead.

I will ask you for the third time, does God love all humans the same?

For God so loved the world

He died for everyone, so in this aspect. yes he did

He did this for all the humans He has chosen for salvation.

Then all tht is left is belief or unbelief, which is what Jesus said

That includes you if you are saved.

Romans 8:29 Because those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers;
Romans 8:30 and those whom He predestined, He also called; and those whom He called, He also justified; and those whom He justified, He also glorified.

Ephesians 1:4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him in love,
Ephesians 1:5 by predestining us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,
Ephesians 1:6 to the praise of the glory of His grace, which He graciously bestowed on us in the Beloved.

1 Peter 2:9 But you are A CHOSEN FAMILY, A royal PRIESTHOOD, A HOLY NATION, A PEOPLE FOR God’s OWN POSSESSION, so that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light;
1 Peter 2:10 for you once were NOT A PEOPLE, but now you are THE PEOPLE OF GOD; you had NOT RECEIVED MERCY, but now you have RECEIVED MERCY.


"Seem" or you just really do not understand what I believe.

I am saved, By Grace THROUGH FAITH

I do believe so I am not condemned.

Not because God chose me, but because he saved me

 

[ElectedbyHim]

scripture is bad theology? I am sad you see this



No i did not do anything

The difference between us is you rely on a doctrine. i rely on the word of god


Well yes. if i tried to earn salvation.

But I can not earn salvation.

Me allowing God to save me is not me saving myself.


You did do something, You called God a god of hate. God chose you and placed you in a pedi stool. While refusing to allow others come to hime



Yes, this refutes the discussion that Israel was chosen by human standard.

it does not say God saved one fetus and condemned another fetus/


I member said they did, again, stop listening to men and doctrine, and listen to what people are telling you


Then no one can be saved. Because until you’re justified. Your dead.



For God so loved the world

He died for everyone, so in this aspect. yes he did




Then all tht is left is belief or unbelief, which is what Jesus said


I am saved, By Grace THROUGH FAITH

I do believe so I am not condemned.

Not because God chose me, but because he saved me

Me allowing God to save me is not me saving myself.

My friend, you did not "allow" God to do anything.

God does whatever He pleases.

You did do something, You called God a god of hate. God chose you and placed you in a pedi stool. While refusing to allow others come to hime

Believe as you will, your childish comments mean nothing.

The difference between us is you rely on a doctrine. i rely on the word of god

Yes I do, the teachings (doctrine) of the Bible.

Yes, this refutes the discussion that Israel was chosen by human standard.

it does not say God saved one fetus and condemned another fetus/

Romans 9 is also about salvation.

Do you understand Soteriology?

He died for everyone, so in this aspect. yes he did

Again, if that were true, there would be no one in hell because all sins would be paid for, even the sin of unbelief.

 

[ElectedbyHim]

scripture is bad theology? I am sad you see this



No i did not do anything

The difference between us is you rely on a doctrine. i rely on the word of god


Well yes. if i tried to earn salvation.

But I can not earn salvation.

Me allowing God to save me is not me saving myself.


You did do something, You called God a god of hate. God chose you and placed you in a pedi stool. While refusing to allow others come to hime



Yes, this refutes the discussion that Israel was chosen by human standard.

it does not say God saved one fetus and condemned another fetus/


I member said they did, again, stop listening to men and doctrine, and listen to what people are telling you


Then no one can be saved. Because until you’re justified. Your dead.



For God so loved the world

He died for everyone, so in this aspect. yes he did




Then all tht is left is belief or unbelief, which is what Jesus said


I am saved, By Grace THROUGH FAITH

I do believe so I am not condemned.

Not because God chose me, but because he saved me

You should study Theology Proper to have a better understanding of who God is and His attributes.