THE Trinity can Now be discussed.

[face2face]

3 is the number of God/Elohim - Genesis , Gospel, Revelation

Sorry David,

If you look at day three
Growth Upon the Earth verses 9-13

You will find the number three in the Bible often has the figurative signification of resurrection, or completion. The first appearance of land was also of great significance in the development of Yahweh's purpose.

F2F

 

[David in NJ]

Depends if you can see what Paul did to the text, if you can't then how can you understand how all Israel (natural) will be saved?

i SEE what Paul did to the text and WHY he did and i AGREE that all Israel will be saved.

 

[RLT63]

Yes, one is a subject, and the other is an object.

I'm not seeing where it says Ho Theos. What am I missing?

 

[face2face]

i SEE what Paul did to the text and WHY he did and i AGREE that all Israel will be saved.

Can you now see how the Jehovah's Witnesses' belief that Christ remains in Heaven is essentially impossible? If Christ comes to Zion to save her, and then leaves Zion to restore all thing (peace to the earth), how can they still hold that Christ and the 144,000 remain in Heaven? This doctrine seems laughable to me, as the true saints long to be with Christ on earth to help bring about its renewal.

F2F

 

[David in NJ]

Sorry David,

If you look at day three
Growth Upon the Earth verses 9-13

You will find the number three in the Bible often has the figurative signification of resurrection, or completion. The first appearance of land was also of great significance in the development of Yahweh's purpose.

F2F

There are 3 Elements = Sky , Land , Water

Sky - FATHER
Land - Word became flesh
Water - Holy Spirit

 

[RLT63]

Can you now see how the Jehovah's Witnesses' belief that Christ remains in Heaven is essentially impossible? If Christ comes to Zion to save her, and then leaves Zion to restore all thing (peace to the earth), how can they still hold that Christ and the 144,000 remain in Heaven? This doctrine seems laughable to me, as the true saints long to be with Christ on earth to help bring about its renewal.

F2F

I can't see how they think 144,000 Jews are actually JWs

 

[MonoBiblical]

I'm not seeing where it says Ho Theos. What am I missing?

You are correct-- ton theon is [the] only similar construction. However, I am very antithetical. I would render the Greek artricles indefinite, and all anarthrous nouns as definite. "In the beginning it was, a word, and a word it was with a God, and the God it was." Mine is heresy, but I would say it is correct.

 

[face2face]

Also @David in NJ I owe you an apology (sorry) for claiming you were wrong when actually you were right. The true spiritual children from Jacob are given divine care and called by the HS so while its true the multitude of Elect from Jacob is the primary lesson; God's divine care of us and the sealing of us through faith is by the HS. It was a logical conclusion once I followed the crumbs!

F2F

 

[face2face]

I can't see how they think 144,000 Jews are actually JWs

I understand why they would want to feel special in His eyes and use this belief to motivate their proclamation, but in my view, they are still mistaken.

 

[MonoBiblical]

I understand why they would want to feel special in His eyes and use this belief to motivate their proclamation, but in my view, they are still mistaken.

They are encouraged to be poor and not attend college. They can try to brag about how they are better than the Mormons all they want.

 

[RLT63]

You are correct-- ton theon is [the] only similar construction. However, I am very antithetical. I would render the Greek artricles indefinite, and all anarthrous nouns as definite. "In the beginning it was, a word, and a word it was with a God, and the God it was." Mine is heresy, but I would say it is correct.

Well you know more about Greek than I do, I won't argue

 

[RLT63]

I understand why they would want to feel special in His eyes and use this belief to motivate their proclamation, but in my view, they are still mistaken.

Those are the ones they say have the heavenly hope, the rest just live on earth

 

[face2face]

Those are the ones they say have the heavenly hope, the rest just live on earth

Correct

 

[RLT63]

Correct

These are also the only ones allowed to take communion

 

[Aunty Jane]

Do you dispute that scripture says that we are the adopted sons and daughters of God and joint heirs with Christ...
Galatians 4 (KJV)

That depends on who you believe this designation pertains to….
Can you tell me what it means to be a “joint heir with Christ”?
What is Christ inheriting that his “saints” also inherit? Is heaven the only destination for Christians?
That is not what the Bible says. “The meek shall inherit the earth”…so who are they?

¹ Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of all;
² But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father.
³ Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:
⁴ But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
⁵ To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
⁶ And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
⁷ Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.

Who is “we” spoken about there?
What is redemption?
Who are redeemed, and why do they need it?
What is this “adoption” that the Bible speaks of?
How does one go from being a “servant” to being a “son” and “heir”?

You see there are these verse quoted as some kind of proof texting, but most who quote them have no idea what they actually mean because it’s all filtered through a trinitarians lens….take that lens away and there is a whole other story, not obscured by man made doctrines.

 

[David in NJ]

Can you now see how the Jehovah's Witnesses' belief that Christ remains in Heaven is essentially impossible? If Christ comes to Zion to save her, and then leaves Zion to restore all thing (peace to the earth), how can they still hold that Christ and the 144,000 remain in Heaven? This doctrine seems laughable to me, as the true saints long to be with Christ on earth to help bring about its renewal.

F2F

true saints long to be with Christ on earth to help bring about its renewal.

AWESOME and TRUE

 

[David in NJ]

Also @David in NJ I owe you an apology (sorry) for claiming you were wrong when actually you were right. The true spiritual children from Jacob are given divine care and called by the HS so while its true the multitude of Elect from Jacob is the primary lesson; God's divine care of us and the sealing of us through faith is by the HS. It was a logical conclusion once I followed the crumbs!

F2F

BIG THANK YOU for us getting back together in Christ
We are Brothers in Christ
i grew up with brothers and we fought at times, real hard, but we always loved each other - even when we did not act as such.

You and i can get a little testy with each but we must LOVE each other = John 15:12
“These things I have spoken to you, that My joy may remain in you, and that your joy may be full.
This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you."

 

[David in NJ]

Those are the ones they say have the heavenly hope, the rest just live on earth

Very sad how they are lied to.

 

[Aunty Jane]

So what happened? Did Strong's Concordance conspire to leave Ho Theos out of John 1:1 and just put Theos?

Here it is in the Mounce Interlinear….
”In en the beginning archē was eimi the ho Word logos, and kai the ho Word logos was eimi with pros ·ho God theos, and kai the ho Word logos was eimi God theos.“
Take note of that little word “ho”….

There it is….”ho logos” (the Word) who was ”with ho theos’ but the Word was only “theos”.…no definite article. Yet the definite article is missing in the translation where it actually belonged. It changes the whole meaning of that verse…..reverses it.

Two “gods” (divine mighty ones) are in that verse…..but that is not all….see the word “WAS “ (”eimi”)?….that is the same word that Jesus used in John 8:58 saying that “before Abraham, I WAS”……not “I Am”. A past tense question was answered with a past tense statement.

I'm not seeing where it says Ho Theos. What am I missing?

You are perhaps reading a trinitarian interlinear…..It’s there in other interlinears.

The Kingdom Interlinear reads….
”In ἀρχῇ beginning ἦν was ὁ the λόγος, Word, καὶ and ὁ the λόγος Word ἦν was πρὸς toward τὸν the θεόν, God, καὶ and θεὸς god ἦν was ὁ the λόγος.”
The phrasing is a little different in Greek, saying that the Word was with τὸν θεόν, (the God) and “god was the Word”.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Very sad how they are lied to.

Are you saying that all Christians have a heavenly calling? (Heb 3:1) Where does that leave the meek who will inherit the earth? (Matt 5:5)

If everyone goes to heaven what was the purpose of creating them as humans on earth?