THE TWO GOSPEL HERESY

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Grailhunter

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Jesus broke their law.
No apostle including Paul preached any other way to heaven ,other than through Jesus, which is the only gospel.

This is part of the topic of Christian Greek. The Greek word that Christians use for the word Gospel is euangélion (εὐαγγέλιον). In post 157 I explained it is a Greek military word for the proclamation of victory. It does not mean Good News or Glad Tidings, its Greek definition has nothing to do with a religious message or religious event.

But the Apostles changed the definition of the Greek word to mean “The message of salvation is Good News” which is fine and normal for Christian Greek. And as I also explained they really had no other option than to change the definition of Greek words because the Pagan Greek language did not have Christian words or terms.

But the word Gospel as used in Christian Greek is a loose term. For example…The Gospel according to Saint Matthew is the story of Yeshua’s life and ministry according to Matthew. But it is not “The” Gospel, it is one of four stories of Yeshua’s life and ministry and part of a larger story about 1st century Christianity. In post 165 I said that a lot of times the word Gospel is used out of context. It is not any one “book” in the New Testament, it is the New Testament as a whole and as such the Gospel can mean the story of salvation in the New Testament. Yeshua saves! Is it a proclamation or a story? Or both.....loose term.

But in the New Testament how to observe the Christian religion changes as does its character. The Gentile-Christians dropped the requirement to obey the Mosaic Law and in doing so dropped the harsh character of the Mosaic Law. Let all that you do be done in love. 1st Corinthians 16:14 So the story of the Gospel changes.

They dropped the harsh character of the Mosaic Law. Why did I say that? In accordance with the Mosaic Law the Jewish-Christians could sell their daughters as sex slaves ie concubines and they could have multiple wives. But did they?

When did the Christian practice of polygamy end?
The Catholic Church held a synod in Hertford, England, in 673 that was supervised by Archbishop Theodore. Chapter 10 issued by the synod declared that marriage is allowed between one man and one woman…..A few centuries later the Jews started to stop practicing polygamy.

When did the Christian practice of concubinage end?
The practice of concubinage was eventually outlawed by the Catholic Council of Trent in the 16th century.
(Yeap, this time it did involve the Catholic Church.)

Do the Protestants practice polygamy and or concubinage?
But who were the Christians that were practicing polygamy and concubinage? It is speculation to say, then as today, it was Christians, that were holding on to Jewish-Christian beliefs or simply mixing Judaism with Christian beliefs? As it is, it is mostly about mixing Judaism with Christian beliefs. Not all Protestants that mix Judaism with Christianity practice polygamy and or concubinage ….so it is a selective mixing of Judaism with Christianity which can be mixed in different ways. And I have meet Protestants that practice polygamy and or concubinage and they were not Mormon.
 
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Behold

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Repent means turn to God in submission to Him.

Absolutely not,.

To Repent, as God requires you to do.. so that He can forgive you.... is to Repent from UNBELIEF.....to Turn from unbelief... to FAITH in Christ...

Thats the "repentance" that God is looking for in your HEART, as that is where Faith in Christ is found....or not.
 

JLB

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Absolutely not,.

To Repent, as God requires you to do.. so that He can forgive you.... is to Repent from UNBELIEF.....to Turn from unbelief... to FAITH in Christ...

Thats the "repentance" that God is looking for in your HEART, as that is where Faith in Christ is found....or not.

Then you openly and defiantly reject the plain and clear words of Jesus Christ.


Repent means turn to God in submission to Him.

“Therefore, King Agrippa, I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance. Acts 26:19-20


If we are called to turn to God then by default we are called to turn away from Satan as our lord.

I will deliver you from the Jewish people, as well as from the Gentiles, to whom I now send you, to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and
from the power of Satan to God,


…. in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God,

Turn them from Satan and his power to God is undeniable!


The way we obey this command of the Gospel to repent is to confess Jesus as our LORD.
 

Behold

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Repent means turn to God in submission to Him.

You can be a disciple of Christ and go to hell.

God is looking first and foremost for the unbeliever to TRUST IN CHRIST..

The water baptism, the trying to live the Christian life........all that comes AFTER the person becomes a Christian.
See...The "present your body as a living sacrifice to God which is your reasonable service"... SUBMISSION... come LATER...........AFTER you become a Christian,.

And to become a Christian you have to stop being an UNBELIEVER.......you have to REPENT (turn from) your UNBELIEF.

That's called "FAITH in Christ"........

Repenting from unbelief to FAITH In Christ.

Thats the Repentance that God is looking for, from a SINNER.
 

Dan Clarkston

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Even as one who believes in eternal security, I am very VERY opposed to the heretical notion that this gives anyone the right to simply live any way they please and sin as much as they like.

If it was actually true that we cannot ever never ever lose our salvation... then we actually could sin all we want and still go to Heaven.

Many churches actually teach this and while few (so far) come out and say "it's OK to live in sin if ya want to".... what they do is claim if one lives in sin then they'll just loose a few rewards in Heaven but none the less they will still go to Heaven even if they lived a lifestyle of knowingly and willing engaging in sinful behavior.

I was going to a church years ago when the Lord proved to me from scripture that OSAS is actually a doctrine of devils.

In order to be a follower of the OSAS heresy, one must become a cherry picker and ignore portions of scripture and instead only believe a handful of verses as they reject the whole counsel of God.

In other words, the attitude the OSAS people have towards the Lord is... "Lord, I just do not believe all the things you say in your Word!"

It is extremely unfortunate and disheartening to see people taking promise of security and warping it into a lawless, fruitless existence of self-indulgence.

This is why the Lord put this in His Word...

Jude 1:4
For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

In fact, God's definition of grace specifically tells us we are to turn away from ungodliness and worldly lusts, and we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world

Titus 2:11,12
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;


God's Word tells us we are ordained unto good works that we should walk in them

Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Don't tell this to any of the OSAS peoples because they don't actually believe all the Lord says in His Word and they play this little game where they claim something things God says in His Word are more true than other things He says and it's those other things we should ignore.

This is yet another way we know the OSAS people are following doctrines of demons because they REJECT the whole counsel of God

The majority of them have to because they have secret sin in their lives (such as spreading heresy) and they really have to work at feeling good about themselves do to being involved in wrong doing.
 

Dan Clarkston

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That judgment call is well above your paygrade

It's not above the Lord's pay grade... you are a denier of the whole counsel of God and as such your future is not going to be what you expect.... unless you REPENT of the doctrines of demons you have been indoctrinated with.


Don't confuse children of the devil with children of God

1 John 1:6
If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

It's always funny how the OSAS peoples claiming it's not possible for one to lose their salvation when the majority of them are walking after the flesh

Those that have been brain washed by the false doctrines of OSAS have had their understanding darkened (reprobate) and can no longer accept all that the Lord says... which is why they hold on to their handful of happy verses while ignoring the rest of God's Word.


You are not the judge of the universe.

No, but I have access to the Word of the Living God Who will judge according to what He has said

I wouldn't expect the OSAS peoples to understand... how could they? They don't accept the whole counsel of God. clueless-doh.gif



In context, this is addressing false prophets and false teachers.

Uh huh, and those teaching the false doctrines of OSAS are definitely in the false teacher camp.


Just because the book of Romans is addressed to Christians does not mean that everyone being discussed in the book of Romans is a genuine Christian.

Yes and those teaching the false doctrines of OSAS are no longer genuine Christian due to following doctrines of devils.



But since non-elect covenant members are mixed in, Christ clearly appears to have non-elect branche

And of course we see where the false doctrines of OSAS come from.... the false doctrines of calvinism

This is why these people are reprobate seeing they reject the whole counsel of God and twist scripture just their their boy John Calvin did to justify murdering people in the name of their lord and savior which is the fake jesus (the devil) who enjoys killing, stealing and destroying and not the Real Jesus of the Bible.
 

mailmandan

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It's not above the Lord's pay grade...
You are not the Lord.

you are a denier of the whole counsel of God and as such your future is not going to be what you expect....
You are a false accuser of the brethren, and your future may not be what you expect. My future rests in Jesus Christ. (1 John 5:11-13)

unless you REPENT of the doctrines of demons you have been indoctrinated with.
I neither teach nor am indoctrinated into doctrines of demons. You really need to tone down the slander.

Psalm 37:28 - For the Lord loves justice and does not forsake His saints; They are preserved forever, But the descendants of the wicked shall be cut off. Jude 1:1 - Jude, a bondservant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to those who are called, sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ. Do you believe that God's preservation is a doctrine of demons? Perhaps you prefer self-preservation based on works-righteousness.

John 6:39 - This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing but raise it up on the last day. 40 For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day. *Jesus loses nothing. Maybe you should start believing Jesus.

John 10:27 - My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. Would you refer to the words of Jesus here as a doctrine of demons?

In Romans 8:30, we read - Moreover, whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified. *ALL of them. *Notice how Paul uses the past tense for a future event to stress its certainty. Perhaps you accuse the apostle Paul of teaching a doctrine of demons.

Ephesians 1:13 - In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory. Did you see that? sml

Ephesians 4:30 - And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Would you call sealed until the redemption of the purchased possession/for the day of redemption a doctrine of demons?

2 Corinthians 1:22 - who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.

2 Corinthians 5:5 - Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee. Would you call God's guarantee a doctrine of demons?

I have found that ALL false religions and cults that pervert the gospel by promoting salvation by works strongly oppose OSAS which has always been a major red flag for me. So, what do YOU believe the gospel IS and also, what do YOU believe it means to BELIEVE the gospel?

1 John 1:6
If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
1 John 1:6 does not teach a loss of salvation. I prefer my exegesis over your eisegesis. 1 John 1:6 - If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

*Walking in darkness is 'descriptive' of children of the devil. Walking in the light is 'descriptive' of children of God. Only those who are saved/believers are in the light.

Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.

2 Corinthians 6:14 - Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?

Ephesians 5:8 - for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light. Children of the devil walk in darkness, not in the light. Children of God walk in the light, not in darkness. IF confirms these positions in verses 6 and 7. It's one or the other.

In 1 John 2:9, we read - He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. In vs. 11 - But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.

*Compare with 1 John 3:10 - In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, (compare with 1 John 1:6 - does not practice the truth) nor is he who does not love his brother.

*Notice that walks in darkness, hates his brother is 'descriptive' of children of the devil.

It's always funny how the OSAS peoples claiming it's not possible for one to lose their salvation when the majority of them are walking after the flesh
Again, these types of judgment calls are well above your paygrade. Only the Lord can infallibly judge the hearts of men. Also, there are genuine Christians and there are "nominal" or pseudo-Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers.

Those that have been brain washed by the false doctrines of OSAS have had their understanding darkened (reprobate) and can no longer accept all that the Lord says... which is why they hold on to their handful of happy verses while ignoring the rest of God's Word.
It's you who seems to be brain washed and you also seem to be suffering from a severe case of anti-OSAS derangement syndrome. So, you don't like happy verses in the Bible and instead prefer unhappy verses? Maybe you also prefer to remain on your roller coaster ride of fear and bondage to insecurity. The same roller coaster ride that I got off of upon my conversion when I left the Roman Catholic church. Now I do accept all that the Lord says. I just don't accept your eisegesis.

No, but I have access to the Word of the Living God Who will judge according to what He has said

I wouldn't expect the OSAS peoples to understand... how could they? They don't accept the whole counsel of God. View attachment 52697

Uh huh, and those teaching the false doctrines of OSAS are definitely in the false teacher camp.

Yes and those teaching the false doctrines of OSAS are no longer genuine Christian due to following doctrines of devils.

And of course we see where the false doctrines of OSAS come from.... the false doctrines of calvinism

This is why these people are reprobate seeing they reject the whole counsel of God and twist scripture just their their boy John Calvin did to justify murdering people in the name of their lord and savior which is the fake jesus (the devil) who enjoys killing, stealing and destroying and not the Real Jesus of the Bible.
LOL! I am not a Calvinist, and I can see that your indoctrination along with your severe case of anti-OSAS derangement syndrome runs deep. I can also see that you have some serious issues. :( I will continue to lift you up in prayer to the Lord. pryw
 

Doug

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The false brethren always say this when they get caught believing false doctrine.
You need to do better than this homie! View attachment 52636






Alrighty then... you think one can live like the devil, as an adversary to the Lord and they are automatically forgiven
View attachment 52633What a fresh steaming pile of horse hockey that is!

No wonder all you OSAS peoples are living in sin which is spiritual adultery against the Lord

2 Peter 2:14
Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

Romans 11:22
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, IF thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

You should take heed to these warnings... written to Christians! View attachment 52635
(there's more warnings in the NT about this...)





So you think it's OK to live in sin... if those people died while in sin after having become a believer,. they would have gone south not north... just like Ananias and Sapphira

False doctrines such as what you osas peoples espouse is causing people to miss Heaven... but you and your boy Charlie Stanley love some false doctrine!





Well you.... believe wrong

God's Word does not teach this so you have been deceived by doctrines of demons.
I think you have misunderstood me saying we can sin. My fault I was being too succinct. I mean that we are not sinless even after being justified unto eternal life. We are to reckon ourselves dead to sin and alive to God. Sin does not have to have dominion over us seeing we are under grace. Grace teaches us to live righteously and please God.
 

Doug

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The false brethren always say this when they get caught believing false doctrine.
You need to do better than this homie! View attachment 52636






Alrighty then... you think one can live like the devil, as an adversary to the Lord and they are automatically forgiven
View attachment 52633What a fresh steaming pile of horse hockey that is!

No wonder all you OSAS peoples are living in sin which is spiritual adultery against the Lord

2 Peter 2:14
Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

Romans 11:22
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, IF thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

You should take heed to these warnings... written to Christians! View attachment 52635
(there's more warnings in the NT about this...)





So you think it's OK to live in sin... if those people died while in sin after having become a believer,. they would have gone south not north... just like Ananias and Sapphira

False doctrines such as what you osas peoples espouse is causing people to miss Heaven... but you and your boy Charlie Stanley love some false doctrine!





Well you.... believe wrong

God's Word does not teach this so you have been deceived by doctrines of demons.
I copied my posting in Bible Study on OSAS and sin


There is a lot of sentiment that refutes eternal security based on the belief that it propagates freely sinning.

The Bible teaches both eternal security and living righteously.

Let's first look at eternal security.

[Jhn 3:14-16 KJV] 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

While the Old Testament was primarily given to Israel to obey, we can still learn from it.

The Jews only had to believe on Jesus to have eternal life.

[Rom 3:21-22 KJV] 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Now on to Paul who was given revelation from the risen Christ Jesus to preach our gospel today for Jew and Gentile.

Paul revealed that we have the righteousness of God by faith in Christ. If have been declared righteous then we can know we have eternal security.

[Rom 4:21-25 KJV] 21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Righteousness was imputed to Abraham; it was not his righteousness but the righteousness of God.

The righteousness of Christ is imputed to us as well.

Jesus died for our sins and rose for our justification unto eternal life.

[Rom 5:9-11 KJV] 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 11 And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

We are justified by his blood and are reconciled.

[Rom 5:21 KJV] 21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Rom 6:23 KJV] 23 For the wages of sin [is] death; but the gift of God [is] eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Tit 1:2 KJV] 2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
[Tit 3:7 KJV] 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

These verses promise eternal life and security.

Being justified can we freely sin?

[Rom 6:1-2 KJV] 1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? 2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Paul gives answer to those who would say we are free to sin.

[Rom 6:6-7 KJV] 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

We are to reckon we are dead to sin but alive to God.

[Rom 6:12, 14-15, 22 KJV] 12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. ... 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. 15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. ... 22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

Above are more verses pertaining to sin.

[Tit 2:11-12 KJV] 11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

Finaly the above passage dispels the assertion that being justified eternally by grace promotes sin.
 

Doug

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Even as one who believes in eternal security, I am very VERY opposed to the heretical notion that this gives anyone the right to simply live any way they please and sin as much as they like. It is extremely unfortunate and disheartening to see people taking promise of security and warping it into a lawless, fruitless existence of self-indulgence.
I agree

I read your post and just wanted to share a posting on this

There is a lot of sentiment that refutes eternal security based on the belief that it propagates freely sinning.

The Bible teaches both eternal security and living righteously.

Let's first look at eternal security.

[Jhn 3:14-16 KJV] 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

While the Old Testament was primarily given to Israel to obey, we can still learn from it.

The Jews only had to believe on Jesus to have eternal life.

[Rom 3:21-22 KJV] 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Now on to Paul who was given revelation from the risen Christ Jesus to preach our gospel today for Jew and Gentile.

Paul revealed that we have the righteousness of God by faith in Christ. If have been declared righteous then we can know we have eternal security.

[Rom 4:21-25 KJV] 21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Righteousness was imputed to Abraham; it was not his righteousness but the righteousness of God.

The righteousness of Christ is imputed to us as well.

Jesus died for our sins and rose for our justification unto eternal life.

[Rom 5:9-11 KJV] 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 11 And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

We are justified by his blood and are reconciled.

[Rom 5:21 KJV] 21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Rom 6:23 KJV] 23 For the wages of sin [is] death; but the gift of God [is] eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
[Tit 1:2 KJV] 2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
[Tit 3:7 KJV] 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

These verses promise eternal life and security.

Being justified can we freely sin?

[Rom 6:1-2 KJV] 1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? 2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Paul gives answer to those who would say we are free to sin.

[Rom 6:6-7 KJV] 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

We are to reckon we are dead to sin but alive to God.

[Rom 6:12, 14-15, 22 KJV] 12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. ... 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. 15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. ... 22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

Above are more verses pertaining to sin.

[Tit 2:11-12 KJV] 11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

Finaly the above passage dispels the assertion that being justified eternally by grace promotes sin.
 

rebuilder 454

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Posting scripture doesn’t answer my question .

How do you know that God raised Jesus from the dead?

Posting scripture is not enough, anyone can do that.

So I ask you again..how do you know that God raised Jesus from the dead?

You need to interpret and explain that scripture please?

How do you know that you are Born Again?

You aren’t Born Again by posting scripture @LatterRain ...
It seems to me like there are two dynamics. There's those that have had a true conversion
they feel clean
they feel different
they feel brand new
the sky is Bluer
the trees are greener
everything is different

and it becomes an adventure to them.
They walk with Jesus they talk with Jesus they know something happened to them even without being able to explain it or any evangelist or any book or any outside help

they know they have been transformed.
From reading your post I get it that that has happened to you.
And that is how I came into the kingdom.
I was born again and nobody told me anything.
Now later on I began to learn not only from the preaching but Christians were showing me and telling me the Dynamics of my salvation and it really gave me more definition in my walk and my relationship.
... but all those things are not salvation
it's that meeting of God is that transformation from within that's salvation and I think something like that happened to you also.
The other Dynamic that I see mainly here, and at the men's bible study I attend, is what I call a "mental salvation".
it does seem like they have something with God
, but the depth is not there .
the intimacy is not there
and the knowledge is not there of true salvation.
it becomes a string of sentences or a formula or this verse or that verse and they actually think that that is salvation
 

rebuilder 454

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This is part of the topic of Christian Greek. The Greek word that Christians use for the word Gospel is euangélion (εὐαγγέλιον). In post 157 I explained it is a Greek military word for the proclamation of victory. It does not mean Good News or Glad Tidings, its Greek definition has nothing to do with a religious message or religious event.

But the Apostles changed the definition of the Greek word to mean “The message of salvation is Good News” which is fine and normal for Christian Greek. And as I also explained they really had no other option than to change the definition of Greek words because the Pagan Greek language did not have Christian words or terms.

But the word Gospel as used in Christian Greek is a loose term. For example…The Gospel according to Saint Matthew is the story of Yeshua’s life and ministry according to Matthew. But it is not “The” Gospel, it is one of four stories of Yeshua’s life and ministry and part of a larger story about 1st century Christianity. In post 165 I said that a lot of times the word Gospel is used out of context. It is not any one “book” in the New Testament, it is the New Testament as a whole and as such the Gospel can mean the story of salvation in the New Testament. Yeshua saves! Is it a proclamation or a story? Or both.....loose term.

But in the New Testament how to observe the Christian religion changes as does its character. The Gentile-Christians dropped the requirement to obey the Mosaic Law and in doing so dropped the harsh character of the Mosaic Law. Let all that you do be done in love. 1st Corinthians 16:14 So the story of the Gospel changes.

They dropped the harsh character of the Mosaic Law. Why did I say that? In accordance with the Mosaic Law the Jewish-Christians could sell their daughters as sex slaves ie concubines and they could have multiple wives. But did they?

When did the Christian practice of polygamy end?
The Catholic Church held a synod in Hertford, England, in 673 that was supervised by Archbishop Theodore. Chapter 10 issued by the synod declared that marriage is allowed between one man and one woman…..A few centuries later the Jews started to stop practicing polygamy.

When did the Christian practice of concubinage end?
The practice of concubinage was eventually outlawed by the Catholic Council of Trent in the 16th century.
(Yeap, this time it did involve the Catholic Church.)

Do the Protestants practice polygamy and or concubinage?
But who were the Christians that were practicing polygamy and concubinage? It is speculation to say, then as today, it was Christians, that were holding on to Jewish-Christian beliefs or simply mixing Judaism with Christian beliefs? As it is, it is mostly about mixing Judaism with Christian beliefs. Not all Protestants that mix Judaism with Christianity practice polygamy and or concubinage ….so it is a selective mixing of Judaism with Christianity which can be mixed in different ways. And I have meet Protestants that practice polygamy and or concubinage and they were not Mormon.
Quote
"But it is not “The” Gospel, it is one of four stories of Yeshua’s life and ministry and part of a larger story about 1st century Christianity"

All 4 gospels tell the same story.
The good news.
the messiah has come.
Salvation has been obtained.
The price has been paid.
The book of Ruth fulfilled.
The prophecies of David and the prophets fulfilled.
The impossible had happened.

Life has replaced death.
The gospel is a person.
His name is Jesus
 

Doug

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It seems to me like there are two dynamics. There's those that have had a true conversion
they feel clean
they feel different
they feel brand new
the sky is Bluer
the trees are greener
everything is different

and it becomes an adventure to them.
They walk with Jesus they talk with Jesus they know something happened to them even without being able to explain it or any evangelist or any book or any outside help

they know they have been transformed.
From reading your post I get it that that has happened to you.
And that is how I came into the kingdom.
I was born again and nobody told me anything.
Now later on I began to learn not only from the preaching but Christians were showing me and telling me the Dynamics of my salvation and it really gave me more definition in my walk and my relationship.
... but all those things are not salvation
it's that meeting of God is that transformation from within that's salvation and I think something like that happened to you also.
The other Dynamic that I see mainly here, and at the men's bible study I attend, is what I call a "mental salvation".
it does seem like they have something with God
, but the depth is not there .
the intimacy is not there
and the knowledge is not there of true salvation.
it becomes a string of sentences or a formula or this verse or that verse and they actually think that that is salv
It seems to me like there are two dynamics. There's those that have had a true conversion
they feel clean
they feel different
they feel brand new
the sky is Bluer
the trees are greener
everything is different

and it becomes an adventure to them.
They walk with Jesus they talk with Jesus they know something happened to them even without being able to explain it or any evangelist or any book or any outside help

they know they have been transformed.
From reading your post I get it that that has happened to you.
And that is how I came into the kingdom.
I was born again and nobody told me anything.
Now later on I began to learn not only from the preaching but Christians were showing me and telling me the Dynamics of my salvation and it really gave me more definition in my walk and my relationship.
... but all those things are not salvation
it's that meeting of God is that transformation from within that's salvation and I think something like that happened to you also.
The other Dynamic that I see mainly here, and at the men's bible study I attend, is what I call a "mental salvation".
it does seem like they have something with God
, but the depth is not there .
the intimacy is not there
and the knowledge is not there of true salvation.
it becomes a string of sentences or a formula or this verse or that verse and they actually think that that is salvation

It seems to me like there are two dynamics. There's those that have had a true conversion
they feel clean
they feel different
they feel brand new
the sky is Bluer
the trees are greener
everything is different

and it becomes an adventure to them.
They walk with Jesus they talk with Jesus they know something happened to them even without being able to explain it or any evangelist or any book or any outside help

they know they have been transformed.
From reading your post I get it that that has happened to you.
And that is how I came into the kingdom.
I was born again and nobody told me anything.
Now later on I began to learn not only from the preaching but Christians were showing me and telling me the Dynamics of my salvation and it really gave me more definition in my walk and my relationship.
... but all those things are not salvation
it's that meeting of God is that transformation from within that's salvation and I think something like that happened to you also.
The other Dynamic that I see mainly here, and at the men's bible study I attend, is what I call a "mental salvation".
it does seem like they have something with God
, but the depth is not there .
the intimacy is not there
and the knowledge is not there of true salvation.
it becomes a string of sentences or a formula or this verse or that verse and they actually think that that is salvation
[1Co 15:6 KJV] 6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.

Over 500 brethren saw the risen Christ. Those alive could verify he was risen.

[2Th 1:10 KJV] 10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

We are to believe their testimony to believe Christ was risen.
 
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Dan Clarkston

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Even as one who believes in eternal security, I am very VERY opposed to the heretical notion that this gives anyone the right to simply live any way they please and sin as much as they like. It is extremely unfortunate and disheartening to see people taking promise of security and warping it into a lawless, fruitless existence of self-indulgence.

All you gotta do is tell people "you can never lose your salvation" and they will go back to living in sin simply because it's the path of least resistance and after all... you keep telling them "you can never lose your salvation"

It's the false "security in sin" gospel which is what satan taught Adam and Eve in the garden... which is you can disobey God and it's all good!


Jesus broke their law.

No, the Law and the Prophets were until John the Baptist - see Luke 16:16

After that mankind is under the New Testament Law of Christ

In the New Testament, many mentions of “the law” is actually referring to Law of Christ (aka the Law of Liberty) and is not talking about the old testament law. Christians are NOT called to keep or live under the old testament law, but we ARE called to live under the Law of Christ.

Ultimately this means we are called to abide In Christ which is living after the Spirit and not after the flesh, or to be spiritually minded and not carnally minded (see Romans 8). As we see in Romans 8, to be spiritually minded is life and peace but to be carnally minded is death which is separation from the Lord.

Galatians 6:2
Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

1 Corinthians 9:21
To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

James 2:12
So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

James 1:25
But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

*Free as in no longer being a slave to sin, as in stop doing sinful things!

2 Peter 1:4-10
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

1 Thessalonians 4:3-8
For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:
That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;
Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God:
That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified.
For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.
He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.

(*Notice what Paul said about his own body in 1 Corinthians 9:27)


Colossians 3:6-10
For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.
Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

Those that do not put on the New Man and quit walking after the flesh, the wrath of God comes upon them for their disobedience because God is NOT mocked, if we sow to the flesh we shall of the flesh reap corruption (Gal 6:7,8)

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9
And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Things end very badly for those that do not obey the gospel.

Romans 11:19-25
Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.
Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

Law of Christ
The phrase "the law of Christ" appears only in Galatians 6:2, although it is implied by the wording of 1 Corinthians 9:21 as well. In both places, its precise meaning is difficult to fix. In Galatians, Paul argues vigorously that the law given at Sinai makes no claim on those who believe in Christ, whether Gentile or Jew ( 2:15-21 ; Galatians 3:10-14 Galatians 3:23-26 ; 4:4-5 ; 4:21-5:6).

He then appeals to the Galatians to engage in ethical behavior by walking in the Spirit ( 5:16 Galatians 16 ), being lead by the Spirit ( 5:18 ), and fulfilling "the law of Christ" (ho nomos tou Christou) through bearing one another's burdens ( 6:2 ). In 1 Corinthians 9 Paul demonstrates how Christians should, out of love for the weaker brother or sister, refrain from demanding their rights.

By way of illustration Paul says in verses 19-23 that he adopts certain Jewish customs when among Jews, although he is not under the Jewish law, and that he adopts some Gentile customs when among Gentiles, although he is not without the law of God but rather "in the law of Christ" (ennomos Christou).

It seems fairly clear from these two texts that Paul uses the phrase to mean something other than the law given to Israel at Sinai and considered by most Jews to be their special possession.

Help is found in the prophets. In Isaiah 42:1-4 we read that God's chosen servant will one day establish justice throughout the earth and that "the coastlands will wait expectantly for His law" (NASB). If we take this passage to refer to the Messiah, then we could paraphrase it by saying that the Christ, when he comes, will teach God's law to the Gentiles ("the coastlands"). Jeremiah 31:31-34 similarly predicts the coming of a time in which disobedient Israel will receive a new covenant, consisting of a law written on the heart and therefore obeyed (cf. Ezek 36:26-27 ).

Jesus' teaching, although standing in continuity with the law given at Sinai, nevertheless sovereignly fashions a new law. In some instances Jesus sharpens commandments ( Matt 5:17-48 ) and in others considers them obsolete ( Mark 7:17-19 ). On one occasion, having been asked to identify the greatest commandment, Jesus concurs with the Jewish wisdom of his time ( Mark 12:32-33 ) that the greatest commandments are to love God supremely and to love one's neighbor as oneself ( Mark 12:28-31 ). He breaks with tradition, however, by defining the term "neighbor" to mean even the despised Samaritan ( Luke 10:29-37 ).

Paul believed that the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus Christ marked the beginning point of God's new covenant ( 2 Cor 3:1-18 ; Gal 4:21-31 ; cf. Rom 8:2 ). Like Isaiah, he believed that this covenant included the Gentiles ( Gal 3:7-20 ), and like Jeremiah he believed that it offered Israel a remedy for the curse that the old Sinaitic covenant pronounced on Israel's disobedience ( Gal 3:10-13 ).

In light of this, Paul understood the teaching of Christ as a new law. If so, then the correspondence between the ethical teaching of Jesus and Paul on many points (e.g., 1 Cor 7:10-11 / Mark 10:2-9 ; 1 Cor 9:14 / Luke 10:7 ; Rom 14:1-23 / Mark 7:18-19 ) is a matter of Paul's intention rather than happy accident. Paul's own admonition to fulfill the law of Christ by bearing one another's burdens provides both a pithy restatement of Jesus' summary of the law and an indication that Jesus' teaching fulfills prophetic expectations.

Galatians 5:4
Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
 
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mailmandan

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In other words, the attitude the OSAS people have towards the Lord is... "Lord, I just do not believe all the things you say in your Word!"

This is why the Lord put this in His Word...

Jude 1:4
For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
Oh, the irony. Jude is exhorting believers to contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints (vs. 3) because certain ungodly men who have crept in unnoticed.

Jude further describes these ungodly men who are ordained to condemnation as ones who cause divisions, worldly-minded, devoid of the Spirit. (vs. 19)

In CONTRAST with those who are called, sanctified by God the Father, and PRESERVED in Jesus Christ. (vs. 1)

You really need to practice more exegesis and less eisegesis.
 
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Dan Clarkston

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In CONTRAST with those who are called, sanctified by God the Father, and PRESERVED in Jesus Christ. (vs. 1)

So you think those that go to hell.... it was God's fault they went there since God did not elect them can preserve them.

Only a bunch of demons would follow the false doctrines of calvin.
 

IronMaiden

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So you think those that go to hell.... it was God's fault they went there since God did not elect them can preserve them.

Only a bunch of demons would follow the false doctrines of calvin.
I’m not a Calvinist, either. Folks confuse Calvinism with the Word of God. God only elected those who love Him.
 
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