The Lord will fight for Israel and Jerusalem; Zech. 12

[Stewardofthemystery]

Amillennialists agree that we shall reign on the earth after the resurrection at the last day, which is the day Jesus will return, but the earth will have been made new at that point (2 Peter 3:10-13) and we will inherit it forever (Matt 5:5).

As Peter said in 2 Peter 3:13, in accordance with the promise of Christ's second coming, we are looking forward to new heavens and a new earth where righteousness will dwell. He didn't say we're looking forward to a temporal earthly kingdom, but rather to the eternal new heavens and new earth. At His second coming, Jesus will rid the earth of sin and death forever, resulting in the new earth where righteousness, and only righteousness, will dwell forever.

Just answer these 2 questions.

1st Do you believe the thousand year reign of Christ on earth has already begun?

2. Do you believe that Satan is currently bound for a thousand years?

A simple yes or no will do, no need for spin.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

When does the end come? Not until 1,000+ years after Christ comes again? Where is that indicated in the above passage? Nowhere. Think about that. When the end comes, the last enemy will be destroyed. Agree? When does scripture say that will happen? Keep reading in 1 Corinthians 15 to find out.

1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

It will be at the last trumpet, when Jesus returns, that the last enemy, death, will be destroyed and "swallowed up in victory". This shows that there is no time between His coming and "the end" as premillennialism teaches. That is why Paul makes no mention of such a thing. You need to allow scripture to interpret scripture for you whenever possible.

How do you interpret the following passage:

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:....41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:....46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

I didn't quote all of Matthew 25:31-46 in order to save some space and I just wanted to include the verses that were relevant to my point. This is a portray of the day of judgment that will occur on "the last day" (John 12:48). Notice that both the saved and lost will be there.

What is your understanding of Matthew 25:34? Who are the sheep (also called "the righteous" in verse 46) that will inherit "life eternal" in "the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world"? Would you agree that this is when we (believers) will inherit the kingdom of God of which mortal flesh and blood cannot inherit (1 Cor 15:50-54)?

Who are the goats who will be cast "into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels" at that time? Are they not those whose names are not written in the book of life? Can Matthew 25:41 be referring to something different than this?

Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

I don't believe so. I think it's clear that Matthew 25:41 and Revelation 20:15 are referring to the same thing. But, Matthew 25:31-46 makes it clear that it will happen when Jesus comes with His angels and not 1,000+ years later. There will not be two different events when unbelievers are cast into the lake of fire. That makes no sense. No, all whose names are "not found written in the book of life" will be cast there at the same time. And all whose names ARE written in the book of life will inherit eternal life in the eternal kingdom of God at the same time.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The Gentiles I am referring to are the “uncircumcised” in heart/mind/spirit.

Luke 21:24
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

This does not fit the context of Romans 11. You are trying to relate unrelated scriptures. Romans 11 is about salvation from beginning to end. It's about Gentile believers being grafted in with Israelite believers. So, "the fullness of the Gentiles" refers to the salvation of Gentiles. Paul said their salvation was intended to provoke Israelite unbelievers to jealousy so that they too would want to be saved like the Gentiles have been. And this was something that God began doing back in Paul's day already (Romans 11:11-14).

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Just answer these 2 questions.

1st Do you believe the thousand year reign of Christ on earth has already begun?

Invalid question. There is no thousand year reign of Christ on earth. Show me in Revelation 20 where it shows Christ reigning on earth. I see a description of souls of the dead in Christ, which are in heaven. That is where Christ is. He reigns with the souls of the dead in Christ there.

2. Do you believe that Satan is currently bound for a thousand years?

A simple yes or no will do, no need for spin.

Yes. No spin is required. My view is based on straightforward scripture.

Matthew 12:28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. 29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

John 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. 32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Luke 10:17 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. 18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

Acts 26:14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. 15 And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest. 16 But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee; 17 Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee, 18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

All of the above passages relate to the binding of Satan which has to do with Jesus coming to "destroy the works of the devil" by way of taking "the power of death" away from him which he formerly used to keep the world (especially the Gentiles) in spiritual darkness and in slavery to the fear of death (due to previously having no hope of eternal life). Before He came very few Gentiles in the world had been saved, but after that a multitude has been saved. That was made possible by way of Jesus binding Satan and restraining the power he once held over the world to make it possible for people to be delivered "from the power of Satan unto God".

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

When does the end come? Not until 1,000+ years after Christ comes again? Where is that indicated in the above passage? Nowhere. Think about that. When the end comes, the last enemy will be destroyed. Agree? When does scripture say that will happen? Keep reading in 1 Corinthians 15 to find out.

1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

It will be at the last trumpet, when Jesus returns, that the last enemy, death, will be destroyed and "swallowed up in victory". This shows that there is no time between His coming and "the end" as premillennialism teaches. That is why Paul makes no mention of such a thing. You need to allow scripture to interpret scripture for you whenever possible.

How do you interpret the following passage:

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:....41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:....46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

I didn't quote all of Matthew 25:31-46 in order to save some space and I just wanted to include the verses that were relevant to my point. This is a portray of the day of judgment that will occur on "the last day" (John 12:48). Notice that both the saved and lost will be there.

What is your understanding of Matthew 25:34? Who are the sheep (also called "the righteous" in verse 46) that will inherit "life eternal" in "the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world"? Would you agree that this is when we (believers) will inherit the kingdom of God of which mortal flesh and blood cannot inherit (1 Cor 15:50-54)?

Who are the goats who will be cast "into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels" at that time? Are they not those whose names are not written in the book of life? Can Matthew 25:41 be referring to something different than this?

Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

I don't believe so. I think it's clear that Matthew 25:41 and Revelation 20:15 are referring to the same thing. But, Matthew 25:31-46 makes it clear that it will happen when Jesus comes with His angels and not 1,000+ years later. There will not be two different events when unbelievers are cast into the lake of fire. That makes no sense. No, all whose names are "not found written in the book of life" will be cast there at the same time. And all whose names ARE written in the book of life will inherit eternal life in the eternal kingdom of God at the same time.

The confusion I see in this Amil doctrine has to do with the thousand year reign of Christ on earth, and with the timing of Satan being bound during that same thousand years.

Because you all believe the thousand years have already started, it is throwing off the entire time line of events in your mind.

Even though a couple of thousand years have past from Christ crucified, you still claim the thousand year reign began at the cross. This is also why you claim the thousand years is just a figure of speech, and it is not really a literal thousand years, to cover up the first error. The first error leads to another, and then to another, until it snowballs into a whole bunch of errors.

A little leaven can leaven the whole lump.

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

Invalid question. There is no thousand year reign of Christ on earth.

There is the problem right there. No need to say anything else.

Show me in Revelation 20 where it shows Christ reigning on earth. I see a description of souls of the dead in Christ, which are in heaven. That is where Christ is. He reigns with the souls of the dead in Christ there.


Yes. No spin is required. My view is based on straightforward scripture.

Matthew 12:28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. 29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

John 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. 32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Luke 10:17 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. 18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

Acts 26:14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. 15 And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest. 16 But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee; 17 Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee, 18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

All of the above passages relate to the binding of Satan which has to do with Jesus coming to "destroy the works of the devil" by way of taking "the power of death" away from him which he formerly used to keep the world (especially the Gentiles) in spiritual darkness and in slavery to the fear of death (due to previously having no hope of eternal life). Before He came very few Gentiles in the world had been saved, but after that a multitude has been saved. That was made possible by way of Jesus binding Satan and restraining the power he once held over the world to make it possible for people to be delivered "from the power of Satan unto God".

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

This does not fit the context of Romans 11. You are trying to relate unrelated scriptures. Romans 11 is about salvation from beginning to end. It's about Gentile believers being grafted in with Israelite believers. So, "the fullness of the Gentiles" refers to the salvation of Gentiles. Paul said their salvation was intended to provoke Israelite unbelievers to jealousy so that they too would want to be saved like the Gentiles have been. And this was something that God began doing back in Paul's day already (Romans 11:11-14).

The fulness of the Gentiles happens at the 6th seal events, wether you believe that or not. Salvation is still available to the Gentiles after the 6th seal, all the way up to the last day at the last trump.

You saying the fulness of the Gentiles being fulfilled means all the Gentiles that are going to be saved is fulfilled at that point in time is false.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The confusion I see in this Amil doctrine has to do with the thousand year reign of Christ on earth, and with the timing of Satan being bound during that same thousand years.

Because you all believe the thousand years have already started, it is throwing off the entire time line of events in your mind.

Even though a couple of thousand years have past from Christ crucified, you still claim the thousand year reign began at the cross. This is also why you claim the thousand years is just a figure of speech, and it is not really a literal thousand years, to cover up the first error. The first error leads to another, and then to another, until it snowballs into a whole bunch of errors.

A little leaven can leaven the whole lump.

Can you please address what I said in post #162? Please address them and then I will address what you said here. I'm interested in a two way discussion where we each address each other's points.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

There is the problem right there. No need to say anything else.

So, just saying you're right and I'm wrong is enough. You think that is a sufficient argument? I don't think so. Show me where Revelation 20 says something about Jesus reigning on earth. I would say the problem is you making assumptions about the text that are not indicated in the text anywhere.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The fulness of the Gentiles happens at the 6th seal events, wether you believe that or not. Salvation is still available to the Gentiles after the 6th seal, all the way up to the last day at the last trump.

You saying the fulness of the Gentiles being fulfilled means all the Gentiles that are going to be saved is fulfilled at that point in time is false.

You are not recognizing the multiple parallels in the book of Revelation that cover the time period from Christ's first coming to His second coming. At the sixth seal it is said that the great day of the Lamb's wrath is at hand at that point. How do you have a period of time occurring after that when it's already at hand at that time?

Compare Revelation 6:12-17 to this:

Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Did Jesus indicate that there is some time period that occurs between what is described in Matthew 24 verse 29 and verse 30? No. His coming is at hand once the sixth seal is opened. Unbelievers on the earth will see "the sign of the Son of man in heaven" and will mourn or wail, but not for Him. They will wail and mourn for themselves because His wrath is on them. They will be so afraid that having mountains and rocks fall on them will be preferable to experiencing His wrath.

The sixth seal is parallel to the sixth trumpet and sixth vial. Then He actually comes at the seventh seal, trumpet and vial. Your view does not have His coming "at hand" at the sixth seal.

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

So, just saying you're right and I'm wrong is enough. You think that is a sufficient argument? I don't think so. Show me where Revelation 20 says something about Jesus reigning on earth. I would say the problem is you making assumptions about the text that are not indicated in the text anywhere.

I have already posted the scriptures several times, how many times do I need to post the same verses of scripture?

Here we go again…

Revelation 5:9-10

King James Version

​

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Now You show me proof text that the saints of God DO NOT reign on earth with Christ for a thousand years.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I have already posted the scriptures several times, how many times do I need to post the same verses of scripture?

Here we go again…

Revelation 5:9-10​

​

King James Version​

​

​

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Now You show me proof text that the saints of God DO NOT reign on earth with Christ for a thousand years.

I already responded to this in post #157. Did you miss that one? Please read it and give me your thoughts on what I said there.

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

I already responded to this in post #157. Did you miss that one? Please read it and give me your thoughts on what I said there.

Again you are thinking that the thousand year reign of Christ ON EARTH is happening right now. It is not! When Christ is reigning on earth with His anointed Priesthood, AND Satan is also bound; there shall be RIGHTEOUSNESS reigning on earth not SIN and WICKEDNESS.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Again you are thinking that the thousand year reign of Christ ON EARTH is happening right now. It is not!

Are you denying that Christ reigns right now in hearts of His people living on earth? Are you denying that Jesus has all power and authority right now both in heaven and on earth? Are you using scripture to form your conclusions? It doesn't seem like it.

Matthew 28:16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them. 17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted. 18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

When Christ is reigning on earth with His anointed Priesthood,

Is that not what the following says He is doing? It does, but just not in the way you imagine it.

Revelation 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, 6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Are we on earth? Yes. Is Christ reigning now? Yes. Is it true that Jesus Christ HATH MADE us kings and priests unto God and his Father? Yes. So, Jesus is reigning on earth with His anointed Priesthood. Just not in the way you want Him to, which is actually similar to what the Pharisees expected of the Messiah. I'm not calling you a Pharisee, but simply pointing out that your expectation of the Messiah's reign is similar to theirs.

there shall be RIGHTEOUSNESS reigning on earth not SIN and WICKEDNESS.

That will not happen until the eternal new heavens and new earth are ushered in by Jesus at His second coming.

2 Peter 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, 4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation....The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Impatient scoffers ask "Where is the promise of His coming?". They think He surely would have come by now if He was coming. But, Peter points out that the Lord is not slack concerning the promise of His coming. And He indicates that what we are looking for in accordance with His coming is not a supposed temporal earthly kingdom, but rather "new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness".

Can you tell me how you interpret the following passage:

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

Are you denying that Christ reigns right now in hearts of His people living on earth?

Why are you always trying to misrepresent what I have said? Strawman

Are you denying that Jesus has all power and authority right now both in heaven and on earth?

Strawman

Are you using scripture to form your conclusions? It doesn't seem like it.

Strawman

Matthew 28:16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them. 17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted. 18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.


Is that not what the following says He is doing? It does, but just not in the way you imagine it.

Revelation 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, 6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Are we on earth? Yes. Is Christ reigning now? Yes. Is it true that Jesus Christ HATH MADE us kings and priests unto God and his Father? Yes. So, Jesus is reigning on earth with His anointed Priesthood. Just not in the way you want Him to, which is actually similar to what the Pharisees expected of the Messiah. I'm not calling you a Pharisee, but simply pointing out that your expectation of the Messiah's reign is similar to theirs.


That will not happen until the eternal new heavens and new earth are ushered in by Jesus at His second coming.

2 Peter 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, 4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation....The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Impatient scoffers ask "Where is the promise of His coming?". They think He surely would have come by now if He was coming. But, Peter points out that the Lord is not slack concerning the promise of His coming. And He indicates that what we are looking for in accordance with His coming is not a supposed temporal earthly kingdom, but rather "new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness".

Can you tell me how you interpret the following passage:

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

I’m done with trying to reason with you on this point. Have a nice day

 

[rwb]

The confusion I see in this Amil doctrine has to do with the thousand year reign of Christ on earth, and with the timing of Satan being bound during that same thousand years.

Where in Scripture can you show that Christ will reign on THIS earth for a thousand years?

 

[rwb]

Again you are thinking that the thousand year reign of Christ ON EARTH is happening right now. It is not! When Christ is reigning on earth with His anointed Priesthood, AND Satan is also bound; there shall be RIGHTEOUSNESS reigning on earth not SIN and WICKEDNESS.

When Christ came casting out many devils and demons from people demon possessed, He tells us this is proof the Kingdom of God has come. The disciples, like you did not understand how Christ came in the Kingdom of God since it was not a material/physical Kingdom.

Luke 11:20 (KJV) But if I with the finger of God cast out devils, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you.

Why don't you believe Christ? Why are you still looking for a material/physical Kingdom of God to come to this earth? Have you not read that Christ has said the Kingdom of God is not now of this world, cannot be physically seen, and entrance into the Kingdom of God that is not of this world and cannot physically be seen can be entered when man is born again of His Spirit? Because the Kingdom of God is within you. And only those who have been born again can both know (see) and enter the Kingdom of God, that is not a physical Kingdom to come, but is His spiritual Kingdom being built now, since the first advent of Christ, through the Gospel proclaimed unto all the nations of the world and whosoever believes is born again and have entered into the eternal Kingdom of God through the Spirit of Christ within.

John 18:36 (KJV) Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

Luke 17:20-21 (KJV) And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

John 3:3 (KJV) Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

John 3:5-8 (KJV) Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Romans 14:17 (KJV) For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

If you cannot believe these biblical truths I've given you above from the Word of God, perhaps a re-examination of the doctrine you cling to that keeps you from believing what is written is needed???

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

Where in Scripture can you show that Christ will reign on THIS earth for a thousand years?

Here we go again…

Revelation 5:9-10

King James Version
​

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

Why don't you believe Christ?

Another straw man builder. I am done trying to reason with you as well. Have a nice day.

Why are you still looking for a material/physical Kingdom of God to come to this earth? Have you not read that Christ has said the Kingdom of God is not now of this world, cannot be physically seen, and entrance into the Kingdom of God that is not of this world and cannot physically be seen can be entered when man is born again of His Spirit? Because the Kingdom of God is within you. And only those who have been born again can both know (see) and enter the Kingdom of God, that is not a physical Kingdom to come, but is His spiritual Kingdom being built now, since the first advent of Christ, through the Gospel proclaimed unto all the nations of the world and whosoever believes is born again and have entered into the eternal Kingdom of God through the Spirit of Christ within.

John 18:36 (KJV) Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

Luke 17:20-21 (KJV) And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

John 3:3 (KJV) Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

John 3:5-8 (KJV) Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Romans 14:17 (KJV) For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

If you cannot believe these biblical truths I've given you above from the Word of God, perhaps a re-examination of the doctrine you cling to that keeps you from believing what is written is needed???

 

[rwb]

Here we go again…

Revelation 5:9-10​

​

King James Version​

​

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Revelation 20:6
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years

You're inventing a narrative taken out of context!

Revelation 5 is clearly a vision of things seen in heaven, not on this earth. The saints of heaven, who shall reign forever with the Lord on the new earth. According to Scripture when we become saved we are reigning spiritually with the Lord in heaven through His Spirit within. Because in life we had spiritually entered the Kingdom of God, when faithful saints die they go a spiritual body, John sees as living "souls" to heaven. But heaven is not our permanent home. These souls in heaven shown John in this vision will return with Christ when He comes again (1Th 4:14). Then we shall be changed from mortal & corruptible body to immortal & incorruptible body, fit to reign with Christ throughout eternity on the NEW EARTH.

In this vision John was shown the full embodiment of heaven that shall be when the spiritual Kingdom of God in heaven is complete!

Revelation 5:1-14 (KJV) And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals. And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof? And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon. And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon. And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof. And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth. And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne. And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints. And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands; Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing. And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever. And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

1 Corinthians 4:8 (KJV) Now ye are full, now ye are rich, ye have reigned as kings without us: and I would to God ye did reign, that we also might reign with you.

1 Peter 2:9 (KJV) But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

Revelation 1:5-6 (KJV) And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Revelation 5:9-10 (KJV) And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Revelation 20:6 (KJV) Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Because we live and reign with Christ in time, symbolized a thousand years, we shall also reign with Him in a spiritual body in heaven after our body dies. Then when we are clothed in immortal & incorruptible body of flesh again, we shall continue to reign with Christ physically throughout eternity on the NEW EARTH!