BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Of course it is. Christians should definitely do more stealing, murdering, idolizing, and false witness-bearing.
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What will happen to Christians who reject the Sabbath?
- Thread starter Hobie
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Of course it is. Christians should definitely do more stealing, murdering, idolizing, and false witness-bearing.
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BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
What exactly makes it better? Please be specific. Because 1 Cor 3:8-15 doesn't seem to say anything about rest or worship.
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Why??? Why would you do that?
where this is leading . . .
The Law of Love is as high as the written Law as the heaven is above the earth.
You will never meet the standard according to the Law of Christ, His commands to trust God, and love others, you will never do that by keeping the written Law that was a covenant between God and Israel. Not even close!
You won't be murdering, you won't be, well, you know.
Much love!
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BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
I'm not leading anything anywhere. I like simple stuff. The Bible doesn't say anywhere that we can't keep God's commandments. But it does say that keeping the law has no power to redeem. We've been over this ground before.
Lumping the ten commandments in with the 613-item, human-curated mitzvot is always going to get a comment from me. It's baloney, and no Christian believed it just a few decades ago.
At least, not so much as anyone's ever shown me any evidence, try as I have to solicit some.
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Say what?
These were all commandments given by God. To Israel. As a covenant. Between God and Israel.
Much love!
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Great comments in your post, thanks.
Above you refer to "God's commandments" and "the law". (hold that thought)
In my view,
- the law (given by God through Moses) is the 613 (611) law,
that we sometimes call the law of Moses or the whole law. (James 2:10, Galatians 5:3)
- The Ten Commandments are part of the 613 (611). Therefore the Ten are a subset of the law. (the 613/611)
- God's law preceded any of the law that God gave to the Israelites through Moses. Cain was guilty of murder. By what law?
- Christ's law came in the New Testament.
]
Throughout your whole post I see a problem with definitions. No wonder communication on both sides is so disjointed. What are we talking about? !!!
Above you refer to "God's commandments" and "the law". (hold that thought)
In this quote you refer to "the ten commandments" and "the 613-item, human-curated mitzvot". (hold that thought)
Can we really say that the mitzvot was "the 613-item, human-curated" laws. Did not God give that law to Moses?
In my view,
- the law (given by God through Moses) is the 613 (611) law,
that we sometimes call the law of Moses or the whole law. (James 2:10, Galatians 5:3)
- The Ten Commandments are part of the 613 (611). Therefore the Ten are a subset of the law. (the 613/611)
- God's law preceded any of the law that God gave to the Israelites through Moses. Cain was guilty of murder. By what law?
- Christ's law came in the New Testament.
]
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Baloney. Rabbinical tradition can't even agree on the number, and many of them are duplicates. And no one on the street knew they even existed 30 years ago. All they knew was the ten commandments. It's a red herring. Likening adultery to shaving off sideburns is the height of absurdity, and before the Almighty Internet came, everyone had enough common sense to know that. Satan quotes Scripture. And he loves when Christians do so in his format. He also loves it when people say things like:
A step down from being murderers, liars, adulterers, thieves? Sure!
Believe it or not, this is me being restrained.
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BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
I thought you and I weren't going to talk about what the law is.
Don't make me come over there. I know where you live (within a hundred miles or two).
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St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Assuming you mean the Ten Commandments when you write "God's commandments",
I think it is largely correct, that we can keep them at the surface level. It might be harder at the heart level. After all. we are talking about laws.
We are not likely to carve a god out of wood and bow to it in worship. But do we have others idols we bow to?
It helps to view an idol as a place rather than a thing. The place is the throne of our heart. What might we put their other than the only true God who deserves to sit there.
Visualize this: Pushing God off the the throne of your life to replace him with what you idolize. How pathetic!
--- Parody ---
You: Excuse me God, I have an idol to put on the throne of my life.
God: Oof... Hey, you you don't have to push. I would have moved!
You: Just look at this Lord, isn't it great?
God: Are you serious? Don't you remember the last one?
You: Oh... but this is so much better!
God: It's your choice. Let me know how it goes. See you later.
You: Yeah, Whatever. (pfft)
I asked the question in an earlier post; Can we really say that the mitzvot was not God given to Moses by God?
I'm asking because I may be ignorant on this point. I assume the whole was given by God.
Even the Ten Commandments that we have today were "written" by Moses. (given by God)
My view:
- The whole law = the 613/611
- The Ten Commandments = part of the 613/611 = the whole law
- God's law preceded any of the law that God gave to the Israelites through Moses.
- Christ's law came in the New Testament.
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St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
A thousand apologies. I don't recall that agreement. ( at my age, I don't remember what color socks I had for breakfast)
I thought civil discussion about the law was beneficial for all our readers. (don't be so selfish) - LOL
Seriously, have I posted anything offensive on this topic to date? (I sincerely apologize) Not my intention.
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St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
For all readers: Define these terms. Thanks.
1) The law
2) The Ten Commandments
3) God's law
4 Christ's law
5) The Law (capital L)
Need help?
www.christianityboard.com
]
1) The law
2) The Ten Commandments
3) God's law
4 Christ's law
5) The Law (capital L)
Need help?
Observations about the law, the Law, God's law, Christ's law - four different things
- What's the difference between the law and the Law? (capital L) - What's the difference between the law and God's law? - What's the difference between the law, God's law, and Christ's law? The law, the Law, God's law, Christ's law; four different things. Agree, or disagree? Points...
www.christianityboard.com
]
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Hey, wait a minute.
Perhaps misquoting scripture is inappropriate, and YES it does happen on internet forums, But PERSONALLY I think properly quoting scripture is a VERY positive thing.
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BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Well, isn't there a way of improperly quoting Scripture that is distinct from misquoting it?
The truth is, there's a way of discussing extremely difficult issues surrounding Scripture that most people simply aren't emotionally equipped to do. I can say honestly that I'm not always ready to brave it.
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St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
St. SteVen
Well-Known Member
Of course. But what does it even mean? (misquoting scripture)
If a person is unable to separate themselves from their doctrine, they become offended by any disagreement. They take it personally.
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BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Hey, I'm a technical kind of guy—a retired machinist who still remembers that a millimeter is 0.03937 inches. Which makes an inch 2.54 centimeters, blah, blah.
I'm mind-numbingly analytical, and I don't really like things that don't make perfect sense.
Misquoting is simply quoting something incorrectly or inaccurately.
Improperly quoting is a somewhat subjective term but it usually applies to misusing a correctly quoted text.
Which, let's face it, is all the rage in these parts.
We can talk about to what degree it's actually done in a given instance, and that it's not always worth correcting, but being human still doesn't make being wrong truthful. It just makes it quite necessarily tolerable.
Christ told his disciples that He had many things to tell them, but that they weren't able to take them onboard at the time.
When I get frustrated over how ignorant people can be at times, I just try to imagine how Jesus felt. Not that I have a detectable fraction of His wisdom but, actually, that's precisely the point. The ignorance He had to tolerate must have been nearly unbearable and yet He did it gladly, which leads me to this:
I wonder How Christ separated Himself from His doctrine.
Actually, I don't wonder at all because I know that He didn't do so.
"Doctrine" is another word that's been weaponized.
If a man can separate himself from his knowledge, then there's nothing at all to commend him in remaining unoffended.
Show me a man who can cling tenaciously to his beliefs and yet manage to be compassionate and tolerant and I'll show you a worthy hero.
A search for the word "doctrine" in the New Testament reveals just such heroes—Christ and his apostles (including Abraham and Moses, btw).
Notwithstanding the imperfections recorded of the latter.
I like talking to you. I don't feel like I have to guard every word.
:)
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