The Galilean wedding is the model for the pre-trib rapture

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rebuilder 454

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Ohhh!!! Really??? How convenient! You have nothing to support your Pretrib rapture before a tribulation period. Surprise surprise!!! I wonder why? Because it does not exist. It is a figment of your imagination. You are arguing from silence like I said. You have nothing. You are promoting an extra-biblical theory that contradicts numerous clear climactic Scripture.

This is why every single Christian should reject this error. It is a man-made fabrication foisted upon the inspired text.
You have no verses chief

You post verses on the second coming on white horses and erroneously transpose that setting to the rapture.
You do it over and over, oblivious that your deal is in fact impossible.
The rapture of Rev 14:14 ALONE defeats you entire deal.
I could sail a ship through the hole I just blew in your silly doctrine.
Game
Set
Match
Big time
 

WPM

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1 they are all 10 saved believers.
2 thank you for the " door wass shut" component. That aligns with the preflood pretrib door shutting with Noah.
Thanks , I had actually forgotten that one .
3 There is no " half left/taken with noah. There is only one 50% taken dynamic that fits anything..and that is the half the church taken/ left behind in the biblical pretrib rapture you aspire to void.
4 there is no " doomed for all eternity" in the parable.
Since you are the one changing the parable, I would say with great confidence you are DEFINITELY on the wrong path.

How are these 10 believers? Who told you that? Believers are prepared. They persevere to the end. They possess eternal life and shall never perish. This is what Pretrib produces! This is simply an earthly story to represent deep spiritual truth. It is talking about the two types of person that will be here when Jesus comes. There is absolutely nothing to do with a 50/50 breakdown when He apears. You're missing the whole import of the parable.

What are they left to?

Destruction!

They miss the boat! The destruction comes immediately. Listen to the words of Christ instead of inventing your own theology. Jesus said in Luke 17:26-30, “as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.”

Jesus words support my position and forbid your doctrine. Christ speaks of “the days of Noe” (plural), speaking of the days that preceded the destruction of all the wicked. He then spoke of “the day” (singular), speaking of the actual day when the wicked were wholesale wiped out.

Pretribbers consistently try to explain away the clear and explicit New Testament narrative to support their faulty opinion of the vaguer Old Testament narrative. They invent obscure extra-biblical theories to reinforces their beliefs. They have to!

The reason why Pretribbers insist on such obscure theories is because they do not have any biblical support in either the Old or the New Testament. There is no where in scripture that teaches (1) a rapture of the Church, (2) immediately followed by a literal seven-year tribulation, (3) immediately followed by a further coming of Christ.

Anyway, what has seven days notice anything to do with a supposed future seven-year tribulation? Nothing! That is how nonsensical Pretrib is.
 
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rebuilder 454

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I appreciate your honesty in admitting that Pretrib is not clearly taught in the Bible. But your argument from "concealment" and "mystery" runs contrary to the NT revelation of Scripture, which is an unveiling of truth. Mormons, JWs and RCs use the same rhetoric to justify their extra-biblical teaching. Pretrib is not in good company. Scripture is enlightenment. Truth is clearly taught and retaught. It can be grasped by the simple. It is not just for the learned.

The Bible teaching on the second coming coming couldn't be clearer or simpler: when Jesus comes that is it. It is the end! Men are either ready or caught unexpectedly; they are caught up or caught on. They are either saved or lost. What is more, Scripture places our existence into two distinct and diverse ages: “this age” and” the age to come.” These two could not be more different. Simply put: “this age” refers to “time” and “the age to come” or the “hereafter” refers to “eternity.” This is age is full of sin, death and corruption. The age to come is pristine, perfect and incorrupt. I could teach a child this.

Pretrib makes end-time teaching a convoluted cryptic mess that can only be understood by those who have studied the subject intensely. But even after years of trying to put the dots together, Pretribber still cannot get everything to add up. It is easy to get men who have taught this doctrine 40 years in circles because they cannot even truly explain it. It simply doesn't add up.

Remember, even a parable is a simple earthly story with a heavenly meaning. There are deep spiritual revelations that are simplified so that we can grasp them. This is not Jesus speaking cryptically or mystically, it is Jesus speaking spiritually, simply and clearly. The truth is only concealed from the unenlightened. Parables are invented stories that serve to illustrate deep profound spiritual truths that pertain to reality.

There is a simplicity to God’s truth. But we complicate it.

Your reference to Proverbs 25:2 has nothing to do with what we are talking about. It is not even in context.

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and 1 Corinthians 15:51-54 do not teach (1) a rapture of the Church, (2) immediately followed by a literal seven-year tribulation, (3) immediately followed by a third coming of Christ. You know that. You admit that.

1 Corinthians 15:50-55

1 Corinthians 15:50-55 has nothing to do with what you are claiming. It declares, “flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed [Gr. allasso], In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed [Gr. allasso]. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?”

This passage is describing the great supernatural change that occurs to God’s people when Jesus returns and takes them from a temporal fallen “flesh and blood” existence to an eternal glorified condition. Corruptibility and mortality are shown here to be interlinked. Incorruption and immortality are also shown to be enjoined. They describe the two converse states existing in two completely different dimensions.

1 Thessalonians 4:14-5:4

1 Thessalonians 4:14-5:4 confirms this saying: “if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming [Gr. parousia] of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words. But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.”

There is a catching away ("rapture") here, but no tribulation period following. That is because it is ongoing since the early Church. If Pretrib was true, this is where you would find it, but no, It is not here. Neither can you add it to the inspired text. That is forbidden. What follows Christ's climactic appearing then? Total destruction!

This is a record of Christ’s one and only future coming. This reading describes how Christ comes “with” and “for” His saints the next time. Verse 14 of our reading explicitly states, “them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.” Those living believers will be “caught up” to meet Jesus when He appears. This is the final uniting of the elect on earth (the live in Christ) and those in heaven (the dead in Christ). It is accompanied by the great sound of the trump ushering in the end. The word rendered “remain” in our King James Version (which relates to those that are alive at Christ’s coming) is the Greek word perileipo, which means “to survive.” Thus, we can take from this reading that the Lord is returning for those who remain by surviving. These are tribulation saints.

This coming is not only sudden but noisy. Christ is not coming secretly with an apologetic whisper but publicly with a triumphant shout. He appears with “with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God.” This trumpet will sound and bring forth the elect from all nations. I Thessalonians 5:2-7 confirms that it isn’t just Christ’s coming that is sudden but also the destruction that accompanies. Likening Christ’s return to “a thief in the night” capably serves to impress the surprising nature of this coming for the lost. It shows that the wicked are caught abruptly in their folly at the apocalypse. The “sudden destruction” is so impactful that none escape. That is explicit in the narrative. The wicked are totally and completely destroyed, allowing no room for the Pretrib theory of a subsequent 7yrs trib.
Uh, you changed the virgins parable components, then claimed the planet contains 50% believers and 50% devil worshippers at the white horses arrival.

SMH.
 

WPM

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Well let me tell you that your false assertion I avoid your little misconstrued posts is a lie.
I don't AVOID any of your misplaced verses or posts.
So let it be established every time you do that you just keep your deflection going and lie about what my intentions are.
There is no post by you that I can not handle and destroy with great ease.
You expose yourself to be corrected easily by anyone with a Bible.
No cleverness by you,( or any parable changing postribber) has ever had any traction.
It only works in the minds of postribbers.
We own end times ,and we eagerly await your next misconstrued verses for correction.

This is all noise. There is no substance to anything you are writing here. It is all fizz and bubble. There is definitely no biblical basis to it. You sound like a bias politician that is bereft of genuine objectivity. This is all theological politicking. You seem be in love with a taught doctrine rather than the truth. You cannot even show one single text that teaches (1) a rapture of the Church, (2) immediately followed by a literal seven-year tribulation, (3) immediately followed by a further coming of Christ.
 

WPM

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Uh, you changed the virgins parable components, then claimed the planet contains 50% believers and 50% devil worshippers at the white horses arrival.

SMH.

When did I say that? You're obviously getting desperate now. You're having to put words into my mouth in order to give some semblance of credibility to what you're saying. I will take that as a concession that you have lost the argument.

Now, do I need to re-post it again? You're avoiding every single point that I made.
 
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rebuilder 454

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How are these 10 believers? Who told you that? Believers are prepared. They persevere to the end. They possess eternal life and shall never perish. This is what Pretrib produces! This is simply an earthly story to represent deep spiritual truth. It is talking about the two types of person that will be here when Jesus comes. There is absolutely nothing to do with a 50/50 breakdown when He apears. You're missing the whole import of the parable.

What are they left to?

Destruction!

They miss the boat! The destruction comes immediately. Listen to the words of Christ instead of inventing your own theology. Jesus said in Luke 17:26-30, “as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.”

Jesus words support my position and forbid your doctrine. They show what that "self-same day" was - "the day" of destruction, thus the 7th day. Christ speaks of “the days of Noe” (plural), speaking of the days that preceded the destruction of all the wicked. He then spoke of “the day” (singular), speaking of the actual day when the wicked were wholesale wiped out.

Pretribbers consistently try to explain away the clear and explicit New Testament narrative to support their faulty opinion of the vaguer Old Testament narrative. They invent obscure extra-biblical theories to reinforces their beliefs. They have to!

The reason why Pretribbers insist on such obscure theories is because they do not have any biblical support in either the Old or the New Testament. There is no where in scripture that teaches (1) a rapture of the Church, (2) immediately followed by a literal seven-year tribulation, (3) immediately followed by a further coming of Christ.

Anyway, what has seven days notice anything to do with a supposed future seven-year tribulation? Nothing! That is how nonsensical Pretrib is.
Virgins = pure undefiled innocence.
5 foolish had oil= the Holy Spirit.
5 foolish were watching andcwaiting for Jesus.
5 foolish had lamps
5 foolish had light.

So you have unsaved devil worshippers as virgins ( pure set aside and undefiled)

You also place heathens as having The Holy Spirit, light, lamps, fellowshipping and sleeping with true believers , and those devil worshippers waiting for Jesus.
Huh??????
Like I keep saying, your doctrine is so poorly thought out, a baby in christ with a bible can pick it apart.
 

rebuilder 454

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This is all noise. There is no substance to anything you are writing here. It is all fizz and bubble. There is definitely no biblical basis to it. You sound like a bias politician that is bereft of genuine objectivity. This is all theological politicking. You seem be in love with a taught doctrine rather than the truth. You cannot even show one single text that teaches (1) a rapture of the Church, (2) immediately followed by a literal seven-year tribulation, (3) immediately followed by a further coming of Christ.
About all you got left is to go after me personally

Comical how handily I pick your deal apart.
 
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WPM

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Virgins = pure undefiled innocence.
5 foolish had oil= the Holy Spirit.
5 foolish were watching andcwaiting for Jesus.
5 foolish had lamps
5 foolish had light.

So you have unsaved devil worshippers as virgins ( pure set aside and undefiled)

You also place heathens as having The Holy Spirit, light, lamps, fellowshipping and sleeping with true believers , and those devil worshippers waiting for Jesus.
Huh??????
Like I keep saying, your doctrine is so poorly thought out, a baby in christ with a bible can pick it apart.
The Holy Ghost is not in lamps. That is ridiculous! The Holy Spirit is in hearts. You're not remotely getting the meaning of this parable. Your teachers have taught you wrong. You're forcing your theology into it because you have nothing to support your theories. Where is your seven year tribulation after this event? Nowhere! You have to force it into the sacred text! This is how desperate you are getting! You obviously have nothing.

The parable of the 10 virgins has nothing to do with 50% being saved and 50% not within the Church. It has nothing to do with 50% or professors being genuine and 50% not. It has equally nothing to do with the percentage of society that will know Christ when He comes. The 50/50 breakdown is an earthly illustration relating to preparedness; some were wise and prepared others were foolish and were caught on. This is what will happen when Jesus comes. Remember, the broad road holds the vast bulk of mankind. There are few on the narrow road. This truth is played out throughout Scripture.
 

rebuilder 454

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When did I say that? You're obviously getting desperate now. You're having to put words into my mouth in order to give some semblance of credibility to what you're saying. I will take that as a concession that you have lost the argument.

No, do I need to re-post it again? You're avoiding every single point that I make.
How confused you are

You have the half taken/ left as half heathen and half believers.
That isvyour little deal that you are now backtracking on?
You also have 5 foolish virgins as unbelievers and are unaware the " half" equals 50%
Huh??????
You are really getting confused huh??????
 

rebuilder 454

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The Holy Ghost is not in lamps. That is ridiculous! The Holy Spirit is in hearts. You're not remotely getting the meaning of this parable. Your teachers have taught you wrong. You're forcing your theology into it because you have nothing to support your theories. Where is your seven year tribulation after this event? Nowhere! You have to force it into the sacred text! This is how desperate you are getting! You obviously have nothing.

The parable of the 10 virgins has nothing to do with 50% being saved and 50% not within the Church. It has nothing to do with 50% or professors being genuine and 50% not. It has equally nothing to do with the percentage of society that will know Christ when He comes. The 50/50 breakdown is an earthly illustration relating to preparedness; some were wise and prepared others were foolish and were caught on. This is what will happen when Jesus comes. Remember, the broad road holds the vast bulk of mankind. There are few on the narrow road. This truth is played out throughout Scripture.
Give me that 50-50 breakdown again?
Half are ready and half are not????
Half of what exactly??
The world???
The church?????

BTW. I never said, nor have I ever placed the lamps as the Holy Ghost.
The oil is representative of the Holy Ghost.
The lamps are the vessel containing the Holy Ghost
 

WPM

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You have no verses chief

You post verses on the second coming on white horses and erroneously transpose that setting to the rapture.
You do it over and over, oblivious that your deal is in fact impossible.
The rapture of Rev 14:14 ALONE defeats you entire deal.
I could sail a ship through the hole I just blew in your silly doctrine.
Game
Set
Match
Big time
How does it? I believe in several recaps in Revelation describing the intra-Advent period. As you dive into the book of Revelation it is important to recognize that it is not chronological. It is a series of recaps. It is a number of repetitions describing the spiritual battle going on during the intra-Advent period. It presents different camera views of the same game (mainly, the period between Christ's First Advent and His Second Advent). Sometimes when one is watching a sports game, the camera is close in on the action, sometimes it presents a broad panoramic view of the game. Sometimes it is focused on the coaches, sometimes it is focused on the players, other times, it is focused on the fans. The book Revelation is a bit like that. Sinclair Ferguson describes the apocalypse as: “Recapitulatory and progressive parallelism.” Each recapitulation finishes with the gathering of the wicked together to battle against the righteous, followed by the glorious climatic coming of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Parallels are simply different camera views of the same corresponding intra-Advent period which look at different aspects of the great battle between darkness and light. While they focus in on the same intra-Advent period, they focus different aspects of the overthrow of the kingdom of darkness. Revelation is written for the purpose of revealing the character and standing of Christ, His power and glory, following His victorious earthly ministry. It reveals who Christ is, His current standing, what His plan is, and it also ministers unto those who are going through tribulation.
 
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WPM

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How confused you are

You have the half taken/ left as half heathen and half believers.
That isvyour little deal that you are now backtracking on?
You also have 5 foolish virgins as unbelievers and are unaware the " half" equals 50%
Huh??????
You are really getting confused huh??????

Now, are you going to tell us where your seven year tribulation (or any protracted period of tribulation) is after this event in the passage? In fact, can you show me one single rapture passage in the Bible that shows a seven year tribulation (or any protracted period of tribulation) after it?
 

rebuilder 454

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The Holy Ghost is not in lamps. That is ridiculous! The Holy Spirit is in hearts. You're not remotely getting the meaning of this parable. Your teachers have taught you wrong. You're forcing your theology into it because you have nothing to support your theories. Where is your seven year tribulation after this event? Nowhere! You have to force it into the sacred text! This is how desperate you are getting! You obviously have nothing.

The parable of the 10 virgins has nothing to do with 50% being saved and 50% not within the Church. It has nothing to do with 50% or professors being genuine and 50% not. It has equally nothing to do with the percentage of society that will know Christ when He comes. The 50/50 breakdown is an earthly illustration relating to preparedness; some were wise and prepared others were foolish and were caught on. This is what will happen when Jesus comes. Remember, the broad road holds the vast bulk of mankind. There are few on the narrow road. This truth is played out throughout Scripture.
Parables are a story within a story.
All of them have components.
When you change the components you pervert what Jesus is saying .
Best not to do that.
I feel bad for you that your false doctrine has you changing the parable.
 

rebuilder 454

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Now, are you going to tell us where your seven year tribulation (or any protracted period of tribulation) is after this event in the passage? In fact, can you show me one single rapture passage in the Bible that shows a seven year tribulation (or any protracted period of tribulation) after it?
Ahhhh
Can't answer about the 50% taken can you?
 

rebuilder 454

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How does it? I believe in several recaps in Revelation describing the intra-Advent period. As you dive into the book of Revelation it is important to recognize that it is not chronological. It is a series of recaps. It is a number of repetitions describing the spiritual battle going on during the intra-Advent period. It presents different camera views of the same game (mainly, the period between Christ's First Advent and His Second Advent). Sometimes when one is watching a sports game, the camera is close in on the action, sometimes it presents a broad panoramic view of the game. Sometimes it is focused on the coaches, sometimes it is focused on the players, other times, it is focused on the fans. The book Revelation is a bit like that. Sinclair Ferguson describes the apocalypse as: “Recapitulatory and progressive parallelism.” Each recapitulation finishes with the gathering of the wicked together to battle against the righteous, followed by the glorious climatic coming of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Parallels are simply different camera views of the same corresponding intra-Advent period which look at different aspects of the great battle between darkness and light. While they focus in on the same intra-Advent period, they focus different aspects of the overthrow of the kingdom of darkness. Revelation is written for the purpose of revealing the character and standing of Christ, His power and glory, following His victorious earthly ministry. It reveals who Christ is, His current standing, what His plan is, and it also ministers unto those who are going through tribulation.
Revelation is what it SAYS IT IS.
Events about to take place.
 

rebuilder 454

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Give me that 50-50 breakdown again?
Half are ready and half are not????
Half of what exactly??
The world???
The church?????

BTW. I never said, nor have I ever placed the lamps as the Holy Ghost.
The oil is representative of the Holy Ghost.
The lamps are the vessel containing the Holy Ghost
Again
What is the 50- 50 taken/left breakdown?????
Who are they??????
 

WPM

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Give me that 50-50 breakdown again?
Half are ready and half are not????
Half of what exactly??
The world???
The church?????

BTW. I never said, nor have I ever placed the lamps as the Holy Ghost.
The oil is representative of the Holy Ghost.
The lamps are the vessel containing the Holy Ghost
This passage is basically a call for preparedness for Christ’s coming. It is nothing to do with percentages. Many parables are like that. It is to do with believers and unbelievers. It is describing those that are ready and those that are not. The enlightened will get the thrust. Whether theologians want to apply this to the visible church or to all mankind makes little difference. That is not worth fighting over. It is the overall trust that Christ is pressing up - be prepared.
 

rebuilder 454

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This passage is basically a call for preparedness for Christ’s coming. It is nothing to do with percentages. Many parables are like that. It is to do with believers and unbelievers. It is describing those that are ready and those that are not. The enlightened will get the thrust. Whether theologians want to apply this to the visible church or to all mankind makes little difference. That is not worth fighting over. It is the overall trust that Christ is pressing up - be prepared.
Are the foolish virgins heathen or believers?

A critical component that any Christian can discern.