Bibliolatry: Worship/knowledge of the book MORE than the author

[St. SteVen]

From the OP (with new emphasis)

I have encountered some that I thought had fallen into this trap.

I asked them, "What would become of your faith if you put your whole library out on the curb on trash day?"
The guilty are left mostly speechless. Or, alternatively VERY angry. How come?

To be clear, I love the Bible and use it every day. But I know the difference between the book and the author.
In my experience, my relationship with the author is much more important than my relationship with the book.
Appropriate scriptures come to my mind all day long. Due to the work of the Spirit to quicken these things to my memory.

- The Bible is not omniscient. (all knowing)
- The Bible is not omnipresent. (everywhere present)
- The Bible is not omnipotent. (all powerful)

The Bible does NOT love me.

It's paper and ink, maybe a leather cover. (or digital info)
That cow didn't die to pay my sin debt.

A true Bibliolator will demand chapter and verse to support my premise. - LOL

The bottom line:
Let's use the Bible to grow closer to God and each other, rather than as a weapon to destroy each other.

John 13:35 NIV
By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

]

 

[Behold]

John 13:35 NIV
By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

The word of God is more than a "book", to those who understand why.

To others, its just a negative talking point, and a target to be assaulted.

For them, the word of God is not an authority, as it can't compete with their opinions.

 

[Spyder]

The word of God is more than a "book", to those who understand why.

To others, its just a negative talking point, and a target to be assaulted.

For them, the word of God is not an authority, as it can't compete with their opinions.

Oh, I worked for a long time to find evidence that it was not "just a book." I finally got my eyes opened the the fact that it was supernatural.

The only negative regarding the bible is that we - the believers - intentionally remain ignorant on all that the bible says. The "why" is going to be personal to each individual. For me, I found that there were contradictions in my bible written in English. In order to remove those contractions (which is mandatory if I am going to accept that it is "God-breathed), I had to delve down into interlinear bibles, history, and a study of the ancient Jewish culture. It takes time and effort. I believe God wants us to invest time and effort - and then depend on Him for our truth.

Realistically, unless we invest as needed in eliminating contradictions in scripture and come to understand truth, the bible in not the authority until we have done due diligence to find truth through the spirit of God. Then, what the spirit of God gives me in the "authority." I realize for some that it is much easier just to thump their English translations and claim it is truth without ever applying hermeneutics to their studies - beyond what their Sunday School teacher told them.

 

[Behold]

Realistically, unless we invest as needed in eliminating contradictions in scripture

I dont presume to be equal to the task of sitting in judgement against the word of God... as some who have elevated themselves to the prideful position of claiming they are capable of correcting the word of God.

I dont Correct it.
I BELIEVE IT.

I'll let the bible correctors have their day in eternity explaining that to the Son of God.

Im not that one and THANK GOD, i'll never be that one.

Reader, you'll never find me in a pulpit, or on a Forum, trying to convince God's Church that the "Bible has errors" as that is the Devil's work, and im not that one.

Believe it.

 

[Spyder]

I dont presume to be equal to the task of sitting in judgement against the word of God... as some who have elevated themselves to the prideful position of claiming they are capable of correcting the word of God.

I dont Correct it.
I BELIEVE IT.

I'll let the bible correctors have their day in eternity explaining that to the Son of God.

Im not that one and THANK GOD, i'll never be that one.

Reader, you'll never find me in a pulpit, or on a Forum, trying to convince God's Church that the "Bible has errors" as that is the Devil's work, and im not that one.

Believe it.

So, you have never seen any contradictory passages in your bible?

May I suggest that you get yourself a copy of a book called "Hard Sayings of the Bible." In it, not only will you see those passages that contradict, you'll see "experts" dance all around trying to explain some of them. But then, it is your choice in how you learn scripture.

 

[Behold]

May I suggest that you get yourself a copy of a book called "Hard Sayings of the Bible."

Im seminary trained, ive perfomed extra studies regarding "extant Grk Texts". "manuscript evidence"... etc, etc.

So, as i said, i am a BIBLE BELIEVER, and i would not be caught DEAD trying to correct the word of God.

Believe it.

 

[Spyder]

Im seminary trained, ive perfomed extra studies regarding "extant Grk Texts". "manuscript evidence"... etc, etc.

So, as i said, i am a BIBLE BELIEVER, and i would not be caught DEAD trying to correct the word of God.

Believe it.

Well, that makes two of us who have been trained. I don't really understand your point here? Are you conflicted with the idea of performing hermeneutics that require additional research to understand? Or, are you accusing me of trying to correct the word of God?

 

[Behold]

Well, that makes two of us who have been trained. I don't really understand your point here?

The point is..

The Devil's work is to deny or to revise the word of God.
He did this when deceiving EVE.. He said..>"hath God said"?
"Is that what God really MEANS?""

"Here let me correct what God said, so that its ......."

See that?

That is...>"there are errors in the bible". "you can't trust the Bible, as the "original grk says"...

= Its the same DEVIL, doing the SAME thing, as that is His Work.....

 

[St. SteVen]

The Devil's work is to deny or to revise the word of God.

There is no consensus on what the Bible means.
So, when there is disagreement, who is denying and who is revising?

Just because someone disagrees with your personal understanding of the Bible,
does that mean they are denying or revising? Perhaps you are the one denying and revising. ???

]

 

[Behold]

There is no consensus on what the Bible means.

Sure there is...

However, those who do not recognize the word of God as "final authority"...... and Paul as their NT Teacher, are always confused.

Listen.

The Bible is given by the Holy Spirit and written down by Men who were anointed by the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit is in every Believer, and He reveals the word to the born again spirit in the person, that becomes "revelation knowledge", as their Belief system. (Theology).

In the "time of the gentiles', Jesus sent PAUL as a "chosen Vessel" to reveal church doctrine, as Paul's doctrine, to all the Born Again.

So, when a person says..>"what is all that"... "i never heard of that STUFF, all my life...till behold showed up"""""..then of course they have no idea what they are doing with the NT, and that is why they don't actually believe it, and can't explain it, and in reality, just want to deny it., and preach their Calvinism or their Maryism, or their whatever "ism" instead.

Even the KJV is written on a 5th Grade level, that a 11 yr old can read...but the Bible is not to be READ.. to be understood as if its a DICTIONARY..........its to be "discerned" "Spiritually".., and when the person is "Mind owned" by Calvin, or some cult, then that bible is LOCKED FOR LIFE.
Thats a fact.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

So, you have never seen any contradictory passages in your bible?

May I suggest that you get yourself a copy of a book called "Hard Sayings of the Bible." In it, not only will you see those passages that contradict, you'll see "experts" dance all around trying to explain some of them. But then, it is your choice in how you learn scripture.

@Spyder

There are contradictions in translations I agree.

But why don't you start a thread that all can read and perhaps contribute to that would show a comparison of the errors.

Is this the book you referenced....? Hard sayings of the Bible : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive
This link will take it to all who care to read it.

I am not seminary trained, and I am not a Koine Greek or Arabic scholar to understand the nuances of translations... I can merely trust what I read to be correct.... and of course the assorted opinions of those
who do opine be them at odds with another or not.

I have read translated bits and pieces of Jewish writings and such... but still rely on parallel scriptures... that often can and do show something different based on comparison readings and then one needs to go to the commentaries... that sometime are different... and done by men who have their own leanings.

But I am smart enough to know that when one translation says

And the evening and the morning were the first day.
And the evening and the morning were the second day.

Yet compared to

And there was evening and there was morning, one day.
And there was evening and there was morning, a second day.

Or

and it was evening and it was dawn, day one.
and it was evening and it was dawn, day second.

The argument being that these all say the same thing..... But nuances say differently. and major differences to the non-YEC people.So I simply think a thread with actual examples from specific translations.... BTW, my 3 are from KJV, NASB95 and the Peshitta.... is waranted. I could not find Genesis 1 in Codex Sinaiticus, and can find no translation for Codex Vatinicus... the alleged 2 oldest bibles we have.

Also... not pertaining to Genesis I have been checking out something @Guestman posted... elsewhere (JW thread)

The Codex Vaticanus of about 350 C.E. (and the Codex Sinaiticus of about 375 C.E.), predating the King James Bible (pub in 1611) over 1,260 years, reads at John 1:1, 2 as follows: "In a beginning was the ("the", Greek ho, definite article) Word, and the ("the", Greek ho, definite article) Word was with the ("the", Greek ho, definite article) God, and a god (NO definite article) was the ("the", Greek ho, definite article) Word. This was in a beginning with the ("the", Greek ho, definite article) Word."

"A" beginning.... (FYI, that plays ointo those who believe there were other lifew or creations before we got here)
"'A' god...... ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

And this is wrong.... Of course I cannot find Codex Vaticanus but Codex Sinaiticus says, from what I could find

1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 He was in the beginning with God.

And if we are very lucky, maybe our brother @Behold would give us his learned opinion on things.

I know he trusts the bible as the inerrant word of God but it is man who messes things up and we should at least know where and how.

 

[amadeus]

From the OP (with new emphasis)

I have encountered some that I thought had fallen into this trap.

I asked them, "What would become of your faith if you put your whole library out on the curb on trash day?"
The guilty are left mostly speechless. Or, alternatively VERY angry. How come?

To be clear, I love the Bible and use it every day. But I know the difference between the book and the author.
In my experience, my relationship with the author is much more important than my relationship with the book.
Appropriate scriptures come to my mind all day long. Due to the work of the Spirit to quicken these things to my memory.

- The Bible is not omniscient. (all knowing)
- The Bible is not omnipresent. (everywhere present)
- The Bible is not omnipotent. (all powerful)

The Bible does NOT love me.

It's paper and ink, maybe a leather cover. (or digital info)
That cow didn't die to pay my sin debt.

A true Bibliolator will demand chapter and verse to support my premise. - LOL

The bottom line:
Let's use the Bible to grow closer to God and each other, rather than as a weapon to destroy each other.

John 13:35 NIV
By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

]

@Spyder @Behold

We can choose God's Way which requires us to lean or Him and hear what He is saying. The Holy Spirit is to provide Life to what we have consumed [read in or heard from the Book or elsewhere?]. There is potential in the Book because it was written under God's inspiration. The potential only comes to Life in people who allow themselves to be led by the same Holy Spirit. This leading occurs as a result of the same inspiration in you or me from the same source [God]. The source is not in the Book. The source is God.

People have wrong messages or mixed messages because they quench the Holy Spirit in themselves and/or then follow themselves or other men... even in how they read and understand the written Bible [in most or any version or language].

 

[Behold]

@Spyder @Behold

We can choose God's Way which requires us to lean or Him and hear what He is saying. \

When Jesus was confronted by Satan, after The Lord's fasting, ... Jesus would only respond to the Devil, using the Scriptures.
So, that is the Word of God, speaking the word of God, against the deceiver.

SATAN, (Paul teaches) comes to us, as an "angel of LIGHT"....

"Light", = false enlightenment. = Religious Theology.... Man made religion.

He has "Ministers" who have been led of the Devil to write THEIR Theology, that can deceive you.

HEBREWS 13:9

Jesus said that when the Devil's enlightenment becomes the person's belief system..., then their light that is in them...

= Their Belief system.. .is now darkness.

DARKNESS, spiritual darkness, theological darkness, is the DEVIL's LIGHT, and many teach it, as "im led of the spirit". "God told me"...etc.

And yes they are LED, but its not the right spirit, its : Luke 11:35 that has happened to them.

"behold, how do you know all this stuff"..

I did what Paul told you to do in Hebrews 13:9 (KJV)

He told you to establish your HEART, with "GRACE", and most establish their heart with Calvin, or Mary Worship, or some Cult "content".
Most establish their heart with some book that says..>"errors in the bible".....written by... Louis Siffer.

Hebrews 13:9 explains it.

 

[Ritajanice]

To be clear, I love the Bible and use it every day. But I know the difference between the book and the author.
In my experience, my relationship with the author is much more important than my relationship with the book.
Appropriate scriptures come to my mind all day long. Due to the work of the Spirit to quicken these things to my memory.

Wahoo!!!....mine to !...we know God in our spirit, that is where we have His Living witness who made our spirit Born Again.

The Bible is the written word, we wouldn’t die in spirit without it, we just wouldn’t grow and mature....remember we have been Born Again of incorruptible seed that liveth and endureth forever!

Same here, the Holy Spirit brings all scripture to my mind....also brings the written word to understanding in my spirit, after all we are spiritual children of God......

What an Amazing!!!..God we serve...Praise His Holy Name!..

◄ 1 Corinthians 2:14 ►

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. New Living Translation But people who aren’t spiritual can’t receive these truths from God’s Spirit. It all sounds foolish to them and they can’t understand it, for only those who are spiritual can understand what the Spirit means. English Standard Version The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. Berean Standard Bible The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God. For they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. Berean Literal Bible But the natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God; for they are foolishness to him, and he is not able to understand them, because spiritually they are discerned

 

[amigo de christo]

From the OP (with new emphasis)

I have encountered some that I thought had fallen into this trap.

I asked them, "What would become of your faith if you put your whole library out on the curb on trash day?"
The guilty are left mostly speechless. Or, alternatively VERY angry. How come?

To be clear, I love the Bible and use it every day. But I know the difference between the book and the author.
In my experience, my relationship with the author is much more important than my relationship with the book.
Appropriate scriptures come to my mind all day long. Due to the work of the Spirit to quicken these things to my memory.

- The Bible is not omniscient. (all knowing)
- The Bible is not omnipresent. (everywhere present)
- The Bible is not omnipotent. (all powerful)

The Bible does NOT love me.

It's paper and ink, maybe a leather cover. (or digital info)
That cow didn't die to pay my sin debt.

A true Bibliolator will demand chapter and verse to support my premise. - LOL

The bottom line:
Let's use the Bible to grow closer to God and each other, rather than as a weapon to destroy each other.

John 13:35 NIV
By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

]

To be clear me smells something else . One who does not really love the truth in that bible .
i already know the COW DIDNT DIE FOR ME .
BUT I DO KNOW HE WHO INSPIRED THEM WORDS IN THAT BIBLE , DID .
EVERY WORD of THE LORD IS for our good . Me smells one who aint what he say He is .
Rather he says he loves the truth in that bible , BUT DONT . Not all of it . HIMS Likes
twisted versions of things . You can fool you , man can fool himself and he can fool others
But he aint fooling a lamb . NOW BIBLE UP pard .

 

[amigo de christo]

Wahoo!!!....mine to !...we know God in our spirit, that is where we have His Living witness who made our spirit Born Again.

The Bible is the written word, we wouldn’t die in spirit without it, we just wouldn’t grow and mature....remember we have been Born Again of incorruptible seed that liveth and endureth forever!

Same here, the Holy Spirit brings all scripture to my mind....also brings the written word to understanding in my spirit, after all we are spiritual children of God......

What an Amazing!!!..God we serve...Praise His Holy Name!..

​

◄ 1 Corinthians 2:14 ►

​

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. New Living Translation But people who aren’t spiritual can’t receive these truths from God’s Spirit. It all sounds foolish to them and they can’t understand it, for only those who are spiritual can understand what the Spirit means. English Standard Version The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. Berean Standard Bible The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God. For they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. Berean Literal Bible But the natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God; for they are foolishness to him, and he is not able to understand them, because spiritually they are discerned

The decieved often use the very words
but do so to support something contrary to the written word .
If i had a dime for every time a false teacher used that saying about the natural man
and used it to support his OWN FLESH FED DECETPOINS , rita i could feed africa .
WHILE IT IS TRUE the natural man does not recieve the things of GOD .
MANY who use that are THE NATURAL MAN and use it to support something NOT TRUE
and since they cannot overcome the words of those who speak truth
THEY SIMPLY SAY this . i see this so much , so very often . THE NATURAL MAN TRULY CANNOT recieve the things of GOD
is very true . THEY DONT and yet USE THAT LINE TO DECIEVE .folks so as to support they own false stuff
and make it seem as though it be spiritual meat . man oh man , folks are fast to embrace deceptoin .

 

[Michiah-Imla]

It’s like saying we don’t need our cars because our relationship with the car maker is more important.

Ridiculous philosophy.

 

[amadeus]

When Jesus was confronted by Satan, after The Lord's fasting, ... Jesus would only respond to the Devil, using the Scriptures.
So, that is the Word of God, speaking the word of God, against the deceiver.
Both the devil and Jesus quoted the scriptures. The devil spoke the dead letter while Jesus spoke the Living Word:

Mt 4:6

And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone. [from Psalm 91:12]

Mt 4:7

Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God. [from Deut. 6:16]

2co 3:6

[God] Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

Just quoting the Bible does not equal quoting the Word of God. The Life of the Word is the Spirit. The letter without the Spirit is dead and kills

 

[Carl Emerson]

It’s like saying we don’t need our cars because our relationship with the car maker is more important.

Ridiculous philosophy.

I have smuggled the Scripture into parts of the world where it is illegal.

Believers there don't have it but they want it.

They are believers because of Him.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

They are believers because of Him.

Any thing that degrades the written word is abomination.

Leave the Holy Bible alone.