Why are some interpreters not being honest with the text involving Daniel 9:27?

[Spiritual Israelite]

Yeah, like when Christ said they would come and destroy the temple and in three days Christ rebuilt it. And like you, they thought Christ was talking about the physical temple that took 46 years to build.

I do not think that! Why do you lie? Do you think lying helps your case? It only makes you a liar that no one should take seriously.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Why are you talking about Jews in Judea? I'm not.

It was the Judaean Christians who heeded Jesus' warning and fled.

The ones you say God did not talk about.

He certainly did, and they listened, and acted, and survived.

They were smarter than futurists.

Thank God that there wasn't one futurist in the bunch.

They'd have been dead.

Not spiritually dead.

Physically dead.

You are funny. Christians have already gone into the surrounding nations after Pentecost. Even Saul has to pursue Christians in Damascus. Nothing to do with 70AD.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Was the city completely repopulated and rebuilt the day after the Romans destroyed it?

Was the temple or even the city physically rebuilt after three days in 70AD? Then that is not what the Lord talked about.

 

[TribulationSigns]

It's ludicrous to deny that the temple buildings referenced in Matthew 24:1-2 (Mark 13:1-2, Luke 21:6-7) were anything but the physical temple buildings standing at that time. The temple buildings of the temple they had just been in were clearly what the disciples and Jesus were referring to. It couldn't be more clear.


There is no indication of such whatsoever in Matthew 24:1-2 (Mark 13:1-2, Luke 21:6-7). Not even close.

As I said, it is because you lacks spiritual discernment thinking the Lord was talking about physical stones and buildings. But this is not what the Lord had in mind. But regardless...

Gal 4:16
(16) Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

The Lord judges and I am comfortable with that. :-)

 

[covenantee]

You are funny. Christians have already gone into the surrounding nations after Pentecost. Even Saul has to pursue Christians in Damascus. Nothing to do with 70AD.

So quote for us the Scripture confirming that all of the Christians in Jerusalem and Judaea, upon seeing the Roman armies advancing on Jerusalem, after Pentecost, fled into the mountains.

Book, chapter, verse, please.

 

[covenantee]

Was the temple or even the city physically rebuilt after three days in 70AD? Then that is not what the Lord talked about.

No mention of rebuilding in the Olivet discourse. Irrelevant.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

As I said, it is because you lacks spiritual discernment thinking the Lord was talking about physical stones and buildings. But this is not what the Lord had in mind. But regardless...

Gal 4:16
(16) Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

The Lord judges and I am comfortable with that. :)

He spoke of both. If you want to insist that He would refer to the church as "these great buildings", then I guess I can't stop you from believing nonsense like that which comes about by way of your supposed spiritual discernment.

Now, if He would have said "this great building" instead of "these great buildings" then I would consider whether or not He could have been referring to His body or the corporate body of Christ that Paul described as "the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit" (Ephesians 2:21-22).

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

No mention of rebuilding in the Olivet discourse. Irrelevant.

Trying to get this guy to stick to the context of the Olivet Discourse is a difficult, if not impossible, task.

 

[TribulationSigns]

So quote for us the Scripture confirming that all of the Christians in Jerusalem and Judaea, upon seeing the Roman armies advancing on Jerusalem, after Pentecost, fled into the mountains.

Book, chapter, verse, please.

I already quoted disputed Scripture with you many times here and on other threads. You are in denial that Olivet Discourse is about God's New Testament Congregation of Israel, the Church prior to Second Coming in the future. Not Israel with Jews in physical Judaea and destroyed temple in Jersualem by Roman armies. Because of your carnal mind, you are dealing with wrong city, wrong temple, and wrong Jews. Like I said, you go ahead and play in Preterist sandbox that won't come to the Truth.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

So quote for us the Scripture confirming that all of the Christians in Jerusalem and Judaea, upon seeing the Roman armies advancing on Jerusalem, after Pentecost, fled into the mountains.

Book, chapter, verse, please.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure there's nothing anywhere about anyone fleeing into the mountains soon after Pentecost.

Acts 8:1 And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria, except the apostles.

They were "scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria". That obviously covers more ground than just the mountains. Nothing there about anyone fleeing into the mountains. It's amazing how some people here are so willing to just make things up in order to keep their doctrines afloat. It's pathetic.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I already quoted disputed Scripture with you many times here and on other threads. You are in denial that Olivet Discourse is about God's New Testament Congregation of Israel, the Church prior to Second Coming in the future.

Again, you lie. He, like me, does believe a majority of the "Olivet Discourse is about God's New Testament Congregation of Israel, the Church prior to Second Coming in the future". He, like me, just happens to believe that part of it is about the destruction of first century Jerusalem and the temple as well.

Not Israel with Jews in physical Judaea and destroyed temple in Jersualem by Roman armies. Because of your carnal mind, you are dealing with wrong city, wrong temple, and wrong Jews. Like I said, you go ahead and play in Preterist sandbox that won't come to the Truth.

LOL. You're like Truth7t7 in some ways. Like him, you think that if someone agrees with preterists on one thing it makes them a preterist. Well, pre-tribs believe Matthew 24:29-31 is about the future return of Christ just like you and I do. Does that make us pre-tribs?

 

[covenantee]

I already quoted disputed Scripture with you many times here and on other threads. You are in denial that Olivet Discourse is about God's New Testament Congregation of Israel, the Church prior to Second Coming in the future. Not Israel with Jews in physical Judaea and destroyed temple in Jersualem by Roman armies. Because of your carnal mind, you are dealing with wrong city, wrong temple, and wrong Jews. Like I said, you go ahead and play in Preterist sandbox that won't come to the Truth.

"In about 50 AD, Paul and Barnabas go to the council in Jerusalem 14 years after Paul's conversion (Galatians 2:1-9 and Acts 15:2)."

Paul and Barnabas were in Jerusalem in 50 AD, years after Pentecost.

They obviously got left behind, so they obviously weren't Christians.

 

[covenantee]

I already quoted disputed Scripture

What you meant to say is, "I already disputed quoted Scripture".

You're welcome.

 

[TribulationSigns]

He spoke of both. If you want to insist that He would refer to the church as "these great buildings", then I guess I can't stop you from believing nonsense like that which comes about by way of your supposed spiritual discernment.

Now, if He would have said "this great building" instead of "these great buildings" then I would consider whether or not He could have been referring to His body or the corporate body of Christ that Paul described as "the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit" (Ephesians 2:21-22).

The Lord spoke of His People, His builders that the "great buildings" of the city and temple represents. They are Christ's congregation. Stones=People. The Lord did not talk about physical destruction of physical stones and building here.

Mar 13:1-2
(1) And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
(2) And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

Now read carefully what Mark wrote:

Mar 12:1-11
(1) And he began to speak unto them by parables. A certain man planted a vineyard, and set an hedge about it, and digged a place for the winefat, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country.
(2) And at the season he sent to the husbandmen a servant, that he might receive from the husbandmen of the fruit of the vineyard.
(3) And they caught him, and beat him, and sent him away empty.
(4) And again he sent unto them another servant; and at him they cast stones, and wounded him in the head, and sent him away shamefully handled.
(5) And again he sent another; and him they killed, and many others; beating some, and killing some.
(6) Having yet therefore one son, his wellbeloved, he sent him also last unto them, saying, They will reverence my son.
(7) But those husbandmen said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and the inheritance shall be ours.
(8) And they took him, and killed him, and cast him out of the vineyard.
(9) What shall therefore the lord of the vineyard do? he will come and destroy the husbandmen, and will give the vineyard unto others.
(10) And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner:
(11) This was the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?

The certain man is God.
His servants were His Prophets.
His son was of course Christ (God Himself)
His husbandmen were the Jews.
The vineyard was the congregation (kingdom representation).

The Jews rejected Son. God did destroy them and took the vineyard (kingdom representation) from them and gave to the church. Again we read in Matthew 21...

Mat 21:39-43
(39) And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him.
(40) When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?
(41) They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.
(42) Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
(43) Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

The former husbandmen were the Jews of the Old Testament Congregation who have rejected Son and slew Him. In judgment, the Lord took the kingdom representation (vineyard) from them and gave to another husbandmen which is CHRISTIANS. The very people you have mentioned in Ephesians 2:21-22. We, as Christians are the builder of God's New Testament Congreation where Christ is now a chief corner stone of that building! Did The Lord talk about physical stones and buildings here? No? Same goes with former husbandmen, Jews that God saw as stones of the Old Testament buildings that was falling! In other words, they no longer represents God's Kingdom. The physical temple does not have to be destoryed to confirm this. It already took place at the Cross where Christ prophesied that they (the Jews) will come and destroy the temple and the sanctuary by put Christ to the Cross! In other words, they have de stored their kingdom representation. So they are the stones falling that Christ talked about. Spiritual discernment!

But no... just like the Jews of old, you are blind to believe that the Lord was talking about physical temple and stones falling to build doctrine upon.

 

[TribulationSigns]

What you meant to say is, "I already disputed quoted Scripture".

You're welcome.

No, I quoted the disputed Scripture you believed was physical when you have been corrected... many times. You do not receive the love of the truth.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

The Lord spoke of His People, His builders that the "great buildings" of the city and temple represents. They are Christ's congregation. Stones=People.

You are trying to skate around the issue. He referenced "these great buildings", not "these great stones". The stones make up one building. Don't try to change what He said. Be honest with scripture.

 

[TribulationSigns]

"In about 50 AD, Paul and Barnabas go to the council in Jerusalem 14 years after Paul's conversion (Galatians 2:1-9 and Acts 15:2)."

Paul and Barnabas were in Jerusalem in 50 AD, years after Pentecost.

They obviously got left behind, so they obviously weren't Christians.

You misunderstood.

There were many Jews from surrounding regions and nations who visited Jersualem during Passover (when Christ died) and went back home after Pentecost with the Holy Ghost preaching Gospel before Paul even did. Christianity had already spread into regions after 33AD. Paul did go on his first missionary journey before return back to Jerusalem for the council. Keep in mind that Christianity was already founded in Greek territory to preach Christianity in 49AD. That does not mean the Paul and Barnabas were staying in Jersualem the whole until after 50AD.

 

[covenantee]

Look....anyone can study history. There is no Biblical law against the study of History. The problem comes in when Christians attempt to use secular history to prove fulfilled scripture.

So you would believe that there was no historical physical birth of Christ, because that would be secular history proving fulfilled Scripture.

Agreed?

 

[TribulationSigns]

You are trying to skate around the issue. He referenced "these great buildings", not "these great stones". The stones make up one building. Don't try to change what He said. Be honest with scripture.

I believe the one who has downplayed the Scripture I quoted regarding the stones is the one who is dishonest.

 

[TribulationSigns]

So you would believe that there was no historical physical birth of Christ, because that would be secular history proving fulfilled Scripture.

Agreed?

But what does that have to do with the price of bananas with the fallen stones of the buildings?! The "secular history" of the Herod temple destroyed in 70AD was NOT what Christ had in mind when He prophesied about His own people (the husbandmen) who came and destroy him. Not Romans.