Where does the Pope get his authority?

[Marymog]

The scriptures decide what is truth. Not your men. Or my men. Or any man.
KJV John 17:17
17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

Do you even think about what you are going to say before you say it?

First off, you just admitted that your men don't know the truth of Scripture.

Second off, you just admitted that YOU don't know the truth of Scripture. But you KNOW that everyone else is wrong except for YOU and your men.

Third off, Scripture doesn't decide what the truth is. Scripture is the truth! It takes men, guided by the Holy Spirit, to discern that truth. You are following SDA men who believe they have discerned the truth from Scripture. The writings of your men are clearly different than the writings of the Apostolic Fathers (students of the Apostles) truth. Your men fulfil 2 Peter 3:16 but your men accuse the students of the Apostles of fulfilling 2 Peter 3:16. STUDENTS OF THE APOSTLES twist Scripture, but your men 1,900 removed from the Apostles DON'T???????????

This is why you crack me up all the time.....

 

[Marymog]

What two traditions? Paul was given the same gospel in the exact same way the apostles previously did,

Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold to the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word or our epistle.

 

[Marymog]

Mary worship is forbidden?

Yup, that is what The Church teaches. Do you agree with The Church?

 

[Marymog]

"He that is Spiritual discerneth all things".

"The Born again are "One with God, In Christ" "Born again Spiritually".

"He that hath not the Spirit of God, is none of God's".

= Im Born again... so, that means that "Christ in you, the hope of Glory".. = Im a "Temple of The Holy Spirit".

So, all that means, = is that im SPIRITUAL... = "He that is Spiritual discerneth all things".

And the Spiritual can do this....>"The word of God(BIBLE) is Spiritually discerned"..

No, as you have no use for "protestants", then if i tell you that im "called of God", you will not believe it.

If i tell you that my Local Assembly is "Messianic" and i dont subscribe to "denominationalism"... at all.

Listen, , there is noone else on any forum Protestant or Catholic or otherwise... on the INternet who can can answer your question, as i have done.

I didnt "cut and paste" any of that oh ye "cult of the Virgin" owned., and i wrote a condensed version for you....

So, for you to ask me a question, while knowing that you will not accept my answer, is really a false game that you should not play with people.

in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

Mary worship is forbidden?

Then you need to tell this person...
-

"""Pope adds new Mary memorial to calendar""​

-
View attachment 45316

Still, after a detailed explanation of the difference between veneration and worship, you still don't get it. Once again, the Pope is honoring the prototype (in heaven), not the statue itself. Only the Holy Spirit can break your chains of prejudice. You may fool some people by repeating the same lie over and over again with massive pictures, but not everyone is so stupid as to think the Pope is worshipping a statue.

Bible cults forbid physical devotional aids largely due to the influence of John Calvin.
1) Muslims smash statues and crosses because they don’t believe an image can represent God or bring His actions to mind.

2) Calvinists smashed statues and crosses (and don’t have statues in their churches or crucifixes) because they don’t believe an image can represent God or bring His actions to mind.

3) Bible cults post HUGE photos in forums thinking they can prove idolatry which is no different than Jihadists or Calvinist way of thinking.



Go ahead, @Behold, post more photos of "Mary worship" and continue making a fool of yourself.

 

[Behold]

Still, after a detailed explanation of the difference between veneration and worship,

I believe that you believe what you say, or it could be that you are caught in the headlights, and are forced to deny the truth..

As, if a person is a Catholic, and they realize that "OMG this Mary stuff is not BIBLICAL, but its ALL CATHOLIC Doctrine".

So, if a person who was "raised catholic' and "mother is catholic' and "Grandma and Grandpa".. = all the way back to the Pilgrims...

Then can that person, leave the " cult of the Virgin"?

It is possible, as i know of lifelong Catholics that were AWAKENED to this man made religious circus, complete with 80 Ft Tall Plastic Mary's, and an incredible religious OPERA that they have enjoyed watching all their life.

Some do wake up.
Others, like Marymog, on this Forum, will be giving praise to the "mother of God" till the sky cracks and the ice melts on the sun.
-

 

[Titus]

Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold to the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word or our epistle.

You haven't been following our conversation otherwise you would not of posted this

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

I believe that you believe what you say, or it could be that you are caught in the headlights, and are forced to deny the truth..

It is you who deny the meaning of plain English words, such as the difference between veneration and worship.

As, if a person is a Catholic, and they realize that "OMG this Mary stuff is not BIBLICAL, but its ALL CATHOLIC Doctrine".

Truth is objective, not subjective. All Catholic doctrine is derived directly or indirectly from Scripture. Weak or dead Catholics fall for your hate propaganda. Practicing informed Catholics don't. Your narrative is appealing to those predisposed to the same relativistic bigotry.

So, if a person who was "raised catholic' and "mother is catholic' and "Grandma and Grandpa".. = all the way back to the Pilgrims...

Then can that person, leave the " cult of the Virgin"

Ethnic Catholics are often Catholic in name only, not necessarily Catholic by practice. Weak or dead Catholics are targeted by Bible cults and "get saved from the evil Catholic Church." "cult of the Virgin" does not mean what you want it to mean, you use the term in a derogatory manner and show that your are incapable of understanding the meaning, and ignore explanations already given. You refuse to accept the meaning of veneration, confuse it with worship, use the vernacular meaning of "cult" and not its theological meaning. This ignorance is reinforced in Bible cults.

It is possible, as i know of lifelong Catholics that were AWAKENED to this man made religious circus, complete with 80 Ft Tall Plastic Mary's, and an incredible religious OPERA that they have enjoyed watching all their life.

Some do wake up.
Others, like Marymog, on this Forum, will be giving praise to the "mother of God" till the sky cracks and the ice melts on the sun.
-
View attachment 45322

Do you honor your mother?

 

[Titus]

Go ahead, @Behold, post more photos of "Mary worship" and continue making a fool of yourself

Huge idols that catholics bow down to and pray to is idol worship.

 

[Titus]

A person decides to believe or not believe in Christ. God does not make us believe in Him. God does not make Christians. So, once again, you are wrong

Catholics baptize babies against their will. That is definitely not someone who has decided, catholics force their religion on them.

 

[BreadOfLife]

You are either a lying deciever or very ignorant of 1st, century Jewish culture.

Michael O Wise "Languages of Palestine in dictionary of Jesus and the gospels
By Joel B. Green
Scot Mcknight
Dowers Grove: Intervarsity
Press 1992

Also Read
Joseph A. Fitzmyer
" Did Jesus Speak Greek "
1992

Stanley E. Porter
" The Language Of The New Testament "
Classic Essays ( Sheffield: Academic Press 1991

All of the hand picked Apostles were from Galilee,

Guess what?
The predominant language in Galilee in the 1st. Century was Koine Greek and Aramaic

Jews were trilingual

And isnt it strange that All the new testament documents were written in Greek? Huh?

The common language in Galilee and Judea was Koine greek.

Aramaic was NOT the dominant language.

Why is it if Jesus and His disciples did not speak Greek that they HAD GREEK NAMES!!!!
Andrew
Philip
Nicodemus
Theophilus

Greek customs were adopted by the Jews

On Jewish Ossuaries(a site, building made to serve as resting place for the dead)
On these Jewish ossuaries were etched, carved into the site, GREEK WORDS

Greek was used in oral and written form by Jesus and disciples.

Matthew 22:29,
- Jesus answered and said to them,
You do err not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God

Time for another Linguistics Lesson . . .

Jesus spoke ARAMAIC to His Apostles. We have examples straight from the Gospels of Jesus using Aramaic words to the Apostles and the crowds - “Talitha Koum “(Mark 5:41), “Ephphatha” (Mark 7:34), “Eli, Eli, Lama Sabachthani” (Matt. 27:46) and elsewhere.

Specifically, in Matt. 16:18 – Jesus calls Peter “Kepha” (Rock). How do we know this?
Because Paul refers to him as “Cephas” in his letter, which is a Greek transliteration of the Aramaic title of “Kepha”.

Greek was the language of commerce and international communication in the first century.
As for Jews with Greek names – this was during the Diaspora, when Jews were dispersed throughout the known world, living in every country (Acts 2:9-11).

 

[BreadOfLife]

Huge idols that catholics bow down to and pray to is idol worship.

Huge LIE.

An "idol" is somthing that ius worshipped.
We don't worship Mary. We simply ask herfor intercession - the SAME way YOU woud ask your loved one for intercession.

Don't add LIES to your lack pf faith . . .

 

[Titus]

Jesus spoke ARAMAIC to His Apostles. We have examples straight from the Gospels of Jesus using Aramaic words to the Apostles and the crowds

I never claimed Jesus didn't speak aramaic.
Quote me saying Jesus did not speak Aramaic.
This is exposing you as a man with no principles.
Nice strawman

 

[BreadOfLife]

I never claimed Jesus didn't speak aramaic.
Quote me saying Jesus did not speak Aramaic.
This is exposing you as a man with no principles.
Nice strawman

After I schooled you about Jesus speaing Aramaic - YOU implied that he spoke a mix of both.
From post #1326:
"Guess what?
The predominant language in Galilee in the 1st. Century was Koine Greek and Aramaic"

Jesis called Peter "Kepha", which is Aramaic for "Rock".

 

[Titus]

There are at least 7 types of Baptisms, in the Bible.

The one that is related to Salvation as our Eternal Redemption, is this one.

"There is ONE Lord, One Faith, and ONE Baptism"..


This ONE Baptism, is spiritual regeneration, its to be immersed into the Spirit of God by the Spirit of God

Water baptism is spiritual baptism.
It washes away your sins.
The gospel of Jesus Christ is His great commission.
Holy Spirit baptism was done DIRECTLY BY JESUS, JESUS BAPTIZED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT
But today the GOSPEL OF JESUS CHRIST ALL ARE BAPTIZED IN WATER.

Matthew 28:19-20,
- go therefore and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit...

Who is told to do the baptizing in Jesus'new testament gospel Behold?
Answer: the apostles which ARE MEN.

Men baptize men in water.
Jesus baptizes men directly with the Holy Spirit NO MEN INVOLVED IN HOLY SPIRIT BAPTISM.

Mark 1:8,
- I indeed baptize you in water but Jesus will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.

Jesus's great commission has men baptizing men. That's water baptism friend.

Heres the great commission repeated again in Mark 16:16,
- he who believes and is baptized(water) will be saved; he who believes not will be condemned.

The spiritual baptism that is for the forgiveness of sins in the new testament gospel of Jesus Christ is water immersion.
Not Holy Spirit baptism.

Did you know the apostles were already saved before they got Holy Spirit baptized?

Mark 1:4
- John came baptizing in the wilderness and preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins

conclusion:
The one baptism must be water,
Ephesians 4:5,
- One Lord, One faith, One baptism(water)

 

[Titus]

After I schooled you about Jesus speaing Aramaic - YOU implied that he spoke a mix of both.
From post #1326:
"Guess what?
The predominant language in Galilee in the 1st. Century was Koine Greek and Aramaic"

Jesis called Peter "Kepha", which is Aramaic for "Rock"

You claimed I said Jesus did not speak Aramaic which is a lie!!!!
You are a deceiver !!!

I said Jesus was trilingual as was His disciples.
You also claimed Jesus did not teach in greek.
Which was also wrong. You ain't schooling nobody.

Jesus spoke ARAMAIC to His Apostles. We have examples straight from the Gospels of Jesus using Aramaic words to the Apostles and the crowds - “Talitha Koum “(Mark 5:41), “Ephphatha” (Mark 7:34), “Eli, Eli, Lama Sabachthani” (Matt. 27:46) and elsewhere

Here you are using a straw man to deceive others into thinking I taught Jesus did not speak Aramaic.

I taught Jesus was trilingual. THREFORE I TAUGHT JESUS SPOKE ARAMAIC

Specifically, in Matt. 16:18 – Jesus calls Peter “Kepha” (Rock). How do we know this?
Because Paul refers to him as “Cephas” in his letter, which is a Greek transliteration of the Aramaic title of “Kepha”.

Again this is either a bold face lie or ignorance on display.

Matthew 16:18-19 was orginally written in Koine greek.
Later translated in other languages.

You don't know what you are talking about or you are intentionally deceiving others.
Which is it?

 

[Titus]

Time for a Bibe Lesson and a Linguistics Lesson . . .

First of all, you need to remember that Jesus and the Apostles didn’t speak Greek to each other. They spoke Aramaic. In Aramaic,

You dont know what you're talking about.
Jesus taught, in Greek spoke in Greek along with His disciples.
The predominant language in Galilee at this time was Greek. Not Aramaic!!!

 

[BreadOfLife]

Perhaps, except when tradition contradicts scripture, then tradition has the final say right? Scripture is interpreted in the light of tradition, not the other way round.

A truly ignorant statement.
It's clear you know NOTHING about Catholic teahing or you would never have made such a bankrupt claim.

Sacred Tradition NEVER supercedes Scripture - not does the reverse ever occur because God's trith is ALWAYS true..

Name me one instance in scripture where the woman in Revelation 12 is interpreted as a symbol of Mary. And I mean where scripture itself does the interpreting, not you or your church. For every one you produce, I will show you 3 where women in prophecy are a symbol for the church... Both in the old and new testaments.
Here's something to start with...
KJV Jeremiah 6:2
2 I have likened the daughter of Zion (the church) to a comely and delicate woman.
The above was when Israel was faithful and committed to the Lord. When they fell away, into idolatry, as was often the case, the prophecy went more like this...
KJV Jeremiah 2:20
20 For of old time I have broken thy yoke, and burst thy bands; and thou saidst, I will not transgress; when upon every high hill and under every green tree thou wanderest, playing the harlot.

Let me ask you some questions.
When did "Mary" spend 1260 days in the wilderness after Jesus was caught up to His throne? (Revel. 12:6)
Who fed her there? (Revel. 12:6)
When did Satan persecute her, and in what form did that take? (Revel 12:13)
What do the wings of the great eagle signify that caused her to fly?
Are the times, time, and half a time the same time span as the 1260 days? (12:14)
What was the flood that Satan cast out of his mouth after the woman?
How did the earth protect her, and where? (12:14,-16)
Who is the remnant of her seed that keep the Commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus, which according to Revelation 19:10 is the spirit of prophecy?
Finally, if the woman of Revelation 12 is Mary, who then is her arch enemy, the woman in Revelation 17 and 18?

For starters – you FIRST need to refute the ample Scriptural argument I gave you in post #1294 that points to Mary as the Ark of the New Covenant. This points to the Woman in Rev. 12.

The Woman is a polyvalent symbol who represents all at once - Mary, the Church and Israel. The Twelve Stars are the Twelve Tribes of Israel and also represent the Twelve Apostles of the Church.

Jesus, Mary’s Son came out of Israel and comes to us through His Church.

 

[Titus]

Guess what?
The predominant language in Galilee in the 1st. Century was Koine Greek and Aramaic"

Jesis called Peter "Kepha", which is Aramaic for "Rock".

More ignorance from BreadofLife.
At the least ignorance at worst willfull deception.

THE EARLIEST MANUSCRIPTS ARE WRITTEN IN KOINE GREEK.
ALL ARAMAIC TRANSLATIONS WERE TRANSLATED FROM THE GREEK.

Bread of life claims the Greek was translated from the aramaic.
Also the predominant language was first Greek, second Aramaic third Hebrew

 

[BreadOfLife]

That has absolutely nothing to do with those scholars books.
The reason those sources were posted is to prove that Jesus and the Jews in the 1st, century SPOKE GREEK, TAUGHT IN GREEK AND WROTE IN GREEK.

BreadofLife claimed none of the apostles or Jews spoke Greek in the 1st. Century. An extraordinarily ignorant statement.

Show me where I made tgis statement - or apologize for LYING.

So, I don't care if those men did or did not believe whether Peter was or was not the Head of the church. That's not the point for why I posted them.
What is the point is those men ALL agree that the new testament was written in greek.

The ancient manuscripts of the new testament were written in greek.

Are you sure about that??
History tells us a DIFFERENT story . . .

Early in the 2nd century, Papias, bishop of Hieropolis in Asia Minor, wrote:
“Matthew compiled the sayings [of the Lord] in the Aramaic language, and everyone translated them as well as he could” (Explanation of the Sayings of the Lord [cited by Eusebius in History of the Church 3:39]).

About 50 years later in 180AD, Irenaeus wrote:
“Matthew also issued a written Gospel among the Hebrews in their own dialect, while Peter and Paul were preaching in Rome and laying the foundation of the Church. After their departure, Mark, the disciple and interpreter of Peter, did also hand down to us in writing what had been preached by Peter. (Against Heresies 3:1:1)

About 65 years later 244 the Scripture scholar Origen wrote:
“Among the four Gospels, which are the only indisputable ones in the Church of God under heaven, I have learned by tradition that the first was written by Matthew, who was once a publican, but afterwards an apostle of Jesus Christ, and it was prepared for the converts from Judaism and published in the Hebrew language” (Commentaries on Matthew [cited by Eusebius in History of the Church 6:25]).

Eusebius himalso declared that:
“Matthew had begun by preaching to the Hebrews, and when he made up his mind to go to others too, he committed his own Gospel to writing in his native tongue [Aramaic], so that for those with whom he was no longer present the gap left by his departure was filled by what he wrote” (History of the Church 3:24 [inter 300-325]).

You are either intentionally hiding the truth to support your perverted position that Peter's confession
Was not the confession but Peter himself or you are ignorant.
Which is it?

Since Matthew 16:18-19 is the Greek words petros and petra we can know what Jesus built His church on
Peter himself?
Or
Peter's confession the revelation that Jesus is God.

Jesus built His church on the revelation from Peter's mouth that Jesus is God.

This disproves catholics misinterpretation that Jesus is appointing Peter as Head by building or establishing the church on earth with Peter as the authority over it.

Matthew 16:18-19,
- I also say to you that you are Peter(petros, masculine) and on this rock(petra, feminine) I will build My church...

So Jesus will build His church on petra, feminine AS BREADOFLIFE ALREADY ADMITTED IT CANNOT BE PETER OTHERWISE JESUS WAS CALLING PETER BY A GIRLS NAME. Read Your own catholic brothers teaching, below,

Jesus said - "YOU are Kepha", my ignorant friend
He didn't say, "Your confession is Kepha."

Conclusion: Jesus built His church on the REVELATION FROM PETERS MOUTH THAT JESUS IS GOD.
The catholic interpretation is heresy,
Catholic: Jesus built His church on Peter himself.

The Bible is as clear as the nose on your face that Jesus is the HEAD OF THE CHURCH ON EARTH,

Matthew 28:18,
- and Jesus came and spoke to them saying, ALL AUTHORITY has been given to Me in heaven and on
EARTH

Jesus IS the Head of the Church (Col. 1:18).
He appoinrted Peter to be the earthly leader (Matt. 16L18, John 21:15-19).