People say you can not lose faith, God can't lose you, is that true?

[Ronald David Bruno]

Thank you for sharing your testimony and the way you see things,

Welcome

 

[gpresdo]

Jerusalem backsliding doesn't change this:

Psalm 37:28 -
For the Lord loves justice,
And does not forsake His saints;
They are preserved forever,
But the descendants of the wicked shall be cut off.


Those who are truly born of God have received a new nature, a divine nature (2 Peter 1:4) and have been transformed from pigs and dogs into sheep. The change is more than just cosmetic, as in 2 Peter 2:20. *These cleaned up on the outside dogs and pigs were never sheep.*

Compare 2 Peter 1:4 - "partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption - Strongs #5356 that is in the world through lust with 2 Peter 2:20 - with they escaped the pollutions - Strongs #3356 (different Greek word) of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, yet they are again entangled therein, and overcome. *Notice that 2 Peter 2:20 did not mention them being "partakers of the divine nature."

Corruption (Strongs #5356) (to shrivel or wither, spoil , ruin , deprave, corrupt , defile, to destroy by means of corrupting, to spoil as does milk). Corruption - describes decomposition or rotting of an organism and the accompanying stench. The utter depravity of the fallen flesh and the resultant moral decomposition of the world opposed to God is driven by it sinful lusts or evil desires. Internal corruption.

Pollutions/Defilements (Strongs #3393) ("pollutions", "filthy things", "contaminations", "world's filth") describes the state of being tainted or stained by evil and refers to impurity, impure, tainted, defilement, foulness or pollution. Pollutions/Defilement refers to what is on the outside (2 Peter 2:20). But genuine believers have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4).

Corruption is deeper than pollutions/defilements on the outside: it is decay on the inside. Having the knowledge of Jesus Christ does not save a person if there is no heart submission to that knowledge. The latter end is worse than the beginning for these men because rejecting this knowledge will make them more accountable at the judgment. Judas Iscariot is a good example.

If you are a backslider.......... you are no longer a saint.

 

[gpresdo]

The letter may have been written to Hebrew brethren, but that does not mean everyone in this group of "professing" Hebrew Christians were genuine Christians as I already showed you in post #33. It's not hard to find "nominal" Christians mixed in with any large group of "professing" Christians in various churches and on various Christian forum sites.

WOW...are you saying there are different levels of Christians? Surly not!!!!

 

[mailmandan]

If you are a backslider.......... you are no longer a saint.

Show me the words "no longer a saint" in scripture. Jerusalem in general was being addressed, but we can always find a remnant. Do you disagree with Psalm 37:28? God's saints are preserved forever. How long is forever?

 

[mailmandan]

WOW...are you saying there are different levels of Christians? Surly not!!!!

No. I'm saying there are genuine Christians and there are "nominal" Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers mixed together in this large group of professing Hebrew Christians and in various churches and on various Christian forum sites.

 

[gpresdo]

Show me the words "no longer a saint" in scripture. Jerusalem in general was being addressed, but we can always find a remnant. Do you disagree with Psalm 37:28? God's saints are preserved forever. How long is forever?

You r a new age religion believer and I will not waste time with your position so long as you are in that mode.

You don't understand that we are not saved until Christ says we are saved after death and then judgement. On this earth we are ...born again. That status can be lost.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

What do backsliders slide back from?

Backsliding is only mentioned twice in the word.

In the OT, it speaks of a people who were close to God but allowed sin to cause them to fall back. Hurting their relationship with God. And hence bring about the discipline used to bring them back

The NT also speaks of this discipline or chastening of God used on those who fall back.

What it does not mean is to fall back to being the creature you were before God made you into a new creature. God changed you. You can not change yourself back.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

WOW...are you saying there are different levels of Christians? Surly not!!!!

Um lets see

John said there are children, young men, and fathers. Paul said their are babes.

you do not understand this?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You r a new age religion believer and I will not waste time with your position so long as you are in that mode.

You don't understand that we are not saved until Christ says we are saved after death and then judgement. On this earth we are ...born again. That status can be lost.

In other words

You can;t answer him because its not in the bible

 

[Patrick1966]

Paul wrote that Jesus must rule the kingdom until ALL are following him. 1 Corithians 15.

Hello to you and welcome,

What does the bible say about?

You can quote any passage you want to prove your point.

There are people who believe God chooses you and that is it. Nothing you ever even did to choose.

What are your thoughts about that?

Did you choose to accept God as a reality in faith? Or did God just choose you and you had nothing to do with it, and you are sanctified with no effort in allowing God to work in your heart and mind?

Some people do not even believe they have a free will.

However, whatever you express, you will not be condemned or looked down upon just because you may see differently than myself.

From my perspective, just claiming Jesus, doesn't mean anything. Just claiming faith doesn't mean anything, without works of love.

However ... what does the bible say?

Love to you,
Matthew

Paul wrote that Jesus must rule the kingdom until ALL are following him. 1 Corinthians 15. Many go to their graves NOT following Christ but if Paul is correct, they will do so, but it will in the hereafter that they go to him.

 

[MatthewG]

Paul wrote that Jesus must rule the kingdom until ALL are following him. 1 Corithians 15.


Paul wrote that Jesus must rule the kingdom until ALL are following him. 1 Corinthians 15. Many go to their graves NOT following Christ but if Paul is correct, they will do so, but it will in the hereafter that they go to him.

That is good to hear, some believe people will die in the afterlife, and no longer exist, Patrick.

Thank you for sharing,
Matthew

 

[mailmandan]

You r a new age religion believer and I will not waste time with your position so long as you are in that mode.

You don't understand that we are not saved until Christ says we are saved after death and then judgement. On this earth we are ...born again. That status can be lost.

Where do you keep coming up with this new age religion believer accusation? So born again = not saved yet according to you?

John 5:24 - Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation, but has passed from death into life.

For by grace you "have been" (past tense with ongoing present results) saved through faith. (Ephesians 2:8)

Romans 5:1 --Therefore, having been justified by faith we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Don't confuse justification with glorification. Now show me the words "lost salvation" in scripture.

 

[MatthewG]

Where do you keep coming up with this new age religion believer accusation? So born again = not saved yet according to you?

John 5:24 - Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent me has eternal life, and does not come into judgement, but has passed out of death into life.

For by grace we "have been" (past tense with ongoing present results) saved through faith. (Ephesians 2:8)

Don't confuse justification with glorification. Now show me the words "lost salvation" in scripture.

becoming faithless

Jesus name means God is Salvation

you stop believing

you lose deliverance

It's impossible to please God but by faith -

@mailmandan

 

[Patrick1966]

some believe people will die in the afterlife, and no longer exist, Patrick.

Yes, most Christians believe in forever punishment but that isn't scriptural, although many English translations erroneously state that some will suffer "eternally". Of course, their choice of that word is very flawed in that only God is eternal. Bad translations lead to bad doctrines.

 

[MatthewG]

Yes, most Christians believe in forever punishment but that isn't scriptural, although many English translations erroneously state that some will suffer "eternally". Of course, their choice of that word is very flawed in that only God is eternal. Bad translations lead to bad doctrines.

While I do believe that there are good houses in the Kingdom of God, there are also corrupted houses that are in need of repairing and some things have to be burned out perhaps, and some things replaced, of course...

Going through that fire will never be by force - except in context with Satan, his angels, the false prophet, and the beast. They are supposedly there forever - but human beings only have a part - but what spiritual fire feels like i dont know. If it is anything like real life, it will be painful to go through. Truth hurts.

 

[Patrick1966]

except in context with Satan, his angels, the false prophet, and the beast. They are supposedly there forever

I believe they too will be changed and saved. As 1 Corinthians 15 states, Jesus must rule until ALL enemies are "under his feet".

Besides, Satan and the fallen angels and demons are doing exactly what God intended them to do. Also, we know that a good tree cannot produce bad fruit. Satan and the "fallen" angels are serving a purpose, which is to educate and edify us through the proverbial school of "hard knocks". But they too are of God and they will willingly return to God and worship him alongside of us in God's kingdom, or so I believe. :)

 

[MatthewG]

People really need to challenge their stances.

I know people look at me like a foolish person who is crazy and a son of the devil.

However people really need to be encouraged to think, study, consider, break down everything that you may have built your faith on, and perhaps rebuild.

That is tough to do the older you get.

 

[ChristisGod]

You r a new age religion believer and I will not waste time with your position so long as you are in that mode.

You don't understand that we are not saved until Christ says we are saved after death and then judgement. On this earth we are ...born again. That status can be lost.

Only if you had biblical proof and passages that affirm your "assumptions" of losing ones salvation/eternal life. But as any student of scripture knows there are none to be found.

 

[MatthewG]

I believe they too will be changed and saved. As 1 Corinthians 15 states, Jesus must rule until ALL enemies are "under his feet".

Besides, Satan and the fallen angels and demons are doing exactly what God intended them to do. Also, we know that a good tree cannot produce bad fruit. Satan and the "fallen" angels are serving a purpose, which is to educate and edify us through the proverbial school of "hard knocks". But they too are of God and they will willingly return to God and worship him alongside of us in God's kingdom, or so I believe. :)

I never heard that before but all I can do is respect and not mock you or condemn you my friend.

People can believe in their man made doctrines, people can believe other people on a pulpit,


but nothing compares to beliving and trusting in God, and in wonderment of his possibilities for GOOD.

However, there is the choice



- Faith or no faith.

To be with God, or be without him in the afterlife - at least until you change your mind - that is a hope that we can maybe go help them as we try to help others today.

 

[ChristisGod]

People really need to challenge their stances.

I know people look at me like a foolish person who is crazy and a son of the devil.

However people really need to be encouraged to think, study, consider, break down everything that you may have built your faith on, and perhaps rebuild.

That is tough to do the older you get.

We should always be learning and reforming our beliefs when they are found to contradict scripture. Its a sign of humility and the opposite of being proud and trying to be right all of the time.